Should Elections move with the times?

Rhys Essien · 25-04-2014 11:03AM #1

In 2014,idiots are still putting up posters.Cost,Environmentally bad,littering,hazards,unsightly etc.

We have to listen to crap from candidates at doors.Can they not put up Youtube videos giving information and what they hope to do.

We still have to go to polling stations.Again cost,hassle etc.Should we not be able to vote online using our PPS numbers.Get instant results,do away with recounting.

The sooner technology takes over from this crap the better.

Birneybau · 25-04-2014 11:03AM

Yeah, make them all fight in a Thunderdome-esque stadium.

Sir Arthur Daley · 25-04-2014 11:05AM

I am friends with several candidates on facebook, get constant updates on their intentions.

Eponymous · 25-04-2014 11:09AM

Agreed. Perhaps if we had some sort of voting machines we could use...

Dravokivich · 25-04-2014 11:10AM

Voting with your PPS, means your vote is no longer anonymous.

Robbo · 25-04-2014 11:31AM

Eponymous wrote: »

Agreed. Perhaps if we had some sort of voting machines we could use...

As far as I remember, they were Windows XP based so now that most support has ended for that, it would only make sense that we tried to resurrect them.

SEPT 23 1989 · 25-04-2014 11:35AM

If there was only some machine to cast our votes on rather then using pen and paper

yoyo · 25-04-2014 11:37AM

Robbo wrote: »

As far as I remember, they were Windows XP based so now that most support has ended for that, it would only make sense that we tried to resurrect them.

Windows 98 and used an Access db is what I heard!!

Nick

Davarus Walrus · 25-04-2014 11:38AM

I've an uncle involved in the politics game at a national level. Firing up posters and calling to people's doors is still the best way of getting votes. It's the personal touch and good 'brand recognition'.

The Internet is still viewed with utter suspicion. Twitter is used as it allows you to send out a short, snappy message. But doing online Q&A is an accident waiting to happen. Can you imagine a politician doing a Q&A session of a site like thejournal.ie? Just an excuse for punters to pour out their vitriol and stupidity.

rubadub · 25-04-2014 11:47AM

Rhys Essien wrote: »

In 2014,idiots are still putting up posters.Cost,Environmentally bad,littering,hazards,unsightly etc.

The majority are illegal in my area, dun laoghaire rathdown county council have clear guidelines on where they can be put.

I have contacted various politicians in the past about their illegal posters. One member of the green party was one of the few who responded. He also signed me up to his newsletter creating a female version of my name, presumably thinking it is degrading/insulting to be a woman and having a dig at me for complaining.

Now this misogynist was recently complaining about posters going up about warning pedestrians. Ironically just this morning I saw a group of kids walking along and 1 wandering onto the road, this to avoid an illegal green party poster was obstructing them.

Another from years ago is still discarded on the N11, I contacted the ex-green party member about her poster and she threatened to call the gardai, showing no responsibility or care for this.

Ruthless scum, labour are worst as they purposely designed posters to look like motoring danger signs. Setting out to distract motorists, I would like to seem them jailed over this practice.

I have also challenged the people putting up posters, on both occasions none knew anything about guidelines. I have gone to the gardai who said it was nothing to do with them. Unfortunately I think it will take a death before they are banned. I expect there have been loads of accidents already. And when the death does occur it will be all "oh isn't hindsight great", no its not you fucking scum.

Cookie_Monster · 25-04-2014 11:51AM

/\/\I want to thank that a hundred times over/\/\

Amirani · 25-04-2014 12:00PM

There's some big issues with Internet voting that haven't yet been figured out. Running a vote based on PPS numbers removes anonymity, which is a fundamental aspect of our voting system using anonymous online voting greatly increases the chances of rigging. How can you ensure that everyone only votes once?

wazky · 25-04-2014 12:18PM

I hate when those posters go up, I don't know about the rest of the country but there are some weird looking squares going for election around my area, the eyes on the posters seem to just follow you.....

woppi · 25-04-2014 12:18PM

Using PPS to vote would work like this...

