Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - See Mod Warning in OP, 09/11

Cantona's Collars · 15-11-2014 11:29PM

Sunday paper gossip: Moyes wants to sign Young,Atletico want Mata.

LVG has sent scouts to watch Anderson Talisca and is looking at Fabian Schar,Villa are looking for a replacement for Vlaar who they expect to join us.

Pro. F · 15-11-2014 11:58PM

Your Airbag wrote: »

You quite clearly did try to spin it that way. See below

"Not spent a penny on players" is quite a definitvie spin.

514M is a lot spent that could have been filtered elsewhere overtime.

Investing in a company and then allowing the company to keep conducting business is not the same thing as spending your own money on the business' purchases.

Your Airbag wrote: »

As usual though you'd rather back peddle on your original point, drag an argument out and get the last word in time and time again rather then admit your mistake but its there for all to see.

I really am the root of all evil.

Hococop · 16-11-2014 12:02AM

zerks wrote: »

Sunday paper gossip: Moyes wants to sign Young,Atletico want Mata.

LVG has sent scouts to watch Anderson Talisca and is looking at Fabian Schar,Villa are looking for a replacement for Vlaar who they expect to join us.

These reports are somewhat believable but I'd still be wary

Headshot · 16-11-2014 12:02AM

Pro. F wrote: »

I really am the root of all evil.

That's the first step in the road to recovery, being honest with yourself.

So proud of you Pro lol

Pro. F · 16-11-2014 12:08AM

beno619 wrote: »

He's done no more than Rafa in the PL with regards to the top teams but is also proven in the CL.

Of course we can judge players but im trying to provide facts to back up my argument, your argument seems highly opinionated. Lots of players make the jump to a top club and fail so as of yet Coleman has everything to prove.

Nope we can judge him but playing for Everton vs United is a completely different beast as you well know.

You believe Coleman is better, facts and Rafa's trophy cabinet say different.

By your logic it would be impossible to ever say that a player at Everton was better than a player starting for United because the Everton player has not yet proven he can do it at United. That is bollocks.

You have used non facts to back up your argument. Number of tackles, blocks and interceptions does not tell you who is the better defender. There's no stat to tell you how many times the defender averted danger through reading of the game or good positioning.

Trophies won is also a stupid argument for obvious reasons.

The Moldy Gowl · 16-11-2014 01:31AM

Found out where the herrara moving story was from

The sport bible. They mention his injury then say he has been on the bench and failed to impress and will leave for 19 million.

Jaysus, why do people even believe click bait stuff like that.

Backstreet Moyes · 16-11-2014 01:34AM

Pro. F wrote: »

By your logic it would be impossible to ever say that a player at Everton was better than a player starting for United because the Everton player has not yet proven he can do it at United. That is bollocks.

You have used non facts to back up your argument. Number of tackles, blocks and interceptions does not tell you who is the better defender. There's no stat to tell you how many times the defender averted danger through reading of the game or good positioning.

Trophies won is also a stupid argument for obvious reasons.

The trophies part i agree with. Have you stats on the other things you mentioned that would be interesting.

I am not getting involved in an argument. I think Coleman is overrated not a patch on Ivanovic or Zabaleta and Rafael is made of glass.

16-11-2014 02:32AM

Nuts102 wrote: »

The trophies part i agree with. Have you stats on the other things you mentioned that would be interesting.

I am not getting involved in an argument. I think Coleman is overrated not a patch on Ivanovic or Zabaleta and Rafael is made of glass.

Coleman who scores more and assists more than all 3 of them is the overrated one? Not sure I follow the logic. He was excellent defensively last night too. I always thought Zabaleta would be a better DM than RB and Ivanovic isn't even the best RB at Chelsea imo.

beno619 · 16-11-2014 04:52AM

Pro. F wrote:

You have used non facts to back up your argument. Number of tackles, blocks and interceptions does not tell you who is the better defender. There's no stat to tell you how many times the defender averted danger through reading of the game or good positioning.

All you've done is shout down facts and dismiss the only really applicable criteria to judge two simalar players on.

You still haven't put up any decent points pro Coleman apart from the fact you prefer him.

What has Coleman done to prove he's better that Rafa ?

Nalz · 16-11-2014 05:09AM

beno619 wrote: »

What has Coleman done to prove he's better that Rafa ?

Sounder defensively
More goals
More assists

Me thinks ...

Deiseboy01 · 16-11-2014 08:05AM

Trilla wrote: »

Sounder defensively
More goals
More assists

Me thinks ...

Less likely to get sent off.

Can play five games in a row without needing to be rebuilt.

homerjay2005 · 16-11-2014 10:36AM

Thornley and Strudwick have been pulled from the England medical team by Van Gaal as of this week.

Another sign hopefully that the massive shakeup thats needed in our fitness department is finally happening.

beno619 · 16-11-2014 10:45AM

Trilla wrote:

Sounder defensively More goals More assists

Rafa is better defensively according to stats posted yesterday.
Both on one a assist I beleive this season as well.
One freak season of goal scoring doesn't quite cut it if you ask me.

