Another US School Attack.

Gringo180 · 09-04-2014 10:35PM

EyeSight wrote: »

Yesterday there was a thread about someone in Ireland smashing a mans head in while he slept in his car. Lets now call Ireland a messed up country :rolleyes:

Every country on the planet has its troubles but America seems to have more than others, every few months there seems to be attacks like this and fortunately this time no lives were lost.

Stavros Murphy · 09-04-2014 11:24PM

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

Oh really, so you think the average person can inflict the same number of deaths with a knife compared to a gun or a semi-automatic (no I'm not an expert on specific guns, bare with me) but I assuming those which can fire multiple rounds rapidly can kill ultimately a lot more people than a person repeating an action swinging a knife around?

Always mystifies me when I hear of somone going on a rampage with a gun and then there's six people killed and five injured. They must all be rotten shots.

If you were in a large group of people and someone walked through with a stanley knife, slashing everyone they passed, you wouldn't notice until an awful lot of people had been injured - there's no loud bang, all you'd see was a ripple of panic and no idea why. Even people who had been cut would take seconds or even minutes to realise they'd been injured and how.

strobe · 09-04-2014 11:45PM

Jaysus this murdering school kids business is ****ed up. Hard to believe this **** has happened once let alone as many times as it has now. If I had kids in a school in america I'd be looking for soldiers stationed at schools. Gotta be a lot of unemployed ex soldiers in the States these days no? Enlist up few of them lads, give them their body armour and m16's or whatever their using these days.

Stavros Murphy · 09-04-2014 11:47PM

strobe wrote: »

Jaysus this murdering school kids business is ****ed up. Hard to believe this **** has happened once let alone as many times as it has now. If I had kids in a school in america I'd be looking for soldiers stationed at schools. Gotta be a lot of unemployed ex soldiers in the States these days no? Enlist up few of them lads, give them their body armour and m16's or whatever their using these days.

Ah stop. Yeah, it's bad, but out of the millions upon millions of days put in by students in America, what percentage of them days involve getting shot? Must be miniscule. It's a damn big place with a lot of students.

strobe · 09-04-2014 11:48PM

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

Ah stop. Yeah, it's bad, but out of the millions upon millions of days put in by students in America, what percentage of them days involve getting shot? Must be miniscule. It's a damn big place with a lot of students.

Ah I know yeah, I'm not saying it's rational, I'm just saying that's how I'd feel.

Tokyo · 09-04-2014 11:51PM

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

Ah stop. Yeah, it's bad, but out of the millions upon millions of days put in by students in America, what percentage of them days involve getting shot? Must be miniscule. It's a damn big place with a lot of students.

184 students since 1996 might disagree with you

Stavros Murphy · 10-04-2014 12:09AM

mike_ie wrote: »

184 students since 1996 might disagree with you

184 out of how many million? More died of constipation than that. Sheet, I'd say more died of falling off the school bus while drunk than that. 10ish a year?

AlanS181824 · 10-04-2014 12:22AM

Yet another one, well here's hoping all those involved are okay.

Capt'n Midnight · 10-04-2014 12:23AM

Gatling wrote: »

And yesterday's report of a mother who found a credible threat to her sons life on Facebook ,
The 2 year old who shot his/her 11 year old sibling the day before ,

Over the last few years Toddlers have killed more Americans than foreign Terrorists have in America.

It's a regular enough occurrence

The Diabolical Monocle · 10-04-2014 12:23AM

MadsL wrote: »

One word. China.

Can you really say to yourself that this isn't a bullsht comparison.

10 men. For 30 victims.

Stop for one moment and question your own politics and this comparison honestly.

The Diabolical Monocle · 10-04-2014 12:27AM

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

Always mystifies me when I hear of somone going on a rampage with a gun and then there's six people killed and five injured. They must all be rotten shots.

If you were in a large group of people and someone walked through with a stanley knife, slashing everyone they passed, you wouldn't notice until an awful lot of people had been injured - there's no loud bang, all you'd see was a ripple of panic and no idea why. Even people who had been cut would take seconds or even minutes to realise they'd been injured and how.

You'd also be in close proximity and have a very good chance of getting k.o'd.

Probably a bit more difficult to pimphand a gunman.

Stavros Murphy · 10-04-2014 12:28AM

The Diabolical Monocle wrote: »

You'd also be in close proximity and have a very good chance of getting k.o'd.

Probably a bit more difficult to pimphand a gunman.

It all depends how strong your pimp-hand be.

Capt'n Midnight · 10-04-2014 12:30AM

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

Would relative population size not be a factor? i.e. probability-wise britain should be 10 times more likely to have a multiple-shooting over a given time period than Ireland?

UK has a population 1/5th that of the US so yeah that explains all the school massacres in the UK we keep hearing about.

EU is over 1.5 times US population.

Americans with guns kill people.

nocoverart · 10-04-2014 12:36AM

gramar wrote: »

We don't know what type of knife the loon had. If someone is swinging a machete around then it's all too easy to imagine a lot of people getting injured.

