Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

chiropractor yes or no

2

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,942 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Clearlier wrote: »
    My mistake. It's actually only 5 years of training to qualify. It's clearly not an embarrassment.
    How long is the training to be a voodoo witchdoctor?

    Ban billionaires



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 458 ✭✭N8


    Akrasia wrote: »
    How long is the training to be a voodoo witchdoctor?

    I think it is a trainee position with a voodoo witchdoctor?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 458 ✭✭N8


    It seems that even GPs are embracing chiropractors into their medical practices now too....

    http://www.knocknacarramedicalcentre.ie/services-chiropractor/


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    N8 wrote: »
    I think it is a trainee position with a voodoo witchdoctor?

    witchdoctors you say
    "Chiropractors have found in every disease that is supposed to be contagious, a cause in the spine.

    In the spinal column we will find a subluxation that corresponds to every type of disease. If we had one hundred cases of small-pox, I can prove to you where, in one, you will find a subluxation and you will find the same conditions in the other ninety-nine. I adjust one and return his functions to normal... . There is no contagious disease... . There is no infection...-- B.J. Palmer, The Philosophy of Chiropractic, V. Davenport, IA: Palmer School of Chiropractic


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50




  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,942 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Chiropractors in the UK have softened up their language significantly since they were successfully sued by Simon Singh, but they still make ludicrous claims

    Nobody in their right mind could think that athsma can be treated by spinal manipulation, but chiropractors do.

    http://www.healthcentre.org.uk/chiropractors/chiropractors-chiropractic-treatment-asthma.html

    Ban billionaires



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,606 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    Akrasia wrote: »
    Chiropractors in the UK have softened up their language significantly since they were successfully sued by Simon Singh, but they still make ludicrous claims

    Nobody in their right mind could think that athsma can be treated by spinal manipulation, but chiropractors do.

    http://www.healthcentre.org.uk/chiropractors/chiropractors-chiropractic-treatment-asthma.html

    Just to be peadntic, the BCA sued Singh for libel and he successfully appealed.
    They were also caught removing their bogus claims from their websites (which were the subject of Singh's article) before their libel action.

    So they're willing to lie, cheat and sue for their unfounded beliefs.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,613 ✭✭✭BigChap1759


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Over time it could

    CTS from keyboards
    RSI from mouse and other stuff
    constant exposure to toner dust
    iffy food for lunch for 30 years
    dodgy air quality
    Excessive light levels playing havoc with your body clock


    KKN77UD.jpg

    Iffy food for lunch - now that really was a stretch.........

    All of the above is assuming you don't do any exercise or look after yourself in any way


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 576 ✭✭✭dutopia


    There's no definitive scientific evidence that any chiropractic treatments are beneficial. In fact, there have been many reported cases of them causing further injuries to people.

    Go to a physiotherapist or a specialist.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 458 ✭✭N8


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Adrian Wenban is presently the principal of the Barcelona College of Chiropractic.

    Your point being?

    5uspect wrote: »
    Just to be peadntic, the BCA sued Singh for libel and he successfully appealed.

    To be pedantic - the BCA withdrew from the appeal.
    5uspect wrote: »
    So they're willing to lie, cheat and sue for their unfounded beliefs.

    To be fair, the profession in the main was against the BCA suing Singh.

    dutopia wrote: »
    There's no definitive scientific evidence that any chiropractic treatments are beneficial.

    Currently, the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (NICE) recommends spinal manipulation (as practised by chiropractors) as a treatment option for one condition: persistent lower back pain. Read the 2009 NICE guidelines on low back pain.

    dutopia wrote: »
    In fact, there have been many reported cases of them causing further injuries to people.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1570468/


  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,606 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    N8 wrote: »
    To be fair, the profession in the main was against the BCA suing Singh.

    Yet many of them removed the references to treating infant colic from their websites and denied it was ever there.

    Are you a chiropractor?
    Do you think manipulating the spine of a baby can cure colic?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,823 ✭✭✭atilladehun


    I haven't read the whole thread just the first page and last. You said you had to give up running and that you are still swimming.

