Social Manners - what are people's opinions?

Arbiter of Good Taste · 05-03-2014 11:40AM

I had a situation on an Aer Lingus flight recently which made me laugh. I boarded the plane and proceeded towards my seat, which was an aisle seat. There was a middle aged couple in the window (him) and middle (her) seats. Her coat and hat were on my seat and she was all buckled up reading a magazine - so it wasn't like she had just dumped them there for a few minutes while she sorted herself out. I politely said, "sorry that's my seat" and the filthy look she gave me was unbelievable. Cue an audible sigh while she took her stuff. I'm not sure where she thought I should have sat.

So she then proceeded to continuously sigh loudly. I thought maybe she was having some type of panic or asthma attack.

As it happened the row ahead of us was empty. Normally I would have jumped into the empty row once the flight took off, but this time I stayed put, took out my laptop, spread my elbows and worked away for the hour. She was not happy

Pinch Flat · 05-03-2014 11:41AM

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

You become a lot more tolerant of crappy behaviour living in a big city anyway. Things that would phase many people don't phase me as much as they used to.

Maybe there's a bit of this, but I lived in London for 5 years, so large cities don't phase me. Dublin is a lot smaller and wheras I would say Londoners are "ruder" on first meeting, they are actually just used to these social norms that have developed there over years and will more than likely put you right when you break these.

With Irish people, I find them more self centred - it's all about me. So, I'll happily laugh, joke, text and take calls through the movie and it's you're problem if you interject.

emmabrighton · 05-03-2014 11:46AM

sopretty wrote: »

Well of course one should sit down and one queue. Otherwise you'd have 2 eejits blocking up a queue unnecessarily and the OP would be quick to put 'manners' on them and tell them to remove themselves from the queue.

Jeeze, to me that is a Ryanair model - "Quick, dash for a seat as soon as one becomes available". So it looks like I am going to have to go to coffee shops with waiters. This is always happening in my local coffee shop. You walk in, there are no seats, so you and your partner joins the queue together. Next more people come in, still no seats... they join the queue together and so on. Then someone gets up to leave and one of us in the queue dashes over and stands guard over the person getting ready to leave. Marking ownership over the "good table".

If we all behaved ourselves and only looked for a seat when we reached the top of the queue. There would always be seats for us to sit in...

Just the panic mentality means people order their drink and then have to wander round the coffee shop looking for a seat because there are a load of table bookers sitting down and daring you to say something...

:mad:

ps. I will get my mom to do the seat booking when I am out with her cos I can't bare the nasty looks people like me throw seat bookers...

Pinch Flat · 05-03-2014 11:46AM

Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »

So she then proceeded to continuously sigh loudly. I thought maybe she was having some type of panic or asthma attack.

It's the sighing I love - people personalise it so much. You don't get it outside of Ireland.

I decided to go into the flight fest with my 7 year old son in September. When the train arrived at our station, it was packed - if we missed this train, we missed the start of the flight fest and my little guy would have been devastated. So I was getting on that train.

People were packed at the space at the doors - but plenty of room in the aisles. I asked people to please move down the aisles so the few waiting to get on could be accommodated - well, you swear I'd asked them to stand on their heads in a barrel of sh!t. Moaning, tutting, 'we've got children with us as well'. Anyway, after 30 or so seconds of me telling every one to use the available space on the train, guess what? we all go on. No-one died and we had a great day.

Legs.Eleven · 05-03-2014 11:48AM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Maybe there's a bit of this, but I lived in London for 5 years, so large cities don't phase me. Dublin is a lot smaller and wheras I would say Londoners are "ruder" on first meeting, they are actually just used to these social norms that have developed there over years and will more than likely put you right when you break these.

With Irish people, I find them more self centred - it's all about me. So, I'll happily laugh, joke, text and take calls through the movie and it's you're problem if you interject.

