Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Notes in OP,22/7

Quandary wrote: »

Cleverley stats and ratings based on last season - http://www.whoscored.com/Players/69956/

Clasie stats and ratings based on last season - http://www.whoscored.com/Players/90802/Show/Jordy-Clasie

He is also almost 3 years younger than Cleverley. If he was signed for a reasonable fee he would be a significant improvement over almost any of our first team midfielders. If we managed to flog Cleverley to Everton for £10m, I'm sure Clasie could be gotten for a similar fee to replace him.

I'd much rather the 10 million be kept for a player less limited, I'm not saying I don't think Clasie is an upgrade on Cleverly, he is... but think we should be looking at less 7 out of 10's. We've a squad of average players don't want to be replacing average with average, and the squad needs trimming down anyway

Pighead wrote: »

They were 33/1 in Paddy Powers to win it at the start of the tournament so they obviously weren't fancied by too many to do particularly well. Shame Van Persie wasn't at the races in the knockout stages. May have cost them a world cup.

As always. Not sure what's the problem with him but he always misses easy chances in KO matches. I think olympiakos game was exception.

Thank fùck Evra will never play for United again. He seems to be a sound fella and all that, but he's been poison on the pitch for the last few seasons. I'm delighted to see the back of him.

ToiletFusion wrote: »

I'd much rather the 10 million be kept for a player less limited, I'm not saying I don't think Clasie is an upgrade on Cleverly, he is... but think we should be looking at less 7 out of 10's. We've a squad of average players don't want to be replacing average with average, and the squad needs trimming down anyway

Our whole midfield needs major surgery. It's not just our first team options. The only 2 midfielders out of last years squad worth keeping IMO are Carrick and Fellaini, and that's based on their performances over the last few years(not just last season, otherwise we would be getting rid of them all ). Ideally, we would like to ship out Cleverley, Anderson, and Fletcher(nostalgia aside, he is no longer a dependable option).

Also, for what it's worth, Vidal, Kroos, Pogba, Pirlo,and most other "World Class" centre mids only average around 7.5 out of 10 over the course of a season! If our midfielders were averaging 7 out of 10 level performances we would not have finished the season in upper mid table!

Quandary wrote: »

Carvalho for 20m??

Where have you seen his price being reported as low as that? Any articles I've read on him report his price being up around £35m! Some even have him reportedly costing up to £37m!

That's his buy-out clause, so that means the people writing the articles are spoofing.

Interesting article in todays Guardian:



Germany’s Mats Hummels would fit in at Louis van Gaal’s Manchester United

The urbane Borussia Dortmund centre-back would consider a move, and is grounded enough to make an instant impact
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Mats Hummels has gone from budding journalist to being one of the world's best defenders. Photograph: Christophe Simon/AFP/Getty Images


In his summer pursuit of Mats Hummels, Louis van Gaal – and Manchester United fans – can take encouragement from the pilgrimage taken by the Borussia Dortmund and Germany central defender when turning 18.

On Boxing Day 2006 Old Trafford was the destination for Hummels who, along with a friend, was sent by his father, Hermann, to watch Sir Alex Ferguson’s team take on Wigan Athletic as a gift to mark his birthday of 10 days before.

A friend of Hummels says: “Manchester United is a big club for any footballer. Mats went to see them playing Wigan as a present.”

Hummels saw Cristiano Ronaldo score twice, after coming on at half-time, in a 3-1 victory in which Ole Gunnar Solskjaer also registered for a United XI that featured Wayne Rooney, Paul Scholes and Edwin van der Sar.

Hummels, who is now 25 and could cost up to £30m, was then at Bayern Munich, having joined as a six-year-old when his father moved from Bergisch Gladbach – his birthplace – to became a youth team coach at “club Hollywood”.

Hermann, a successful lower league footballer who at Mainz 05 in the early 1990s managed Hummels’ current boss, Jurgen Klopp, coached his son as a 14-year-old, deploying him as a defensive midfielder or centre-back.

Three years after the trip to Old Trafford, in February 2009, the man who scored the 13th-minute winner in Germany’s last-16 victory over France at Brazil 2014 – and who is set to start Sunday’s World Cup final against Argentina – left Bayern for Dortmund, a few months before Van Gaal took over.

His father remained at Bayern, came to know Van Gaal and was impressed by his abilities, believing the Dutchman to be one of European football’s leading coaches.

Hummels is also an admirer of Van Gaal and would welcome the chance to work with the incoming United manager who, although aware of this, is conscious Dortmund are resistant to selling him.

Hummels’ advisors also acknowledge Dortmund’s stance but believe that once Germany’s World Cup campaign is over it could change, and are hopeful United will step up their bid to prise him from the club.

Hummels admits to being attracted by playing in the Premier League although, given the sensitivities of being contracted to Dortmund until 2017, is cagey when discussing the prospect.

During the World Cup, he said: “I never think about that or talk about it because it is something that isn’t important for me right now. Maybe it will be some day, but I don’t expect it to be like that this summer.”

However, should Dortmund receive an offer from United they cannot turn down then Hummels has told friends he is open to the move.

