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796 children buried in Septic Tank in Galway - ### Mod Warning in 1st Post

13567…66

Comments

  • #62
    gctest50
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,597 ✭✭✭gctest50


    .jacksparrow. wrote: »
    For such a small country we have a shameful past, mostly to the with the Catholic church.

    It's not "we" though - if it wasn't you and you were not yet around - it wasn't you.

    The RCC and friends made Unmarried Mothers less than human so they could sell their babies


  • #63
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,780 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    jandm wrote: »
    I was baptised !

    Did your parents find a nice priest because that's what it took to get us baptised.


  • #64
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,246 ✭✭✭Daith


    obezyana wrote: »
    Just had a look on the RTE website no mention of anything about this story???????

    Fortunately

    http://www.broadsheet.ie/2014/06/04/mortification-once-again/


  • #65
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Ceauşescu in Romania did the same as the church did here, he was breeding an army too and dumped the handicapped and disabled and mentally retarded into orphanages to die. Ha also banned contraception and abortion.

    The church did the same in Australia with indigenous children and babies and those who were mixed breed were given special attention as they were destined do work as servants in rich people's homes as nanny's and cleaners and chauffeurs etc.


  • #66
    oceanman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,779 ✭✭✭oceanman


    Resonator75 wrote: »
    The Roman Catholic Church must be eradicated from this land. Murdering Bastard$.
    never going to happen in any of our lifetimes im afraid...


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  • #67
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    It shows how the tentacles of the catholic church are still wrapped tight around some media outlets in this country

    You mean the one that displays religious pictures and plays the Angelus before doing the news ??

    This country is weird though in many respects.

    I was casting my vote in a church outhouse right under a big statue of Mary a couple of weeks ago.

    We still don't even seem to understand why confusing state and church isn't a good thing.

    The Oireachtas still starts sessions with :

    http://www.oireachtas.ie/viewdoc.asp?fn=/documents/a-misc/prayer.htm

    "Direct, we beseech Thee, O Lord, our actions by Thy holy inspirations and carry them on by Thy gracious assistance; that every word and work of ours may always begin from Thee, and by Thee be happily ended; through Christ our Lord. Amen"

    So, don't be expecting any objectivity on church issues.


  • #68
    super_furry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,355 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    Grayson wrote: »
    It's nuts that we need to have US newspapers break stories like this. I like to think that RTE does it's best with it's limited resources, but events like this and pantigate show how quickly it'll crumple when faced with catholic right wingers.

    US newspapers didn't break the story at all, they're catching up on it about a week after Irish sources, like RTE had it. This is from 30 May http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0530/620665-tuam-babies-grave/


  • #69
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,246 ✭✭✭Daith


    super_furry wrote: »
    US newspapers didn't break the story at all, they're catching up on it about a week after Irish sources, like RTE had it. This is from 30 May http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0530/620665-tuam-babies-grave/

    That's about a memorial fund. Not exactly asking what happened to these children is it? Or even a mention that it was a septic tank. "Unmarked grave"
    Diocesan Secretary Fr Fintan Monaghan said today that Archbishop of Tuam Michael Neary would meet Bon Secours representatives with a view to erecting a permanent memorial.

    He said the nuns were separate from the running of the diocese but the Church was sympathetic to the efforts of the local community to erect a memorial.


  • #70
    denhaagenite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,169 ✭✭✭denhaagenite


    Plazaman wrote: »
    Don't get me wrong, this story is tragic beyond belief and I'm no fan of the Church but to lay the blame solely at their feet is letting others off the hook. The State was equally to blame and many girls were sent to these workhouses through the courts and guards. In some cases their own families turned them in because of the shame their pregnancy would bring on the family.

    True but as we learned from the Magdalene Laundries report last year, the Church are happy to sit back and let the State take full responsibility while completely extricating themselves from any wrongdoing- as in today's world, the buck stops there. We all know that this has historically not been the case, and that they had more control than the State back in the day.

    I feel that there have been so many atrocities by the RCC that there is absolute grounds to start taking cases against them in the European Court of Justice. These children may have died from "natural" causes but they Church were paid to look after them and they were neglected and then dumped in a mass grave. To me this mirrors (on a much smaller scale) the killing fields in Cambodia, for example. Starvation and neglect are just crueller forms of genocide. Of helpless children- it really beggars belief. The Church needs to be held accountable for their heinous actions, not just in Ireland, but all over Europe.