Machine 1
User provides PPS and authentication credentials to get one time use token (one way hash)
System records that a token has been issued for that PPS without recording the identity of that token.

Machine 2
User votes with that token. No authentication required.

This is very similar to the existing system where one authenticates at a desk (with a carbon based lifeform) to get a ballot paper.
There are edge case issues which would require reset and override such as how to deal with the case where voter some how loses their token between Machine 1 and Machine 2.

kowloon · 25-04-2014 12:24PM

Saw a guy roll his jeep on to a roundabout yesterday to put up a poster. The jeep already had crash damage. Can't guarantee it was from doing dumb sh1t like that, but he was asking for another accident.

woppi wrote: »

There are edge case issues which would require reset and override such as how to deal with the case where voter some how loses their token between Machine 1 and Machine 2.

Could issue the token chained to a cavity block. Then you could consider any lost tokens a contribution to creating a more intelligent electorate.

Dublinflyer · 25-04-2014 12:27PM

The posters are bad enough but it's the cable ties that are left behind when they are taken down really bugs me. There are some posts in my area with dozens of the things on them.

Conmaicne Mara · 25-04-2014 12:27PM

No, absolutely not. The only enjoyment I get out of elections is watching SOME of them sweat at the count

Davarus Walrus · 25-04-2014 12:29PM

rubadub wrote: »

Ruthless scum, labour are worst as they purposely designed posters to look like motoring danger signs. Setting out to distract motorists, I would like to seem them jailed over this practice.

I'll ignore the rest of your post where you imply that someone was being misogynist for misspelling your name.

Are you suggesting that the Labour Party; a party that is over 100 years old and the junior partner in the current coalition government deliberately designs posters that will distract drivers? That's a pretty serious claim.

wazky · 25-04-2014 12:30PM

Davarus Walrus wrote: »

Are you suggesting that the Labour Party; a party that is over 100 years old and the junior partner in the current coalition government deliberately designs posters that will distract drivers? That's a pretty serious claim.

It's a pretty serious issue.

Amirani · 25-04-2014 12:32PM

woppi wrote: »

Using PPS to vote would work like this...

Machine 1
User provides PPS and authentication credentials to get one time use token (one way hash)
System records that a token has been issued for that PPS with recording the identity of that token.

Machine 2
User votes with that token. No authentication required.

This is very similar to the existing system where one authenticates at a desk (with a carbon based lifeform) to get a ballot paper.
There are edge case issues which would require reset and override such as how to deal with the case where voter some how loses their token between Machine 1 and Machine 2.

That's not online voting though?

rubadub · 25-04-2014 01:15PM

Davarus Walrus wrote: »

I'll ignore the rest of your post where you imply that someone was being misogynist for misspelling your name.

I don't think a 3 letter name turning into a 9 letter name is a simple typo. This happened after numerous direct emails, I have zero doubt that it was a subtle dig at me. Many would view complaints as petty, I have seen the real danger of this madness.

Davarus Walrus wrote: »

Are you suggesting that the Labour Party; a party that is over 100 years old and the junior partner in the current coalition government deliberately designs posters that will distract drivers? That's a pretty serious claim.

I think all parties with posters up have set out to distract drivers, that's not a serious claim, why else would they do it? just they went the extra mile to try and make them look like diamond red road signs warning ones. Luckily for them their party colours are red so they can claim it is less purposefully done.

This is the style I am talking about
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy49/Nighteishes/396091_565968220098351_72906574_n_zps622163ef.jpg

http://cdn1.herald.ie/migration_catalog/article25351168.ece/764df/ALTERNATES/h342/1906_gilmore_herald

Do you seriously think they did not intend these to look like official road signs?

