IDF save irish..

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 08:59AM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So you have no first hand experience of armed conflict but feel you have the right to comment on it because you have read a book or seen a documentary :rolleyes:

thats correct, do you have first hand experience in everything you comment on? :rolleyes:

Timberrrrrrrr · 13-09-2014 09:01AM

evo2000 wrote: »

thats correct, do you have first hand experience in everything you comment on? :rolleyes:

I do, i was in the first gulf war in 1991. So tell us the difference between war and peacekeeping since you seem to know so much about it.

jill_valentine · 13-09-2014 09:01AM

Gatling wrote: »

I call bull**** on the story .

At no stage over thw last while has there been any reports of the IDF saving Our Irish Troops or were involved in shooting at all during the rescue

I'm not really sure what Irish Central is, but I've been left lolling about at their bizarre take on something really basic before. Can't recall what.

Suffice it to say that I'm extremely dubious of them, I seem to recall getting the feeling they were Irish American, rather than actually Irish.

ETA:

http://www.irishcentral.com/about/

IrishCentral is the largest Irish site in North America and covers news and interests, from the nostalgic and the modern Irish America and Ireland.

...

Headquartered in New York City with additional contributing writers around the US and in Ireland, IrishCentral is at the center point of major news announcements affecting the Irish community. Our editorial staff operates 24/7 to bring the latest in Irish news, politics, entertainment, sports, opinion, and craic to our readers.

Hmm.

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:01AM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I do, i was in the first gulf war in 1991. So tell us the difference between war and peacekeeping since you seem to know so mu h about it.

do you have first hand experience in everything you comment on?

Grayson · 13-09-2014 09:02AM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So you have no first hand experience of armed conflict but feel you have the right to comment on it because you have read a book or seen a documentary :rolleyes:

To be fair that Chad bloke we were guarding was a bit of a joke of a mission. Get your own bodyguard mate!

Timberrrrrrrr · 13-09-2014 09:03AM

evo2000 wrote: »

do you have first hand experience in everything you comment on?

If i don't know what i am talking about i won't comment, i certainly wouldn't talk down about someones profession if i new **** all about it the way you are.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 13-09-2014 09:06AM

Jawgap wrote: »

I don't know I wasn't there - but I'd imagine deep, roofed with something like railway sleepers and earth - sandbagged 90 degree entrance.

They were nothing of the sort.. Of all the bunkers I sheltered in maybe one camp had something half decent.

But the majority were pretty flimsy corrugated sheeting over with a layer of earth and sandbags and would have offered minimal protection against anything heavier that .50cal (and even thats questionable).

There was an element of luck too of course, given the ferocity of some of the fighting we were exceptionally lucky not to have lost more.

Regards the IDF and co-operation with the UN.. Mostly we got on fine with them, even swapping rations on some of the posts and when UN per's were injured we were medi-vac'ed to Rambam hospital in Israel for treatment.

The real scum (IMO) were the South Lebanese Army (Christians), Hezbollah, Amal and in the earlier trips the PLO.

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:06AM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

If i don't know what i am talking about i won't comment, i certainly wouldn't talk down about someones profession if i new **** all about it the way you are.

what have i said thats incorrect? could we talk about the topic rather than me personally lol

also are u saying uve never once commented on something without 1st hand experience? lol

Timberrrrrrrr · 13-09-2014 09:09AM

evo2000 wrote: »

what have i said thats incorrect? could we talk about the topic rather than me personally lol

also are u saying uve never once commented on something without 1st hand experience? lol

How about explaining the difference between a war and a peacekeeping mission for us??

This should be fun.

Jadaol · 13-09-2014 09:10AM

Surprising not a whisper about this in the last week other than a small article in the independent last weekend.

Given how the media bleated on and on and on about the Irish saving the Filiipinos for 24 hours, you'd think there'd be some recognition when they're on the receiving end.

But no. They're Israeli so we can only condemn.

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:10AM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

How about explaining the difference between a war and a peacekeeping mission for us??

This should be fun.

before i do tho... are you saying theres no diff lol?

Jawgap · 13-09-2014 09:11AM

Nova CoolS Graphology wrote: »

They were nothing of the sort.. Of all the bunkers I sheltered in maybe one camp had something half decent.

But the majority were pretty flimsy corrugated sheeting over with a layer of earth and sandbags and would have offered minimal protection against anything heavier that .50cal (and even thats questionable).

There was an element of luck too of course, given the ferocity of some of the fighting we were exceptionally lucky not to have lost more.

Regards the IDF and co-operation with the UN.. Mostly we got on fine with them, even swapping rations on some of the posts and when UN per's were injured we were medi-vac'ed to Rambam hospital in Israel for treatment.

The real scum (IMO) were the South Lebanese Army (Christians), Hezbollah, Amal and in the earlier trips the PLO.

I'm not sure what your point is considering where you came in the discussion - are you suggesting the preparations weren't professional?