In general, I don't find the Irish particularly rude and from my experience, most people accept and respect the social norms (social norms obviously differ in smaller cities). Don't find them ruder than anywhere else tbh. Obviously talking during a film is highly rude but it's generally not accepted and the vast majority of people don't do that.

anncoates · 05-03-2014 11:49AM

I'm normally very polite and mannerly in social situations but tend to get a bit worked up if I think people are being rude or ignorant to me or if they are - admittedly, imo - being stupid and often say something acid-tongued to them. I try not to but often I just blurt it out and regret it later.

Pinch Flat · 05-03-2014 11:51AM

anncoates wrote: »

I'm normally very polite and mannerly in social situations but tend to get a bit a bit worked up if I think people are being rude to me and often say something acid-tongued to them. I try not to but often I just blurt it out and regret it later.

Being honest, I felt a bit guilty when I asked the lady to move her stuff .But what was I to do - stand with my coffee upon on a saucer in one hand and a plate with my bun in the other, waiting for a set to come free while getting jostled in a busy city centre coffee shop?

Red21 · 05-03-2014 11:53AM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

So I politely tell the lady to move her stuff so I can sit down - she's surprised and says she didn't realise I could do that and sort of questions me. Well, I said where am I going to sit? She moved her stuff in a huff and, when a seat became available, I could feel her seething con?tempt towards me. So, harsh or not?

Are you saying she didn't move right awat but waited till one became avaiable and then moved.

If she had refused to move what would you've done?

Pinch Flat · 05-03-2014 11:55AM

Red21 wrote: »

Are you saying she didn't move right awat but waited till one became avaiable and then moved.

If she had refused to move what would you've done?

No, she moved right away. If she hadn't of moved - well, I was going to squeeze in beside her.:D

Legs.Eleven · 05-03-2014 12:05PM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

No, she moved right away. If she hadn't of moved - well, I was going to squeeze in beside her.:D

Actually, this is one thing that doesn't happen many places outside Ireland: people sitting down at the same table with you. They'll ask you politely if it's okay if they sit there and you sit there in silence eating your lunch together. Last time I was home I got the shock of my life when someone did as I haven't lived there in years and wasn't used to it. We ended up having a nice chat about Pennys and the weather.

You do NOT do that here in Madrid. A Spanish person I know even commented on it after she'd been to Ireland. You have one person sitting on a massive, long table suitable for about 20 people and no one will ask if it's okay to share it. If you do, prepare for a simple, "No" and possible Bitch Face.

Imhof Tank · 05-03-2014 12:24PM

Couple of weeks ago, got on a not too crowded Dart about 9.30 am. I sat on the outside of a seat with a mid-20s girl by the window (casually dressed, had one of those security passes on a string around her neck, I took her for a call centre worker possibly) and a older guy opposite me with no one beside him.

I could see immediately that the girl had the edge of her shoe on the leading edge of the empty seat opposite her. That annoyed me straight away and I got the sense all 3 of us were focusing on that foot to see what she do with it.
After 2 stations up went the foot and I exploded “SEATS ARE NOT FOR FEET” (might possibly have said that a little too loud with my ear phones in), pointing at the sign and illustration on the window. Guy opposite me seemed to think this was hilarious.

Anyway yer one took down her feet immediately, turned to me, held her face 6 inches from mine and we proceeded to have a sort of staring contest for a good 10 seconds until she looked away and that was that I thought. I then saw that she was wiping her eyes and seemed to be sobbing for the next 20 minutes. This went on until Tara Street where she gathered up her bags to get off, and then we had an exchange which was pretty much word for word:

Her – I just want to say “congratulations” on reading the sign
Me- No problem, I thought you couldn’t read
Her – You are smarter than you look
Me – Thank you!
Her – (mouths silent expletive)
Me – (raises middle finger)
Her - (over the top ironic friendly wave to me) (she was off the carriage and gesturing at me through the window from the platform at this stage)

So what do you make of that? She was 1000% in the wrong over the feet on seats thing and had to know that. She basically went postal anyway so was there something about how I challenged her? Or was it just her. My opinion at the time was that she somehow felt that I would be slower to challenge a skinhead or a junkie for example (which is probably true in fairness) and it enraged her that I felt confident enough to confront her, like I was the one disrespecting her?? I am male, mid 40s, suit & tie combo, by the way.

