The Bishop of Elphin

Nodin · 09-03-2015 07:47PM

Tabnabs wrote: »

Politicians only care about getting re-elected and public opinion. Or do you think Enda Kenny is a regular of the Pantibar?

Schools are there to educate our children. Parents are there to teach morals and life skills. My kids don't have an ounce of religious views or opinions in their heads. The catholic church is irrelevant to modern Irish society.

This individuals views and that of his employers do not matter. Let them go, stop giving them credence and oxygen to survive.

And if hes on a hospital board with a position to block treatments, how would you ignore that?

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 07:52PM

reprise wrote: »

It's an outlier either way, and not a great example of one at that.

Doesn't matter how rare you think it is - the point is that there are women who are raped and who can't access an abortion in their own country directly because of the beliefs of the people Kevin Doran represents. So to have to hear him pontificate about how right he is and how wrong she is on the media as though he had any right to respect must be extremely hurtful.

And actually that lack of empathy for their predicament can't fail to strike other women who have been raped at any time, whether or not they actually got pregnant. So not that much of an "outlier" really.

How many raped women would it take before you felt their feelings might be worth taking into account then?

reprise · 09-03-2015 07:56PM

volchitsa wrote: »

Doesn't matter how rare you think it is - the point is that there are women who are raped and who can't access an abortion in their own country directly because of the beliefs of the people Kevin Doran represents. So to have to hear him pontificate about how right he is and how wrong she is on the media as though he had any right to respect must be extremely hurtful.

And actually that lack of empathy for their predicament can't fail to strike other women who have been raped at any time, whether or not they actually got pregnant. So not that much of an "outlier" really.

How many raped women would it take before you felt their feelings might be worth taking into account then?

May I remind you, the outlier I referred to was your mythical rape victim with no one but the Bishop to turn to for words of wisdom.

I will pass on the abortion debate.

dublinman1990 · 09-03-2015 08:01PM

He is such a vulgar individual to listen to with those comments.

If he had any credibility left he will spout these comments of pure bigotry out onto the public media until he is put into the wilderness then I will be happy with that result.

K4t · 09-03-2015 08:07PM

reprise wrote: »

I will pass on the abortion debate.

There's no debate. It's inhumane that a woman cannot have an abortion in Ireland as a result of being impregnated from rape.

One eyed Jack · 09-03-2015 08:12PM

Lapin wrote: »

Fundamentalist Catholic opinion my hole...
From Newstalk....

The Bishop of Elphin Kevin Doran has likened homosexuality to Down Syndrome, and also believes that gay parents are not parents.

It comes as the Irish Catholic Bishops' Conference meet for the first time since the date for the referendum on same-sex marriage was announced by the government.

Meanwhile the Children and Family Relationships Bill is making its way through the Oireachtas, in the expectation that it will be passed before the country goes to the polls on May 22nd.

Dr Doran had this to say when it was put to him that gay people in Ireland already have children.

"They may have children - but that's the point - people who have children are not necessarily parents," he said.

"This legislation that the government is introducing - the Children and Family Relationships Bill - seems primarily focused about making it possible for people in various different relationships to have children. It's not about ensuring that children have their parents."

I know of many Catholics who would strongly disagree with such sentiments.

Thank you for at least recognising that much.

Honestly lads, there are some opinions so, so utterly stupid that anyone who takes that nonsense seriously is the person who needs to question themselves.

This guy is one odious idiot that really only speaks for himself, and clearly he loves the attention he gets for his musings, and the media love him. He's simply a wind-up merchant akin to John Waters and that other clown Quinn.

Most people wouldn't be aware of these people's existence were it not for their "opinions" being shared across social media so we can all be outraged at their shìte talk.

I would sincerely suggest that people stop giving these idiots the oxygen of publicity they so badly crave and let them die off in the vacuum.

Nodin · 09-03-2015 08:17PM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Thank you for at least recognising that much.

Honestly lads, there are some opinions so, so utterly stupid that anyone who takes that nonsense seriously is the person who needs to question themselves.

This guy is one odious idiot that really only speaks for himself, and clearly he loves the attention he gets for his musings, and the media love him. He's simply a wind-up merchant akin to John Waters and that other clown Quinn.

Most people wouldn't be aware of these people's existence were it not for their "opinions" being shared across social media so we can all be outraged at their shìte talk.

I would sincerely suggest that people stop giving these idiots the oxygen of publicity they so badly crave and let them die off in the vacuum.

Again, that isn't the case
http://www.herald.ie/news/abortion-row-priest-blocked-cancer-trials-29484085.html
Were this some randomer spouting crap we could just slag him off.

Eutow · 09-03-2015 08:28PM

^^^^^^^

It just shows you how far Ireland still needs to go to be dragged into the 21st century. How is a priest, nun or bishop given the opportunity to suit on a hospital board. Why are hospitals still owned by a religious organisation. Forcing religious beliefs on hospials, having a religious ethos. Fking ridiculous.

shruikan2553 · 09-03-2015 08:28PM

Im wondering who let him out into the public.

