Traffic in the morning.

rosie16 · 20-11-2014 7:38pm

the beer revolu wrote: »

Fair enough.

Generally, lane discipline in this country is atrocious. I regularly find myself passing on the inside.

Aye, I do sometimes. I try not too. It's just his manner is all. Weaving in and out.

namloc1980 · 20-11-2014 9:07pm

the beer revolu wrote: »

Fair enough.

Generally, lane discipline in this country is atrocious. I regularly find myself passing on the inside.

Isn't passing on the inside one of the worst examples of poor lane discipline?

the beer revolu · 20-11-2014 9:45pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Isn't passing on the inside one of the worst examples of poor lane discipline?

Depends on the circumstances imo.
If you sit behind someone in the overtaking lane and they won't move over despite a polite flash or two, I think it's fair game.
If people are using lanes properly, it shouldn't be possible to overtake on the inside.
(Obviously, things change when the traffic isn't free flowing.)

Jimmy Bottles · 21-11-2014 9:03am

Worst morning yet. How the hell hasn't something been done yet. I've emailed just about everyone who would have a role in fixing this and yet nothing.

christy02 · 21-11-2014 9:34am

the beer revolu wrote: »

Depends on the circumstances imo.
If you sit behind someone in the overtaking lane and they won't move over despite a polite flash or two, I think it's fair game.
If people are using lanes properly, it shouldn't be possible to overtake on the inside.
(Obviously, things change when the traffic isn't free flowing.)

Worst thing is d**kheads who get are going right at dunkettle decide to get in lane around kinsale road flyover. Then sit in right lane at 80kph until tunnel. Flash of lights does nothing! No wonder you get undertaken

leahyl · 21-11-2014 9:44am

Rampant queue skipping again this morning going over the bridge at Penrose Quay. The lane going over the bridge was busy (as it usually is) so cars pulling out into the other lane way down the line and then "rejoining" at the top by just putting on their indicators and bullying their way in......really f**king annoying :mad:

christy02 · 21-11-2014 10:05am

leahyl wrote: »

Rampant queue skipping again this morning going over the bridge at Penrose Quay. The lane going over the bridge was busy (as it usually is) so cars pulling out into the other lane way down the line and then "rejoining" at the top by just putting on their indicators and bullying their way in......really f**king annoying :mad:

Always pull up and prevent them getting in. Have a little glance across then to see how pissed they are!!!!!

leahyl · 21-11-2014 10:09am

christy02 wrote: »

Always pull up and prevent them getting in. Have a little glance across then to see how pissed they are!!!!!

I normally do but sometimes they come out of nowhere, so to prevent an accident (even though it would be their fault)....

I blew the horn but sure makes no difference anyway

Dannyboy83 · 21-11-2014 10:25am

Jimmy Bottles wrote: »

Worst morning yet. How the hell hasn't something been done yet. I've emailed just about everyone who would have a role in fixing this and yet nothing.

Tried to go training yesterday after work, gave up after 60mins traffic and just went home. Wilton Rd was basically a car park.

Traffic this morning was backed up from the Togher slip on to the link, further than I've ever seen in my life before.

This can't be simply due to light sequencing or an economic recovery, something has gone very, VERY wrong with the traffic network in Cork. I'm convinced the cycling lane changes have something to do with it.

Padraig Mor · 21-11-2014 10:37am

Bad this morning alright. Kinsale Rd not quite as bad as the last few days, but that's only because there was a crash at Rochestown holding the traffic back (as far as Mahon). Did the ol' all way around Sarsfield r'bout again but had to go on to Kinsale Rd R'bout due to backup at Togher. Kinsale Rd was fine from that approach though.

Yes, I do wonder if removing car space in favour of cycling superhighways has forced people out to the orbital routes.

forzacalcio · 21-11-2014 10:48am

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Bad this morning alright. Kinsale Rd not quite as bad as the last few days, but that's only because there was a crash at Rochestown holding the traffic back (as far as Mahon). Did the ol' all way around Sarsfield r'bout again but had to go on to Kinsale Rd R'bout due to backup at Togher. Kinsale Rd was fine from that approach though.

Yes, I do wonder if removing car space in favour of cycling superhighways has forced people out to the orbital routes.

Took me 40 minutes to get from Mahon Point to the airport this morning, left at 8am got to Airport at 8:40! Unbelievable

Idiots cutting in at the last minute to skip the queues is getting worse and worse

rob316 · 21-11-2014 11:39am

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Tried to go training yesterday after work, gave up after 60mins traffic and just went home. Wilton Rd was basically a car park.

Traffic this morning was backed up from the Togher slip on to the link, further than I've ever seen in my life before.

This can't be simply due to light sequencing or an economic recovery, something has gone very, VERY wrong with the traffic network in Cork. I'm convinced the cycling lane changes have something to do with it.

