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Narrow tyre vs wider tyre: both same "size". Disadvantages of each?

  • 30-09-2014 01:52PM
    #1
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭


    Recently got my back tyre replaced as it was worn down. Previous was a Gatorskin, new is a Schwalbe as it is supposed to have better grip in winter.

    The new tyre is the same "size" as the original, but noticeably thinner.

    The guy in the shop said I could change it for a larger size if I didn't feel comfortable on it, but after cycling to work with it this morning it seems to be fine.

    I'm curious to know what are the specific advantages/disadvantages of keeping the current thinner tyre over going for one size up to be roughly 33% wider?

    I'm mainly worried about:
    - puncture avoidance
    - longevity of the tyre
    - durability on Dublin city roads (potholes / wet-weather handling / etc)

    Main use is commuting.


«1

Comments

  • #2
    Rotunda Shill
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 212 ✭✭Rotunda Shill


    Narrow tyre less resistance, less road surface to get punctures, (If using non puncture resistant). lighter, quicker to pump.

    Wider tyres are "more comfortable", slower, better resistance to potholes and heavier.


  • #3
    Rotunda Shill
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 212 ✭✭Rotunda Shill


    Narrow tyre less resistance, less road surface to get punctures, (If using non puncture resistant). lighter, quicker to pump.

    Wider tyres are "more comfortable", slower, better resistance to potholes, better grip and heavier.


  • #4
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Rotunda Shill wrote: »
    Narrow tyre less resistance, less road surface to get punctures, (If using non puncture resistant). lighter, quicker to pump.

    Wider tyres are "more comfortable", slower, better resistance to potholes and heavier.

    There's some debate as to whether thinner tyres have more rolling resistance, I'll see if I kind find the thread. One of Lumen's illuminations from memory.

    Narrower tyres may be quicker to pump, but also much harder to do so as they need you to get to a higher pressure, e.g. 120psi. This is ok with a CO2 cannister but can be hard work with a hand pump.

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  • #5
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    hmm I usually go to 120psi with my gauge-pump so that wouldn't really be an issue.

    Comfort seems fine.

    I'm a little concerned about the longevity though, would a wider tyre last longer? Do I need to make sure the pressure is always topped up if using the thinner tyre?


  • #6
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Probably depends on the type of tyre more than the width, where Schwalbe Marathons have a good name for being robust and puncture resistant but much heavier as a consequence. I use Shwalbe Durano plus which are a compromise, being lighter than Marathons, but heavier than many other road tyres, while still offering good puncture protection. I'm on 25mm for comfort reasons FWIW.

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  • #7
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    smacl wrote: »
    Probably depends on the type of tyre more than the width

    I guess my question is based on comparing 2 tyres of the same model, one being the wider size.

    I'm thinking that wider = will last longer but be heavier.


  • #8
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,145 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    mrcheez wrote: »
    ...I'm a little concerned about the longevity though, would a wider tyre last longer? Do I need to make sure the pressure is always topped up if using the thinner tyre?
    Which Schwalbe did you get? (Lots of different types).

    I wouldn't get too worked up about longevity. You can slice a tyre open on it first outing regardless of the intended longevity.

    And you need to check the pressure regularly with any tyre - rubber is not airtight.


  • #9
    petethedrummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,604 ✭✭✭petethedrummer


    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=92412348&postcount=4


  • #10
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    Which Schwalbe did you get? (Lots of different types).

    says "Durano Plus Etape"

    also note that it says max psi of 115... interesting. I thought 120psi would be the norm.


  • #11
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    I've been running Durano plus for a couple of years now and find them pretty bomb proof.

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  • #12
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    ok so thinner is better? (i.e. are they faster/lighter/ more puncture-free/better grip in rain?)

    Remember comfort isn't an issue as it feels fine for me.


  • #13
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    No expert, but I would have though wider would have marginally better grip in the rain, based on more rubber on the road. Only times I've had an issue was once cornering over a slick manhole cover, and another time where I left the corner too late (i.e. user error on my part). I doubt the difference between 23mm and 25mm came into play.

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  • #14
    quozl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,308 ✭✭✭quozl


    mrcheez wrote: »
    ok so thinner is better? (i.e. are they faster/lighter/ more puncture-free/better grip in rain?)

    I think thinner is none of the above except for lighter.

    This is within reason. I'm not sure where exactly reason lies but I'm very happy with 28mm tyres and would definitely prefer 25mm to 23.


  • #15
    piston
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 530 ✭✭✭piston


    I doubt you'd notice any speed difference in real world conditions but wider will be more comfortable and will actually roll better on rough roads.

    Narrow tyres are lighter and have better aerodynamics (which only matters in excess of 20mph anyway and is of little consequence if you have full mudguards) so racers/time triallists will gain but most real world riders would be better on a wider, lower pressure tyre but it's unfashionable at the moment and most modern bikes are stupidly designed to make the use of wide tyres impossible.

    I ride 32mm tyres @ 50 -60 psi. I wouldn't buy any frame that couldn't accept them.


  • #16
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    I tend to cycle my tyres at max-pressure as I prefer the speed/feel, I wonder if that factors in the decision of which to use?


  • #17
    petethedrummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,604 ✭✭✭petethedrummer


    It may feel (marginally) faster but you are going (marginally) slower.


