Woman who failed to pay TV licence fine taken to jail in five-hour taxi trip

Grandeeod · 01-03-2015 10:42PM

conorh91 wrote: »

There is no provision for instalment payments in law, so it's not clear how the woman thinks she has been paying instalments. The Fines Act 2010 and the Fines (Payment and Recovery) Act 2014 did make such provision but have not been commenced.

As such there is no system in place for AGS or the Courts to work with. They have to work with the system they've been given.

Maybe the woman should have gone back before the Court prior to the due date.

She would have got a fines notice to inform her that the due date was imminent.

I know nothing about you Conor, but your assumption that ordinary people know the law is useless here. I understand what you are saying, but seriously it's merely window dressing and by the book BS.

Tony EH · 01-03-2015 11:02PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

So what?

Lobby you local TD then and ask him/her to campaign to get the license fee reduced/abolished then instead of bitchin on here about it .

Ha ha...brilliant.

:pac:

conorh91 · 01-03-2015 11:10PM

Grandeeod wrote: »

it's merely window dressing and by the book BS.

You're hearing what you want to hear.

People are given notice before the final due date of the fine. After the due date has passed, they are routinely contacted by AGS and given a final opportunity for payment. If they still have not paid, AGS haver no option but to execute the committal warrant.

Why did this woman not contact AGS when she saw that the due date was approaching? Why did she not contact the District Court? Either one would have told her how to seek an extension.

I think what happened here was a nonsense, but the blame rests with the Government, and with the woman herself for apparently not engaging.

foggy_lad · 01-03-2015 11:11PM

Grandeeod wrote: »

I believe that in certain cases, it should be the case. Treating people to prison, that don't pay court issued fines in full and on time for cases like minor road traffic offences and the TV license is a pretty prehistoric approach. The same BS goes on in family law regarding maintenence. Daddy doesn't pay or misses payments and he's jailed.

There is no consistancy across the spectrum of who serves time in jail.

any waster of a father who can't pay as little as €20/week from his dole to support his kids deserves jail as often as he refuses to pay! in such cases jail should be automatic at a rate of 7 days for every weekly maintenance missed or not paid in full!

foggy_lad · 01-03-2015 11:16PM

conorh91 wrote: »

You're hearing what you want to hear.

People are given notice before the final due date of the fine. After the due date has passed, they are routinely contacted by AGS and given a final opportunity for payment. If they still have not paid, AGS haver no option but to execute the committal warrant.

Why did this woman not contact AGS when she saw that the due date was approaching? Why did she not contact the District Court? Either one would have told her how to seek an extension.

I think what happened here was a nonsense, but the blame rests with the Government, and with the woman herself for apparently not engaging.

Maybe she got no notice? Maybe the local Gardai are so busy and overstretched they are unable to contact those with fines approaching the due date?

conorh91 · 01-03-2015 11:24PM

foggy_lad wrote: »

Maybe she got no notice? Maybe the local Gardai are so busy and overstretched they are unable to contact those with fines approaching the due date?

Unless the woman starts making those claims herself, I don't think it's wise to start inventing claims on her behalf.

bonzos · 01-03-2015 11:27PM

Or 1/50 taxi driver is a retired guard!

Specialun wrote: »

Nice cushie earner for the taxi driver

I bet:

1/4 related to a guard
9/4 overcharged and nobody questioned
10/1 complete random stranger

Grandeeod · 02-03-2015 04:32PM

foggy_lad wrote: »

any waster of a father who can't pay as little as €20/week from his dole to support his kids deserves jail as often as he refuses to pay! in such cases jail should be automatic at a rate of 7 days for every weekly maintenance missed or not paid in full!

A wild generalisation.

YFlyer · 02-03-2015 06:37PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

Is there no prison closer to donegal than dublin?

Leitrim.

Little CuChulainn · 02-03-2015 06:44PM

YFlyer wrote: »

Leitrim.

Yes, but the warrant can only be executed in the prison named on the warrant. Once lodged, the prison authorities can move them to more suitable locations.

Tea 1000 · 02-03-2015 06:48PM

I know a few Gards, and they tell me to my surprise that they have to give notice to (scumbags) criminals that they are going to arrest them at x o'clock next Wednesday or whatever. Why wasn't she afforded the same courtesy? Is she worse than some scum who beats people and steals for a living?

thickhead · 02-03-2015 06:52PM

bring back hanging, maybe people would obey the laws.

Little CuChulainn · 02-03-2015 06:53PM

Tea 1000 wrote: »

I know a few Gards, and they tell me to my surprise that they have to give notice to (scumbags) criminals that they are going to arrest them at x o'clock next Wednesday or whatever. Why wasn't she afforded the same courtesy? Is she worse than some scum who beats people and steals for a living?

