Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

Ernest Oreo · 26-03-2014 09:42AM

Doc - you're also ignoring the fact that city barely jumped out of second gear last night
they completely coasted their way through

pathetic

that 10/15 mins before HT when united were 'in the game' was solely down to the city crew having no interest really in the match
beating united isnt such a big deal for them anymore..

Ernest Oreo · 26-03-2014 09:44AM

van gaal would be a better option than moyes of course
but wouldnt transform the club like Pep or Klopp
Pep isnt an option (now - well done united for fooking this up), but Klopp might be

Cookiemunster · 26-03-2014 09:46AM

Ernest Oreo wrote: »

van gaal would be a better option than moyes of course
but wouldnt transform the club like Pep or Klopp
Pep isnt an option (now - well done united for fooking this up), but Klopp might be

Klopp signed a contract with Dortmund till 2018 only 2 months ago. He's well aware of the situation in the Bundesliga and still signed. He will not be leaving Dortmund next season.

bullvine · 26-03-2014 09:46AM

Ernest Oreo wrote: »

van gaal would be a better option than moyes of course
but wouldnt transform the club like Pep or Klopp
Pep isnt an option (now - well done united for fooking this up), but Klopp might be

Van Gaal set the ground work for a lot of Bayerns Success though.

Lord TSC · 26-03-2014 09:47AM

Ernest Oreo wrote: »

van gaal would be a better option than moyes of course
but wouldnt transform the club like Pep or Klopp
Pep isnt an option (now - well done united for fooking this up), but Klopp might be

Agreed. VG would likely be a short term solution in a bid to steady the ship (and ironically regain the stability of "United are winners" before leaving again). Klopp is who I want.

But VG is a fair few levels above Hughes and Curbirshy, so you make yourself look foolish lumping him in with them.

Lucas Hood · 26-03-2014 09:47AM

bangkok wrote: »

citys midfield lineup last night......

Navas
Fernandinho
Toure
Silva
Nasri

United Midfield

Cleverly----Carrick----Fellaini---- Mata
Welbeck

before a ball was even kicked we were never going to win

That's bullshït.

Maximus Alexander · 26-03-2014 09:48AM

Ernest Oreo wrote: »

that 10/15 mins before HT when united were 'in the game' was solely down to the city crew having no interest really in the match
beating united isnt such a big deal for them anymore..

Right yeah, they can find the motivation to go out and put 5 past Fulham and Blackburn and 6 past West Ham and Arsenal, but when it's the reigning champions and their cross town rivals they're just not arsed anymore.

ericzeking · 26-03-2014 09:50AM

TheDoc wrote: »

Well...

That was pretty painful to watch. The starting formation was a bit obscure and the start from City was electric, talk about absolutely throwing a brick in my face of positivity.

Apart from Dzeko's botched attempt, I'm struggling to remember many saves De Gea had to make. For all the incisions and slick passing from City, they'd the same amount of chances as we did. And all I can remember is a few rubbish shots, Wellbecks flick and Mata's botched attempt.

I think, yet again, the issues that occured for the goals were the problems Moyes had already identified early on, and things that will be addressed in the summer. Evra looks shot on his feet. He was being torn asunder at every opportunity and frequently was jogging back when Navas was belting.

For the first goal, talk about completely away with the fairies. He was in a covering position and from the point Nasri got the ball at his feet, Evra barely moved. It was shocking to see.

The second goal, Ferdinand just showing how he is finished. And his reaction showed it. Dzeko didnt even move intelligently, he just lost Ferdinand with a straight run, the finish was excellent.

The third goal was so soft, it wasn't even a good dummy, Evra sold again stupidly, and Carrick wasn't anywhere close.

There appeared to be a resurgence towards the end of the first half with some slick play and unfortunately we didnt make any chances. Fellaini seemed be playing a more advanced role and I was suprised to see him struggling to get back at times. Granted he's no box to box player, he's not who we need in the final third.

I was disappointed overall with him last night. Too many times he was standing off, instead of just milling someone. The amount of times he jockeyed Toure, and I was screaming at the telly to tackle him. His elbow I think was a good call from the referee. From replays it doesnt appear he was looking at Zabaleta, and I think he went to fend of the defender, but obviously being alot taller caught him in the cheek.

Mata was extremely poor last night. Really poor. I'm hoping a good pre-season and a bit of frshness can bring out the best in him, cause I've seen a shadow so far of the Chelsea player who was rampant in the league.