Deiseboy01 wrote:

Less likely to get sent off.

Can you draw up some stats to prove this or is it typical nonsense you hear about Rafa based on a sending off 4 years ago ?

Pro. F · 16-11-2014 11:21AM

beno619 wrote: »

All you've done is shout down facts and dismiss the only really applicable criteria to judge two simalar players on.

You still haven't put up any decent points pro Coleman apart from the fact you prefer him.

What has Coleman done to prove he's better that Rafa ?

Watching them play is the only really applicable criteria to form an opinion on which player is better. Your "facts" are the weakest and most tangential imformation we have for comparing two defenders.

Pro. F · 16-11-2014 11:35AM

beno619 wrote: »

Can you draw up some stats to prove this or is it typical nonsense you hear about Rafa based on a sending off 4 years ago ?

That's something that is recorded. Rafael has more cards than Coleman in all three seasons available on Squawka.

beno619 · 16-11-2014 12:01PM

Pro. F wrote:

Watching them play is the only really applicable criteria to form an opinion on which player is better. Your "facts" are the weakest and most tangential imformation we have for comparing two defenders.

Nope, that's just an opinion mate. Facts and stats can strengthen an argument which you have failed to do.

Pro. F wrote:

That's something that is recorded. Rafael has more cards than Coleman in all three seasons available on Squawka.

Yep Rafa one sending off in that period, "loose cannon".

Adamocovic · 16-11-2014 12:09PM

On the whole Rafael/Coleman thing going on here it really does depend on the individuals opinion. Obviously Coleman being names in SkySports team of the year and PFA player of the year along with Evertons supporters and players of the year would suggest that a lot of people rank him higher than Rafael.

Honestly though that it just opinion based. Personally I prefer Coleman, since his 2010/2011 season I really wanted him to join us, quick player with skill and defensively good too. Can make the odd mistake but most do. It is hard to take into account stats when comparing defenders, goals conceded and cards depend a lot on how the rest of the team does, it is probably better just to compare their style of play.

Rafael is good going forward too but I suppose my biggest concern on him is he has averaged something like 14/15 games a season in the league for us since joining and Coleman on the other hand 21 games a season. I know it may not seem much of a difference but 6-7 games difference without your first choice RB can be a big thing. This season alone I think Coleman has played 5 more games than him. I know injuries are hard to predict and Rafael could prove me wrong but he does have a history of picking up knocks. In his favour though he is the younger of the two and if he stays fit could get into some good form.

Pro. F · 16-11-2014 12:10PM

beno619 wrote: »

Nope, that's just an opinion mate. Facts and stats can strengthen an argument which you have failed to do.

Indeed they can. But as I've pointed out, the defensive stats avaialable do not tell half the picture of a defender's game, and if you were to go on which teams they play for you would never be able to spot a better player playing for a smaller club.

beno619 wrote: »

Yep Rafa one sending off in that period, "loose cannon".

So are yellow cards not important now?

Adamocovic · 16-11-2014 12:12PM

Back to more United talk is it expected that Jones, Evans, Falcao and Rafael are all going to be fit by next weekend?

beno619 · 16-11-2014 12:37PM

Pro. F wrote:

Indeed they can. But as I've pointed out, the defensive stats avaialable do not tell half the picture of a defender's game, and if you were to go on which teams they play for you would never be able to spot a better player playing for a smaller club.

So basically it's just opinion which makes this back and forward pointless.

Pro. F wrote:

So are yellow cards not important now?

Not when the argument being put forward that one player is a walking red card, defenders will always pick up yellows.

Professional Griefer · 16-11-2014 01:46PM

So the Mirror are saying Moyes wants to bring A.Young to Sociedad in January, pls be true.

Jimmy Iovine · 16-11-2014 01:49PM

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/nov/15/adrian-doherty-manchester-united-class-of-92

The chances are you might never have heard of Adrian Doherty, let alone remember him play football. Yet if you had seen him, it is also fair to say you might never have forgotten what it was like when he had a ball at his feet. Doherty is the player nobody mentions when they talk of that group at Manchester United who eventually became known as the class of 92. He was on the opposite wing to Ryan Giggs and for a while Alex Ferguson and his coaching staff wondered whether he was actually the better player. “One of the fastest wingers many people have ever seen,” according to Tony Park, co-author of Sons of United, a history of the club’s youth team. “The United scouts said he ‘could catch pigeons’ he was that quick.”

