Kids arrested for mouthing at Gardai (video)

tayto lover · 08-06-2014 08:13PM

catallus wrote: »

Nonsense. Violence begets submission and obedience. Sometimes it is the only way.

It is never the way.
In that video the garda did the right thing. They didn't use excessive force and on several occasions actually tried to explain the situation to the youngsters.
However the boys didn't want to know and their language and reactions necessitated the amount of force used and no more. In fact I didn't see any violence above that necessary to put them into the garda car.

end of the road · 08-06-2014 08:14PM

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

It doesn't really, it hammers the point home quite well.

no, it doesn't

steddyeddy · 08-06-2014 08:14PM

PeteFalk78 wrote: »

Should have tied those little knackers to a lampost on James Street.

You want to tie up kids? Do you not see what's wrong with that?

end of the road · 08-06-2014 08:18PM

Simply Red wrote: »

All i see in this video is 2 scumbags being rightfully arrested for verbally abusing 2 guards while trying to do their job

not rightly at all, waste of money just for "verbal abuse" should not be an arrestable offense, if i get verbally abused i have to put up and shut up

Simply Red wrote: »

nobody deserves to be spoken to like that while trying to do their job.

agree, but many of us have no option but to do the job along with having to put up and shut up when abused, the guards should be no different

LionelNashe · 08-06-2014 08:19PM

Foxhound38 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCJvDzbyWEk

What do ye make of this?

Seems the first kid hurt his hand, but the other lads thought he was getting arrested and so the situation got a bit out of hand.

Should they have arrested the young lad or was it over the top?

Who was in the right here?

The guard shouldn't have been dragging that kid around by his t-shirt in the first 5 seconds of the clip; the kid was practically pulled off his feet and he was knocked against the wing-mirror of the car. Everything that came after it was the crowd reacting to that.

Hootanany · 08-06-2014 08:20PM

Sticks & stones turn the other cheek springs to mind

Neeson · 08-06-2014 08:21PM

They could do public hangings at the five lamps. Soon the antisocial behaviour would end. Joe Duffy could be chief executioner.

suicide_circus · 08-06-2014 08:22PM

LionelNashe wrote: »

The guard shouldn't have been dragging that kid around by his t-shirt in the first 5 seconds of the clip; the kid was practically pulled off his feet and he was knocked against the wing-mirror of the car. Everything that came after it was the crowd reacting to that.

not the wing-mirror!! :eek:

the_syco · 08-06-2014 08:27PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Never works. Violence begets violence.

Agreed, but unfortunately some scrotes need to get shot by rubber bullets (the ones who attack ambulance and fire crews when said crews are helping injured people).

TheNog · 08-06-2014 08:34PM

end of the road wrote: »

agree, but many of us have no option but to do the job along with having to put up and shut up when abused, the guards should be no different

That's a crazy notion. People should not be allowed abuse anyone

darkpagandeath · 08-06-2014 08:54PM

LionelNashe wrote: »

The guard shouldn't have been dragging that kid around by his t-shirt in the first 5 seconds of the clip; the kid was practically pulled off his feet and he was knocked against the wing-mirror of the car. Everything that came after it was the crowd reacting to that.

Wonder will you have the same attitude when this type pull the wing mirrors off your car or smash the window as they have nothing better to do to entertain themselves. Oh wait I can guess there under 16 so they don't know any better and should be given the benefit of the doubt. Or they could be chucking stones at emergency vehicles stopping them from getting to someone you know dying in a car crash ? Sure they don't know any better, They do know their rights though and are not shy of abusing them. And I am using the word type because it’s exactly that, the ones who are clearly antisocial and have no respect for anyone apart for their peers.

end of the road · 08-06-2014 08:54PM

conorhal wrote: »

People are pissed off, rightly so.

thats the irish way, rabel rabel about every thing

conorhal wrote: »

We need to take back our streets from the anti social element of society.

jesus would you stop, we have a problem yes but suggesting the streets need to be taken back is over the top nonsense

conorhal wrote: »

it can be done, the problem is the lack of will to do it.

no, its down to resources and money.

conorhal wrote: »

When Guillani wanted to clean up Time Square in New York and reclaim it from the pimps, dealers and junkies people said it couldn't be done.

no they didn't, they said it would take a lot of money and resources, something america has.

conorhal wrote: »