Evident again last night was the lack of pace and width in the side. I lost count the amount of times Evra lost the ball and then we were hit on the break. But moreso when he or Rafael had the ball, and its like everyone moved forward, and no one made an option. It was just Sunday football to be honest, no one showing.

I've noticed that in a number of the bad performances, this craic with our fullbacks moving forward, with no one showing for the ball.

The lack of umph from the team was dissppointing, but I felt it was just another indication of our obvious weaklinks costing us.

The more I see Carrick, the more I fear for his survival in this squad, he looks to be worse and worse everytime I see him.

Still holding on for Moyes, when it comes to a game, I tend to focus more on the players playing, then the tactics of potential strategy behind it, and last night was riddled with examples of players costing us again, lazyness, end of careers and just downright dirt.

I'll just saw that obviously we lost 3-0, but it in no way felt as harrowing as the Liverpool result. While we fizzled out in the second half, there was few or far between attempts I can remember from City outside the goals. And you'd nearly be amde believe De Gea was working overtime last night.

Evra is actually boiling my blood this year, I don't know if it's lazyness or if it's his legs going, but it's a disgrace for him to be having the captains armband. And I wish Moyes would grow a pair of bollox and sort some things out now.

Hand the captaincy to Rooney, and remove Evra from the squad entirely and play Buttner.

Pretty much on the same page as you Doc, nice post... I actually posted this after the West Ham game..

Is there any correlation to be drawn between this promising performance and the absence of the players who aren't playing for Moyes intentionally or not for one reason or another, ie RVP, Vidic, Evra, Rio?? Just throwing it out there.

the audible out campaign is iminent though, I'm wondering can he survive this.

bangkok · 26-03-2014 09:51AM

I said before the game that stopping silva was the key to beating city.... after 5 mins silva had touched the ball 20 times!! he was going around as if he owned old Trafford!!

what was wrong with mata last night he was awful!!

DARK-KNIGHT · 26-03-2014 09:58AM

Its almost like moyes is trolling united now... jesus some of the tactics have been shocking. City are a fantastic side but lets face it we are miles behind them.

Moyes is defo not the man for the job. I think he is fantastic at managing smaller club like everton he seems to find quality players with a limited budget. I couldnt care who or what is said by the trolls about our club but we need to address moyes and replace him asap the new manager needs to see setup and pick his summer targets..

I wouldnt let moyes manage my weekly tesco shop nevermind manage the biggest club in the world...

Irishcrx · 26-03-2014 09:59AM

I know Klopp is a bit eccentric himself , but the man has passion , has a vast tactical knowledge of the game , has proven he can build a squad to compete and win titles and is far from a puppet.

I have no doubt if Utd got him he would run the club in his own way and take no **** from anyone , players , board or SAF.

I really do think he is a perfect fit for the job. Jesus if only I owned Man Utd , I'd be over in Germany swooning him all season and I'd have Moyes hung from the gallows (Ok he's a nice bloke and all blah blah , but a top flight manager the man is not)

buckfasterer · 26-03-2014 09:59AM

I've heard more Liverpool fans talking about the game than anyone else. It's not that they're laughing either.....it's a sense of disbelief about the tactics, players and wondering how it's gone so wrong so quick.

rob316 · 26-03-2014 10:05AM

buckfasterer wrote: »

I've heard more Liverpool fans talking about the game than anyone else. It's not that they're laughing either.....it's a sense of disbelief about the tactics, players and wondering how it's gone so wrong so quick.

We are all shocked to be honest, we all hoped it would be tough but for it to be this bad was beyond my wildest dreams.
Mata looks like a pub player. The same Mata who was Chelsea's player of the season twice winning a Europa and European cup.
He hasn't a clue, there is no identity, no belief from the manager and its filtered down into the players.

Its the speed of the decline, Liverpool didn't even fall away this quick.

Lord TSC · 26-03-2014 10:06AM

buckfasterer wrote: »

I've heard more Liverpool fans talking about the game than anyone else. It's not that they're laughing either.....it's a sense of disbelief about the tactics, players and wondering how it's gone so wrong so quick.

That's the thing; even the people who want to find it funny are n disbelief. For all the fears other fans would laugh at us for sacking a manager, I think most non-United fans can't wrap their heads round why we are being so stubborn.

Irishcrx · 26-03-2014 10:06AM

buckfasterer wrote: »

I've heard more Liverpool fans talking about the game than anyone else. It's not that they're laughing either.....it's a sense of disbelief about the tactics, players and wondering how it's gone so wrong so quick.