    If its muscle pain you have then think of muscle exercises, not cardio. Break kyour back up into sections and find out the best exercises to build them up. You'll probably need to do upper back, lower back, hamstrings and neck the most but don't neglect the rest of your body. Then supplement that with proper stretches and foam rolling.

    Running can make issues worse sometimes. Watch runners when they go past you on the street and look at them from behind. Very often they're not balanced, they jerk around and are going to injure themselves.
    Find a physio or Osteo that works for you. Osteos with proper degrees in it are usually best.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Currently, the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (NICE) recommends spinal manipulation (as practised by chiropractors) as a treatment option for one condition: persistent lower back pain. Read the 2009 NICE guidelines on low back pain.


    Thats a bit like saying its recommended to weld certain gas pipelines

    Depends who welds them - can't go making up voodoo welding quals


    Chiro is way too dodgy

    Research has increasingly shown that in about half cases, chiropractic can cause adverse effects.


    Sandy Nette, 46, had her neck manipulated which ripped two arteries and caused multiple strokes which left her totally paralysed and unable to talk

    Sandra has Locked-In syndrome. She is cognitively not impaired and she is aware that other than very limited function in her right ann, she cannot move or communicate due to complete paralysis of nearly all voluntary muscles in her body. It is a condition that has been described as “the closest thing to being buried alive”. There is no treatment nor is there a cure. She has retained sensation throughout her body by which she perceives pain. She cannot swallow, speak or breathe without regular mechanical ventilations and suctioning of her secretions. She cannot attend to her own personal care. She has survived a number of emergency crises in her condition solely as a result of the expert, dedicated efforts of the finest medical, nursing and technical hospital personnel available who have treated her since Stiles’ procedure at Life Stiles.


    Before her series of strokes, Sandy Nette, now 46, worked as a successful administrator for a Canadian gas company. She was incredibly fit and enjoyed an active lifestyle




    llvIiD9.jpg

    But after visiting her chiropractor, two of her vertebral arteries ripped, triggering a series of strokes which left her with locked-in syndrome. She was unable to communicate and doctors did not believe she would survive


    e8RZKxQ.jpg


    Chiropractic treatment to the cervical vertebrae disrupted blood flow to her brain, causing stroke and neurological damage rendering her a tetraplegic.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 746 ✭✭✭calfmuscle


    I had the misfortune of working in a chiropractic clinic when I first came out of college. They where scandalous liars and had no scientific/medical /rational or logical basis for the manipulations they did. And they didnt normally look for consent before they did dangerous high risk cervical spine manipulations.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    More of it :
    Other documents reveal Stiles admitted to forging Nette's signature on a consent form.
    According to an affidavit by Gregory Dunn, the chief operating officer of the Canadian Chiropractic Protective Association, Stiles disclosed he signed Nette's name on a "blank informed consent form" included in records provided to the CCPA
    In a 2010 statement of defence, Stiles initially claimed all procedures were done with Nette's consent


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    more


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 458 ✭✭N8


    5uspect wrote: »
    Are you a chiropractor?

    Are you a medical researcher with a bias toward evidence based alternatives to a medical approach even if its not evidence based?
    calfmuscle wrote: »
    I had the misfortune of working in a chiropractic clinic when I first came out of college. They where scandalous liars and had no scientific/medical /rational or logical basis for the manipulations they did. And they didnt normally look for consent before they did dangerous high risk cervical spine manipulations.

    Many other health care approaches do not get full on signed consent either. I agree re some chiropractors being like full on American approaches - were cash take takes providence - like u I have I been there but seen others where it is patient based.
    I haven't read the whole thread just the first page and last. You said you had to give up running and that you are still swimming.

    If its muscle pain you have then think of muscle exercises, not cardio. Break kyour back up into sections and find out the best exercises to build them up. You'll probably need to do upper back, lower back, hamstrings and neck the most but don't neglect the rest of your body. Then supplement that with proper stretches and foam rolling.

