Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

Agueroooo · 28-03-2014 02:50PM

Timmyctc wrote: »

I agree Moyes is out of his depth but what else did you expect Fergie to say after retiring?

"That squad there needs a lot of investment." ?

emmmm..

he won the league a week before he said that, and left the CL controversially a few weeks prior to that again.

I honestly thought there would be a slight blip like maybe definitely been ruled out of the title race come the turn of the year, and ending up anywhere in the top4 in his first year, but no one, and I mean NO ONE predicted this.

the common dominator in all this is David Moyes.

Timmyctc · 28-03-2014 02:50PM

Blatter wrote: »

Much like the majority of the squad throughout the season.

It's a pity they didn't have a manager to organise and motivate them. They really did deserve better.

Arah here now. There is no way to Motivate Rio into being a faster human being ffs.
Evra has been a lost cause for a season or two now. I'd love to see a compilation of all goals we've conceded in last 3 seasons and see how many come from the left flank.

As for Vida. His decline is exaggerated. Playing in an unorganised team, two of his sendings off this season have been unwarranted imo also

FourFourRED · 28-03-2014 02:50PM

KH25 wrote: »

What is it? Work won't let me see the photo.

Preparing the plane with the "Wrong One Moyes Out" banner

KH25 · 28-03-2014 02:51PM

Aodhagan wrote: »

Preparing the plane with the "Wrong One Moyes Out" banner

Im embarrassed to be a United fan.

Blatter · 28-03-2014 02:51PM

Agueroooo wrote: »

and just to add...

sounds like someone is well out of their depth.

A journalist with some balls really should relay that quote him and ask for his response.

Agueroooo · 28-03-2014 02:52PM

Blatter wrote: »

A journalist with some balls really should relay that quote him and ask for his response.

is the press core still a bit sanitised

these days at OT ?

TheDoc · 28-03-2014 02:52PM

KH25 wrote: »

Thats the part I just cannot get my head around. For the past few seasons Moyes would have looked at United and identified weaknesses for Everton to exploit. CM and LB would be the 2 main ones. Many fans have been discussing the need to address these areas for at least 2 years now. Moyes then walks into the club and fails to properly address these areas. He failed at the first hurdle.

He identified LB, CB and CM during the summer.

It's not his fault that Woodward made a ****ing meal of it. Worth remembering that the manager doesn't do the deals, it's handed by the Chief Exec, after targets are put forward.

Moyes still gets too much guff over the summer window, which had little to nothing to do with him. Woodward got suckered into a Fabregas scam and wasted too much time, something that was probably discussed with him in review of the carry on that summer.

Moyes wasn't out with the chequebook, he just hands over a list of targets, and I'm sure he expected to get them, probably shocked he didn't.

You can trapse back if you want, but there was an extensive list of targets that looked more or less genuine and it just appears it was a case of a new Chief Executive getting caught up in some dirty agent tricks and wasting time. Hopefully something he wont repeat this summer.

Bids need to come firm and high, no penny pinching, and strict deadlines attached. We shouldn't be holding out for anyone, it shouldnt be a big decision for someone to join Manchester United, you either are, or your not.

No room for error this window, in early, lay down the cash, give clubs, players and agents specific timeframes of negotiations and if someone is dragigng their heels, move on an forget them.

Timmyctc · 28-03-2014 02:55PM

Agueroooo wrote: »

emmmm..

he won the league a week before he said that, and left the CL controversially a few weeks prior to that again.

I honestly thought there would be a slight blip like maybe definitely been ruled out of the title race come the turn of the year, and ending up anywhere in the top4 in his first year, but no one, and I mean NO ONE predicted this.

the common dominator in all this is David Moyes.

I don't ... understand what point you're trying to make. I said I agree Moyes isn't the man for the job but taking a quote from an outgoing manager saying he thinks his team is set up for continued success as another stick to beat Moyes with is pointless. People have enough ammo, picking up on nonissues is just pointless (Tbh without investment I doubt Fergie would win anything with the same team or the same team + Fellaini (With Mata too I certainly think they'd be competing alright))

That team has A LOT of weaknesses. Particularly in the wings (Val + Young are useless along with a constantly Inured Nani) Coupled with absolutely No CM options. That team was a few signings away from "continued success" Signings which moyes et al didn't make. (Not that I think it would have made a huge difference tbh)

TheDoc · 28-03-2014 02:56PM

Timmyctc wrote: »

As for Vida. His decline is exaggerated. Playing in an unorganised team, two of his sendings off this season have been unwarranted imo also

I disagree with this and to be honest, personally feel not enough being made of his poisonous form. It was evident from just before the Champions league kicked in, he was looking a bit disheveled and off the pace, prone to more liable lapses then usual.