Tiddlypeeps · 05-03-2014 12:26PM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Being honest, I felt a bit guilty when I asked the lady to move her stuff .But what was I to do - stand with my coffee upon on a saucer in one hand and a plate with my bun in the other, waiting for a set to come free while getting jostled in a busy city centre coffee shop?

What would you have done if there were no tables?

I don't get this at all. If there were feck all tables and not likely to be any free when you get your order why the hell would you queue up in the first place?

I don't go to coffee shops alone, don't really see the point so I'd never book at table with my bag. But when I do go with someone else I make sure I have a table before ordering. I'm not gonna spend a fortune on a drink and possibly a snack when there might be no tables when I get to the end of the queue. That to me just seems like a really stupid thing to do. You'll be left standing like an eejit, coffee in hand, waiting for a table to free up. It could be cold by the time you get a seat and you won't be able to relax and chat with your friend while frantically looking for a sign that someone is about to get up.

I had no idea this was considered bad manners by anyone and to be honest I don't really care. If someone asked me to move while I sit at a table and wait for my friend to return with our order then I'd tell them where to go.

Demanding that someone move like that because of some rule you made up in your head seems like the absolute hight of bad manners and self centeredness.

Voodoomelon · 05-03-2014 12:29PM

anncoates wrote: »

I'm normally very polite and mannerly in social situations but tend to get a bit worked up if I think people are being rude or ignorant to me or if they are - admittedly, imo - being stupid and often say something acid-tongued to them. I try not to but often I just blurt it out and regret it later.

I'm the same, I normally wouldn't say boo to a mouse but if I have to sit there seething for a few minutes while someone annoys the hell out of me, i'll end up saying something.

I'm the worst in the cinema, not only do you have to contend with yappers, we also have smartphones acting like flood lights when people whip them out to check Facebook in the middle of a film.

Usually say something to these arses if they don't put them away very quickly. I still remember roaring out a few years ago to some girls to shut the hell up; others obviously felt the same as two more people shouted out at the same time in agreement.

OldNotWIse · 05-03-2014 12:31PM

irish_goat wrote: »

If there is a queue of people waiting for coffee ahead of you and very few seats, then yes.

It's their own fault if they were silly enough to overlook the vacant seats

Fortune favours the brave :pac:

mad muffin · 05-03-2014 12:32PM

Imhof Tank wrote: »

Couple of weeks ago, got on a not too crowded Dart about 9.30 am. I sat on the outside of a seat with a mid-20s girl by the window (casually dressed, had one of those security passes on a string around her neck, I took her for a call centre worker possibly) and a older guy opposite me with no one beside him.

I could see immediately that the girl had the edge of her shoe on the leading edge of the empty seat opposite her. That annoyed me straight away and I got the sense all 3 of us were focusing on that foot to see what she do with it.
After 2 stations up went the foot and I exploded “SEATS ARE NOT FOR FEET” (might possibly have said that a little too loud with my ear phones in), pointing at the sign and illustration on the window. Guy opposite me seemed to think this was hilarious.

