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Ballymurpy massacre.

24

Comments

  • #32
    Gatling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    [quote="Busted Flat.;90238089How many brits were shot at, lets start from there.[/quote]


    Can you actually say no British soldiers were shot at during the few days in question
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #33
    Busted Flat.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,003 ✭✭✭Busted Flat.


    Gatling wrote: »
    Can you actually say no British soldiers were shot at during the few days in question

    Good night couldn't be bothered.


  • #34
    Absoluvely
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,327 ✭✭✭Absoluvely


    Busted Flat. wrote: »
    How many were murdered in those few days. How many brits were shot at, lets start from there.

    Not nearly enough :pac:


  • #35
    Gatling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Sound of Silence wrote: »

    You seemed to be displaying significantly less compassion for these victims of the Troubles than you displayed for the McConville family.

    As I said earlier justice for the 6 gardai murdered in this country first ,
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #36
    wazky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭wazky


    Gatling wrote: »
    As I said earlier justice for the 6 gardai murdered in this country first ,

    Can you explain why?, in front of the countless other victims this should be the case?


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  • #37
    Gatling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    wazky wrote: »
    Can you explain why?, in front of the countless other victims this should be the case?

    They were murdered in this country plain and simple
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #38
    wazky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭wazky


    Gatling wrote: »
    They were murdered in this country plain and simple

    And no non garda citizens were murdered, good point.


  • #39
    .jacksparrow.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,428 ✭✭✭.jacksparrow.


    Head, brick wall.


  • #40
    Sound of Silence
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭Sound of Silence


    Gatling wrote: »
    As I said earlier justice for the 6 gardai murdered in this country first ,

    I'm not sure what this would have to do with your ability to display compassion. You had little difficulty in the McConville thread.

    As far as Justice is concerned, the best thing possible for Northern Ireland at this moment would be to continue the Peace Process. We could spend our entire lives embroiled in the injustice of the past, and the only thing we would accomplish would be keeping the spirit of hate alive and well in the present.

    The best form of justice now is to ensure that atrocities like Ballymurphy never happen again.


  • #41
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,038 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Any justice for these men?



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  • #42
    wazky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭wazky


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    Any justice for these men?

    Two armed soldiers rock up to a Republican funeral?, a funeral for a man murdered at another funeral by the UDA.

    They died horrifically but it was their own stupidity


  • #43
    orangesoda
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,223 ✭✭✭orangesoda


    that's a whole different ball game to ballymurphy altogether

    http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/03/16/article-2294241-18B2CE65000005DC-29_634x474.jpg


  • #44
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Gatling wrote: »
    The IRA murdered 620-640

    Including 6 Gardai and one member of the our defence forces ,

    I'd be happy to see the killers of our gardai punished first

    I condemn IRA atrocities as much as anyone, but this persistent bringing them into every single debate regarding British Army atrocities is unbelievably tiresome.

    Nothing the IRA did will ever justify the brutality of the Brits, nor vice versa.


  • #45
    Elmer Blooker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,592 ✭✭✭Elmer Blooker


    Gatling wrote: »
    Like the mother of ten kidnapped ,tortured and executed by the ira
    ..... and anyone murdered by Army/RUC Loyalist collusion is called "whataboutery" - they don't even have names.


  • #46
    y0ssar1an22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,522 ✭✭✭✭y0ssar1an22


    Busted Flat. wrote: »
    That is disgusting.


    I tend to agree, but if the seeking of compensation is motivated by justice, rather than wanting money, then the money should be donated to a just cause.


  • #47
    moxin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,203 ✭✭✭moxin


    Apparently those foaming at the mouth seeking justice for the mother of ten McConville, are not foaming at the mouth here in this thread seeking justice for a mother of eight who was shot by the BA in this massacre. Hypocrites.


  • #48
    Shakespeare's Sister
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    Gatling wrote: »
    The IRA murdered 620-640

    Including 6 Gardai and one member of the our defence forces
    I don't understand this. The opening post was about the Ballymurphy massacre... and your response is what the IRA did.
    We know the IRA committed heinous atrocities, but this is about the Ballymurphy massacre.
    It looks like you're saying "Boo hoo to the victims of this, the IRA were worse."
    Then someone else said why no compassion for the victims in this case and your response was "justice for the six gardai murdered in this country first."

    :confused:


  • #49
    Santa Cruz
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Santa Cruz


    We will never progress if each side want's to have total victory. Are we going to spend forever looking back?


