Athiests - Who cares

Shrap · 08-01-2015 10:19AM

constance tench wrote: »

What's the big deal?
If he's an atheist it wouldn't be a real baptism!
Or would it...?

Oh dear. Don't get me started...or there'll be a bunch of people giving out about atheist rants. It is rather a big deal, put it that way.

shruikan2553 · 08-01-2015 10:20AM

constance tench wrote: »

What's the big deal?
If he's an atheist it wouldn't be a real baptism!
Or would it...?

Considering there would be a baptism cert and everyone else in the room saying there was a baptism I would have to assume that it was in fact a baptism.

constance tench · 08-01-2015 10:20AM

Shrap wrote: »

Oh dear. Don't get me started...or there'll be a bunch of people giving out about atheist rants. It is rather a big deal, put it that way.

Why?

Akrasia · 08-01-2015 10:22AM

kneemos wrote: »

The very essence of science is to investigate that for which there is no evidence,(Aliens) particularly if it is part of culture or folklore and something which billions believe.

Wha????

That's the opposite of science.

Science is inherently empirical. If there is absolutely no evidence, then there is nothing to investigate scientifically. You can't conduct experiments on things that have no physical properties

Dravokivich · 08-01-2015 10:22AM

Shrap wrote: »

Not in this country. In countries where growing up atheist is not questioned by others or discriminated against, they may not have to question the pervasive religious belief. Here, you find out the hard way. I was always atheist, so that's my story. For people who were brought up religious, I can imagine that the force feeding of said religion at home and at school led them to question why, and in what name, they were being forced to believe something.

I grew up being told I was Catholic and that there wasn't anything else provided as what someone else may believe in. Either you were in or out. I've seen what you refer to when you say you grew up atheist, occurring to others. But for the most part, if were are getting that from kids, it's social ignorance. They wouldn't be in a position to know better, because nothing else had been made available for them to know.

That still doesn't mean to decide one is atheist, from a stereotypical point of view presented here, they do so as a result of looking into everything and then discounting it all as irrational.

One doesn't need to do that. I didn't.

Grayson wrote: »

That's atheism. You have all the people who believe in something supernatural and then you have atheists who don't get involved. They looked at all the options and decided the only rational response is not to join in.

That sounds like a lot of bollox to be honest. You don't need to look at all or any options.

seamus · 08-01-2015 10:25AM

kneemos wrote: »

Atheism is flawed logic as it rules out the possibility of the unexplained and as any scientist will tell you their whole life is devoted to the unexplained.

No, that's religion. Taking the "unexplained" and plugging the gaps with books written by bronze age farmers and medieval Hitlers.

Bootros Bootros · 08-01-2015 10:25AM

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Considering there would be a baptism cert and everyone else in the room saying there was a baptism I would have to assume that it was in fact a baptism.

It's just water on a baby's head.

TheChizler · 08-01-2015 10:29AM

constance tench wrote: »

Why?

Would you be happy to put your child through the Muslim or Jewish equivalents of baptism? If not why not? If you don't believe in them it wouldn't be proper, would it?

Shrap · 08-01-2015 10:30AM

constance tench wrote: »

Why?

OK.

Because atheists take other people's beliefs seriously. It's not just a splash of water on the head, it's signing your child up to be indoctrinated into a belief that you think is irrational, discriminatory and dangerous to the development of their thinking for themselves. My eldest was the first in a tiny school not to have to repeat the prayers or colour in pictures saying "we thank you lord for making the flowers, clouds and bees" or similar. He knew where clouds came from, aged 6. The other kids in school didn't learn any contradictory science till they were 11 or 12.

There's a principal at stake with "going along with" religious beliefs that you don't hold. It leads to the unshakeable statistic that Ireland is 85% Catholic, which it patently IS NOT in terms of actual believers, but state and church being so entwined, policy is formed (or not formed, more to the point) from these statistics.

kneemos · 08-01-2015 10:31AM

Akrasia wrote: »

Wha????

That's the opposite of science.

Science is inherently empirical. If there is absolutely no evidence, then there is nothing to investigate scientifically. You can't conduct experiments on things that have no physical properties

Don't need experiments to investigate.
I'd liken God to Dark matter...observable effects but no physical evidence.

08-01-2015 10:32AM

I find aggressive atheists annoying but at the same time I believe every one is entitled to their opinion.

I am reading a gloriously nutty book I got for Christmas called Sapiens: A brief History of Humankind by Yuval Noah Harar. i I would recommend it to anyone interested in this subject its not a book about atheism.

Dravokivich · 08-01-2015 10:32AM

Bootros Bootros wrote: »

It's just water on a baby's head.

Well then they should wash the damn baby themselves, instead of getting everyone to dress up for an over glorified bath!

TheChizler · 08-01-2015 10:34AM

kneemos wrote: »

Don't need experiments to investigate.
I'd liken God to Dark matter...observable effects but no physical evidence.

Except observable effects are physical evidence. They can observe the gravitational effects the mass of dark matter has on the surrounding universe.

