Pressures around Church weddings

Shenshen · 13-02-2015 04:03PM

ronjo wrote: »

Outside Dublin too?

The numbers have been posted an referenced a few times now in this thread, they refer to across Ireland.

However, given that Dublin accounts for a quarter of the population, if you were to assume that everywhere outside Dublin almost everyone gets married in church, that would almost mean that there are no church weddings in Dublin at all any more.

I think overall, the numbers would be pretty evenly distributed. Maybe with the exception of the particular time-space anomaly this Nox101 seems to be posting from.

valoren · 13-02-2015 04:06PM

If you believe in and like the good stuff of a religion (which they all contain elements of anyway), love thy neighbour, be a good samaritan, don't be a d1ck i.e. you see Catholicism as another version of Aesop's Fables essentially, but personally draw the line at the magic trick parts, the water into wine, the holy spirit, transubstantiation, heaven and hell....are you still a hypocrite if you want to get married in a church or not?

Tarzana2 · 13-02-2015 04:07PM

ronjo wrote: »

Outside Dublin too?

No idea. But bear in mind, many people who live in Dublin and are in the broad "marrying age" bracket would have been raised outside of Dublin and have moved there for work. It's not like all marriages happening in Dublin happen just between people born and reared there. So many will be coming from traditional rural upbringings.

Even so, it's still an interesting statistic. Dublin comprised one quarter of the population twenty years ago when church weddings were at +90%, and still does now when the church wedding figure is much lower. I reckon Dublin doesn't skew it that much.

13-02-2015 04:11PM

Shenshen wrote: »

I think overall, the numbers would be pretty evenly distributed. Maybe with the exception of the time-space anomaly this Nox character seems to be posting from.

If I were only referring to my group of friends, neighbours etc from rural Ireland then maybe my sample wouldn't be the best however through work I have a whole other group of city friends from a different part of the country and the trend for church weddings is no different between the two groups, well actually that's not true as there will be one civil marriage among the city friends vs none (or none on the horizon anyway) among my friends from home.

ronjo · 13-02-2015 04:14PM

Tarzana2 wrote: »

No idea. But bear in mind, many people who live in Dublin and are in the broad "marrying age" bracket would have been raised outside of Dublin and have moved there for work. It's not like all marriages happening in Dublin happen just between people born and reared there. So many will be coming from traditional rural upbringings.

Even so, it's still an interesting statistic. Dublin comprised one quarter of the population twenty years ago when church weddings were at +90%, and still does know when the church wedding figure is much lower. I reckon Dublin doesn't skew it that much.

Ok fair enough but poor Nox seems to be fighting the good fight by himself and I thought you misrepresented what he said slightly thats all.

Tarzana2 · 13-02-2015 04:15PM

Galilea Cold Miner wrote: »

If I were only referring to my group of friends, neighbours etc from rural Ireland then maybe my sample wouldn't be the best however through work I have a whole other group of city friends from a different part of the country and the trend for church weddings is no different between the two groups, well actually that's not true as there will be one civil marriage among the city friends vs none (or none on the horizon anyway) among my friends from home.

As said, the figures are for the whole country. As shenshen said, it's not likely that there are next to no church weddings happening in Dublin, which would have to be the case to keep the church wedding percentage high for the rest of the country.

Like it or not, civil ceremonies are rising in popularity nationwide, and I can see that trend continue. Get used to attending more and more "improper" weddings in the future!

13-02-2015 04:15PM

I have actually never in my life been to a church wedding. And I'm from Kerry!

Shenshen · 13-02-2015 04:15PM

Galilea Cold Miner wrote: »

If I were only referring to my group of friends, neighbours etc from rural Ireland then maybe my sample wouldn't be the best however through work I have a whole other group of city friends from a different part of the country and the trend for church weddings is no different between the two groups, well actually that's not true as there will be one civil marriage among the city friends vs none (or none on the horizon anyway) among my friends from home.

Well, neither sample seem to be in line with official statistics anyway.

Maybe the people who get married in a civil ceremony simply wouldn't think of inviting you along?

ronjo · 13-02-2015 04:16PM

Shenshen wrote: »

The numbers have been posted an referenced a few times now in this thread, they refer to across Ireland.

However, given that Dublin accounts for a quarter of the population, if you were to assume that everywhere outside Dublin almost everyone gets married in church, that would almost mean that there are no church weddings in Dublin at all any more.

I think overall, the numbers would be pretty evenly distributed. Maybe with the exception of the particular time-space anomaly this Nox101 seems to be posting from.

Yes, I am aware that.

Nice of you to get another dig at Nox101 though in your answer.

Tarzana2 · 13-02-2015 04:16PM

ronjo wrote: »

Ok fair enough but poor Nox seems to be fighting the good fight by himself and I thought you misrepresented what he said slightly thats all.

Not sure it's a good fight myself personally, if statistics are being wilfully ignored.

ronjo · 13-02-2015 04:17PM

Tarzana2 wrote: »

Not sure it's a good fight myself personally, if statistics are being wilfully ignored.

Haha fair enough

13-02-2015 04:20PM

Tarzana2 wrote: »

As said, the figures are for the whole country. As shenshen said, it's not likely that there are next to no church weddings happening in Dublin, which would have to be the case to keep the church wedding percentage high for the rest of the country.

Like it or not, civil ceremonies are rising in popularity nationwide, and I can that trend continue. Get used to attending more and more "improper" weddings in the future!