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 08:29PM

reprise wrote: »

May I remind you, the outlier I referred to was your mythical rape victim with no one but the Bishop to turn to for words of wisdom.

I will pass on the abortion debate.

I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to turn to a bishop for advice on anything other than perhaps about a new car, so that wasn't what I said at all. I was objecting to the excessive access he has to the media in Ireland to air his hate filled views of women.

reprise · 09-03-2015 08:33PM

volchitsa wrote: »

I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to turn to a bishop for advice on anything other than perhaps about a new car, so that wasn't what I said at all. I was objecting to the excessive access he has to the media in Ireland to air his hate filled views of women.

I think it is paying off for the people who invited him judging by the reaction on this thread alone. I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't asked more often tbh.

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 08:35PM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Thank you for at least recognising that much.

Honestly lads, there are some opinions so, so utterly stupid that anyone who takes that nonsense seriously is the person who needs to question themselves.

This guy is one odious idiot that really only speaks for himself, and clearly he loves the attention he gets for his musings, and the media love him. He's simply a wind-up merchant akin to John Waters and that other clown Quinn.

Most people wouldn't be aware of these people's existence were it not for their "opinions" being shared across social media so we can all be outraged at their shìte talk.

I would sincerely suggest that people stop giving these idiots the oxygen of publicity they so badly crave and let them die off in the vacuum.

Unfortunately for your theory, and even more unfortunately for any women unlucky enough to find themselves dependent on his views, that simply isn't true. He was responsible for preventing women with lung cancer from trying a new drug purely because that would mean they had to take contraception.

Yes. That is contraception and not abortion that he was objecting to, and he managed to delay their treatment by several weeks if not months until a way was found to get around his objections - but he wasn't just told where to get off, as one might expect. No, they just found another hospital to take responsibility for the trial.

So it's absolutely not true that he is some sort of harmless fool that nobody listens to.

Hotblack Desiato · 09-03-2015 08:35PM

Tabnabs wrote: »

Schools are there to educate our children. Parents are there to teach morals and life skills. My kids don't have an ounce of religious views or opinions in their heads. The catholic church is irrelevant to modern Irish society.

Are they in one of the few Educate Together schools? If so they're very lucky.

Religious denominations control 96% of schools in this country (the RCC alone is over 90%) and they can quite legally refuse to enrol kids on the basis of religion.

joseph brand · 09-03-2015 08:35PM

Pumpkinseeds wrote: »

To say that rape victims would be likely to be angry at their rapist is a massive understatement. To suggest that a child conceived through rape isn't at fault, while accurate, is negligible when a woman is forced to give birth to it. The fact that he is a bishop means that he is in a position to influence public opinion and he should be reprimanded by the church for stating that women aborting a baby conceived through rape, do it out of spite for the rapist, it implies blame on the victim of rape and almost sympathy for the rapist whose child is aborted. His opinion is absolutely ridiculous and out of touch with reality.

One could go so far as to say that ALL his opinions are out of touch with reality, since he deals in the supernatural (imaginary and not real).

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 08:37PM

reprise wrote: »

I think it is paying off for the people who invited him judging by the reaction on this thread alone. I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't asked more often tbh.

As I've just pointed out (and others have done before) he isn't some sort of talking head a la Fox News. This man was allowed to block cancer treatment for women he had never met just because he didn't want them to take contraception.

reprise · 09-03-2015 08:42PM

volchitsa wrote: »

As I've just pointed out (and others have done before) he isn't some sort of talking head a la Fox News. This man was allowed to block cancer treatment for women he had never met just because he didn't want them to take contraception.

Doesn't chemotherapy cause sterility in both sexes?

shruikan2553 · 09-03-2015 08:47PM

Lack of father ted references is disappointing.

Who let that gob****e on the radio?

Much better

One eyed Jack wrote: »

This guy is one odious idiot that really only speaks for himself, and clearly he loves the attention he gets for his musings, and the media love him. He's simply a wind-up merchant akin to John Waters and that other clown Quinn.

Not really, he is a bishop, a representative of the RCC. Of course he is a bit mad and few people would agree with him but he is still following the churches views and has a bit more authority than the like of lolek.

joseph brand · 09-03-2015 08:50PM

JC01 wrote: »

This moron is only highlighting how outdated and insignificant the church and its teachings are in this country. Let him mutter away to himself about his space dad and his fairytales all he wants. The church is dying a death and soon muppets like this won't even get the airtime they still do from certain quarters of the media.

While their takings from the baskets have obviously dwindled, they still attract the older crowd. It is these people who leave land and property to the church when they pass away. So, never mind the coins in the baskets, it's the tens and hundreds of thousands left to the church in a will.

Their numbers are falling, but they still have crowd with more to give. $$$$

Woman, 81, leaves church camp $2.5 million from her estate.

"It was like winning the lottery. It blew me away. We didn't see it coming, but it was a game changer for Living River," the Rev. Robert Hay said.

There were unverified reports of 'The Rev' wearing a brand new, jewel-encrusted crown and a fur coat.