Boom nail on the head, they have destroyed the flow of traffic in the city centre, 1 lane on Washington st merging onto the Western Road, 1 lane from north main st to south main st. Its a disaster, we are accommodating a cycling population that just isn't even there.

run_Forrest_run · 21-11-2014 11:42am

and the majority of cyclists are on the footpaths :mad: clowns.

rob316 · 21-11-2014 11:53am

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

and the majority of cyclists are on the footpaths :mad: clowns.

Yep, and on south main street the cars just park along the lane anyway. I presume the idea was with more cycle lanes less cars but they forgot one thing, the weather is absolute ****e here for a cycling culture.

rebs23 · 21-11-2014 1:35pm

Another nightmare of a morning this morning. I know we are all saying it but it is getting worse by the week. We simply need the Dunkettle Interchange upgrade, the N28 to ringaskiddy and we need to start long term planning for a mass public transport system in the city and suburbs.

rob316 · 21-11-2014 1:43pm

Im saying it years there should be a flyover over the dunkettle onto the dublin road to ease the traffic.

namloc1980 · 21-11-2014 1:56pm

rob316 wrote: »

Yep, and on south main street the cars just park along the lane anyway. I presume the idea was with more cycle lanes less cars but they forgot one thing, the weather is absolute ****e here for a cycling culture.

Not really weather related. Cities like Copenhagen and Amsterdam have as much if not more rain and poor weather as Cork but have some of the highest levels of cycling in the world. The problem in Cork, and another poster above touched on it, is the car centric nature of the city and the appallingly poor public transport system. A good public transport system allows a strong bicycle culture. A poor system means you try to squeeze bikes in with cars and with no other alternative for people there is not enough room for both leading to congestion and conflict between the two on the same routes.

forzacalcio · 21-11-2014 1:56pm

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

and the majority of cyclists are on the footpaths :mad: clowns.

Stupid comment..

rosie16 · 21-11-2014 2:10pm

It was bad alright this morning. The thing i used to like about fridays is that there's no traffic. I can leave at 9 and be where i want to be anywhere between half past and 20 to. I've been leaving at 9 every friday for the last 10 or so weeks and it's been fine apart from this morning. Long-ish queues at the dunkettle interchange- it's a lot longer on other days. And the kinsale rd roundabout was chock-a-block. Luckily i breezed through the sarsfield rd. rounabout. xD

And yeah i'd agree about the dunkettle interchange needing to be changed.It's totally inadequate coming off the motorway, in the mornings. I was a good 1.5km or so from the lights one morning

j8wk2feszrnpao · 21-11-2014 4:19pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Cities like Copenhagen and Amsterdam have as much if not more rain and poor weather as Cork.....

Not true.
I checked this out on previous cycling threads, and the data showed that not only do we get more rain, we also get it more often.

TINA1984 · 21-11-2014 7:53pm

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Not true.
I checked this out on previous cycling threads, and the data showed that not only do we get more rain, we also get it more often.

Of course, in that very thread you reference, it was pointed out to you that cities that DO have similar rainfall levels to Cork, such as London, still manage to have high levels of cycling participation.

namloc1980 · 21-11-2014 8:45pm

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Not true.
I checked this out on previous cycling threads, and the data showed that not only do we get more rain, we also get it more often.

Noted. Of course these cities still get substantial levels of rain and very often. Placing the blame solely on weather is very simplistic.

j8wk2feszrnpao · 22-11-2014 11:10am

TINA1984 wrote: »

Of course, in that very thread you reference, it was pointed out to you that cities that DO have similar rainfall levels to Cork, such as London, still manage to have high levels of cycling participation.

Again, it was pointed out that London has significantly less rainfall than Cork.
You only wanted an argument on that thread, and I've zero intention to continue it here.

j8wk2feszrnpao · 22-11-2014 11:19am

namloc1980 wrote: »

Placing the blame solely on weather is very simplistic.

I agree, but it is a significant factor for many people.

And those cities have had a culture of cycling for a long time. Introducing a similar culture here isn't something than can be achieved overnight.

And IMO Amsterdam really shouldn't be used in a comparison with Cork; not only is the weather vastly different, it's extremely flat.

I've gone through this previously in the "has cork city been ruined by bike lanes?" thread, so not looking to rehash it here.

corblimey · 23-11-2014 8:34am

I was passing Kinsale RA at about 930am on Friday morning. I was actually going into town, so planned on turning right off the RA and heading in on the South Link. That plan was scuppered when the usual tailback started around the Rochestown slip road. All well and good, follow some advice upthread and go around the Sarsfield RA and come back at Kinsale that way. Job done, simple.