Anyway yer one took down her feet immediately, turned to me, held her face 6 inches from mine and we proceeded to have a sort of staring contest for a good 10 seconds until she looked away and that was that I thought. I then saw that she was wiping her eyes and seemed to be sobbing for the next 20 minutes. This went on until Tara Street where she gathered up her bags to get off, and then we had an exchange which was pretty much word for word:

Her – I just want to say “congratulations” on reading the sign
Me- No problem, I thought you couldn’t read
Her – You are smarter than you look
Me – Thank you!
Her – (mouths silent expletive)
Me – (raises middle finger)
Her - (over the top ironic friendly wave to me) (she was off the carriage and gesturing at me through the window from the platform at this stage)

So what do you make of that? She was 1000% in the wrong over the feet on seats thing and had to know that. She basically went postal anyway so was there something about how I challenged her? Or was it just her. My opinion at the time was that she somehow felt that I would be slower to challenge a skinhead or a junkie for example (which is probably true in fairness) and it enraged her that I felt confident enough to confront her, like I was the one disrespecting her?? I am male, mid 40s, suit & tie combo, by the way.

Sounds to me like love at first sight.

GreeBo · 05-03-2014 12:32PM

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

What would you have done if there were no tables?

I don't get this at all. If there were feck all tables and not likely to be any free when you get your order why the hell would you queue up in the first place?

I don't go to coffee shops alone, don't really see the point so I'd never book at table with my bag. But when I do go with someone else I make sure I have a table before ordering. I'm not gonna spend a fortune on a drink and possibly a snack when there might be no tables when I get to the end of the queue. That to me just seems like a really stupid thing to do. You'll be left standing like an eejit, coffee in hand, waiting for a table to free up. It could be cold by the time you get a seat and you won't be able to relax and chat with your friend while frantically looking for a sign that someone is about to get up.

I had no idea this was considered bad manners by anyone and to be honest I don't really care. If someone asked me to move while I sit at a table and wait for my friend to return with our order then I'd tell them where to go.

Demanding that someone move like that because of some rule you made up in your head seems like the absolute hight of bad manners and self centeredness.

If everyone only looked for a seat when they had their stuff then it would be much easier to determine of there are seats free or not when you need them, its impossible to figure out otherwise as depending on the numbers together some will sit before ordering and some wont....chaos.

Its not some rule you made up, its the equivalent of towels on the sunbed the night before. Where do you draw the line with this? Can I just leave some stuff on a table in the morning so I have it booked for lunchtime?

Get a table when you have ordered, simples.

stinkle · 05-03-2014 12:34PM

Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »

I had a situation on an Aer Lingus flight recently which made me laugh. I boarded the plane and proceeded towards my seat, which was an aisle seat. There was a middle aged couple in the window (him) and middle (her) seats. Her coat and hat were on my seat and she was all buckled up reading a magazine - so it wasn't like she had just dumped them there for a few minutes while she sorted herself out. I politely said, "sorry that's my seat" and the filthy look she gave me was unbelievable. Cue an audible sigh while she took her stuff. I'm not sure where she thought I should have sat.

So she then proceeded to continuously sigh loudly. I thought maybe she was having some type of panic or asthma attack.

As it happened the row ahead of us was empty. Normally I would have jumped into the empty row once the flight took off, but this time I stayed put, took out my laptop, spread my elbows and worked away for the hour. She was not happy

Had a similar enough experience last week on a very full transatlantic flight - middle aged couple dumping all their stuff on my seat before I boarded. They were grand once they realised, but come on, the departure gate area was jammed, why would you put all your stuff there knowing it was very likely that someone would be allocated the seat.

Same flight - overhead bin for our row was unusually tiny as it was near the emergency exit which was fair enough. I needed to use the one beside it but the one guy ahead of me managed to sprawl 4 pieces of hand luggage into it leaving me with no room for my small backpack. I just asked the stewardess and she made him pack things in a more sensible way.

Train booking system used to do my head in too when I travelled from Dublin to Clare every other week. I used to deliberately book a window seat in a two-seater row so i could plug in my laptop and work, so wouldnt be prepared to move for anyone hogging my seat as I chose it for a reason. I'd usually point out I had it booked and needed to use the socket.

