contract rearing heifers

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 12:20AM

What about this? 30c per day and a €1 for every kilo weight put on the animal.

I have been getting heifers contract reared since 2010. I'm not posting what I'm paying but it's not what ye guys expect. Rearer is delighted with the arrangement. He weighs regularly and thus can concentrate supplement to the ladies that need it most. The key to good profit is SR.

He runs it on about 4 hrs per week. I showed him this thread but unlike some posters here talking about deserving a profit, he says he needs a margin and its up to him to make the profit.

Btw, no other animals on his farm as its a condition of ours

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 12:31AM

frazzledhome wrote: »

What about this? 30c per day and a €1 for every kilo weight put on the animal.

I have been getting heifers contract reared since 2010. I'm not posting what I'm paying but it's not what ye guys expect. Rearer is delighted with the arrangement. He weighs regularly and thus can concentrate supplement to the ladies that need it most. The key to good profit is SR.

He runs it on about 4 hrs per week. I showed him this thread but unlike some posters here talking about deserving a profit, he says he needs a margin and its up to him to make the profit.

Btw, no other animals on his farm as its a condition of ours

Do you mind if your Heifers come back small and butty and weight like lead. This lad is more than likly farming extensively, by the sounds of 4 hours/week he is not stocked heavy. As a matter what is his stocking rate. Like I posted earlier it grand if you are taking in heifer to collect the SFP.

At 1 euro/kg and 30c/day over the winter period if you gain .5kg/day you are losing 50c/day.

The other thing most lads I expect that are doing it at present have the heifers adjacent to the farm so they can spin over to check regularly. The reality is that rearing now may be 2 counties away.

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 12:34AM

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Do you mind if your Heifers come back small and butty and weight like lead. This lad is more than likly farming extensively, by the sounds of 4 hours/week he is not stocked heavy. As a matter what is his stocking rate. Like I posted earlier it grand if you are taking in heifer to collect the SFP.

At 1 euro/kg and 30c/day over the winter period if you gain .5kg/day you are losing 50c/day.

4 Lu/ ha, highly organised
What time could it take. Move calves twice a week follow with heifers. Herding? Of course there are days he does longer but often shorter.
My figure mentioned is off the top of my head and maybe you could flesh it a bit. I thought it would incentivise.

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 12:37AM

frazzledhome wrote: »

4 Lu/ ha, highly organised

My figure mentioned is off the top of my head and maybe you could flesh it a bit. I thought it would incentivise.

He is carrying either 7 maiden heifers/HA( nearly 3/acre ) or he is carrying 4.8U/HA. all year round.

funny man · 29-07-2014 12:37AM

ellewood wrote: »

Any contracts ive seen go from May 1st year 1 to Dec 1st year 2 so somewhere between 570 - 580 days depending on dates.

So in year 2 you would have

Jan 1st-Apr 1 yearling per acre 122 days

May 1st- Dec 1 yearling/maiden per acre and 213 days
1 calf per acre 213 days
Dec 1 calf per acre 31 days
Total 579 days

The maiden is gone on 1st dec before the expensive winter part, with good grass after July you should be able to build up a wedge for Aug and Sept and half of Oct, So you may have to supplment with bales outside for 40-50 days say half grass half wraps
There should be plenty of wraps made as in May stocking rate wont be too high and you should be able to make enough to supplment the maidens and winter the calves.

yea that would be the jist of it but most of the ones I know about the in-calf heifers come back on or after 1st Nov depending on grass supplies on the rearer farms and it's in the rearers interest to try to keep them on grass as long as possible.

I do not think so, it shows 415 summer(grazing) and 210 Winter(housing) days this is 625 day a bit less than 19 months, It shows costs of 775 euro attached to this time. If a heifer was returned 30 days before calving we are left with 75 days a 10 week old calf.

This in my opinion equates to contract rearing cost and the document shows it costs 775 euro and you need to add a margin to that. It is pretty clear cut except the yellow highlight blanks out the costs.

On the document above I just scrolled down a few pages and the first thing that struck me was stocking rates. Teagasc are quoting a stocking rate of 3 units/HA equivlent to 2.5LU/ha on the beef e-flow monitor the stocking rate is 1.7LU/ha and the margin levels in theory are less for an untried system.

Live weight produced is about 600kgs/ha in the beef e-flow by teagasc if a calf comes in at 100kgs and a heifer leaves the farm at 500kgs this rearer will have to be producing 1200 kgs/HA. And this is with animals that have poor conversion rates.