It just goes to show that the problem isn't guns...it's mental health.

and bullying doesn't help a persons mental health, Which needs to be addressed more with spree shootings/stabbings in the US.

Heckler · 10-04-2014 12:59AM

MadsL wrote: »

A semi-auto will fire loudly at best 12-15 rounds per minute before overheating. In a crowd (as happened here) this kid stabbed 20 before anyone really had a clue what was happening.

That said I don't dwell on the most efficient way to kill lots of people, I leave you to that.

Hardly. Unless you confused overheating with reloading. A semi rifle can carry more than 15 rounds and far beyond and a semi pistol with a magazine of say 7/8 rounds like a .45 colt up to a 17 round glock can happily fire away all day as long as you reload, without overheating (within reason). 12 rounds per minute is one every 5 secs. Not exactly a scenario for overheating. If you meant 12-15 rounds per second then you're talking fully auto not semi.

And if you are talking fully auto they can fire a hell of a lot more than 12-15 rounds per second.

And even if you are talking about a semi auto pistol at 12-15 rounds per minute then thats a hell of a slow shooter and that gun isn't going to overheat. Anyone with minimum practice could put out a round a second. I shoot bolt action rifle (slow) but have had a go on pistols and I can shoot a 10 round magazine easily in under 10 secs. Anyone with practice could do it a whole lot faster.

Being slow give me 5 seconds to drop the used mag and reload thats 40 rounds a minute on a semi without any overheating.

Never mind the loudly bit. Ever heard of a moderator ? Loudness has nothing to do with rate of fire or overheating. Sure sustained shooting can have an effect on a moderator i believe but i don't think thats the point you were trying to make.

moc moc a moc · 10-04-2014 01:00AM

MadsL wrote: »

In Europe? Whilst there has been no shootings in a school in Ireland, there have been several in the UK with even more restrictive gun laws than Ireland. Your statement doesn't make any logical sense.

They now have very strict gun laws. Enacted because of the likes of the Dunblane attack.

the_syco · 10-04-2014 02:02AM

Nate Scimio should be given an award. Seems he put his arm in the way of the blade when the tard with the blade tried to slice girls, and then tripped the fire-alarm to get people out of the building.

=-=

America is funked due to the lack of proper gun training. Train them all like Switzerland, and then see if the amount of shootings drop.

Witcher · 10-04-2014 02:28AM

the_syco wrote: »

America is funked due to the lack of proper gun training. Train them all like Switzerland, and then see if the amount of shootings drop.

It's nothing to do with training, that wouldn't have stopped Adam Lanza in Newtown. There is no quick fix solution in the US, anything you can think of has already been thought of by some US president and binned because it's unrealistic.

People always talk of banning AR15's..'make people turn then in' etc. people in the US would just flat out ignore any such law. It's not like here where the government have control over firearms and can sweep them all up, once a gun leaves a store in the US it's off the radar, the gov. don't know where it is, who has it or who they might sell it to in the future.

The cat is out of the bag in the US, they can't just call in all the firearms now. A lot of people in the US wholeheartedly believe that the reason they hold firearms is to prevent a tyrannical gov., if you make a grab for their firearms that will confirm to them that that is what you are.

Lingua Franca · 10-04-2014 02:48AM

the_syco wrote: »

Nate Scimio should be given an award. Seems he put his arm in the way of the blade when the tard with the blade tried to slice girls, and then tripped the fire-alarm to get people out of the building.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=669026596491145&set=a.264297080297434.62872.232186683508474&type=1

biketard · 10-04-2014 06:23AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I was hoping it was a flamethrower

I know this was just said as a throwaway joke, but that happened in my school shortly after I left. Just outside Belfast.

Davei141 · 10-04-2014 06:50AM

nocoverart wrote: »

[/B]

and bullying doesn't help a persons mental health, Which needs to be addressed more with spree shootings/stabbings in the US.

This needs to be discussed as number one, not gun control. I wonder how many of the killers have went through some serious bullying? Everything you read about american schools/colleges has you believe there is a serious class system going on, and god help you if you are at the bottom.

BurnsCarpenter · 10-04-2014 07:08AM

MadsL wrote: »

One word. China.

I'm not sure if you're being disingenuous or if you just haven't thought about this very deeply. Being able to trot out some counter-examples doesn't prove anything. It's the equivalent of 'my grandpa lived to 100 and he smoked 60 a day'.

MadsL · 10-04-2014 03:41PM

moc moc a moc wrote: »

They now have very strict gun laws. Enacted because of the likes of the Dunblane attack.

The Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988 in the UK was well before Dunblane.

MadsL · 10-04-2014 03:44PM

BurnsCarpenter wrote: »

I'm not sure if you're being disingenuous or if you just haven't thought about this very deeply. Being able to trot out some counter-examples doesn't prove anything. It's the equivalent of 'my grandpa lived to 100 and he smoked 60 a day'.