Red21 · 05-03-2014 12:34PM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

No, she moved right away. If she hadn't of moved - well, I was going to squeeze in beside her.:D

If I was alone I wouldn't block off a seat cos it's so easy to fit in some corner when it's just youself. If it was 2 one of us often does block off a seat, but this is usually a dash from mid-queue if the place is filling up. Plus what tiddlypeeps just said- I'll give a look in the door and it's very busy/full I'll move on.

Legs.Eleven · 05-03-2014 12:36PM

Imhof Tank wrote: »

Couple of weeks ago, got on a not too crowded Dart about 9.30 am. I sat on the outside of a seat with a mid-20s girl by the window (casually dressed, had one of those security passes on a string around her neck, I took her for a call centre worker possibly) and a older guy opposite me with no one beside him.

I could see immediately that the girl had the edge of her shoe on the leading edge of the empty seat opposite her. That annoyed me straight away and I got the sense all 3 of us were focusing on that foot to see what she do with it.
After 2 stations up went the foot and I exploded “SEATS ARE NOT FOR FEET” (might possibly have said that a little too loud with my ear phones in), pointing at the sign and illustration on the window. Guy opposite me seemed to think this was hilarious.

Anyway yer one took down her feet immediately, turned to me, held her face 6 inches from mine and we proceeded to have a sort of staring contest for a good 10 seconds until she looked away and that was that I thought. I then saw that she was wiping her eyes and seemed to be sobbing for the next 20 minutes. This went on until Tara Street where she gathered up her bags to get off, and then we had an exchange which was pretty much word for word:

Her – I just want to say “congratulations” on reading the sign
Me- No problem, I thought you couldn’t read
Her – You are smarter than you look
Me – Thank you!
Her – (mouths silent expletive)
Me – (raises middle finger)
Her - (over the top ironic friendly wave to me) (she was off the carriage and gesturing at me through the window from the platform at this stage)

So what do you make of that? She was 1000% in the wrong over the feet on seats thing and had to know that. She basically went postal anyway so was there something about how I challenged her? Or was it just her. My opinion at the time was that she somehow felt that I would be slower to challenge a skinhead or a junkie for example (which is probably true in fairness) and it enraged her that I felt confident enough to confront her, like I was the one disrespecting her?? I am male, mid 40s, suit & tie combo, by the way.

Jaysus it all sounds very childish. She shouldn't have had her feet on the seats but there's probably a better way to say it to her that wouldn't have provoked that reaction. Shouting and pointing at the sign would rile most people up, I'd think.

Would you have said it to a man your own age by any chance? Another man in a suit and tie combo, even?

Katgurl · 05-03-2014 12:40PM

Yes when I find people behaving in a rude way I do assert myself, no problem. The key is to smile, be calm and very firm. You have to be respectful - its not alright to embarrass the other person when there is a high probability they didnt even know they were being rude.

However OP, 'manners' or acceptable behaviour varies with where you are. I've even noticed vast difference between Dublin and Galway. So I think you have to be flexible to what's acceptable in your surroundings. Just because something worked well in Germany doesn't mean it's the same in Ireland. My mother alway says she enjoys travelling in France, that boys will automatically hop out of their seats on the train and offer to her. That doesn't mean somebody merits a telling off for not doing the same here. Perhaps that woman in the cafe thought it perfectly acceptable to book her seat as that is what she had seen everyone do for years?

To be honest if it was me in that cafe and a woman on her own did that I wouldn't have asked her to move I would have said "oh that's the last table, would you mind if I shared?"

When I moved to Galway first , people drove me mad; always a little bit late and never accurate when saying how far away they were. Another guy I know here has lived in Sweden for years and only moved back to Galway three years ago. He is permanently enraged waiting ten or fifteen minutes for people every time and repeating the same things over and over "I'm on time. You're on time. Why can't he/she be on time". I think this is ridiculous. It's obviously deemed not rude to be up to 15 mins late here so expecting everyone else to suddenly tow the line with your expectations is ruder IMO.