Below you can see one placed on top of a "no left turn" sign. This could easily end up falling downwards and obstructing that sign.
http://f0.thejournal.ie/media/2013/02/222011-start-of-the-general-elections-campaigns-4-630x433.jpg

You can see posters here in amongst loads of warning signs, DLR requested the bottom of posters to be a minimum of 2m off the ground, this is just commons sense, crazy that they had to resort to needing guidelines.
http://img.rasset.ie/000556a5-560.jpg
It was a low poster forcing the kid onto the road today, in the picture above it there are obviously kids around at times, small children will be completely hidden if they were beside the woman in the photo.

If there had been no previous tradition of any election posters, and some independent person discovered they could legally be put up and had red diamond shaped ones all up and down dual carriage ways they would change the law immediately, and the candidate's reputation would be rightfully be destroyed by the media & public. Its sort of similar to smoking, if discovered today it would be illegal, but since there is a tradition it continues. But outlawing smoking would be very difficult, banning these posters is easy.

http://www.thejournal.ie/dont-put-election-posters-on-electrical-poles-say-esb-1426867-Apr2014/

ESB warns candidates: Don’t put your posters on electrical poles or you may die

ESB Networks has previously experienced incidents where election posters have caught fire following contact with the electricity network resulting in loss of supply to customers and damaged infrastructure.

woppi · 25-04-2014 01:16PM

Diego Simeone wrote: »

That's not online voting though?

This is my personal preference, but I consider anonymity in the voting process as being of greater importance than convenience. In my opinion, online activity is not anonymous. With remote e-Voting, it is harder to determine that the vote has not been cast under coercion. Moreover, there is no guarantee on how internet traffic will be routed. I do not envisage any government advocating an anonymous internet infrastructure or permitting the involvement of other agencies (in or outside the state). Where remote e-Voting has been used in other countries, some of these concerns have been ignored, considered too impractical to address, or not significant enough.

The Irish are a contrary lot, since there is no perfect remote e-voting system, I can't see any point in pushing for it. Now, e-Voting to reduce the cost of counting the ballots, that's something worth aiming for.

Davarus Walrus · 25-04-2014 01:17PM

rubadub wrote: »

I don't think a 3 letter name turning into a 9 letter name is a simple typo. This happened after numerous direct emails, I have zero doubt that it was a subtle dig at me. Many would view complaints as petty, I have seen the real danger of this madness.

I think all parties with posters up have set out to distract drivers, that's not a serious claim, why else would they do it? just they went the extra mile to try and make them look like diamond red road signs warning ones. Luckily for them their party colours are red so they can claim it is less purposefully done.

This is the style I am talking about
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy49/Nighteishes/396091_565968220098351_72906574_n_zps622163ef.jpg

http://cdn1.herald.ie/migration_catalog/article25351168.ece/764df/ALTERNATES/h342/1906_gilmore_herald

Below you can see one placed on top of a "no left turn" sign. This could easily end up falling downwards and obstructing that sign.
http://f0.thejournal.ie/media/2013/02/222011-start-of-the-general-elections-campaigns-4-630x433.jpg

You can see posters here in amongst loads of warning signs, DLR requested the bottom of posters to be a minimum of 2m off the ground, this is just commons sense, crazy that they had to resort to needing guidelines.
http://img.rasset.ie/000556a5-560.jpg
It was a low poster forcing the kid onto the road today, in the picture above it there are obviously kids around, small children will be completely hidden if they were beside the woman in the photo.

If there had been no previous tradition of any election posters, and some independent person discovered they could legally be put up and had red diamond shaped ones all up and down dual carriage ways they would change the law immediately, and the candidate's reputation would be rightfully be destroyed by the media & public. Its sort of similar to smoking, if discovered today it would be illegal, but since there is a tradition it continues. But outlawing smoking would be very difficult, banning these posters is easy.

http://www.thejournal.ie/dont-put-election-posters-on-electrical-poles-say-esb-1426867-Apr2014/

The red diamond ones aren't Labour posters. They are the work of the Shinners.

dublinman1990 · 25-04-2014 01:18PM

I think improvements in technology will enhance the ways elections are being handled in the future.

In my view Irish political parties should consider only using online promotional posters for getting votes after the next GE because there are far too many posters distributed for the Local and European elections where I live already.