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 08:54PM

reprise wrote: »

Doesn't chemotherapy cause sterility in both sexes?

Apart from showing your ignorance, do you have a point to make?

(And the answer is not necessarily, in fact just such a case brought Ireland to the ECHR, iirc. For advising the woman to have an abortion, and then refusing to allow her to have one.)

Now what was your point again?

Icepick · 09-03-2015 08:55PM

Tabnabs wrote: »

His appalling opinions and diatribe couldn't be of any less significance to me as a modern Irish citizen. I pay about the same amount of attention to his views as I would if any random Rabbi/monk/Imam etc. started spouting that rubbish. Time for Ireland to move on thankfully.

"Random Rabbi/monk/Imam etc." don't control 90+% of primary schools like the Catholic Church.

He also said that god isn't omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient, and that it's apparently a common view held by Catholics. Was news to me.

Lux23 · 09-03-2015 09:04PM

I think he's full of s****, I listened to the whole segment and he did not say one sensible thing. I don't think he's an evil, brainwashing pervert, he just sounded like a man who was well aware that a lot of his arguments are complete dross. He starts every sentence with a sigh, as if he knows what he is about to say is as watertight as a leaky, old boot.

hotmail.com · 09-03-2015 09:07PM

It was telling that he revealed that he struggled with his own sexuality in his teens. A self loathing closet gay man. It's quite sad really. That said, most of what he said was offensive and degrading. Just because he is a bishop doesn't diminish that fact.

reprise · 09-03-2015 10:28PM

volchitsa wrote: »

Apart from showing your ignorance, do you have a point to make?

(And the answer is not necessarily, in fact just such a case brought Ireland to the ECHR, iirc. For advising the woman to have an abortion, and then refusing to allow her to have one.)

Now what was your point again?

Same one I began with silly. I don't hang on The Bishop of Elphin's musings with bated breath and I find myself able to withstand his thoughts without degenerating into a hysterical mess.

Eutow · 09-03-2015 10:36PM

reprise wrote: »

Same one I began with silly. I don't hang on The Bishop of Elphin's musings with bated breath and I find myself able to withstand his thoughts without degenerating into a hysterical mess.

It's a bit hard to do that though if the same guy that talks b0llix then has influence on a hospital board that can delay medical treatments/drugs because it goes against his religious belief. If he was just a random nutjob with no influence on anything then your point would have some validation.

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 10:50PM

Eutow wrote: »

It's a bit hard to do that though if the same guy that talks b0llix then has influence on a hospital board that can delay medical treatments/drugs because it goes against his religious belief. If he was just a random nutjob with no influence on anything then your point would have some validation.

Exactly. I'd say it would be a foolish woman who would dismiss his comments lightly, given that he effectively prevented women from accessing lung cancer treatment rather than have them use contraception. Who knows when one may find oneself the victim of this man and others like him?

Apparently some male posters don't seem to think women's lives matter much either. Not all, thankfully, but always the same bitter few.

reprise · 09-03-2015 10:50PM

Eutow wrote: »

It's a bit hard to do that though if the same guy that talks b0llix then has influence on a hospital board that can delay medical treatments/drugs because it goes against his religious belief. If he was just a random nutjob with no influence on anything then your point would have some validation.

It appears he did not act alone and the story is a decade old. Nor was the drug blocked following a full board decision. Good enough for the die-hards to spin for a decade and more I guess.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/mater-advisory-group-deferred-cancer-drug-trial-1.501647

volchitsa · 09-03-2015 10:54PM

reprise wrote: »

It appears he did not act alone and the story is a decade old. Good enough for the die-hards I guess.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/mater-advisory-group-deferred-cancer-drug-trial-1.501647

If he were acting alone he would be less of a danger to women.

As to how old the story is, since he recently resigned from the board in protest over the idea that the Mater should obey the law of the land, a law passed only in 2013, is there any reason to believe his views have become less or more extreme since ?

Conar · 09-03-2015 10:56PM

Icepick wrote: »

He also said that god isn't omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient, and that it's apparently a common view held by Catholics. Was news to me.

I was listening to some of it this morning and that's what really stood out to me. Since when is that the case?
He really seemed to be struggling to make any real argument.
Also unless I'm wrong he only said that homosexuality is ok with the church as long as there's no sex.

I hate to say this but he didn't come across as evil and bigoted. More a sad confused apologist.

reprise · 09-03-2015 10:59PM

volchitsa wrote: »

If he were acting alone he would be less of a danger to women.

As to how old the story is, since he recently resigned from the board in protest over the idea that the Mater should obey the law of the land, a law passed only in 2013, is there any reason to believe his views have become less or more extreme since ?

Who cares?

He's gone isn't he?

Is it really a shock to find that his catholic views are no less to the fore, what with being a Bishop n'all that?

fleet_admiral · 09-03-2015 11:02PM

An extremely dangerous and evil cult that has a history of destroying milions of young lives should be permanently barred from giving an opinion on ANYTHING

The Bishop of Elphin

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