The more I look at the more I have to question the sums attached to the Teagasc Doc. I am also questioning my own sums and am definatly of the opinion 1.5/day and above is money required for this. Lads doing it at less are only fooling them selves. The more you look at the figure the more see the errors oin the teagasc rearing doc.

Pudsey I can't see the tables that you are reading from on page 5 it clearly shows that its birth to 24 months and 625 days divide by 30 comes up to 20.8 on my calculations. leaving all this aside can you comment on the beef profits that I posted and how contract rearing compares to these. your stocking rates are nonsense good fertile farms can easily carry 3l.u./ha and these are the farms that are switching to contract rearing. the beef figures cover the whole country and cover a lot of marginal land.

1.5/day?? I hope milk price is north of 40c/l if you think dairy farmers can justify paying this to a contract rearer.
Not in your wildest dreams is this a realistic figure.

unfortunately for some €1.50 will be the figure they need to get to make a profit and the teagasc guidelines will show that. these farms are high cost maybe their farm is fragmented, poor grassland fertility/management or just marginal land, but these guys are not suited to contract rearing.

I gave a real life example (taken from the farming independent) on this tread showing how the contract was costed and it did include a land charge (in the price/KgDM) and all sides were very happy and the farmer was quoted as saying "I find it a more profitable business than rearing bulls" , and this was published on the 18th of June 2013 when bull beef was better than it is now.

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 12:44AM

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

He is carrying either 7 maiden heifers/HA( nearly 3/acre ) or he is carrying 4.8U/HA. all year round.

Yes, grew 13 tonnes grass last year. We take maidens in Nov.

His demand is low in Spring and doesn't really get heavy till about now. All his winter feed comes from this block.

This isn't exceptional, just a switched on guy. This game isn't for everyone only the guys who want to make money.

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 01:00AM

frazzledhome wrote: »

Yes, grew 13 tonnes grass last year. We take maidens in Nov.

His demand is low in Spring and doesn't really get heavy till about now. All his winter feed comes from this block.

This isn't exceptional, just a switched on guy. This game isn't for everyone only the guys who want to make money.

How dose he manage with his nitrates

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 01:02AM

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

How dose he manage with his nitrates

Good question, "exports" slurry I think he mentioned. I honestly don't know. Would a derro not do at his SR? I'll ask him if I remember.

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 01:12AM

frazzledhome wrote: »

Good question, "exports" slurry I think he mentioned. I honestly don't know. Would a derro not do at his SR? I'll ask him if I remember.

Stop trolling if you have anything to add to the thread give percise figures

Frazzle just gave an an example of a lad that is above 250kgs of nitrogen/HA. Actually he is nearly 300kgs/HA. If he wants to make stuff up that fine but do it on the after hours forum.

It is bad enough that Teagasc have made up a rearer guide where a drystock farmer will be stocked at 182kgs of N/HA. Most of this will be at the back end of the year. Like I posted it will be grand if you cut over half the farm for silage or hay and these extra generous dairy farmers will give you a fair price for this product

ellewood · 29-07-2014 01:15AM

Does anyone pay/charge different to a per head per day ie. on liveweightgains/target weights and or inhale rates.

Id imagine this would reward better rearers that have reared better/ stronger heifers that prop would have better conception rates as they would all be up to weight and it incentives rearers to pull out smaller ones for extra feeding to ensure correct weight/conception rates??

ellewood · 29-07-2014 08:16AM

frazzledhome wrote: »

What about this? 30c per day and a €1 for every kilo weight put on the animal.

I have been getting heifers contract reared since 2010. I'm not posting what I'm paying but it's not what ye guys expect. Rearer is delighted with the arrangement. He weighs regularly and thus can concentrate supplement to the ladies that need it most. The key to good profit is SR.

He runs it on about 4 hrs per week. I showed him this thread but unlike some posters here talking about deserving a profit, he says he needs a margin and its up to him to make the profit.

Btw, no other animals on his farm as its a condition of ours

Sorry frazzlededhome, I didn't see this last nite, it was a long day yesterday.

It really is small things that make a difference alright, if a rearer got .40/day + E1.10/kg gain it probobly wouldnt be too bad?