    Running can make issues worse sometimes. Watch runners when they go past you on the street and look at them from behind. Very often they're not balanced, they jerk around and are going to injure themselves.
    Find a physio or Osteo that works for you. Osteos with proper degrees in it are usually best.

    excellent reply - chiropractors properly qualified and interested in patient care will be able for the same or should be able to refer the OP to someone else to help them out - as they should others


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭bodice ripper


    N8 wrote: »
    Are you a medical researcher with a bias toward evidence based alternatives to a medical approach even if its not evidence based?

    This sentence has been subluxated. And you are a chiropractor.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Originally Posted by N8 viewpost.gif
    Are you a medical researcher with a bias toward evidence based alternatives to a medical approach even if its not evidence based?
    This sentence has been subluxated. And you are a chiropractor.

    Hang on, i'll give it an adjustment to release the "innate intelligence"
    .


    There you go - minor issue though - it doesn't say anything because it is now paralyzed


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    N8 wrote: »
    Many other health care approaches do not get full on signed consent either.

    Think you missed this bit
    Other documents reveal Stiles admitted to forging Nette's signature on a consent form.
    According to an affidavit by Gregory Dunn, the chief operating officer of the Canadian Chiropractic Protective Association, Stiles disclosed he signed Nette's name on a "blank informed consent form" included in records provided to the CCPA
    In a 2010 statement of defence, Stiles initially claimed all procedures were done with Nette's consent


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 746 ✭✭✭Starokan


    Some interesting points here, I genuinely had no idea that chiropractors were seen in this way, my assumption was they were all highly trained etc. Personally I have had enormous problems with regard to my back for the past 2/3 years. I was actually recommended to a chiropractor by a doctor which to be honest gave me the impression that the medical profession had a positive view of the practice.

    I went to see said chiropractor , before he would treat me he insisted on an MRI being carried out first. I got this and went back and honestly I can say that he has improved my situation a hundred fold. I was put on a twelve week programme and then phased out to once every months to two to three and now 6 months. Unbelievable difference in my quality of life and I have recommended this chiropractor to many people since.

    Is there an element of the medical profession that are pro chiropractic for want of a better phrase , to be honest had I read this thread or similar prior to my first visit I probably would never have gone. You learn something new every day. This is a total eye opener for me.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,606 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    N8 wrote: »
    Are you a medical researcher with a bias toward evidence based alternatives to a medical approach even if its not evidence based?

    I'm an engineer. Are you a chiropractor? You seem very cagey about admitting to something you seem to think is evidence based.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 458 ✭✭N8


    Why concentrate on whether I am a chiropractor or not - what has that got to do with your argument 5uspect?

    I thought any debate should concentrate on the ball not the player.

    Todays Irish Chiropractors in the main are as Starokan described - honest, well trained and professional. Yes a few are not but this is the same in any profession.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,942 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Starokan wrote: »
    Some interesting points here, I genuinely had no idea that chiropractors were seen in this way, my assumption was they were all highly trained etc. Personally I have had enormous problems with regard to my back for the past 2/3 years. I was actually recommended to a chiropractor by a doctor which to be honest gave me the impression that the medical profession had a positive view of the practice.

    I went to see said chiropractor , before he would treat me he insisted on an MRI being carried out first. I got this and went back and honestly I can say that he has improved my situation a hundred fold. I was put on a twelve week programme and then phased out to once every months to two to three and now 6 months. Unbelievable difference in my quality of life and I have recommended this chiropractor to many people since.

    Is there an element of the medical profession that are pro chiropractic for want of a better phrase , to be honest had I read this thread or similar prior to my first visit I probably would never have gone. You learn something new every day. This is a total eye opener for me.


    When Chiropractors recommend treatments that are not chiropractic in nature, they're can often be effective. Changes to posture or stretching exercises or massages can treat some kinds of back pain. However,the minute they start implementing the theory of chiropractic 'medicine' they get into very risky territory.

    It is much safer to skip chiropractors altogether and see qualified medical practitioners such as chartered physiotherapists

    Ban billionaires



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,360 ✭✭✭iwillhtfu


    N8 wrote: »
    Why concentrate on whether I am a chiropractor or not - what has that got to do with your argument 5uspect.

    Well if you're a chiropractor would it not be fait to say you would have a bias towards the practice?