Shrap · 08-01-2015 10:34AM

Dravokivich wrote: »

But for the most part, if were are getting that from kids, it's social ignorance. They wouldn't be in a position to know better, because nothing else had been made available for them to know.

That still doesn't mean to decide one is atheist, from a stereotypical point of view presented here, they do so as a result of looking into everything and then discounting it all as irrational.

Yes, and some people educate themselves more thoroughly on the ignorance they were taught to hold, than others. Some people decide they are atheist based on their learning about their previous religion. Although I accept that others just slip seamlessly into not caring about it at all.

constance tench · 08-01-2015 10:36AM

TheChizler wrote: »

Would you be happy to put your child through the Muslim or Jewish equivalents of baptism? If not why not? If you don't believe in them it wouldn't be proper, would it?

What do you mean by 'proper' ?

kneemos · 08-01-2015 10:37AM

TheChizler wrote: »

Except observable effects are physical evidence. They can observe the gravitational effects the mass of dark matter has on the surrounding universe.

Exactly.Likewise they can observe the effects God has on humans.So God exists.

seamus · 08-01-2015 10:38AM

kneemos wrote: »

Exactly.Likewise they can observe the effects God has on humans.So God exists.

*grabs popcorn*

Go ahead so. Enlighten us with these "observable effects" from God.

shruikan2553 · 08-01-2015 10:38AM

Bootros Bootros wrote: »

It's just water on a baby's head.

Yes, that is how a baptism is done. After that the baby is then considered as baptised.

Shrap · 08-01-2015 10:40AM

kneemos wrote: »

Exactly.Likewise they can observe the effects God has on humans.So God exists.

Wut? Where does God exist then? Enlighten me. Because all I can see in your comment is that God existing in people's imagination and that is measurable by them answering "yes" to the question does god exist.

Dravokivich · 08-01-2015 10:41AM

seamus wrote: »

*grabs popcorn*

Go ahead so. Enlighten us with these "observable effects" from God.

To paraphrase a meme;

I don't think he means, what he means he means.

Dirty Steve · 08-01-2015 10:42AM

kneemos wrote: »

Exactly.Likewise they can observe the effects God has on humans.So God exists.

You should quit while you're behind.

_Brian · 08-01-2015 10:43AM

AlanS181824 wrote: »

If you believe in God, fine.
If you belive in evolution, fine.
If you believe in Miley Cyrus being our twerking supreme leader.. Fine too.

Just whatever you do, don't be a dick about it.

We all have the right to believe in what we want.

There's a thing..
I used to work with a person similar to OP's friend and he would push his belief in Atheism all the time..
He would insist his belief was strong and he really felt it was the right and only proper way of thinking..

He would get upset when I pointed out that belief, faith and his feelings of it being the only true way, it really made him have a religion he called Atheism, this would really push him over the edge, but its true, I find people like this have created a mental state about their Atheism equal to the state of strong religious people... its a bit ironic really.

Hoop66 · 08-01-2015 10:44AM

Akrasia wrote: »

Wha????

That's the opposite of science.

Science is inherently empirical. If there is absolutely no evidence, then there is nothing to investigate scientifically. You can't conduct experiments on things that have no physical properties

Surely you can formulate a hypothesis, and conduct experiments to find evidence that supports it?

kneemos · 08-01-2015 10:44AM

seamus wrote: »

*grabs popcorn*

Go ahead so. Enlighten us with these "observable effects" from God.

Half of this thread (and many others) is taken up with the observable effects of God,murder,terrorism,general mayhem etc.

Shrap · 08-01-2015 10:46AM

kneemos wrote: »

Half of this thread (and many others) is taken up with the observable effects of God,murder,terrorism,general mayhem etc.

So god exists because people are fcuked up enough to kill in the name of a being they have no proof of? And that constitutes proof?

Too much stupid. I'm outta here.

TheChizler · 08-01-2015 10:46AM

kneemos wrote: »

Half of this thread (and many others) is taken up with the observable effects of belief in God,murder,terrorism,general mayhem etc.

FYP...

The Backwards Man · 08-01-2015 10:47AM

Atheists are the iPhone carrying branch of people who see through religion.

kneemos · 08-01-2015 10:47AM

Shrap wrote: »

So god exists because people are fcuked up enough to kill in the name of a being they have no proof of? And that constitutes proof?

Too much stupid. I'm outta here.

If people are killing in the name of God it's undeniable that a God exists.

Zubeneschamali · 08-01-2015 10:47AM

Grayson wrote: »

If I say there's a teapot floating around the earth in an orbit between us and the moon

Teapots exist. The moon exists. Things can physically orbit the earth, and people can put things up there.

God is more like saying there's an invisible monster under your bed.

AndyBoBandy · 08-01-2015 10:47AM

I'd consider myself an atheist, my OH is a believer, we generally don't talk about it that much, that's where it's left

I still 'play the game' with religious events, attending weddings, funerals, christenings etc..., blessing myself etc...

We have a child on the way, and the child will be Christened, as it's what the oh, and most family will want/expect.
does it bother me? no, because i'm an atheist, so what harm will it do everyone involved? I know it will be more harm if I try to oppose it.

Athiests - Who cares

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