Oliver Kay put a link to this article on Facebook yesterday. He included this comment as well:

For nearly four years, I've been quietly working on a book about Adrian Doherty, a former Manchester United prodigy who was considered by many to be the equal of his team-mate Ryan Giggs. Sadly, Adrian suffered a serious knee injury just as he was closing in on his first-team debut and didn't recover. Tragically, he was fatally injured in an accident when he was 26. It sounds like a horrific story, but in many ways, it's a wonderfully uplifting one. He was an amazing character and an extremely gifted poet and writer as well as footballer. Along with his lovely family, I was planning to keep the whole project secret until publication, but my good friend (and cursed rival) Danny Taylor has written a column about Adrian in today's Observer, so I'm pleased to share that here - and while I'm at it, I'll tell you to watch this space for more information on the book, which will be published by Quercus next year. I hope it will serve as a long-overdue tribute to a lost talent. Rest in peace, Adrian.

https://www.facebook.com/OliverKayTimes/posts/837743849610894

I've read the article and I'm very interested in the idea of the book. I quite like these kind of stories.

Has anyone ever heard of Adrian Doherty?

EDIT: This guy has.

I was coach with Moorfield boys football club in Derry in 1987, where Adrian was playing for the under 14 team.

I recommended him to the N.Ireland scout for Man Utd and he went over for a trial. After 15 minutes of the trail match Alex Ferguson telephoned his Dad to ask if Adrian would sign for the club.

He went over to the club at 16 and played in the youth and reserve team with Ryan Giggs, Paul Scholes, and Gary Neville. He was ahead of Giggs to make his first team debut, but was injured during a training match, and never played at the top level again.

Adrian was the best young player that i have ever seen in Ireland in over 30 years of coaching and scouting.

http://www.mattbradleysoccerscout.com/adrian-doherty---a-tribute.html

kryogen · 16-11-2014 02:43PM

For what its worth I feel, and have felt, that there is really not that much between Rafael, Zabaleta and Coleman, any of them in your team and you will be doing well. Where Rafa falls down is his fitness issues. That is the only reason I would think about trading him for anyone else, its a big season for him.

Vic Vinegar · 16-11-2014 02:44PM

Adamocovic wrote: »

Back to more United talk is it expected that Jones, Evans, Falcao and Rafael are all going to be fit by next weekend?

Jones, Falcao and Rafael will be fit, only Rafael has a chance of starting though i'd say. The others have been out too long to be put straight back in to the starting line up.

Vic Vinegar · 16-11-2014 02:46PM

Reports from Spain saying that De Gea's injury isn't that bad, still with the Spain squad and could play against Germany and be fit for Arsenal at the weekend.

The Moldy Gowl · 16-11-2014 04:28PM

I'm fairness, how fit does a keeper have to be?
Off training for a few days to reduce swelling in his hand?

J. Marston · 16-11-2014 04:57PM

Angel Di Maria has revealed that Paris Saint-Germain's spending restrictions prevented him moving to France rather than Manchester United last summer.

Di Maria was the subject of significant interest from the Ligue 1 champions before eventually moving to Old Trafford in a British-record £59.7 million deal, and the Argentine has subsequently made an impressive start to his Premier League career.

PSG were fined £50m and issued with a spending restriction last summer for breaching Uefa's Financial Fair Play regulations, and Di Maria believes this was the key reason why they had to pull out of the race to sign him.

“PSG, I think they had a money problem and they couldn’t buy players," the Argentine said in an interview with Telefoot. "This is the main reason I didn’t go there. Playing in the French league would please a lot of players.

"Now I’m in the English league. But you never know, there is a lot of movements in football. You can never predict where you’re going to play.

"There were a lot of clubs interested in me. A lot really. But Manchester United appeared and didn’t go away. They absolutely wanted me and it happened.”

Di Maria admits the possibility of moving to the French capital intrigued him, and has not ruled out the prospect of joining PSG in the future.

"It could have been a good experience for me to go to Paris," he added. “I know I’m still young, perhaps I’ll go to PSG one day. I don’t know how it will all end."

Real Madrid's decision to sell Di Maria after an impressive season and decisive display in the Champions League final caused consternation among many, but the Argentine insists he is happy with the way things have worked out.

“It’s a different style of football here at Manchester United," he continued. "I’m very happy. I don’t have regrets about leaving Real Madrid. I think I won everything I wanted with Real: La Liga, the Champions League and the Copa Del Rey."

Only in the door and he's starting.

kryogen · 16-11-2014 05:08PM

Where the interview from? (I see now, definitely wouldn't be bothered by it so

)

I wouldn't read too much in to it anyway, international weeks tend to throw up a lot of ****e and its not like we didn't hear it all over the summer anyway

ps its not even like the report is saying he is not happy at the club or any other bull****

FortuneChip · 16-11-2014 05:18PM

J. Marston wrote: »

Only in the door and he's starting.

Good riddance. He's muck anyway! Never rated him!
:pac::pac::pac:

Al Capwned · 16-11-2014 05:21PM

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

I'm fairness, how fit does a keeper have to be?
Off training for a few days to reduce swelling in his hand?

At the highest level?
As fit as any other player to be fair.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - See Mod Warning in OP, 09/11

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