    Clearly the other poster has no immediate bias as he is neither a chiropractor or a medical professional.

    Actually even in writing the above sentence I noticed I've described one as a medical professional and the other as a chiropractor. Interesting.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,606 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    N8 wrote: »
    Why concentrate on whether I am a chiropractor or not - what has that got to do with your argument 5uspect?

    I thought any debate should concentrate on the ball not the player.

    Todays Irish Chiropractors in the main are as Starokan described - honest, well trained and professional. Yes a few are not but this is the same in any profession.

    You're the one making unfounded and unsupported claims that the chiropractic method is evidence based. I've provided evidence here and elsewhere that it is not. You've provided no such evidence. All you have done is evade and assert that if it's good enough for a few GPs then it must be fine.

    So my concern is that you're a chiropractic shill.
    Do you believe that chiropractors should treat asthma?
    Do you believe that chiropractors should treat infant colic?
    What are your views on vaccines?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 247 ✭✭bridest


    wow my thread has been hijacked. haven't been on in a few days. I just need to know how to release this muscle tension under my left shoulder or inbetween 2 ribs or wherever it is , don't need to know all the other stuff that has been posted here. but thanks anyway!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 506 ✭✭✭johnb25


    I have had a history of back problems most of my adult life....almost 30 years. Not very serious most of the time, but it has flattened me a few times over the years.
    After it flared up about four years ago I went to a Chiropractor, and got great relief. He was recommended to me by others who had been to see him. I have been back to him three or four times since.
    He did a couple of manipulation of my back which gets it back into alignment. After a few days of applying ice packs to the affected area of my back, the soreness goes I am as good as new.
    I found his treatment more impactful than doing exercises recommended by Physios.
    The basis of Chiropractic as I understand it is that correct alignment of the spine is essential to back health, which makes sense to me. Like others, I am a bit skeptical about some of the wider medical claims, but that is not relevant to the OP's question, or my own problems, so I just disregard them.
    I too work at a computer most of the day, and I found getting the chair and screen to the correct heights made a difference to correct posture, and how my back felt.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,606 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    There is evidence that deep massage etc can work, nobody is denying that.
    Unlike homeopathy, you do get an actual physical intervention.
    The problem lies with the reasons provided by chiropractors for their treatments. It's a fantasy that isn't remotely founded in anything scientific. You don't know what your getting and the chiropractors can make it up as they go along. This makes it very dangerous.

    This lets them make all kinds of claims such as treating infant colic with spinal manipulation (and then suing scientists for criticising them). When genuine people like you talk about how you were helped it gives them the legitimacy they crave. People you talk to then think their just like real doctors.

    They are not. They are quacks.

    If your physio isn't helping you go to a different one. If your dentist isn't much good you don't go see a toothologist, similarity a dietician can help your diet and not a nutritionist. Anyone can can call themselves a nutritionist, just like any crank can become a chiropractor with a fancy cert from quack school.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 506 ✭✭✭johnb25


    5uspect wrote: »
    There is evidence that deep massage etc can work, nobody is denying that.
    Unlike homeopathy, you do get an actual physical intervention.
    The problem lies with the reasons provided by chiropractors for their treatments. It's a fantasy that isn't remotely founded in anything scientific. You don't know what your getting and the chiropractors can make it up as they go along. This makes it very dangerous.

    This lets them make all kinds of claims such as treating infant colic with spinal manipulation (and then suing scientists for criticising them). When genuine people like you talk about how you were helped it gives them the legitimacy they crave. People you talk to then think their just like real doctors.

    They are not. They are quacks.

    If your physio isn't helping you go to a different one. If your dentist isn't much good you don't go see a toothologist, similarity a dietician can help your diet and not a nutritionist. Anyone can can call themselves a nutritionist, just like any crank can become a chiropractor with a fancy cert from quack school.

    I was helped for a back problem, not a general medical condition. This is the area of the body Chiropractors work on, and the one the OP needs help with. As I mentioned above, I am also skeptical about the claims to heal other conditions. Sharing a positive experience of one Chiropractor for a back problem does not promote the whole discipline as being beneficial for a range of medical conditions.


Advertisement
Advertisement