And weren't the SLA backed / supported by the Israelis?

jill_valentine · 13-09-2014 09:12AM

Jadaol wrote: »

Surprising not a whisper about this in the last week other than a small article in the independent last weekend.

Given how the media bleated on and on and on about the Irish saving the Filiipinos for 24 hours, you'd think there'd be some recognition when they're on the receiving end.

But no. They're Israeli so we can only condemn.

If the only source for this particular narrative is an extremely dubious US based site, it might pay to treat it critically.

Timberrrrrrrr · 13-09-2014 09:12AM

evo2000 wrote: »

before i do tho... are you saying theres no diff lol?

Run along, not feeding you anymore.

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:16AM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Run along, not feeding you anymore.

take your own advice and hop off my thread your pathetic efforts were easily dealt with!

:rolleyes:

Jawgap · 13-09-2014 09:19AM

evo2000 wrote: »

take your own advice and hop off my thread your pathetic efforts were easily dealt with!

:rolleyes:

So are you going to define 'war'? Or not?

arybvtcw0eolkf · 13-09-2014 09:23AM

Jawgap wrote: »

I'm not sure what your point is considering where you came in the discussion - are you suggesting the preparations weren't professional?

And weren't the SLA backed / supported by the Israelis?

Yes the SLA were supported by the IDF but not all compounds had IDF personnel in them, and the compounds which did (have IDF troops) operated much more professionally than those manned by the Christians.

But the Christians had their own command structure too, with its own HQ.

OH, re. the shelter's, most of us felt they were lacking in protecting us and I dread to think what would have happened if one had ever been hit by arty fire ~ as for our accomodation, living in soft skinned port-a-cabins wasn't ideal protection either.

And btw, in case I give an impression that at the first sign of trouble we took to the bunkers that wasn't the case.. If you were on duty you stayed where you were, if you were involved in a scheme of defense you went to your defense post but if you weren't involved (ie not on duty/rostered) you grabbed your sh*t and hit the bunker to sit out a shelling.

Regards the situation in the Golan, well it would be nigh on impossible to operation along any of Israel's border without their co-operation, impossible.

Btw I don't know why you're giving your sense's to evo2000, I think he's on a wind up.

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:24AM

Jawgap wrote: »

So are you going to define 'war'? Or not?

for what purpose? but ill get a wiki there for yeah if you insist on the definition of war

"War is an organized and often prolonged conflict that is carried out by states or non-state actors. It is generally characterised by extreme violence"

fresh off wiki for ya ! enjoy!
:rolleyes:

Jadaol · 13-09-2014 09:25AM

jill_valentine wrote: »

If the only source for this particular narrative is an extremely dubious US based site, it might pay to treat it critically.

It's not the only source. It was in the Irish independent a week ago. Maybe read my post again, in full.

Strange how people are so willing to disbelieve anything about the Israeli army, when I say anything - I mean the good stories. They have no problem with the bad. Never question the stories and figures from their enemies
Pages and pages about how bad the IDF are and nothing about how bad Hamas etc are.

No marches against any one in that part of the world. Nothing. No matter what they do. Maybe the Iraqi people would like some solidarity with their campaign against Isis. Or the Egyptians would like to know where we stand on..... Etc etc

Anybody want to protest against something to do with America or Israel? I'm in. Sure you don't have to ask twice....

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:31AM

Jadaol wrote: »

It's not the only source. It was in the Irish independent a week ago. Maybe read my post again, in full.

Strange how people are so willing to disbelieve anything about the Israeli army, when I say anything - I mean the good stories. They have no problem with the bad. Never question the stories and figures from their enemies
Pages and pages about how bad the IDF are and nothing about how bad Hamas etc are.

No marches against any one in that part of the world. Nothing. No matter what they do. Maybe the Iraqi people would like some solidarity with their campaign against Isis. Or the Egyptians would like to know where we stand on..... Etc etc

Anybody want to protest against something to do with America or Israel? I'm in. Sure you don't have to ask twice....

id be the first too bad mouth israel and its carry on in gaza but being fair they arent all bad either i thought it was gas how there wasnt a word mentioned of this story the hate wagon rolls on i guess lol

Jawgap · 13-09-2014 09:32AM

evo2000 wrote: »

for what purpose? but ill get a wiki there for yeah if you insist on the definition of war

"War is an organized and often prolonged conflict that is carried out by states or non-state actors. It is generally characterised by extreme violence"

fresh off wiki for ya ! enjoy!
:rolleyes:

So assuming you had to refer to a Wiki, you don't know what war is - because if you did you wouldn't have to refer to a Wiki, now would you?

Not a fan of the Clausewitzian ideas of war then?

What about insurgency / counter-insurgency; terrorism; rebellion; peace enforcement; and, peace keeping - are they 'war'? After all they can involve non-state actors and be characterised by extreme violence?

Timberrrrrrrr · 13-09-2014 09:33AM

Jawgap wrote: »

So are you going to define 'war'? Or not?