They don't have to give notice for executing commitals. Many warrant units try to make an arrangement with people to come to the station so they can bus a few down at once but in general it is a knock on the door in the early morning job.

end of the road · 02-03-2015 07:01PM

thickhead wrote: »

bring back hanging, maybe people would obey the laws.

it wouldn't. and no thanks. it didn't work then, and it certainly won't now

conorh91 · 02-03-2015 07:21PM

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Why wasn't she afforded the same courtesy?

Considering that there is no way of paying installments that she thinks she was paying, considering courts send out notice of the due dates, and considering that AGS tend to give people a final chance to pay, this can hardly have come as a big surprise to her.

Don't believe everything you read in the newspapers.

People give-out about shows like Joe Duffy, and so do I, but at least with that real-time element, nobody has time to 'doctor' and sterilize the story. Most of the questions get asked, and we make up our minds.

With print journalism, someone's had a day or more to sanitize it and get creative.

When you read between the lines of what they're not saying, the story becomes more complex.

Hans Bricks · 02-03-2015 10:04PM

I have to laugh at the pro-license end, they're only argument thus far is :

"Just pay the damn thing you tax evader"

"If you can afford a TV, you can afford a license"

Any valid reasons or justification ? Please don't tell me RTE can't run the six one, 9 o clock news, Leader's debate and Prime Time off budgets equating to 127,000.000 in ad revenue alone (2012) ?

Or the subscriber model ? At least give the rest of us an argument.

Baby Jane · 03-03-2015 12:40AM

I think they just mean not paying it will only make things worse. It may be taking a stand not to pay it, but ultimately it won't get rid of it, and only lead to a fine.
Paying it doesn't mean agreeing with it - but if you're not going to get away with not paying it, then the only person you're punishing is yourself unfortunately.

conorh91 · 03-03-2015 01:21AM

Hans Bricks wrote: »

I have to laugh at the pro-license end, they're only argument thus far is :

"Just pay the damn thing you tax evader"

TBH, there are lots f taxes I disagree with. I disagree with the Universal Social Charge, I disagree with motor tax being used to pay for water meters, and in fact I disagree with paying for water provision on top of the property tax and general taxation.

But right or wrong as they may be, I accept the jurisdiction of the present membership of the Government and of the Oireachtas to represent us until such time as we see fit to replace them.

The anti-everything crowd seem to reject that basic tenet of democracy, and they appear to advance a belief that if you don't use something, you shouldn't have to pay for it. Ergo if I don't use public libraries, I shouldn't have to pay for them. If I don't use intensive care wards, I shouldn't have to pay for them.

And other such nonsense etc etc.

hatrickpatrick · 03-03-2015 02:51AM

mass_debater wrote: »

She should pay for the fcukin licence then like the rest of us and not wasting state funds paid by us taxpayers

Then they shouldn't waste license fees on six figure salaries for overblown presenters, while telling people they don't have enough money left over to make decent productions. Simples.

worded · 03-03-2015 03:00AM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Then they shouldn't waste license fees on six figure salaries for overblown presenters, while telling people they don't have enough money left over to make decent productions. Simples.

+ 1

That's exactly it.

No one deserves the bloated salaries they get.
Time to get real at RTE

Hans Bricks · 03-03-2015 07:45PM

conorh91 wrote: »

TBH, there are lots f taxes I disagree with. I disagree with the Universal Social Charge, I disagree with motor tax being used to pay for water meters, and in fact I disagree with paying for water provision on top of the property tax and general taxation.

But right or wrong as they may be, I accept the jurisdiction of the present membership of the Government and of the Oireachtas to represent us until such time as we see fit to replace them.

The anti-everything crowd seem to reject that basic tenet of democracy, and they appear to advance a belief that if you don't use something, you shouldn't have to pay for it. Ergo if I don't use public libraries, I shouldn't have to pay for them. If I don't use intensive care wards, I shouldn't have to pay for them.

And other such nonsense etc etc.

Oh don't get me wrong, me too, but considering we know exactly where (more or less) that 160 is going, I can't help but see it as anything other than a completely unjustified and archaic obligation to assume in 2015. Let's also not forget it's private income through ad revenue. People have been suggesting a subscription model on top of this too. I can't imagine the Late Late, Six One and Prime Time cannot be run on a budget of 127 million.

I just think this "it's the law" argument is too cute when discussing the TV license. Most people don't see any merit or need for a publicly funded RTE anymore.

end of the road · 03-03-2015 07:57PM

Hans Bricks wrote: »

Most people don't see any merit or need for a publicly funded RTE anymore.

i doubt its most. it is however, the gullible believing in the "private sector is perfect" nonsense and we don't need anything publically funded. RTE needs to be publically funded to ensure programs of minority interest get airtime. they need to do better, a lot better, but they are needed.