Really irks me Moyes hasn't addressed this situation. Vidic has declared he is leaving, posted pictures of him singing an ~Inter deal. He should be stripped of the captaincy and it handed to Rooney,

At some point in Moyes United career he is going to need to make a tough call for **** sake.

Our Captain is leaving, and been poor this season.
Our vice captain has been absolutely hapless this season, and is leaving end of term

We just handed Rooney 300k a week and pretty much made him player #1 at the club, because of his performance levels this year. Give him the armband, and just grow a pair ffs.

Timmyctc · 28-03-2014 02:56PM

TheDoc wrote: »

He identified LB, CB and CM during the summer.

I love how he was initially lambasted for trying to Buy Baines (LB wasnt a priority, too much money, too old etc)
I'd say most fans would bite Everton's hand off for Baines at an inflated price now :pac: Evra is a lost cause

Will I Amnt · 28-03-2014 02:56PM

KH25 wrote: »

Im embarrassed to be a United fan.

Why???
Did you donate to it? I'm not one bit embarrassed because of what a select few people are organising.

Agueroooo · 28-03-2014 02:57PM

Timmyctc wrote: »

I don't ... understand what point you're trying to make. I said I agree Moyes isn't the man for the job but taking a quote from an outgoing manager saying he thinks his team is set up for continued success as another stick to beat Moyes with is pointless. People have enough ammo, picking up on nonissues is just pointless (Tbh without investment I doubt Fergie would win anything with the same team or the same team + Fellaini (With Mata too I certainly think they'd be competing alright))

and this ???.....

Ferguson May 2013:
"The quality of this league winning squad, and the balance of ages within it, bodes well for continued success at the highest level whilst the structure of the youth set-up will ensure that the long-term future of the club remains a bright one."

I would not have argued with that in May (nor would many) so what's changed?

adox · 28-03-2014 02:59PM

Drama central here today!

TheDoc · 28-03-2014 02:59PM

Timmyctc wrote: »

I love how he was initially lambasted for trying to Buy Baines (LB wasnt a priority, too much money, too old etc)
I'd say most fans would bite Everton's hand off for Baines at that price now :pac: Evra is a lost cause

I can't specifically remember what I said about that affair, but I might have muted that Baines was crazy money for what was being touted around but definitely felt Evra needed replacing. Thought he was terrible last season.

Buttner was brought in and there was a real sign he was going to have a secluded role, and he kicked up his form, but he couldnt do it this year at all.

Contrao I was realy raging over, as that would have been a great acquisition, and think we should still be hounding Madrid for him. He's been completely underutilized this year in favour of Marcello. I think Contrao is an excellent player and in another life would be a tremendous winger.

MAdrid owe us a sale at this stage, €8-12m for Contrao would be good business for bother parties, his development is going stale at Madrid after bursting onto the scene for Portugal.

KH25 · 28-03-2014 03:01PM

TheDoc wrote: »

He identified LB, CB and CM during the summer.

It's not his fault that Woodward made a ****ing meal of it. Worth remembering that the manager doesn't do the deals, it's handed by the Chief Exec, after targets are put forward.

Moyes still gets too much guff over the summer window, which had little to nothing to do with him. Woodward got suckered into a Fabregas scam and wasted too much time, something that was probably discussed with him in review of the carry on that summer.

Moyes wasn't out with the chequebook, he just hands over a list of targets, and I'm sure he expected to get them, probably shocked he didn't.

You can trapse back if you want, but there was an extensive list of targets that looked more or less genuine and it just appears it was a case of a new Chief Executive getting caught up in some dirty agent tricks and wasting time. Hopefully something he wont repeat this summer.

Bids need to come firm and high, no penny pinching, and strict deadlines attached. We shouldn't be holding out for anyone, it shouldnt be a big decision for someone to join Manchester United, you either are, or your not.

No room for error this window, in early, lay down the cash, give clubs, players and agents specific timeframes of negotiations and if someone is dragigng their heels, move on an forget them.

I understand what you're saying and I agree with you in many respects. Woodward was a farce of a man. But let me elaborate on what I was saying.

He identified LB and CM, granted. But who did we go after? Fabregas, Fellaini, baines, Herrera and Coentrao. Fabregas was a dream signing and very unlikely. Fellaini was quite obviously a last resort. Baines was a no from early days. Herrera and Coentrao if I recall correctly were looked at very late in the window. If you ask me, that shows that Moyes chose his targets poorly. All he ended up getting was a player from his old team.

It was clear after a while that Fabregas would never happen. Thiago (who I forgot earlier :P) was off to Bayern. So where were the alternatives? We had none, bar Fellaini. That is not Woodwards fault.