To really work it out you would also have to account for the fact that most people who are living in Dublin but from other parts of the country actually won't get married in Dublin but go back to their home place (well the woman's home place). i could see this increasing the ratio of civil to church weddings in the capital.

Ush1 · 13-02-2015 04:24PM

Shenshen wrote: »

Well, neither sample seem to be in line with official statistics anyway.

Maybe the people who get married in a civil ceremony simply wouldn't think of inviting you along?

For a "scientist" he seems to place very little emphasis on evidence in any of his many assertions.

13-02-2015 04:24PM

Shenshen wrote: »

Well, neither sample seem to be in line with official statistics anyway.

Maybe the people who get married in a civil ceremony simply wouldn't think of inviting you along?

I'd obviously know they were getting married though even if I wasn't invited. I'm only referring to weddings I have been invited to when giving my opinions on it but if I took my local area and people I went to school with etc (which covers quite a large area) I can only think of one person off the top of my head who didn't get married in a church and they didn't even get married in Ireland.

I really don't see why I'd be making up these figures it's the honest truth even outside of friends and moving to the wider area that 95% of weddings (that I hear are happening) are traditional ones.

Tarzana2 · 13-02-2015 04:26PM

Galilea Cold Miner wrote: »

To really work it out you would also have to account for the fact that most people who are living in Dublin but from other parts of the country actually won't get married in Dublin but go back to their home place (well the woman's home place). i could see this increasing the ratio of civil to church weddings in the capital.

Dublin might see a slight increase, but honestly, I doubt it's the much.

Maybe 50/50 Dublin, 70/30 country.

I really doubt it's still at 90%+ outside of Dublin because for that to work, basically no church weddings would have to have happened in Dublin, and that's not realisitic.

I know you seem to desperately want the church wedding to be as popular outside of Dublin as it always was, but that simply isn't supported by the statistics. And the statistics are the only useful barometer presented so far. Anecdotes mean very little.

ronjo · 13-02-2015 04:34PM

Tarzana2 wrote: »

Dublin might see a slight increase, but honestly, I doubt it's the much.

Maybe 50/50 Dublin, 70/30 country.

I really doubt it's still at 90%+ outside of Dublin because for that to work, basically no church weddings would have to have happened in Dublin, and that's not realisitic.

I know you seem to desperately want the church wedding to be as popular outside of Dublin as it always was, but that simply isn't supported by the statistics. And the statistics are the only useful barometer presented so far. Anecdotes mean very little.

I guess the numbers for second marriages are pretty small but would have some effect too.

Tarzana2 · 13-02-2015 04:55PM

ronjo wrote: »

I guess the numbers for second marriages are pretty small but would have some effect too.

Yeah, would account for some but only a small amount I'd say.

dub_skav · 13-02-2015 04:56PM

I find it strange that everybody is deriding nox as some dancing at the crossroads, reeling in the years throwback.

The statistics say that the majority of marriages are still church affairs. If we accept that people of different ages get married, it is fair to assume that some age brackets (probably the younger folks) are moving towards non-traditional weddings.

So it is perfectly possible that the people in nox's social circle / age group are all still getting married in churches, with a corollary to that being that it is perfectly possible that somebody on here from a different age bracket sees their peer group all going the civil route.

I myself had a civil ceremony, but all the other weddings I have attended have been in churches, I don't think it's that unusual.

So while the country is certainly changing its attitude to weddings, it does not hold that this change is uniform across the board

Shenshen · 13-02-2015 04:56PM

Galilea Cold Miner wrote: »

I'd obviously know they were getting married though even if I wasn't invited. I'm only referring to weddings I have been invited to when giving my opinions on it but if I took my local area and people I went to school with etc (which covers quite a large area) I can only think of one person off the top of my head who didn't get married in a church and they didn't even get married in Ireland.

I really don't see why I'd be making up these figures it's the honest truth even outside of friends and moving to the wider area that 95% of weddings (that I hear are happening) are traditional ones.

I'm not saying you're making up the figures, I'm saying they are not representative.

Official statistics have been posted a few times now showing that the ratio in general is 60% church weddings and 40% non-church weddings.
That wouldn't tie in with the weddings I get invited to, most of which would have been civil ceremonies. I've only ever been to one church wedding in my life, which was when I was about 8 years old.
But I don't go round pretending that my own experience reflects overall trends and numbers.

K4t · 13-02-2015 05:02PM

If she and her family really wanted the church wedding I wouldn't resist. Why let something as silly and trivial as religion get in the way of love and the happiness of the one you love? Love conquers all.

Tarzana2 · 13-02-2015 05:13PM

dub_skav wrote: »

I find it strange that everybody is deriding nox as some dancing at the crossroads, reeling in the years throwback.

The statistics say that the majority of marriages are still church affairs.

Nobody has stated otherwise.

It's not a huge majority any more though, it's getting close to 50/50. And nobody is doubting Nox001 in what he says. It's that Nox001 appeared to be extrapolating his own experiences to the wider population. I believe the term ''vast majority" was used by him a few times. The statistics shows that on the whole, there is no longer a vast majority of weddings being held in churches in Ireland, unlike 20 years ago. Of course, individual groups will differ, but that's not all that relevant really to the bigger picture.

It will be interesting to see where the trend goes from here.

Electric Sheep · 13-02-2015 05:56PM

lazygal wrote: »

Turkey and.ham, blue nun and baked Alaska for all

Well la di da with your baked alaska - trifle was good enough for the rest of us:mad:

Pressures around Church weddings

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