When you say no other cattle on the farm do yo mean no cattle at all say the farmers cattle were on home farm and heifers were on out farm 10 miles away and would never be in contact with rearers own cattle would this still be a no no??

Btw I agree about the work with them, its very little and there very easy/docile cattle to work with.

And I agree the only way it will work for rearer is to stock his land to max - only he will know what the max on his own land is tho, it may be 3 some places and 4 with good land/grasss
When you say he is stocked at 4lu/hec does that mean he is carrying 4 maidens and 4 calves per hec?

I am by no way saying I deserve a profit! But the numbers dont stack up at E1/day even the Teagasc numbers dont stack at E1/day it showes even stocked at 3/hec its little more than a break even system ( beef lads know enough about them already), but at 1.2/day with everything right ya might make 600/ha for youre labour and land and the dairy farmer says this is too much for the rearer to be making for all his work/effort/risk.

I have asked for anybody advocating E1/day to show figures detailing all costs showing what margin is left for the rearer

I do know tho that if stocked at between 3-4 lu hec and get a year like last year you would be pretty fcuked getting paid E1/day

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 08:58AM

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Stop trolling if you have anything to add to the thread give percise figures

Frazzle just gave an an example of a lad that is above 250kgs of nitrogen/HA. Actually he is nearly 300kgs/HA. If he wants to make stuff up that fine but do it on the after hours forum.

It is bad enough that Teagasc have made up a rearer guide where a drystock farmer will be stocked at 182kgs of N/HA. Most of this will be at the back end of the year. Like I posted it will be grand if you cut over half the farm for silage or hay and these extra generous dairy farmers will give you a fair price for this product

Go and have a good shyte for yourself. Why do I care what his N position is. I posted in good faith and phuck you

I'm probably one of the few here that's contract rearing and if you think I'm putting up my figures your out by the side of it, have done it once too often here and out come the real Trolls

ellewood · 29-07-2014 09:02AM

unfortunately for some €1.50 will be the figure they need to get to make a profit and the teagasc guidelines will show that. these farms are high cost maybe their farm is fragmented, poor grassland fertility/management or just marginal land, but these guys are not suited to contract rearing.

I agree

I gave a real life example (taken from the farming independent) on this tread showing how the contract was costed and it did include a land charge (in the price/KgDM) and all sides were very happy and the farmer was quoted as saying "I find it a more profitable business than rearing bulls" , and this was published on the 18th of June 2013 when bull beef was better than it is now.[/QUOTE]

Ah no it dosen't, it gives costs as...
326 feed
150 lab
145 car, phone,dep, insurance, machinery
24 other
Total E645 or E1.1/Day nowhere as far as I can see does it mention land charge (unless the .07c/kg cost for grass and the .15c/kg for silage includes a land charge?)

Even with a dairy farmer just renting a place to rear them the feed costs are the same 326 and just put a rental value on land of 180/acre stocked at 3/hec its costing 148/lu in rent
So assuming he has labour already
He covers his machinery insurance etc with the dairy operation

So he has no other costs just feed heifers and pay rent everything else is paid for already it costs him 326+148 474 / 570 days is 0.83c/day just on feed costs and rent!
I worked out that feed costs are around .60c/day and rent is around .30c/day before any other costs are included so not far out.

Now add in the land he has rented is 10 miles away and it takes him an extra hour each day and E5.00 a day in diesel for the jeep to check on them.

Then add in the fact that the landlord is fond of the bottle and half the time the esb is off so the fence and water is off
The fences are there years and its a costly job every year to maintain them
The land was in tillage and fertility is poor costing more in P+k each year than normal to grow enough grass
The neighbouring farmer is pissed off the rich dairy farmer from 10 miles away has got land he has been renting for 20 years and he should still have but couldnt affort to pay what the big dairy man paid so he keeps opening the gates leaving cattle out:D

And the million other problems ya have when ya rent a place

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 03:32PM

frazzledhome wrote: »

Go and have a good shyte for yourself. Why do I care what his N position is. I posted in good faith and phuck you

I'm probably one of the few here that's contract rearing and if you think I'm putting up my figures your out by the side of it, have done it once too often here and out come the real Trolls

Maybe you are but 4LU/HA is in ultra high nitrates, this farmer would have to export slurry and use no artifical P&K. If a 50 acre(20HA) farm carrying only maiden heifers he would have 135 heifers. If carrying Maidens and heifer calves he be carrying 96 of each that is 190 cattle on 50 acres in the autumn. He be outputting nearly 2 ton of liveweight/HA. Somthing is not adding up.