Harry Palmr · 03-03-2015 08:03PM

Hans Bricks wrote: »

Oh don't get me wrong, me too, but considering we know exactly where (more or less) that 160 is going, I can't help but see it as anything other than a completely unjustified and archaic obligation to assume in 2015. Let's also not forget it's private income through ad revenue. People have been suggesting a subscription model on top of this too. I can't imagine the Late Late, Six One and Prime Time cannot be run on a budget of 127 million.

I just think this "it's the law" argument is too cute when discussing the TV license. Most people don't see any merit or need for a publicly funded RTE anymore.

Most of RTE's costs are hidden not in front of a camera or mic, they suffer from being a legacy organisation. 90 Years accumulating the obligations of being the de-facto or indeed actual national broadcaster since its establishment.

The trick is knowing what to chop and what to keep while fulfilling its legal requirements - for example it built the soarview infrastructure alone and is only now getting anything back through payments by TV3, TG4 and UTV to use the platform.

conorh91 · 03-03-2015 08:09PM

Hans Bricks wrote: »

I can't imagine the Late Late, Six One and Prime Time cannot be run on a budget of 127 million.

And I can't believe we can't run our small island on less than €50 billion-a-year, but they say we can't. My disbelief is not an excuse for me to withhold tax. Ditto the TV licence, the plastic bag levy, water charges and other public charges.

Most people don't see any merit or need for a publicly funded RTE anymore.

I'd like to see evidence for that.

Trust in the media is lower than anywhere else in the EU, but of all the media Irish people do trust, it tends to be the established broadcasters like RTE.

Hans Bricks · 03-03-2015 08:30PM

conorh91 wrote: »

And I can't believe we can't run our small island on less than €50 billion-a-year, but they say we can't. My disbelief is not an excuse for me to withhold tax. Ditto the TV licence, the plastic bag levy, water charges and other public charges.

I'd like to see evidence for that.

Trust in the media is lower than anywhere else in the EU, but of all the media Irish people do trust, it tends to be the established broadcasters like RTE.

Cut it down to the bare essentials then if it's financially unfeasible to fund RTE without the license fee. Subscriber model seems to be the alternative.

I'll concede and say I was wrong on 'most'. However this survey was carried out in 2004. Considering the general opinion I see on Boards, this thread in particular and anecdotally speaking, the majority of people I know, I wouldn't say it's a stretch to say a new opinion poll may be needed.

A survey of public attitudes to public-sector broadcasting was carried out by the Economic and Social Research Institute in 2004 :

The associated opinion poll recorded agree:disagree percentages of 54:29 for the statement "Public Broadcasting should be financed by the licence fee."[34] Respondents were asked what level of monthly fee they would be prepared to pay to receive RTÉ if subscription access were hypothetically to replace the licence fee: the annualised mean and median household figures were €180 and €252.60, compared to the then licence fee of €150, with those who frequently watched RTÉ programs most willing to pay

What's your opinion if you don;t mind on the difference between those with an aerial capable of receiving a signal who do not watch RTE or avail of it's services and those who don't have a TV ?

Hans Bricks · 03-03-2015 08:42PM

conorh91 wrote: »

Trust in the media is lower than anywhere else in the EU, but of all the media Irish people do trust, it tends to be the established broadcasters like RTE.

I'll need evidence for that myself

Hans Bricks · 03-03-2015 09:10PM

end of the road wrote: »

i doubt its most. it is however, the gullible believing in the "private sector is perfect" nonsense and we don't need anything publically funded. RTE needs to be publically funded to ensure programs of minority interest get airtime. they need to do better, a lot better, but they are needed.

And the public sector is ?

What programs of minority interest ?

TG4 is in direct aid of government grants and it's own commercial income. I'd say Ros Na Run is of far more 'minority interest' than Fairly ****ty and the Daily Show.

RTE 2fm, RTE Aertel and RTE.ie are all completely commercial.

Kalman · 03-03-2015 09:14PM

Much cheaper to pay-up in the first place.

end of the road · 03-03-2015 10:15PM

Hans Bricks wrote: »

Cut it down to the bare essentials then if it's financially unfeasible to fund RTE without the license fee. Subscriber model seems to be the alternative.

no . to fulfil its obligations, cutting it down to the bare essentials doesn't work. if it did, it would have been done years ago. a subscriber model isn't going to happen.

Hans Bricks · 03-03-2015 10:17PM

end of the road wrote: »

no . to fulfil its obligations, cutting it down to the bare essentials doesn't work. if it did, it would have been done years ago. a subscriber model isn't going to happen.

What obligations ?

Woman who failed to pay TV licence fine taken to jail in five-hour taxi trip

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