  • #71
    REXER
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 458 ✭✭REXER


    Reformed Character wrote: »
    We don't know with any certainty that they were born dead, they may well have been murdered because they were born with mental of physical disabilities and thus were not fit for sale to Americans, which was the real business of these place, baby selling!

    So really the list of charges should include International Child Trafficking as in reality that is what was going on!


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  • #72
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Reformed Character wrote: »
    Twice the mortality of the child mortality rate for the rest of society, children up six dying?
    It is very possible that murder was committed, which is all I said, possible.
    There are no made up accusations being made!

    Refusing to care properly for and feed small children and beating them will result in many "accidents" and deaths from pneumonia measles or other "normal" illnesses, and there would be no need for an autopsy which would show the neglect or bones broken because the local doctor would put down whatever the nuns or priest said was the cause of death!

    Surely that is murder!


  • #73
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,780 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    super_furry wrote: »
    US newspapers didn't break the story at all, they're catching up on it about a week after Irish sources, like RTE had it. This is from 30 May http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0530/620665-tuam-babies-grave/

    Cheers for that.


  • #74
    Plazaman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,016 ✭✭✭Plazaman


    Reformed Character wrote: »
    Here we go!

    What? Are you saying the State had no part to play? If I remember correctly Patrick Galvins book, Song for a Raggy Boy, documented a incident of a young boy escaping from one of the workhouses to a Garda Station and outlining the physical and sexual abuse to the Guard only to be dragged back to the same place by him. Just sayin there more ba5tards hangin round back then than just priests and nuns.


  • #75
    Colser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,572 ✭✭✭Colser


    The whole thing is horrific and heartbreaking..one can only imagine the suffering of those poor babies/children.There must be women who were directly affected by this atrocity alive today who are being tortured again reading this story.My heart goes out to them and I hope they have someone in their lives than they can open up to and get some kind of understanding and comfort from after the mental and physical torture that the pillars of society caused them to endure.


  • #76
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,039 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    On radio 1 now


  • #77
    humanji
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,976 ✭✭✭✭humanji


    Mod: Folks, please refrain from making wild accusations and/or assumptions of murder and torture. And don't use this thread as another church bashing thread. If the story makes you so incensed that your can't post anything other than to express your hatred of the RCC, then just don't post and save us all some time. You can, of course, criticise the events and the people involved, but don't lose the run of yourselves.


  • #78
    Micky Dolenz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,079 ✭✭✭✭Micky Dolenz


    MOD

    Just to add to humanji's post.

    We understand that this is very emotive.

    Below is just a sample of posts which will lead to this discussion being shut down. Have an opinion but keep it within the LAWS of the land. Hate Speech, unfounded accusations and blasphemy can not be tolerated.

    There won't be anymore warnings.

    Thanks.

    Akrasia wrote: »
    The catholic church are 'pro-life' up until the point the baby is born, after that, they are pro-catholic agenda, and anyone or anything that posed a threat to their dominance were literally flung onto the sceptic tank.
    Reformed Character wrote: »
    Scum, and those who might defend or try in any way to defend or explain away this crime against humanity are even lower than the scum who committed it!
    Reformed Character wrote: »
    We don't know with any certainty that they were born dead, they may well have been murdered because they were born with mental of physical disabilities and thus were not fit for sale to Americans, which was the real business of these place, baby selling!
    Resonator75 wrote: »
    The Roman Catholic Church must be eradicated from this land. Murdering Bastard$.


  • #79
    greenflash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 499 ✭✭greenflash


    The church closed the loophole that allows catholics to leave following the "Count Me Out" campaign a few years ago.


    http://www.indymedia.ie/article/97899?userlanguage=ga&save_prefs=true


    My daughter is not baptised and will not be (same will go for my unborn child). She's registered with our local Educate Together school and I will campaign for the removal of religious control of the Irish education system.


  • #80
    kylith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,739 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Seedy Arling wrote: »
    There's a brief mention in the Irish Times and Independent.ie is obsessed with some dude filming people taking a dump.

    What am i missing here? :confused:
    They're probably hoping that if they don't report it we'll forget about it.