  • #18
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,457 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Narrower tyres feel faster for me. As the surface gets rougher you'll have to slow down earlier with thinner/harder tyres. So it probably depends on your route. Whats fine on smooth tarmac would be a PITA on a bad surface.


  • #19
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    beauf wrote: »
    As the surface gets rougher you'll have to slow down earlier with thinner/harder tyres.

    ok so assume 2 tyres of same model at 115 psi ... one is wider than the other.

    With the wider tire could I could maintain my speed longer on rough roads?


  • #20
    quozl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,308 ✭✭✭quozl


    mrcheez wrote: »
    ok so assume 2 tyres of same model at 115 psi ... one is wider than the other.

    The wider tyre would be at a lower pressure than 115 psi, that's a large part of the point of it and how (allegedly) they get lower rolling resistance.


  • #21
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    quozl wrote: »
    The wider tyre would be at a lower pressure than 115 psi, that's a large part of the point of it and how (allegedly) they get lower rolling resistance.

    Weird, so when I pump up my "wider" tyre so that the gauge reads 115 psi, it isn't actually 115 psi?

    or do you mean it "should" be at a lower psi when I pump it?


    Regardless, going back to my original question... assuming I like to ride at 115 psi... is there any advantage to the wider tyre?


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  • #22
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Don't know how wide your tyres are, but my Durano plus are marked as 75-115psi. I wouldn't trust the gauge on my pump to be more than 5% accurate so anything over 110psi doesn't seem clever. Its also worth remembering that pressure changes with temperature, so if you inflate your tyres to the max on a cool evening and then leave them in the sun the next day, you may hear a loud bang and be down a tyre.

    On 25mm Durano plus I run 95psi front, 105psi rear, which has proven pretty robust in terms of getting my lardy 86kg around the place puncture free. If I had the clearance, I'd be more comfy on 28mms at something like 75/85. YMMV.

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  • #23
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    hmm cheers for all replies but I'm still no clearer on a consensus so I guess it's what "feels right".

    I'll cycle them home this eve and see how they feel on the pock-marked road. If I feel I "slip in" to the cracks more often than previously (or it just feels more vulnerable cycling over them), then I'll go for the wider tyre.

    If I feel the bike is noticeably nippier I'll keep the thinner tyre.


  • #24
    Del2005
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,148 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    smacl wrote: »
    No expert, but I would have though wider would have marginally better grip in the rain, based on more rubber on the road. Only times I've had an issue was once cornering over a slick manhole cover, and another time where I left the corner too late (i.e. user error on my part). I doubt the difference between 23mm and 25mm came into play.

    Thread pattern and rubber type would have more influence than width, a skinny tyre would be less prone to aquaplaning in wet conditions.


  • #25
    petethedrummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,604 ✭✭✭petethedrummer


    mrcheez wrote: »
    hmm cheers for all replies but I'm still no clearer on a consensus so I guess it's what "feels right".
    A thinner tyre will feel faster, just like doing 100mph in a fiesta feels faster than 100 mph in a mercedes. But just because you feel more road buzz doesn't mean you are going any faster.

    I'm mainly worried about:
    - puncture avoidance
    - longevity of the tyre
    - durability on Dublin city roads (potholes / wet-weather handling / etc)
    A wider tyre is better for all these but I wouldn't lose sleep over it.


  • #26
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Del2005 wrote: »
    Thread pattern and rubber type would have more influence than width, a skinny tyre would be less prone to aquaplaning in wet conditions.

    AFAIK, even 28mm road bike tyres are way to thin to aquaplane, and hence road bike tyres are predominantly slicks. Semi-slicks and knobblies are for poorly paved and unpaved surfaces.

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  • #27
    mrcheez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,875 ✭✭✭✭mrcheez


    petethedrummer wrote: »
    A wider tyre is better for all these

    Why exactly?

    I guess the answer to that will be probably the answer I'm looking for after all :D


  • #28
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,525 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Tyres are like cheese. You buy a big block that will last ages, and you're like 'hard cheese is awesome' and then after a while you're like 'I really miss soft cheese', so when you get through the hard cheese you buy a load of soft cheese and you're like 'I love this soft stuff' and then after a while you think 'I miss hard cheese' and so...


  • #29
    ROK ON
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,831 ✭✭✭ROK ON


    I use 23s, 24s and 25s.
    I have noticed the difference between brands but on the same brand I have never noticed the difference between size.
    Ye must have very sensitive backsides.


  • #30
    crosstownk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,863 ✭✭✭✭crosstownk


    I previously had Michelin Pro 4 Service Course 25's. They're a 'wide fit' and roll really well. They lasted about 3,000km.

    Recently, for various reasons, I replaced them with Mavic Aksion 23's. I can't really complain about the Mavics just yet as I've only 400km on them but I do think that the Michelins were slightly more comfortable and rolled an awful lot better. I'm going to order a replacement pair of Pro 4 SC 23's.

    The Michelins were inflated to 7.5 bar and the Mavics to 8 bar
    Untitled Image




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  • #31
    Carpenter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭Carpenter


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG28gAJpo_c&list=TL9crFXceL-gU5bw4V-BvGMOiFRHimD3li This makes sense watch it speed is mentioned


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