It can't because it hasn't a clue what it's on about.

Jawgap · 13-09-2014 09:36AM

Nova CoolS Graphology wrote: »

.......

And btw, in case I give an impression that at the first sign of trouble we took to the bunkers that wasn't the case.. If you were on duty you stayed where you were, if you were involved in a scheme of defense you went to your defense post but if you weren't involved (ie not on duty/rostered) you grabbed your sh*t and hit the bunker to sit out a shelling.

Regards the situation in the Golan, well it would be nigh on impossible to operation along any of Israel's border without their co-operation, impossible.

Btw I don't know why you're giving your sense's to evo2000, I think he's on a wind up.

Just clipped the post for the sake of brevity.

Yeah, sorry didn't mean to convey the idea that everyone immediately ran for the shelters once a post came under fire - just those not immediately needed. I have two uncles (both now retired) who spent several tours with UNIFIL in 1980s, I was relying on their secondhand stories!

I think @evo2000 is on a wind up too - but sure if we keep him engaged here, he's not bothering anyone else

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 09:40AM

Jawgap wrote: »

So assuming you had to refer to a Wiki, you don't know what war is - because if you did you wouldn't have to refer to a Wiki, now would you?

Not a fan of the Clausewitzian ideas of war then?

What about insurgency / counter-insurgency; terrorism; rebellion; peace enforcement; and, peace keeping - are they 'war'? After all they can involve non-state actors and be characterised by extreme violence?

im not a fan of your bull**** to be honest,cut to the chase what point are you trying to make, i get the impression ur trying catch me out in an attempt to discredit me personally because u disagree with my post, so lets have it then!

jill_valentine · 13-09-2014 09:41AM

Jadaol wrote: »

It's not the only source. It was in the Irish independent a week ago. Maybe read my post again, in full.

Strange how people are so willing to disbelieve anything about the Israeli army, when I say anything - I mean the good stories. They have no problem with the bad. Never question the stories and figures from their enemies
Pages and pages about how bad the IDF are and nothing about how bad Hamas etc are.

No marches against any one in that part of the world. Nothing. No matter what they do. Maybe the Iraqi people would like some solidarity with their campaign against Isis. Or the Egyptians would like to know where we stand on..... Etc etc

Anybody want to protest against something to do with America or Israel? I'm in. Sure you don't have to ask twice....

Eh... what?

I have no problem doubting Hamas. I assume Hamas are talking bollocks, generally.

Separately, I doubt Israel most of the time, and their track record - not least in regard to Irish troops, by the way - does not dissuade me of this.

But I've gone and read the Indo story. Yes, it was nice of the IDF to present more of an aid than a threat to our troops on this occasion.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 13-09-2014 09:42AM

Jawgap wrote: »

Just clipped the post for the sake of brevity.

Yeah, sorry didn't mean to convey the idea that everyone immediately ran for the shelters once a post came under fire - just those not immediately needed. I have two uncles (both now retired) who spent several tours with UNIFIL in 1980s, I was relying on their secondhand stories!

I think @evo2000 is on a wind up too - but sure if we keep him engaged here, he's not bothering anyone else

I may have served with your uncles so, depending where they're from as company's were made up from troops from the different commands (as they were known back in the eighties).

They were rough days out there, your uncles will have seen a lot and probably not told you much of it either!. Regards to them.

Gatling · 13-09-2014 09:52AM

Somebody must have lost a few games of COD

Jawgap · 13-09-2014 09:54AM

evo2000 wrote: »

im not a fan of your bull**** to be honest,cut to the chase what point are you trying to make, i get the impression ur trying catch me out in an attempt to discredit me personally because u disagree with my post, so lets have it then!

Not to trying to catch anyone out or discredit them......but you did say.....

evo2000 wrote: »

none but i can certainly tell the difference between the abit of peacekeeping and a full scale war,i suppose ur rambo are ya?

.....I was just wondering if you did actually understand the difference between conflict, combat, violence, war and MOOTW?

I think I've had my answer;)

evo2000 · 13-09-2014 10:01AM

Jawgap wrote: »

Not to trying to catch anyone out or discredit them......but you did say.....

.....I was just wondering if you did actually understand the difference between conflict, combat, violence, war and MOOTW?

I think I've had my answer;)

are you saying theres no difference between full scale war and peacekeeping lol

and your uve no exp urself so stop acting like ur all knowing lol

Jawgap · 13-09-2014 10:06AM

evo2000 wrote: »

are you saying theres no difference between full scale war and peacekeeping lol

and your uve no exp urself so stop acting like ur all knowing lol

No, I'm saying there's an immense difference.

While it's true I've no experience (thankfully) of being under fire or in combat - I have, experience of conflict, violence and MOOTW. I've interviewed countless veterans from at least 6 wars, a 'police action' and a few peacekeeping and peace enforcement operations.

Researching and writing about it is what I do.

IDF save irish..

Comments