The Derrypatrick suckler herd struggled the year before last and early last year at a stocking rate of 2.5/HA. Yes dairy farmers stock at high rates on milking platforms however they import a lot of feed and buffer feed at certain time.

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 03:35PM

ellewood wrote: »

Sorry frazzlededhome, I didn't see this last nite, it was a long day yesterday.

It really is small things that make a difference alright, if a rearer got .40/day + E1.10/kg gain it probobly wouldnt be too bad?

When you say no other cattle on the farm do yo mean no cattle at all say the farmers cattle were on home farm and heifers were on out farm 10 miles away and would never be in contact with rearers own cattle would this still be a no no??

Btw I agree about the work with them, its very little and there very easy/docile cattle to work with.

And I agree the only way it will work for rearer is to stock his land to max - only he will know what the max on his own land is tho, it may be 3 some places and 4 with good land/grasss
When you say he is stocked at 4lu/hec does that mean he is carrying 4 maidens and 4 calves per hec?

I am by no way saying I deserve a profit! But the numbers dont stack up at E1/day even the Teagasc numbers dont stack at E1/day it showes even stocked at 3/hec its little more than a break even system ( beef lads know enough about them already), but at 1.2/day with everything right ya might make 600/ha for youre labour and land and the dairy farmer says this is too much for the rearer to be making for all his work/effort/risk.

I have asked for anybody advocating E1/day to show figures detailing all costs showing what margin is left for the rearer

I do know tho that if stocked at between 3-4 lu hec and get a year like last year you would be pretty fcuked getting paid E1/day

I clarfied that 4LU is equivlent to 7 maidens approx for the full 12 months and 4.8 maidens and 4.8 heifer calves/HA. Frazzle said that was the approx rate.

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 08:33PM

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Maybe you are but 4LU/HA is in ultra high nitrates, this farmer would have to export slurry and use no artifical P&K. If a 50 acre(20HA) farm carrying only maiden heifers he would have 135 heifers. If carrying Maidens and heifer calves he be carrying 96 of each that is 190 cattle on 50 acres in the autumn. He be outputting nearly 2 ton of liveweight/HA. Somthing is not adding up.

The Derrypatrick suckler herd struggled the year before last and early last year at a stocking rate of 2.5/HA. Yes dairy farmers stock at high rates on milking platforms however they import a lot of feed and buffer feed at certain time.

The accepted figure is 1 heifer + 1 calf in 1 Lu for 12 mths. What's not adding is the fact that your coming at this with a beef farmers perspective ie know nothing about grass. It would be 80 heifers and 80 calves for the grazing season.

Are you seriously telling us that a well tuned grass farmer on good land targeting meal based on cattle weights couldn't manage this? Remember he only has 80 weanlings for the winter

keep going · 29-07-2014 08:37PM

One thing I cant get my head around is you are not satisfied rearing heifers for a dairy farmer where you have money in the bank every month and no capital involved yet you will contract rear for larry for nothing and take all the risk

C4d78 · 29-07-2014 08:45PM

keep going wrote: »

One thing I cant get my head around is you are not satisfied rearing heifers for a dairy farmer where you have money in the bank every month and no capital involved yet you will contract rear for larry for nothing and take all the risk

Couldn't have put it better ...

ellewood · 29-07-2014 09:28PM

keep going wrote: »

One thing I cant get my head around is you are not satisfied rearing heifers for a dairy farmer where you have money in the bank every month and no capital involved yet you will contract rear for larry for nothing and take all the risk

But if youre still only breaking even ( Im not saying every contract rearer is :rolleyes:) it dosen't matter a toss whether you get paid monthly or once a year if the bank balance is still 0.00 at the end of the year it just means ya pay the bills monthly instead of yearly!

Btw if its such a money spinner for the beef/retired dairy farmer why is it not more popular??? is it just lack of info/details of how it works because im sure there should be many more interested in it

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 10:23PM

frazzledhome wrote: »

The accepted figure is 1 heifer + 1 calf in 1 Lu for 12 mths. What's not adding is the fact that your coming at this with a beef farmers perspective ie know nothing about grass. It would be 80 heifers and 80 calves for the grazing season.