He showed them that all that was required was the will to do it and the square went from a no go area to a tourist attraction becaue the will existed on his part.

no, it was money and resources, and loony rudys policy to drive anything he believed tourists would find undesirable and shocking (even though the same would happen in their own countries) away from the tourist areas and drive it underground out of site out of mind under the guise of "zero tolerents" along with allowing the cops to behave with impunity i'm sure. even the homeless shelters were shut and the homeless more or less thrown away beaten within an inch of their lives and turfed away to somewhere other then the tourist areas, no loony rudy was interested in cleaning up the streets to hide away NY'S problems rather then actually deal with them thinking that tourists were/are thick and come from countries where there are no social problems

Paramite Pie · 08-06-2014 09:09PM

end of the road wrote: »

many of us have no option but to do the job along with having to put up and shut up when abused, the guards should be no different

I'm pretty sure the guards have a job that is more important than yours or mine. The guards are different for a reason. And it's safe to say they get more abuse than any other profession, since it's officially their job to stand up to these people after all.

The kids could have walked away at any point. If the guards left them to it, it would only embolden them further.

LionelNashe · 08-06-2014 09:33PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Wonder will you have the same attitude when this type pull the wing mirrors off your car or smash the window as they have nothing better to do to entertain themselves. Oh wait I can guess there under 16 so they don't know any better and should be given the benefit of the doubt. Or they could be chucking stones at emergency vehicles stopping them from getting to someone you know dying in a car crash ? Sure they don't know any better, They do know their rights though and are not shy of abusing them. And I am using the word type because it’s exactly that, the ones who are clearly antisocial and have no respect for anyone apart for their peers.

They had no respect for the guard who was casually dragging their crying friend around with his feet barely on the ground, and then tried to justify it by saying he 'had a duty of care' for the kid. Just because he wears a uniform doesn't mean he can assault a child. On the other hand, maybe, like you, he just knows 'the type' so he reckoned it was justified.

end of the road · 08-06-2014 09:37PM

Paramite Pie wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the guards have a job that is more important than yours or mine. The guards are different for a reason. And it's safe to say they get more abuse than any other profession, since it's officially their job to stand up to these people after all.

The kids could have walked away at any point. If the guards left them to it, it would only embolden them further.

they are made out to be different for no reason, they aren't different, all jobs are important

darkpagandeath · 08-06-2014 09:41PM

LionelNashe wrote: »

They had no respect for the guard who was casually dragging their crying friend around with his feet barely on the ground, and then tried to justify it by saying he 'had a duty of care' for the kid. Just because he wears a uniform doesn't mean he can assault a child. On the other hand, maybe, like you, he just knows 'the type' so he reckoned it was justified.

How do you know they are not well well know to the Garda ? before assuming some little angles were randomly targeted by the evil Garda for a beating. I assume the Garda work the area and know the people around the area ? We only have one side of the story, How do we know they don’t hang around this area causing trouble.

conorhal · 08-06-2014 09:50PM

Mark Tapley wrote: »

No problem with the Guards response they have to make judgement calls on the spot.
My problem is with the lunatic response some posters have to any crime. Anybody who uses the word "scumbag" or "subhuman" is not worth listening to. If you have concerns about the level of crime you don't need to get irrational about it.
Some people love a bit of self righteous indignation.

Yes, yes they do, though you seems not to spot the irony of that statement.

Like a said, people are angry about what they see in the streets of our cities every day and they're venting a bit of spleen, they aren't the problem, the real problem is on the street, not on boards.ie. You can argue about the language people use to describe the problem all day but that doesn't address the issues that generate the anger people feel. Rather then ignoring such invective and not listening, perhaps you should ask yourself, why are people this excercised? Why is this a constant topic of conversation? What's being done to ensure we don't see endless 'scumbag' bashing threads on Boards?
If these threads are an endless broken record, that to me says once again the problems that generate them are clearly at the bottom of our government's priority list, but then isn't most everything that constitutes the everyday concerns of the man on street pretty much the bottom of their list of priorities?

conorhal · 08-06-2014 10:02PM

end of the road wrote: »

thats the irish way, rabel rabel about every thing
jesus would you stop, we have a problem yes but suggesting the streets need to be taken back is over the top nonsense