It's gotten so sad that even the Liverpool fans are taking pity on us. I really couldn't believe how inept that team were last night. As a few have mentioned it was Sunday football ,players went hiding , when we moved forward nobody was showing , we couldn't hold on to the ball at all, we gave it away with stupid passes , lack of concentration.

When city moved the ball they did so with confidenance and quality , their passes found each other it was fluid and slick , we were the total opposite. It's not like to don't have the attacking players to do it either , Rooney , Mata , Kagawa all on the pitch but they still look like they haven't a clue how to play together.

We can't score against the big teams , we didn't even look threatning , and at the other end we are even worst , dire , melting butter. I feel for DDG he must be thinking what the **** he's doing here now , the lad is the only one back there worthy of wearing a Manchester Utd jersey.

I'm very concerned about Bayern now , particularly at Old Trafford.

beno619 · 26-03-2014 10:12AM

ericzeking wrote: »

Pretty much on the same page as you Doc, nice post... I actually posted this after the West Ham game..

the audible out campaign is iminent though, I'm wondering can he survive this.

You both ignore the fact that moyes picks the team ?

dzer2 · 26-03-2014 10:18AM

As a Liverpool fan with a son supporting United and numerous friends united supporters. 3 yrs ago I was telling them that investment was needed in the united team. I pointed to the early 2000s when every yr they bought a defender and striker and midfielder of quality while some didnt work out if one did it was an improvement but in the last 5 yrs they didnt buy wisely and while van persie hit the ground running and won ye a title single handed if was never good enough. All have rang and said I was close to the truth now but its 5 yrs too late for united and they need savage investment now. I think the felleni signing was a last minute one to try to strenghten a poor midfield and the mata one is a panic buy by the owners to settle the fans. Mata is not a moyes type of player

To me the players arent doing it evra was a disgrace last night stood beside decko for the first goal never took a step when the ball hit the post. For the second goal I thought at first decko headed it in when I seen the replay he side footed it one step out by evra would have blocked it. He is not arsed and should be dropped. mata couldnt make the chavs team why do you think he is good enough to make yours. If you are buying a player you should buy a player who is performing well. As bad as DM is he tried to get full backs so he knows there is a problem. As for the last transfer window who in their right mind would go to a team that is underperforming that much with a world cup coming in the summer.

Giruilla · 26-03-2014 10:20AM

Last 7 games Cleverley has started, United have lost 6 and drawn one. 3 of those losses being at OT.

Yet he still starts against city.

Damage was done before Moyes corrected his mistake and brought Kagawa on at half time.

bangkok · 26-03-2014 10:20AM

beno619 wrote: »

You both ignore the fact that moyes picks the team ?

well the back 4 was forced upon him....

vidic suspended, smalling and evans injured.

midfield is a joke anyway very poor so no matter who he picked there city were always going to come out on top.

rooney picks himself really so its not really giving moyes many options.

and after last night I have finally decided that fellaini is not a united player. good against the likes of west ham and stoke, shocking against better teams and should have been sent off

martingriff · 26-03-2014 10:20AM

Headshot wrote: »

sigh. I hate that excuse. Its just lazy at this stage and just shows you dont watch last seasons team which had a never die mentality and gave it there all even thou they didnt play great stuff. We were miles better last season than we are today and might I add we added a 27m hacker and a player that ozzes class but Moyes doesnt know what to do with him. The transfer window excuse is also a poor one at this stage.

The transfer window is not a poor excuse Utd (not a fan by the way) will need at leat 6 players next summer. Your defence will be all changed with maybe Smalling or Rafael still there. Your midfielder will have Mata all rest so be gone.

Last year yes it was the never say die attitude and yes that is gone but last year your strike force was on fire this year not and how many times did Scoles come on the pitch and bale ye out. City could not hit a barn door when Silva was injured Aresenal were well Arsenal and Liverpool were struggling. If those 3 teams were playing last year as there are this year then I would sau Utd would have also struggled. Having to bring a 37 year old out of retirement last year to shore up the midfield say loads.

Now Moyes is not able for the job and it will take a long time to build back up his stock as for some teams he can do a job

ericzeking · 26-03-2014 10:20AM

beno619 wrote: »

You both ignore the fact that moyes picks the team ?

No I don't, and I've criticised him for it...for sticking with Evra...for sticking with Rio and Vidic, Vidic as captain, although these are more excusable since Smalling and Evans are injured and for failing to give RVP the required clip round the ear when he throws a strop and being afraid to take him off...