Are you seriously telling us that a well tuned grass farmer on good land targeting meal based on cattle weights couldn't manage this? Remember he only has 80 weanlings for the winter

You are back tracking now frazzled a LU is a straight forward agriculture figure a 6-24 month old heifer or bullock is 0.6LU, a cow is 1LU a ewe or goat is 0.15 LU a horse, donkey or mule is LU. It is accepted terminology accross all livestock. I know a fair bit about grass and I an stocked technically at 2.4LU on the farm part of it is a marchy ground and is included for stocking purposes. So in fact on grassland I am stocked nearly at 3LU/HA.

As I have stressed there will be no issue for most of the year the real problem will be in the autumn. On most farms even on dairy farms the trick to building up grass wedges is to destock and bring in silage ground. It is no point in trying to build up a wedge too early.

We will refer to 1heifer and calf as a unit the Teagasc doc specify 3 units/HA that is equivlent to 2.43LU/HA or about 180 kgsN/HA. That is nitrates derogation territory, itis also what the Derrypatrick herd is stocked at and they have a lot of issues with grass management. Keeping 80 maiden and weanling heifers on 50 acres from September to December is impossible with out housing maidens from mid October.

keep going wrote: »

One thing I cant get my head around is you are not satisfied rearing heifers for a dairy farmer where you have money in the bank every month and no capital involved yet you will contract rear for larry for nothing and take all the risk

It really matters not wheather the money is monthly weekly yearly if the sums do not add up. I do not contract rear for Larry an ex head of the IFA is doing that thank you. I consider no capital involved a big issue as it will give most farmers a tax bill on destocking to go contract rearing and if they then are at the mercy of dairy farmers in the case of withdrawal of contract rearing and they need to recapitilise to reenter beef production.

Noe of the biggest subidisers of Larry were those dairy farmers that finished cattle. It was like a clock, come the first week of February, as pressure build on dairy farmers from calving and new year bills they could not sell the cattle they had finished fast enough. It was like a yearly clock good beef price from 10 days before Christmas until Feburary 10thish.

The last thing I would like is one of you dairy farmers to cost the production of a heifer from May 1st at about 10 weeks to Dec 1st and 21 months. Cost your grass your silage meal dosing herd test etc. I costed it in post no 3 on this thread and in Post No 15 freedominacup reckoned contract rearers woulde be at nothing at this margin level

keep going · 29-07-2014 10:42PM

Its great to be able to negotiate you price before you go into the business besides the the beef game where you spend 2 years carrying an animal and then find out how much you might make/lose at the end.nobody is forcing anyone to go contract rear heifers, if you dont like whats on offer stay at the beef game but you cant expect a dairy farmer to pay what you desire or need, obviously he has to get a good deal for himself as well.would you look at an animal in the mart and say he is too cheap , heres an extra 50 for you

frazzledhome · 29-07-2014 10:42PM

1 heifer and 1 calf is a Lu
I'll leave ye at it. Just be very careful of the big bad dairy farmers trying to cod ye, Larry won't though.

If I were ye I'd consult with someone rearing heifers ie someone who knows what they're talking about

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 10:53PM

I see none of you want to quote a cost of rearing price is this because most serious beef farmers know there costs. Yes the lads that local that will let you drop the heifers into his name and look after yourself will be a cheaper option in theory. But as numbers expand and these guys get more scarce real cost will have to be analysed.

One maiden from Jan1st to Dec1 and a heifer calf from May1st to December 31 is 0.81LU.

29-07-2014 10:54PM

frazzledhome wrote: »

What about this? 30c per day and a €1 for every kilo weight put on the animal.

I have been getting heifers contract reared since 2010. I'm not posting what I'm paying but it's not what ye guys expect. Rearer is delighted with the arrangement. He weighs regularly and thus can concentrate supplement to the ladies that need it most. The key to good profit is SR.

He runs it on about 4 hrs per week. I showed him this thread but unlike some posters here talking about deserving a profit, he says he needs a margin and its up to him to make the profit.

Btw, no other animals on his farm as its a condition of ours

One of the reasons contract rearing suits us is my bro and I have full time jobs and the owner still does all the cattle dosing and vaccinating. We are still under pressure at times but overall we are much better off than calving to beef. Calving time was always a difficult period for us.