  • #81
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    its very hard to get your head around what Ireland was like in the past.

    Did family's ever look after anyone in the past or is there a myth of family care.

    For example huge mental hospitals in which thousand's were dumped in to.

    County homes where old people were put in to a lot of this was to do with a greed for land and inheritance.

    Church run mother and child homes, orphanages and the like. They were every where.

    Madglan laundries.

    Church run schools where they took in teenage boys who became christen brothers all this with the consent of the parents.

    Hostels for the working poor in cities run by church organisation

    Boarding schools were everywhere and it was cheap to send you child to them, and thousand's of children went to them again church run.

    It comes across as society that was passive, pious, that expected someone else to take of their children, parents, and those with a learning disabilities or mental illness.. why were the families not taking care of their own. Why was there an expectation of the church or state to take care of them?.


    It was after the famine that the church as we know it was organised in Ireland, what happened before the famine to unmarried mothers? how come after the famine we ended up with a society that expected someone else to take care of our problems?


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  • #82
    denhaagenite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,169 ✭✭✭denhaagenite


    The petition seems to be gaining traction, keep sharing the link and it will be at 10,000 in a matter of hours. Although having said that, will it be enough?

    http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Frances_Fitzgerald_Irish_Minister_for_Justice_and_Equality_A_full_Gardai_investigation_into_the_mass_grave_in_Tuam_Co_Ga/?copy


  • #83
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    denhaagenite wrote: »
    The petition seems to be gaining traction, keep sharing the link and it will be at 10,000 in a matter of hours. Although having said that, will it be enough?

    http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Frances_Fitzgerald_Irish_Minister_for_Justice_and_Equality_A_full_Gardai_investigation_into_the_mass_grave_in_Tuam_Co_Ga/?copy

    What's to stop it from being ignored? Is there any obligation for whoever this petition is targeted towards?


  • #84
    denhaagenite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,169 ✭✭✭denhaagenite


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    What's to stop it from being ignored? Is there any obligation for whoever this petition is targeted towards?

    Well this is my point- it can be ignored and there is no obligation on Frances Fitzgerald to respond, but if it can be put to the forefront of the news both nationally and internationally then non response won't be an option. I heard this for the first time last week and it hasn't been far from my mind since.


  • #85
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,039 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Its the "Dying Room" part of this horror story that makes me feel so desperately sad and angry,if a child is still born well that happens sometimes but to leave a child to die alone till it starves to death just goes beyond evil:mad:


  • #86
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    Well if the government realise this is an issue that might cost them votes, they'll respond.

    I can 100% assure you this will be an issue that will help me decide who to vote for!


  • #87
    Supergurrier
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,302 ✭✭✭Supergurrier


    God wills it !


  • #88
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,771 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    Well if the government realise this is an issue that might cost them votes, they'll respond.

    I can 100% assure you this will be an issue that will help me decide who to vote for!

    The government will be fairly quiet given the hundreds of children who died in state care during the boom times. 115 of which were unnatural deaths.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/115-children-in-state-care-died-of-unnatural-causes-26808009.html

    Almost 60pc of all children who died in care during Ireland's economic boom years died of unnatural causes, a new report reveals.


  • #89
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    RobertKK wrote: »
    The government will be fairly quiet given the hundreds of children who died in state care during the boom times. 115 of which were unnatural deaths.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/115-children-in-state-care-died-of-unnatural-causes-26808009.html
    Suicide, unlawful killings, drugs deaths and accidents accounted for many of the deaths according to the "seminal" report on Ireland's child protection system.

    A bit different to what happened to the 800 i think.


  • #90
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    RobertKK wrote: »
    The government will be fairly quiet given the hundreds of children who died in state care during the boom times. 115 of which were unnatural deaths.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/115-children-in-state-care-died-of-unnatural-causes-26808009.html

    We can't condemn 800 deaths when 115 died due to the state? Both can from disadvantaged backgrounds but I don't see many drugs and suicides being involved in Tuam.


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  • #91
    the culture of deference
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭the culture of deference


    I cannot see what the catholic church have done for the good of humanity.

    They have broken every law they are meant to live by, yet still seem to have brainwashed idiots in power running this country, and still going to mass week in week out.

    The only way forward is for the church to be removed from any form of education, then dismantled and all its resources seized.


This discussion has been closed.
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