Bollox, the Irish way is to fatalistically shrug and say, as you do, a shure what can you? Eveything's grand, and then bury their heads in the sand and wait for the issue to explode in their faces and then have a tribunal about it.

end of the road wrote: »

no, it was money and resources, and loony rudys policy to drive anything he believed tourists would find undesirable and shocking (even though the same would happen in their own countries) away from the tourist areas and drive it underground out of site out of mind under the guise of "zero tolerents" along with allowing the cops to behave with impunity i'm sure. even the homeless shelters were shut and the homeless more or less thrown away beaten within an inch of their lives and turfed away to somewhere other then the tourist areas, no loony rudy was interested in cleaning up the streets to hide away NY'S problems rather then actually deal with them thinking that tourists were/are thick and come from countries where there are no social problems

Again, bollox.

I posted this on another thread, it's a prime example of what you can do when there's the will to do it:

Guards are getting pretty pissed off on the ground about the revolving door that is the judicial system which is clearly broken.

I was very interested to read about a recent initiative taken by a bunch of young Guards on the beat to combat the problem of dealers and junkies in the city center.
They were tired of arresting the same guys for dealing over and over and frequently seeing then back on their same corners within hours of arresting them, so they instituted something called 'station bail'. They would seize any cash the dealers had on them and other property as evidence when they arrested them. That property was generally the dealers mobile phone which was retained to be searched for evidence of dealing.
It soon had a dramatic effect, loosing their phone effectivey put the dealers out of business, customers couldn't call them until they had a new established number, so the Guards were effectively disrupting their business and creating such inconvenience for them that 400 dealers have departed the city center because it was becoming too much hassle for them to conduct business there.

There's a lesson in that story, give the power to deal with the problem to those that know how to solve it, permit initatives by those at the coal face of the problem and you'll see results. Leave the problem in the hands of the courts and bureaucrats and all you get is the same failed solutions to an ever growing problem.

That's an example of a simple solution had a big impact on a problem, so too is making it clear to those behaving in an antisocial manner on our streets that it is unacceptable, there are rules, there is a line and if you cross it there are consequences. Too often guards will walk on by rather then enforcing the law, I applaud the actions of those guards in the OP's post, they didn't. And that's how you solve the issue of making our streets a pleasant place to walk, by doing so.

LionelNashe · 08-06-2014 10:09PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

How do you know they are not well well know to the Garda ? before assuming some little angles were randomly targeted by the evil Garda for a beating. I assume the Garda work the area and know the people around the area ? We only have one side of the story, How do we know they don’t hang around this area causing trouble.

You're the one who has been making assumptions. You 'assume the Garda work the area and know the people' (your words), and you say that they're the type of kids who damage property, assault emergency services etc.

I live 100 meters from that spot. I've seen groups of teenagers there twice lately at night, which is unusual, but I haven't seen any trouble. Even if they had been 'hanging around the area causing trouble', and there's no reason to say that they had been, its irrelevant to the question of whether the cop is allowed to handle the first kid as roughly as he was in that video.

Hootanany · 08-06-2014 10:12PM

What were the unfortunate street urchins up to before this vid was posted please?

carpejugulum · 08-06-2014 10:14PM

"ye scumbags"

How ironic

foggy_lad · 08-06-2014 10:14PM

LionelNashe wrote: »

The guard shouldn't have been dragging that kid around by his t-shirt in the first 5 seconds of the clip; the kid was practically pulled off his feet and he was knocked against the wing-mirror of the car. Everything that came after it was the crowd reacting to that.

That young boy was doing his best to break free from the grip the Garda had of him, the Garda showed great restraint in not grabbing his arm which would have bruised and not slamming the little boy up against the car.

As far as the Garda was concerned this little boy was going with them either to the station to wait for those in charge of him or straight home. it is quite obvious that this little boy was wriggling around dragging his feet and doing everything to get away and the Garda couldn't allow that in case people might start a thread on boards.ie calling him a monster for neglecting the duty of care he had to a little boy.

Yellowblackbird · 08-06-2014 10:14PM

end of the road wrote: »

LOL. no, not because of me, we tried your way it failed, i can at least admit my way is far from perfect but it has a better chance of working then the old failed ways which you subscribe to.

Trying to use the institutional abuse that took place in this country as a strawman.