Greengrass1 · 29-07-2014 10:54PM

Its not that hard to apply for a derogation Pudsey. We do it every yr.
As regards building a wedge to keep heifers out and being stocked at 4? I am good friends with a man milking 120 cows on 90 acres. He calves very quick in spring and stayems out until November every yr without fail. He feeds meal and silage.
Hardly that hard to run heifers in for 2-3 hrs every day and set up strip wires?

Timmaay · 29-07-2014 10:59PM

Frazzles 4lu/ha would be the same as 3.24 cows/ha assuming your .81 figure is correct Pudsey. That sort of SR would work for good farms with all index 3/4 for soils and plenty of reseeding (ie a clued in farmer on good land).

Applying for derogation isn't the issue at all, its actually growing enough grass so as you don't run seriously short when your stocked that high.

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 11:11PM

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Its not that hard to apply for a derogation Pudsey. We do it every yr.
As regards building a wedge to keep heifers out and being stocked at 4? I am good friends with a man milking 120 cows on 90 acres. He calves very quick in spring and stayems out until November every yr without fail. He feeds meal and silage.
Hardly that hard to run heifers in for 2-3 hrs every day and set up strip wires?

I have one as well for the average dairy farmer with roadways etc maybe but may be an issue on beef farms. However if cattle are hungry they plough ground walking around. Also this lad would be bufferfeeding and cows may have access to shed at all stages so if the run out of grass cows as they are used to it will walk to yard and lie on cubicles. They are not hungry. Leaving cattle outside in wet weather on limited grass they will plough the ground GG.

These cows weighing say 600kgs he is stocked at 2.5LU/Acre however he is buffer feeding and in a wet year will feed at a higher rate as grass utilisation reduces. His LW/HA is about 1500kgs/HA.

The rearer will at this stage of the year be stocked at 3.6LU/HA and be carrying about 2200kgs LW/HA. I do not mind feeding meal outside to weanlings to 500kg cattle it is a non runner especially if numbers are high and you are not feeding enough. Feeding silage in ring feeders is also a dead loss too hard on land having to tidy and clean up after.

The first few years after I bought land I spend at that and it is too hard to make money at it and cleaning up after.

mahoney_j · 29-07-2014 11:17PM

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Its not that hard to apply for a derogation Pudsey. We do it every yr.
As regards building a wedge to keep heifers out and being stocked at 4? I am good friends with a man milking 120 cows on 90 acres. He calves very quick in spring and stayems out until November every yr without fail. He feeds meal and silage.
Hardly that hard to run heifers in for 2-3 hrs every day and set up strip wires?

That's a sr of 3.3 very achievable for a seriously committed well tuned in dairy farmer .as for been not too hard to run heifers in every few days,he'll of a lot more to it than that.as it is it costing me close to 1500 to get a heifer in parlour.my big issue with contract rearing is finding someone who will put as much attention to detail and time into itsca so would more to rearing heifers than grass and throwing a look at them once pec twice a day.when I find one I'll blacken my place with cows(could comfortably manage sr of 4 this year ),aiming for 3.7 and buffer feed when needed

Farmer Pudsey · 29-07-2014 11:21PM

Timmaay wrote: »

Frazzles 4lu/ha would be the same as 3.24 cows/ha assuming your .81 figure is correct Pudsey. That sort of SR would work for good farms with all index 3/4 for soils and plenty of reseeding (ie a clued in farmer on good land).

Applying for derogation isn't the issue at all, its actually growing enough grass so as you don't run seriously short when your stocked that high.

Timmaay the issue is autumn stocking at that. You all know how calves intake increases in the autumn as they pass 6 months of age, and yearling friesian have huge intakes as well. The 0.81 is an averages for the year average can be misleading. It is something dairy farmers fail to understand, because they are level stocked all year around and buffer feed spring and autumn.

Beef farming is different as I stated earlier I much prefer to be under pressure with stocking rate in the spring rather than the autumn. I know that a weanling heifer will be a small 0.6 in the autumn but a incalf Friesian heifer will be fairly hungry 0.6.

If I have weanlings I keep out as long as possible as on grass and 1kg of ration they really thrive and keep going in the autumn. A 18-20 month 500kgs friesian need an amount of range to keep in good condition on water autumn grass which will be impossible at that stocking rate.

Timmaay · 29-07-2014 11:35PM

In that case why not aim to build a late summer wedge of grass, and then skin the place bare during the autumn when the high demand is there, you don't need to hold any covers over winter as you have a low spring demand (unlike us dairymen who have a huge demand in feb).

contract rearing heifers

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