2moreMinutes · 26-03-2014 10:21AM

spiralism wrote: »

Yeah but who have we beaten away? Lost to anyone decent we played bar (typical post january) Arsenal and if we went to Anfield now instead of August we'd get pumped by 4 goals.

We have played the same teams away as everyone else has, bar the few games remaining.
Your constant over the top dramatic negative bs is almost getting funny at this stage.

v3ttel · 26-03-2014 10:22AM

Giruilla wrote: »

Last 7 games Cleverley has started, United have lost 6 and drawn one. 3 of those losses being at OT.

Yet he still starts against city.

Damage was done before Moyes corrected his mistake and brought Kagawa on at half time.

Bringing on Kagawa, at half time, to play right wing, is not "correcting his mistake"

Irishcrx · 26-03-2014 10:23AM

Oh and did anyone hear Moyes on Cleverly in the post match.

'Em, yes Tom had an injury...but eh..we had to make a change...he had an injury'

Reeked of lies to protect poor Tom's moral and public image. What he meant to say was.

' I shouldn't have picked him to begin with , he was muck in the first half and I had to correct it by bringing Kagawa on which I should have done at the start'

Giruilla · 26-03-2014 10:25AM

v3ttel wrote: »

Bringing on Kagawa, at half time, to play right wing, is not "correcting his mistake"

It's above a 100% improvement over having Cleverley on the pitch so it is in my book.

Ernest Oreo · 26-03-2014 10:26AM

v3ttel wrote: »

Bringing on Kagawa, at half time, to play right wing, is not "correcting his mistake"

agreed
its exactly like some earlier poster stated - this was just moyes continuing to just randomly throw 'solutions' at growing problems in the hope that something might eventually work
he has no idea how to construct a creative / efficient midfield from the the players available to him
clueless
get rid NOW

keeponhurling · 26-03-2014 10:28AM

As he said himself, he's trying for two solutions, one to "make it difficult for them to play", and one to "score goals ourselves".

That sounds pretty spot on to me, I'd give him time to work with these solutions.

Moyes In!

v3ttel · 26-03-2014 10:34AM

Giruilla wrote: »

It's above a 100% improvement over having Cleverley on the pitch so it is in my book.

It's still wrong for many, many reasons and is definitely not "correcting" anything as regards the balance of the team.

tigger123 · 26-03-2014 10:34AM

If Moyes hasn't been sacked at this stage I'd say he'll last out the rest of the season. I wonder though if the fans turning on Fergie at last nights game will start to have an influence on "the boards" thinking.

partyguinness · 26-03-2014 10:35AM

Now I am not a ManU supporter. I am quite neutral but do have a soft spot for them since the Keano/Irwin days. My take on ManU is this:

They are now being found out. Ferguson, God bless him, was a great manager and his record of trophies will probably never be beaten.

For the past 20 years or so, let’s be honest, ManU didn’t play the most sophisticated football in the world, didn’t have the best technically gifted teams and more often than not they were usually 2nd best but they were always able to grind out a result. They played a fast tempo pressing game and just wore teams down and were great t catching teams on the break.

You had a workman like team sprinkled with some great individuals but not the most technically gifted in the world. For example, look at the team in 1999, lets be honest- Gary Neville, Johnson, Butt, Blomquist, May, Giggs, Beckham. Hardly names that are going to stand the test of time in terms of the greats of world football. As Keane said about Giggs- great career is not equal to a great player. I would say the same about Beckham. This is not a criticism and they were fantastic pros just how I see it.

Also, the other teams in the PL for most of the 20 years have been pretty flaky in terms of competition. Nobody was as consistent as ManU. ManU could quite easily lose to the main challengers a few times a season but it didn’t matter as they beat the lesser teams consistently and that’s what winning the PL was all about- and ManU were consistent thanks to SAF.

I think now the old formula that served them well no longer works- teams and coaches and younger and more sophisticated and ManU have been left behind. A massive rebuilding programme is now on the cards.

Paradoxically, I think SAF staying there so long is now coming home to roast. Yes, they won the league last year but is that really the benchmark anymore?

ManU have fallen way behind there European rivals in terms of quality and sophistication and that has been evident for a few seasons now especially since the 2011 CL final where Barcelona completely outclassed them.

Moyes, I like him and feel sorry for him, has been left with a mesh mash of veterans well past it, players who are just not good enough and Rooney/Van Persie/Mata.

This ManU team/squad is just not good enough. The competition in the PL has moved to new level and ManU have been left behind. SAF got out just at the right time. SAF never had more than 1 serious challenger per season- now there are 3-4.

But let’s see what the summer brings.

Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

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