Manners aren't set in stone and you also need to be flexible with your surroundings.

sopretty · 05-03-2014 12:42PM

Imhof Tank. Could you not have politely reminded her about the rule, rather than lifting the poor woman out of it?? You think roaring, making a woman cry, insulting her intelligence and giving her the finger is acceptable behaviour? I think I'm currently mumbling the same expletive that she was under my breath!!!

OldNotWIse · 05-03-2014 12:43PM

Imhof Tank wrote: »

Couple of weeks ago, got on a not too crowded Dart about 9.30 am. I sat on the outside of a seat with a mid-20s girl by the window (casually dressed, had one of those security passes on a string around her neck, I took her for a call centre worker possibly) and a older guy opposite me with no one beside him.

I could see immediately that the girl had the edge of her shoe on the leading edge of the empty seat opposite her. That annoyed me straight away and I got the sense all 3 of us were focusing on that foot to see what she do with it.
After 2 stations up went the foot and I exploded “SEATS ARE NOT FOR FEET” (might possibly have said that a little too loud with my ear phones in), pointing at the sign and illustration on the window. Guy opposite me seemed to think this was hilarious.

Anyway yer one took down her feet immediately, turned to me, held her face 6 inches from mine and we proceeded to have a sort of staring contest for a good 10 seconds until she looked away and that was that I thought. I then saw that she was wiping her eyes and seemed to be sobbing for the next 20 minutes. This went on until Tara Street where she gathered up her bags to get off, and then we had an exchange which was pretty much word for word:

Her – I just want to say “congratulations” on reading the sign
Me- No problem, I thought you couldn’t read
Her – You are smarter than you look
Me – Thank you!
Her – (mouths silent expletive)
Me – (raises middle finger)
Her - (over the top ironic friendly wave to me) (she was off the carriage and gesturing at me through the window from the platform at this stage)

So what do you make of that? She was 1000% in the wrong over the feet on seats thing and had to know that. She basically went postal anyway so was there something about how I challenged her? Or was it just her. My opinion at the time was that she somehow felt that I would be slower to challenge a skinhead or a junkie for example (which is probably true in fairness) and it enraged her that I felt confident enough to confront her, like I was the one disrespecting her?? I am male, mid 40s, suit & tie combo, by the way.

Why is this relevant?

Imhof Tank · 05-03-2014 12:43PM

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

Jaysus it all sounds very childish. She shouldn't have had her feet on the seats but there's probably a better way to say it to her that wouldn't have provoked that reaction. Shouting and pointing at the sign would rile most people up, I'd think.

Would you have said it to a man your own age by any chance? Another man in a suit and tie combo, even?

Yes, I think this is what maddened her actually, and I have admitted that I probably wouldn't have challenged a skinhead.

I would be really surprised if middle aged suits from Killiney started throwing up their shoes on the Dart seats on the morning commute. Never seen that.

Tiddlypeeps · 05-03-2014 12:44PM

GreeBo wrote: »

If everyone only looked for a seat when they had their stuff then it would be much easier to determine of there are seats free or not when you need them, its impossible to figure out otherwise as depending on the numbers together some will sit before ordering and some wont....chaos.

Its not some rule you made up, its the equivalent of towels on the sunbed the night before. Where do you draw the line with this? Can I just leave some stuff on a table in the morning so I have it booked for lunchtime?

Get a table when you have ordered, simples.

Again I ask, what do you do if there are no tables when you have your order? Let your drink go cold while you wait? Hovering over tables that look like they are nearly done?

I'm not going to risk not having a table. I don't care if you think it's bad manners. It makes no sense to cue up for something when you are unsure if you will have somewhere to sit by the time you have your order.

Saying there would always be seats if everyone did this is both demonstrably wrong and meaningless since everyone doesn't do that.

If you leave a bag unattended in a coffee shop all day long then you'd be pretty naive to expect it to still be there by lunch time. You can be sure staff will have removed it so I can't see that becoming an issue. Plus nobody does that anyway so it's a meaningless analogy.