If he was to join, Van Gaal would be acquiring a top-class operator who could fill the void left by Nemanja Vidic and Rio Ferdinand. At Dortmund, Hummels has won two Bundesliga titles plus the German Cup – and played in the 2013 Champions League final, which was lost to Bayern. He will win a 35th cap on Sunday, and was as impressive at Euro 2012 as he has been during Brazil 2014.

Hummels’ parents divorced when he was young, and his urbane upbringing should allow him to instantly adapt to the foreign environment of English football.

Hummel’s mother, Ulla Holthoff, is a journalist and was the first woman to commentate on German football. He accompanied Holthoff to games when younger, and considered following in her footsteps. “Whenever he has a match, there’s at least one journalist saying: ‘I remember when you were little’,” Holthoff says.

“Mats is a bookworm. He read a lot – even at a young age. He used to read comics in particular. He got his word play from Asterix.”

Hummels has a long-standing partner, Cathy Fischer, and is close to 23-year-old younger brother, Jonas, who plays in the German third division.

“We’re cut from the same cloth,” Hummels said of his brother. “If there’s something to come to terms with, we prefer doing it on our own.”

As a manager who wants his players to be leaders, Van Gaal will welcome this self-reliant streak should he manage to sign Hummels this summer.

Pro. F wrote: »

That's his buy-out clause, so that means the people writing the articles are spoofing.

Most of the rags seem to think his buyout clause is somewhere around £35m, based on googling.

If Carvalho could be gotten for as little as £20m I'm sure someone would have submitted a bid by now?

Let's not get sentimental about Vermealen because he might become a United player.

He's been very poor for the last 2 seasons and during his best period at Arsenal his frailties were covered up by his fantastic goalscoring.

Let's not forget who he's behind at Arsenal and his national team.

As a back up LB and CB option he would be a decent signing but I wouldn't put him ahead of any of our current CB options.

Hummels, Vidal and Vermaelen and I would be a very happy man.

glued wrote: »

Where did you see his buy-out clause? The Portuguese press are reporting no such clause.

That's a good point, I haven't any good source for his buy-out clause either. I'm just going on all the articles that have linked him to us. A lot of them have said that's how much his clause is. They all then go on to make the old mistake of assuming that's how much the player will be sold for, which proves that they are guessing about any deal.

I wouldn't trust the Portuguese press either btw, they're as bad as the rest of them.

Quandary wrote: »

Most of the rags seem to think his buyout clause is somewhere around £35m, based on googling.

If Carvalho could be gotten for as little as £20m I'm sure someone would have submitted a bid by now?

Why are you sure? Is he some amazing talent that £20m would represent extraordinary value on? I haven't watched enough of him myself to be sure, but of the little I've seen of him I would amazed if he's worth more than £20m.

Quandary wrote: »

Last March Sky was reporting Carvalho had a buyout clause of £37.5m and 4 years remaining on his current contract.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11667/9192993/transfer-news-manchester-united-linked-with-sporting-lisbon-midfielder-william-carvalho

Herrera supposedly paid the full buyout clause
Fellaini - well we know how we handled that buyout clause


When's the last time united managed to sign a player for much lower than their buyout clause?

Other than those two examples, when's the last time we bought someone with a buyout clause?

Quandary wrote: »

Last March Sky was reporting Carvalho had a buyout clause of £37.5m and 4 years remaining on his current contract.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11667/9192993/transfer-news-manchester-united-linked-with-sporting-lisbon-midfielder-william-carvalho

Herrera supposedly paid the full buyout clause
Fellaini - well we know how we handled that buyout clause


When's the last time united managed to sign a player for much lower than their buyout clause?

It's difficult to buy a player for less then a buyout clause if they have one in their contract.

In the most cases the club simply act like they don't want to sell, and can take the position that they will only sell once the buyout clause is reached.

It's extremely hard to negotiate down a buyout clause, why would a club forgo a few million, knowing they can hold out and get it.

It's rarely a case a "poor" player has a buyout clause, where a club are willing to offload beneath that target mark.

Pro. F wrote: »

Why are you sure? Is he some amazing talent that £20m would represent extraordinary value on? I haven't watched enough of him myself to be sure, but of the little I've seen of him I would amazed if he's worth more than £20m.

Based on the admittedly small number of times I have seen him play(probably 5 or 6 matches) I would say he'd be a very good signing for £20m. We are missing a lot of the things that Carvalho offers as a player. Solid passer, always tries to be available and looks for the ball, aggressive tackler, and he's surprising composed and pacey for such a physically imposing player. He's only 22 since April so the guy still has a lot of maturing to do but do I think he's worth £20m? Without a shadow of a doubt!

Other than those two examples, when's the last time we bought someone with a buyout clause?

None that I can think of, but when it comes to buyout clauses, unless the player throws a strop and tries to force the move, usually the buyout clause is more or less met.

Headshot wrote: »

I cant wait for the pre season games, granted I wont beable to watch them live (damn work and damn midnight games)

was looking at the times, I'll be able to watch two of them - maybe a third if I work from home the next day. Stupid US timezone.

The weekend games are the only really viable ones.