TheDoc · 28-03-2014 03:07PM

Agueroooo wrote: »

and this ???.....

I would not have argued with that in May (nor would many) so what's changed?

Ferguson underestimating his own powers, as did the club. He was propping up that squad and his departure caused the cracks to burst.

Vidic, Evra and Ferdinand with DRAMATIC declines in form. And look it might be just age, no shame in that. We bought Smalling and Jones as longterm replacements for CB, yet barely if ever played them there.

No RB cover for Rafael.
Brought in Buttner for Evra but for some reason he never gets a crack, so maybe still LB cover required.

A CM containing Cleverly, Carrick Anderson, Giggs, Fletcher to return.

Wingers of Nani not in favour or injured, Ashley Young being terrible, Valencia entirely regressing.

Acquisition of Kagawa and not settling into a role.

Rooney looking on the way out.

While we might have cantered the league last night, it didn't take a genius to realise the comment that the squad could compete for titles for a decade, was utter bull****.

And for all the talk of the youthsetup, we have BARELY brought through a genuine youth player who's cemented a place in the team for YEARs. Wellbeck is probably the first I can remember in donkeys. Cleverly is looking less likely as time goes on.

Januzaj most likely, but it's not like we have a gem coming into the squad each season, so all this talk about our youth setup, if I'm honest is a load of smoke in a bottle.

What actual youngsters came through our acadamy and became first team regulars as a glowing success, that didn't end up iwth them actually being pretty mediocre and being sold.

The "class of 92"....thats over twenty years ago. Since then who ? Wes Brown at times was magnificent, but was prone to be a right bird brain. The talk about our youth system is a bit rubbish in my book, we rarely have a player coming in to actually cement a place in the first team.

The_Kew_Tour · 28-03-2014 03:08PM

TheDoc wrote: »

The "class of 92"....thats over twenty years ago. Since then who ? Wes Brown at times was magnificent, but was prone to be a right bird brain. The talk about our youth system is a bit rubbish in my book, we rarely have a player coming in to actually cement a place in the first team.

Our Youth system is actually appalling the last 10-15 years.

God help us if Welbeck and Cleverley is the best we get from this.

Timmyctc · 28-03-2014 03:09PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Our Youth system is actually appalling the last 10-15 years.

God help us if Welbeck and Cleverley is the best we get from this.

Before anyone quotes that stat that we've had a youth team graduate in the match day squad for the last 80 years or something. Bear in mind Ryan Giggs has been propping that stat up for about 20 year :pac:

The_Kew_Tour · 28-03-2014 03:12PM

Timmyctc wrote: »

Before anyone quotes that stat that we've had a youth team graduate in the match day squad for the last 80 years or something. Bear in mind Ryan Giggs has been propping that stat up for about 20 year :pac:

Maybe im bit OTT with using "appalling" and tbf that is impressive stat, but we should be able to produce better then what we have too in more consistent basis.

onemorechance · 28-03-2014 03:14PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Our Youth system is actually appalling the last 10-15 years.

God help us if Welbeck and Cleverley is the best we get from this.

Welbeck plays out of position more often than not, plays well and works hard.

He can star in a game even if not having played for ages.

If only a few others could do that, United would be in a much better state.

FourFourRED · 28-03-2014 03:16PM

So here's whats going to happen.. the plane will fly over OT, the fans will boo & Moyes will be grinning thinking everybody loves him.

newballsplease · 28-03-2014 03:17PM

onemorechance wrote: »

Welbeck plays out of position more often than not, plays well and works hard.

He can star in a game even if not having played for ages.

If only a few others could do that, United would be in a much better state.

Im not trying to be smart here but What is wellbecks best position? Left,right 10role? Striker? Im not too sure and i dunno if the boss's do either

The_Kew_Tour · 28-03-2014 03:19PM

onemorechance wrote: »

Welbeck plays out of position more often than not, plays well and works hard.

He can star in a game even if not having played for ages.

If only a few others could do that, United would be in a much better state.

Welbecks commitment and attitude has been 100% on the ball.

He has been one of a handful who has at least given 100% each game. I cant fault him and wont for that.

But I still like to think we can produce better footballers too now and again.

spiralism · 28-03-2014 03:21PM

Why do people continuously use the argument that he "needs a summer to get his own players"?? It's bollocks. Nobody said it last year because he had the squad of the champions which needed tinkering. I might point out then that he completely botched the ensuing transfer window and us getting ripped off for Fellaini was our sole purchase. January we do feck all and the statements come out that we're going to stick with the squad, until Mata is offered to us on a silver platter by Mourinho.

Now he's spouting on bollocks about a total rebuild needed. 5 days before Bayern Munich come to town. This is exactly what you want the manager of Man United to be saying.