Katgurl · 05-03-2014 12:47PM

@imhof tank, that is the most ridiculous thing I've read in ages, what were you doing pointing at the sign and shouting? You probably really rattled her with that sort of reaction.

People on the dart do put thei feet on seats so her individual behaviour was not really that shocking and did not warrant that reaction.

I've had to keep my recently broken leg elevated in cafes and at the cinema. I've just informed a nearby staff member and apologised, they're always really nice about it. If a customer came over and yelled at me about (ironically) my manners I would feel pretty upset.

emmabrighton · 05-03-2014 12:47PM

Lateness is definitely an Irish thing. I have to work hard to not be late. Even when I was in school, I was always 10 mins late for the first class every morning. I always left myself 5 mins to get to school even though the walk took 15 mins.

Actually I found the further the distance I had to travel, the less late I would actually be.

15 minute walk to school = 10 mins late
1 hour journey on bus to college = early/on time
15 minute drive to work = 10 mins late

In my last job, my dutch boss just had to get used to it. Lots of Mediterranean/Irish employees... always 15 mins late. The Swedish, German and Dutch employees... always politely 5 mins early

irish_goat · 05-03-2014 12:48PM

OldNotWIse wrote: »

It's their own fault if they were silly enough to overlook the vacant seats Fortune favours the brave :pac:

What if they're by themselves? If there were no other spare seats and someone was sitting at a table by themselves while a friend was queuing up I'd plonk myself down.

Was at a graduation once and a woman had "saved" 5 seats using her bag, coat, jumper and umbrella whilst her friends were outside presumably still finishing their drinks. There were no other spare seats left so we told her where to go.

gramar · 05-03-2014 12:49PM

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

Again I ask, what do you do if there are no tables when you have your order? Let your drink go cold while you wait? Hovering over tables that look like they are nearly done?

I'm not going to risk not having a table. I don't care if you think it's bad manners. It makes no sense to cue up for something when you are unsure if you will have somewhere to sit by the time you have your order.

Saying there would always be seats if everyone did this is both demonstrably wrong and meaningless since everyone doesn't do that.

If you leave a bag unattended in a coffee shop all day long then you'd be pretty naive to expect it to still be there by lunch time. You can be sure staff will have removed it so I can't see that becoming an issue. Plus nobody does that anyway so it's a meaningless analogy.

Do any coffee shops or lunchtime restaurants that anyone visits have a policy that stops people reserving seats?

sopretty · 05-03-2014 12:49PM

Imhof Tank wrote: »

Yes, I think this is what maddened her actually, and I have admitted that I probably wouldn't have challenged a skinhead.

I would be really surprised if middle aged suits from Killiney started throwing up their shoes on the Dart seats on the morning commute. Never seen that.

Well, apparently they're capable of terrorising random strangers, roaring at them, frightening them, making them cry, insulting them and making rude gestures at women though!!!

jester77 · 05-03-2014 12:51PM

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

Again I ask, what do you do if there are no tables when you have your order? Let your drink go cold while you wait? Hovering over tables that look like they are nearly done?

I'm not going to risk not having a table. I don't care if you think it's bad manners. It makes no sense to cue up for something when you are unsure if you will have somewhere to sit by the time you have your order.

Saying there would always be seats if everyone did this is both demonstrably wrong and meaningless since everyone doesn't do that.

If you leave a bag unattended in a coffee shop all day long then you'd be pretty naive to expect it to still be there by lunch time. You can be sure staff will have removed it so I can't see that becoming an issue. Plus nobody does that anyway so it's a meaningless analogy.

If there are no free seats, then it's tough sh*t, but if I pick up my order and you are blocking one of the last seats in the cafe then I will be sitting beside you. Do you really think it is ok to block a seat while I just stand there?

Social Manners - what are people's opinions?

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