My way is 12,000 years of civilisation. And it’s a success not a failure.

end of the road wrote: »

oh and by the way when one mentions bull**** such as "do gooders, PC brigade" and so on it invalidates their point

Yes. You are a do gooder.

darkpagandeath · 08-06-2014 10:26PM

LionelNashe wrote: »

You're the one who has been making assumptions. You 'assume the Garda work the area and know the people' (your words), and you say that they're the type of kids who damage property, assault emergency services etc.

I live 100 meters from that spot. I've seen groups of teenagers there twice lately at night, which is unusual, but I haven't seen any trouble. Even if they had been 'hanging around the area causing trouble', and there's no reason to say that they had been, its irrelevant to the question of whether the cop is allowed to handle the first kid as roughly as he was in that video.

Interesting now their teenagers not children ? and you spend 24hrs a day monitoring that spot ? From what I can see on the video they could easily conceal themselves in the trees or other areas out of your sight. You seem to be inferring i have a problem with “ Working class children” i have not i have a problem with any antisocial disrespectful children. Can i ask you what is reasonable force to restrain someone who is trying to escape your custardy as a Garda ? And why is any form of restraint by a Garda automatically assault now and not reasonable force ? And I used this type to make an example where did i say they specifically did what i covered in the example ?

steddyeddy · 08-06-2014 10:30PM

I think I need more facts before I can comment further:

Why did the gaurds stop in the first place?
What were the kids up to in the first place?
Was the kids hand badly hurt?

steddyeddy · 08-06-2014 10:32PM

Yellowblackbird wrote: »

Trying to use the institutional abuse that took place in this country as a strawman.

My way is 12,000 years of civilisation. And it’s a success not a failure.

Yes. You are a do gooder.

Do gooder? People in this thread are condoning the children getting tied up and/or walloped with batons/rubber bullets ect. If that doesn't have echoes of child abuse I don't know what does.

Runnerkilcoole · 08-06-2014 10:32PM

The Guards did a good job.

RoryMac · 08-06-2014 10:33PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

I think I need more facts before I can comment further:

Why did the gaurds stop in the first place?

What were the kids up to in the first place?

Was the kids hand badly hurt?

Apparently the kids were in a park after it had been closed for public use.

On the 3rd question some of the other kids can be heard saying he hurt his hand puchimg a gate

Hootanany · 08-06-2014 10:34PM

conorhal wrote: »

Bollox, the Irish way is to fatalistically shrug and say, as you do, a shure what can you? Eveything's grand, and then bury their heads in the sand and wait for the issue to explode in their faces and then have a tribunal about it.

Again, bollox.

I posted this on another thread, it's a prime example of what you can do when there's the will to do it:

Guards are getting pretty pissed off on the ground about the revolving door that is the judicial system which is clearly broken.

I was very interested to read about a recent initiative taken by a bunch of young Guards on the beat to combat the problem of dealers and junkies in the city center.
They were tired of arresting the same guys for dealing over and over and frequently seeing then back on their same corners within hours of arresting them, so they instituted something called 'station bail'. They would seize any cash the dealers had on them and other property as evidence when they arrested them. That property was generally the dealers mobile phone which was retained to be searched for evidence of dealing.
It soon had a dramatic effect, loosing their phone effectivey put the dealers out of business, customers couldn't call them until they had a new established number, so the Guards were effectively disrupting their business and creating such inconvenience for them that 400 dealers have departed the city center because it was becoming too much hassle for them to conduct business there.

There's a lesson in that story, give the power to deal with the problem to those that know how to solve it, permit initatives by those at the coal face of the problem and you'll see results. Leave the problem in the hands of the courts and bureaucrats and all you get is the same failed solutions to an ever growing problem.

That's an example of a simple solution had a big impact on a problem, so too is making it clear to those behaving in an antisocial manner on our streets that it is unacceptable, there are rules, there is a line and if you cross it there are consequences. Too often guards will walk on by rather then enforcing the law, I applaud the actions of those guards in the OP's post, they didn't. And that's how you solve the issue of making our streets a pleasant place to walk, by doing so.

If so i conend you

steddyeddy · 08-06-2014 10:39PM

RoryMac wrote: »

Apparently the kids were in a park after it had been closed for public use.

On the 3rd question some of the other kids can be heard saying he hurt his hand puchimg a gate

I'm going to guess this was in a inner city area?

Kids arrested for mouthing at Gardai (video)

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