I guarantee you lads, if he's left here this summer the damage will take at least half a decade to undo and that's being optimistic. Watch as well during the summer as we fight for scraps with City and Chelsea who can offer Champions League football and much higher wages and transfer fees. You think the quality of players we need are going to come play for David Moyes, the man who destroyed a legacy in 8 months? Guys, our two signings were an Everton player the other clubs didnt want and we massively overpaid for and a man that Mourinho ran out of Chelsea. What happens when we need to add to the squad but City, Liverpool and Chelsea want the player too? We're ****ed, that's what.

bangkok · 28-03-2014 03:23PM

TheDoc wrote: »

Ferguson underestimating his own powers, as did the club. He was propping up that squad and his departure caused the cracks to burst.

Vidic, Evra and Ferdinand with DRAMATIC declines in form. And look it might be just age, no shame in that. We bought Smalling and Jones as longterm replacements for CB, yet barely if ever played them there.

No RB cover for Rafael.
Brought in Buttner for Evra but for some reason he never gets a crack, so maybe still LB cover required.

A CM containing Cleverly, Carrick Anderson, Giggs, Fletcher to return.

Wingers of Nani not in favour or injured, Ashley Young being terrible, Valencia entirely regressing.

Acquisition of Kagawa and not settling into a role.

Rooney looking on the way out.

While we might have cantered the league last night, it didn't take a genius to realise the comment that the squad could compete for titles for a decade, was utter bull****.

And for all the talk of the youthsetup, we have BARELY brought through a genuine youth player who's cemented a place in the team for YEARs. Wellbeck is probably the first I can remember in donkeys. Cleverly is looking less likely as time goes on.

Januzaj most likely, but it's not like we have a gem coming into the squad each season, so all this talk about our youth setup, if I'm honest is a load of smoke in a bottle.

What actual youngsters came through our acadamy and became first team regulars as a glowing success, that didn't end up iwth them actually being pretty mediocre and being sold.

The "class of 92"....thats over twenty years ago. Since then who ? Wes Brown at times was magnificent, but was prone to be a right bird brain. The talk about our youth system is a bit rubbish in my book, we rarely have a player coming in to actually cement a place in the first team.

our youth system is just as good as any in Europe.... what players have Real Madrid, Man City, Chelsea, Juventus, even Barcelona in recent years brought through?

class of 92, a bit like barca a few years ago with Busquest,xavi iniesta messi all coming through together or ajax in the 90's, united have had some good success through youth system.

like you said Wes Brown was a great defender but injuries caught up with him, John o Shea was a solid player for united, Evans is first choice centre back now when fit, Rafael another youth team player although he was signed from a young age. Darren Fletcher came through the youths was a brilliant player for us before his sickness. Cleverly and welbeck came through the last few season, welbeck now an established international. Pogba left our youth team and signed for Juve now with a value of 50m +. Januzaj looks to be the next exciting prospect and maybe lingard next season if he gets a run....

newballsplease · 28-03-2014 03:24PM

Strong rumours of a second plane to fly over OT tomorrow.
Waiting to hear if its in defense of Noyes or not!
Oh god....

The_Kew_Tour · 28-03-2014 03:27PM

This plane thing really is cringe.

If you support any other team in PL, hell the world, you can rightly laugh at this.

Better off giving the cost of plane and flight to a charity or worthy cause and save some face.

Agueroooo · 28-03-2014 03:30PM

newballsplease wrote: »

Strong rumours of a second plane to fly over OT tomorrow.
Waiting to hear if its in defense of Noyes or not!
Oh god....

Its a joke ...well could happen.

some Twitter guys (rival fans) are looking for donations (need another £900) to fly a second plane with a #MOYESIN banner.:D

KH25 · 28-03-2014 03:30PM

bangkok wrote: »

our youth system is just as good as any in Europe.... what players have Real Madrid, Man City, Chelsea, Juventus, even Barcelona in recent years brought through?

class of 92, a bit like barca a few years ago with Busquest,xavi iniesta messi all coming through together or ajax in the 90's, united have had some good success through youth system.

like you said Wes Brown was a great defender but injuries caught up with him, John o Shea was a solid player for united, Evans is first choice centre back now when fit, Rafael another youth team player although he was signed from a young age. Darren Fletcher came through the youths was a brilliant player for us before his sickness. Cleverly and welbeck came through the last few season, welbeck now an established international. Pogba left our youth team and signed for Juve now with a value of 50m +. Januzaj looks to be the next exciting prospect and maybe lingard next season if he gets a run....

A few players here and there. We aren't constantly producing players who can step into the first team in the way the likes of Giggs etc did. It could be much better.

Rayne Wooney · 28-03-2014 03:30PM

People read way way too much into quotes

Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

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