  • #50
    Shakespeare's Sister
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    Santa Cruz wrote: »
    We will never progress if each side want's to have total victory. Are we going to spend forever looking back?
    For me, it's not about "One side was yadda yadda and the other was bla bla" - I take a panoramic view of all the rotten violence. It's when people focus disproportionately on one "side" (whatever that side is) that I find objectionable.

    This post puts it perfectly:
    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    I condemn IRA atrocities as much as anyone, but this persistent bringing them into every single debate regarding British Army atrocities is unbelievably tiresome.

    Nothing the IRA did will ever justify the brutality of the Brits, nor vice versa.


  • #51
    Lingua Franca
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,800 ✭✭✭Lingua Franca


    Can people PLEASE stop acting like there is a hierarchy of victims? All of the victims deserve justice, no one special group deserves theirs "first" and the way any thread about an atrocity quickly descends into whatabouttery and shinnerbots vs west brits does no ones cause any favours. It doesn't stimulate debate and it does nothing to heal wounds. It's like people enjoy ripping them open to let them fester.

    All unsolved atrocities, from La Mon and Enniskillen to Jean McConville to the Ballymurphy massacre and all of those in between need looked at. They need to be sorted out and dealt with and put behind us. I don't think HET is effective and Teresa Villiers demanding immunity for British soldiers is just rubbing salt into the wounds. On the other hand, the Bloody Sunday inquiry (although I welcomed that) took a ridiculous and unsustainable amount of time and money and has resulted only in vindication for the families - no prosecutions at all.

    With that in mind, why the hell isn't everyone pushing for a truth and reconciliation commission? Why continue this charade? Every group accused of crime is saying that everyone else should be investigated and prosecuted except for them. People are crying down the idea of justice for Jean McConville with "what about Joan Crawford", as if one murder supersedes another. I'd be happy to see actual justice for both of them but the pragmatist in me is aware it's unlikely ever to happen. So sit everyone down and call an amnesty for anyone who can come and tell the truth and give the victims families some sort of closure.


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  • #52
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Gatling wrote: »
    Can you actually say no British soldiers were shot at during the few days in question


    Congrats, you've sunk lower in my opinion. The impossible is apparently possible.


  • #53
    pO1Neil
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 354 ✭✭pO1Neil


    Gatling wrote: »
    The IRA murdered 620-640

    Including 6 Gardai and one member of the our defence forces ,

    I'd be happy to see the killers of our gardai punished first

    Willie Frazer is that you?


  • #54
    Yeah_Right
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,692 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    I think its time to move on. The idea of a truth and reconciliation commission is perfect. No prosecutions or retaliations, just honesty and putting the past to rest.


  • #55
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    Yeah_Right wrote: »
    I think its time to move on. The idea of a truth and reconciliation commission is perfect. No prosecutions or retaliations, just honesty and putting the past to rest.

    SF and especially Gerry Adams has been pushing for this for years and been met with resistance from the British Authorities at every turn, which is sad.
    I feel like the British Government is too afraid of how much of their own dirty laundry will get aired and won't let it happen because of that.


  • #56
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,566 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    Seaneh wrote: »
    SF and especially Gerry Adams has been pushing for this for years and been met with resistance from the British Authorities at every turn, which is sad.
    I feel like the British Government is too afraid of how much of their own dirty laundry will get aired and won't let it happen because of that.

    Come on, do you really think SF want a truth and reconciliation process?


  • #57
    moxin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,203 ✭✭✭moxin


    Fratton Fred wrote: »
    Come on, do you really think SF want a truth and reconciliation process?

    The British Authorities won't entertain one because of Glennane


  • #58
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,566 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    moxin wrote: »
    The British Authorities won't entertain one because of Glennane

    Politically, SF have far more to lose than any British politician.


  • #59
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    Fratton Fred wrote: »
    Come on, do you really think SF want a truth and reconciliation process?

    No, he's just openly pushing for it for the last decade for the craic.


  • #60
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    Fratton Fred wrote: »
    Politically, SF have far more to lose than any British politician.

    And less to lose collectively than the British authorities.


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  • #61
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,566 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    Seaneh wrote: »
    No, he's just openly pushing for it for the last decade for the craic.

    It's like 90% of Sinn Fein rhetoric, they can say it safe in the knowledge it will never happen, but it keeps the party faithful on board.


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