If the online poster only issue doesn't work. The government should consider a strict quota of one poster on every streetlamp in every county that is governed from Dublin whenever an election is taking place because in my view it will cut waste and saves taxpayers money for candidates because the posters are expensive to be made to use in the short term.

For example there are a total of three posters for three separate parties (Labour, FG and SP) all placed on a streetlamp on the main road outside my house. Two of the posters are for the european elections and the other for a local candidate.

I do think that is a bit much IMO.

The amount of Nessa Childers posters is mind being displayed in Dublin is also mind boggling as she is not too good at distributing posters herself. She is running as an independent candidate but there are loads of her posters being plastered on every streetlamp on the road beside the metals at Dun Laoghaire harbour.

I mean wth? We do get the picture all of a sudden now Nessa.

I have never met her at all but she does seem to be a bit over eager for getting elected into Europe.

Dravokivich · 25-04-2014 01:22PM

Davarus Walrus wrote: »

The red diamond ones aren't Labour posters. They are the work of the Shinners.

Why the colour red then? I'd be hard pressed to find anyone who associates it with them.

Ben D Bus · 25-04-2014 01:24PM

Davarus Walrus wrote: »

The red diamond ones aren't Labour posters. They are the work of the Shinners.

Re-purposed "Sniper at Work" posters?

rubadub · 25-04-2014 01:41PM

Davarus Walrus wrote: »

The red diamond ones aren't Labour posters. They are the work of the Shinners.

I already linked the labour one
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy49/Nighteishes/396091_565968220098351_72906574_n_zps622163ef.jpg

I do now see the second post was sinn fein, that is the first time I have seen them, 2 wrongs certainly do not make a right, this practice is despicable.

This was not a one off labour poster, there have been lots in this style
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5219/5455237049_411b81fa65.jpg

The 3 colour sinn fein one is less similar to road signs than the red/white labour ones.

appropriate image above this one
http://www.photopol.com/elect2011/turdy.jpg

The guy posting the one below said it is blocking a filter light, you can also see a red diamond FF one above it, seems more are copying this style, once they know the others got away with it I suppose. I

http://www.photopol.com/elect2011/blaney_2.jpg

http://f0.thejournal.ie/media/2014/04/sf-poster-373x500.jpg

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/woman-hurt-by-poster-settles-claim-against-ff-26819019.html

Woman hurt by poster settles claim against FF

RAY MANAGH – UPDATED 04 DECEMBER 2012 12:41 PM

A HOUSEWIFE who knocked her head against a low hanging election poster has settled a €38,000 damages claim.

Barrister John Nolan told the Circuit Civil Court yesterday that Fianna Fail and Executive Posters Ltd, Howth, Co Dublin, had jointly agreed to settle the claim.

Sandra Memery, of Dunard Drive, Navan Road, Dublin, claimed she had suffered a head trauma, after walking into a Fianna Fail poster, calling for a yes vote in the second Lisbon Treaty referendum, which took place in October 2009.

As I said earlier it will probably take a death before they are banned.

Caliden · 25-04-2014 02:22PM

They're pointless. We see so much advertising now that we're filtering it out.

They might have made an impact 50-60 years ago when advertising was 'new' but nowadays it's just white noise. I don't know how many posters I drive by each day to work but I still wouldn't be able to name any of them off the top of my head.
They're boring and all look the same.

Ruu · 25-04-2014 02:26PM

Eponymous wrote: »

Agreed. Perhaps if we had some sort of voting machines we could use...

Yes, yes, we could call them 'e-voting machines'. Sounds like a great idea, might be costly but well worth it!

Sh1tbag OToole · 25-04-2014 02:31PM

Not a fan of the e voting as you couldnt trust it to be run in a secure manner but if everyone removed only 1 poster politicians will get the message and eventually stop wasting money on them

hjkl · 25-04-2014 02:38PM

I don't have a problem with the posters at all. Some people on this thread seem to have too much time on their hands imo.

Should Elections move with the times?

Should elections move with the times? 40 votes

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