Likewise the platitude about gun control preventing massacres is patently untrue. For example, it did not prevent Dunblane, nor Anders Breivik's attacks.

MadsL · 10-04-2014 03:56PM

Heckler wrote: »

Hardly. Unless you confused overheating with reloading. A semi rifle can carry more than 15 rounds and far beyond and a semi pistol with a magazine of say 7/8 rounds like a .45 colt up to a 17 round glock can happily fire away all day as long as you reload, without overheating (within reason). 12 rounds per minute is one every 5 secs. Not exactly a scenario for overheating. If you meant 12-15 rounds per second then you're talking fully auto not semi.

And if you are talking fully auto they can fire a hell of a lot more than 12-15 rounds per second.

And even if you are talking about a semi auto pistol at 12-15 rounds per minute then thats a hell of a slow shooter and that gun isn't going to overheat. Anyone with minimum practice could put out a round a second. I shoot bolt action rifle (slow) but have had a go on pistols and I can shoot a 10 round magazine easily in under 10 secs. Anyone with practice could do it a whole lot faster.g to make.

I meant what I said.

The AR-15′s rate of fire is not nearly as high as some exaggerated numbers I’ve seen. Sustained rate of fire is roughly 12-15 rounds per minute, and that link is for the true military M-16 version. They tend to overheat and/or jam if you shoot too fast. It has been widely reported that the AR-15 jammed in the Aurora incident.

Source

Officially the M16 fires;
Cyclic: 800 rounds per minute
Sustained: 12-15 per minute
Semiautomatic: 45 per minute

So yes, you can keep firing until it jams. That won't take long.

dark crystal · 10-04-2014 04:52PM

MadsL wrote: »

Likewise the platitude about gun control preventing massacres is patently untrue. For example, it did not prevent Dunblane, nor Anders Breivik's attacks.

What's patently untrue is misrepresenting what people are saying. You used the word 'prevent'. No law can stop something happening ever again, but they can significantly reduce the instances of it happening, as they have done in the UK and elsewhere.

No matter how you try to twist the facts, the statistics are pretty clear on that.

MadsL · 10-04-2014 06:32PM

dark crystal wrote: »

What's patently untrue is misrepresenting what people are saying. You used the word 'prevent'. No law can stop something happening ever again, but they can significantly reduce the instances of it happening, as they have done in the UK and elsewhere.

No matter how you try to twist the facts, the statistics are pretty clear on that.

Again, you jump to an illogical conclusion vis that strict gun controls reduce the incidents of massacres. If gun control were the only factor in school massacres, then we could create a situation where there were no massacres. Events in Germany, Finland and Canada tell a different story.

The stringent laws in the UK introduced in 1988 post-Hungerford did not "reduce" shootings in Dunblane or Monkseaton, nor did the 97 regulations "reduce" the Cumbria massacre.

Where is 'elsewhere' exactly? Czech Republic? Where guns are widely available to private citizens and the only rampage killing was in 1973 using.....a car.

StinkyMunkey · 10-04-2014 07:00PM

What is it about crazies targeting schools in Amercia these days, its such a nasty trend.

I know it happens elsewhere in the world, but The yanks really have gotten fond of it.

dark crystal · 10-04-2014 07:20PM

MadsL wrote: »

Again, you jump to an illogical conclusion vis that strict gun controls reduce the incidents of massacres. If gun control were the only factor in school massacres, then we could create a situation where there were no massacres. Events in Germany, Finland and Canada tell a different story.

The stringent laws in the UK introduced in 1988 post-Hungerford did not "reduce" shootings in Dunblane or Monkseaton, nor did the 97 regulations "reduce" the Cumbria massacre.

Where is 'elsewhere' exactly? Czech Republic? Where guns are widely available to private citizens and the only rampage killing was in 1973 using.....a car.

I'm not sure if you're deliberately being obtuse or not, but you don't seem able to comprehend my posts at all and it's getting tiresome.

I never said there would be NO massacres, but that there would be much less chance of one. Statistics back this up, yet again you are unwilling to accept what's in black and white. At this point, I'll leave you to it, as debating with you on this issue is as pointless as trying to reason with the NRA.

MadsL · 10-04-2014 07:52PM

dark crystal wrote: »

I'm not sure if you're deliberately being obtuse or not, but you don't seem able to comprehend my posts at all and it's getting tiresome.

I never said there would be NO massacres, but that there would be much less chance of one. Statistics back this up, yet again you are unwilling to accept what's in black and white. At this point, I'll leave you to it, as debating with you on this issue is as pointless as trying to reason with the NRA.

I'd appreciate if you didn't associate me with the NRA. You say statistics back up that gun control reduces massacres. Which ones?

And given that I have presented you with a country where NO massacres have taken place, yet handguns and long guns are freely available to its citizenry then that punches a rather large hole in your argument. How do you account for that statistic?

Another US School Attack.

Comments