However, I did notice as I approached the Kinsale slip road from the Douglas side (ie before going up to Sarsfield) that the turn right lane was empty (or at least as far as I could see up it). The turn left lane was chockablock. It made no diff to me as I was in the far lane and couldn't get across, but I wonder if that's what's tripping people up. That they've seen the turn right lane is empty sometimes and have gone up the middle lane and then thought 'oh bugger, it's backed up and now I'm caught in no-man's land'. Of course if they had any sense, they'd then continue up to Sarsfield and do one of about 56 things from there, so they're not completely blameless.

AugustusMinimus · 23-11-2014 12:01pm

This is the way I perceive the entire situation in Cork at the moment.

There are 4 problems on the South side in regards to traffic.

1. The Kinsale Roundabout. This was last upgraded in 2005 at a significant cost. The upgrade was wholly inappropriate and is nothing but a temporary fix. In the end, this junction will likely have to be upgraded to a fully free flow junction. This will involve some significant CPO of land in the area (the old Little Chef, parts of the Kinsale Business Park. etc. It will have to be done. I'll explain why later.

2. The Dunkettle Interchange. Thankfully, unlike at no. 1 above, we are getting an upgrade to a fully free flow junction. CPOs are currently on going and we'll be shovel ready once funding is put in place. (Map of the scheme below).

3. The Douglas Flyover. It is 2 lanes in each direction without a hard shoulder. This is the pinch point in the whole system with the rest of the SRR being 3 lanes in each direction. Long term, this must be widened to 3 lanes. I don't care how much it will cost, it will eventually have to be done.

4. North-South access across the SRR. Due to virtually all roads which cross the SRR also having access to the SRR itself, these north-south roads are absolutely clogged at the point of their junctions with the SRR. The solution ? Close off some of the junctions.

So, in retrospect. The Bandon and Sarsfield Roundabout flyovers opened last year. A lot of debate surrounded their opening on here and whether it would put pressure on other points in the system. It clear has. The place which has felt it the most is the Douglas flyover. When the Dunkettle Upgrade Scheme opens, it will put even more pressure on the Douglas Flyover. Worse than this, it will completely overwhelm the Kinsale Roundabout, especially the N40 westward exit. Points 1 to 4 above will all have to happen until we'll have an SRR capable of truly supporting the volumes of traffic it faces.

Dunkettle Interchange Upgrade

Bl5npbVCYAAeWTd.jpg:medium

Douglas - My General Solution
Close SRR junction 7 entrance to Douglas. Significantly upgrade Carr's Hill junction on the N28.

kub · 23-11-2014 5:08pm

Your final map above is already in the planning stage I just wonder when it is likely to happen as the builders of Maryborough Ridge were wound up a few months ago.

Excellent post though, however I fear that with the weakness of politicians down here these plans make take another 30 years.

Ludo · 23-11-2014 5:26pm

I'd agree with most of the above except maybe for the Douglas flyover part. I don't see the need to make this three lanes. I believe if the kinsale roundabout and dunkettle were both made free flow then there wouldn't be a mm red for it. It isn't the only 2 lane section.

It would certainly be nice if it was three lanes but I don't see the benefits even coming close to making it worth the cost.

AugustusMinimus · 23-11-2014 6:38pm

Ludo wrote: »

I'd agree with most of the above except maybe for the Douglas flyover part. I don't see the need to make this three lanes. I believe if the kinsale roundabout and dunkettle were both made free flow then there wouldn't be a mm red for it. It isn't the only 2 lane section.

It would certainly be nice if it was three lanes but I don't see the benefits even coming close to making it worth the cost.

The Douglas flyover is now causing major tail backs in both directions as 3 lane traffic is being funnelled down into 2 lanes. In fact, I would think it is now actually the 2nd most pressing matter to deal with on the N40 after the Dunkettle Interchange.

The dualing of the N28 will only make things even worse for this short section of road.

Ludo · 23-11-2014 7:21pm

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

The Douglas flyover is now causing major tail backs in both directions as 3 lane traffic is being funnelled down into 2 lanes. In fact, I would think it is now actually the 2nd most pressing matter to deal with on the N40 after the Dunkettle Interchange.

The dualing of the N28 will only make things even worse for this short section of road.

I disagree. Tailbacks heading west I still believe are being caused by kinsale roundabout delays. The delay ALWAYS ends at the kinsale flyover once you are past the exit. There are only 2 lanes from tunnel to Mahon. Then an off ramp, an on/off ramp and then another on ramp . No 3 lanes being funnelled into 2.

There are rarely delays heading east at the Douglas flyover that I have seen other than the odd time when there is a crash or when the tailback starts beyond the Bloomfield exit anyway which a third lane isn't going to help.

Waste of time and money imho without sorting out the more obvious issues first.

Traffic in the morning.

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