Do you care about Palestine?

wes · 24-01-2014 04:20PM

Bianca Eager Bonus wrote: »

Do you know that prior to 1967 that the West Bank was Jordanian and Gaza was Egyptian?.

So? UN resolutions after 1967 have made the status of the occupied territories clear.

Bianca Eager Bonus wrote: »

Where should the 'get their own country' ?.

As you well know, a Palestinian state would be Gaza, the West Bank and East Jerusalem as its capital, that or they be given citizenship within Israel, which would mean Israel either becoming a secular or bi-national state or maybe both. Leaving the Palestinian stateless is no solution, and ethnic cleansing isn't one either.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 24-01-2014 04:28PM

wes wrote: »

So? UN resolutions after 1967 have made the status of the occupied territories clear.

I think the first UN resolutions on the WB came after the 73 war, doesn't matter anyhow.. Either way the people weren't looking for their own lands under Jordanian rule despite the fact they were horribly treated by the Jordanians (with just cause some Jordanians would say)..

I often wonder were the Jordanians happy to be finally rid of their Palestinian problem.

If the Palestinians would stop terrorizing people someone outside of nationalist Ireland might have an once of empathy with their cause.

jimgoose · 24-01-2014 04:30PM

I couldn't give a monkey's about them. If Israel was Arab, like all the other countries around that region, you wouldn't hear a peep out of the Palestinians.

wandatowell · 24-01-2014 04:30PM

I don't and I very much doubt I could care any less.

sheesh · 24-01-2014 04:37PM

RonnieRocket wrote: »

Personally I’m a bit worried about making my credit union repayment at the end of the month. I haven’t missed a payment yet and the loan is almost paid off, but Christmas spending this year knocked me back a bit. In addition I have my driving test in 2 weeks so I’m focused on that. On the bright side, I'm looking forward to the football next week! Moyes can't catch a break!

I have enough going on in my own life so I don’t see why I should care about Palestine. Do you care and why?

No dougal Palestinians are people too!

jester77 · 24-01-2014 04:39PM

I know a lad from there and it's pretty f*cked up. His family were forced over the border into Lebanon and have nothing now, they used to have an olive farm. He is working here in Germany and he no national identity, no passport and no where he can call home. He has some sort of a special status from the German government that allows him to live and work here. Anyone with any little bit of empathy should care.

Have a read of this and see if you still don't care.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians_in_Lebanon

Oink · 24-01-2014 04:48PM

There's a lot of people outside the area who are apparently experts in geopolitics and can give you all sorts of reasons why Israel are Nazis and Palestinians are murderous terrorists.

All I know since peace died with Yithzak Rabin is this: I hope there is a special, very special place in hell for fundamentalists.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 05:09PM

RonnieRocket wrote: »

Personally I’m a bit worried about making my credit union repayment at the end of the month. I haven’t missed a payment yet and the loan is almost paid off, but Christmas spending this year knocked me back a bit. In addition I have my driving test in 2 weeks so I’m focused on that. On the bright side, I'm looking forward to the football next week! Moyes can't catch a break!

I have enough going on in my own life so I don’t see why I should care about Palestine. Do you care and why?

Odd then that, outside of a major incident and in light of recent revelations about Syria, you start a thread about it.

There is one guy in my group of friends who sees campaigning for Palestine as a
hobby. We’ll be sitting in the pub watching the football and telling jokes and
then every time without fail he drags the mood down by changing the subject to Palestine. A few times I caught a couple of girls laughing at him at the bar for wearing a keffiyeh. In fairness he does look ridiculous with it on.
Myself and my other mates use Facebook for light-hearted chats but he spams the newsfeed with the latest news from Al-Jazeera about Palestine and pictures of charred bodies. One of the boys told him “to cop on, you’re Irish” and he went out in a huff. Very strange chap.

I'll cut to the chase here and say that those incidents never happened and that the person doesn't actually exist.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 05:11PM

ComeraghBlue wrote: »

Israel is the only civilised country in the middle east...........

Running colonies along lines similar to apartheid is no longer considered "civilised".

arybvtcw0eolkf · 24-01-2014 05:14PM

jester77 wrote: »

I know a lad from there and it's pretty f*cked up. His family were forced over the border into Lebanon

Actually the vast majority fled as refugee's with the promise (from their Arab neighbours) that they'd be returning to a defeated Israel (1948), which didn't happen and the Israeli's then prevented a right of return to the refugee's.

Its unlikely the mans family fled to Lebanon in recent times because the Lebanese won't let them enter (Lebanon from the Israeli side).. The children of the original Palestinian refugee's (in Lebanon) are denied basic human rights, they're not represented in Lebanese political life, are not allowed work outside camps etc ~ they've a dreadful life.

Like the Jordanians a lot of Lebanese will say they deserve their lot, the Palestinians are really unliked in Lebanon too (with good reason).

Nodin · 24-01-2014 05:16PM

Bianca Eager Bonus wrote: »

Actually the vast majority fled as refugee's with the promise (from their Arab neighbours) that they'd be returning to a defeated Israel (1948), which didn't happen and the Israeli's then prevented a right of return to the refugee's.
.

That was debunked many years ago.
http://www.amazon.com/Palestinian-Refugee-Problem-Revisited-Cambridge/dp/0521009677/ref=dp_ob_title_bk

Santa Cruz · 24-01-2014 05:18PM

jester77 wrote: »

I know a lad from there and it's pretty f*cked up. His family were forced over the border into Lebanon and have nothing now, they used to have an olive farm. He is working here in Germany and he no national identity, no passport and no where he can call home. He has some sort of a special status from the German government that allows him to live and work here. Anyone with any little bit of empathy should care.

Have a read of this and see if you still don't care.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians_in_Lebanon

Nah. Read it. Still don't give a ****e. Maybe it's something to do with my dislike of bastards who hijacked planes and murdered Olympic athletes

Call Me Jimmy · 24-01-2014 05:19PM

Hand on heart I can't say I care about Palestine, or Africa or North Korea or things that go on in America or China. They pop up as thoughts from time to time, the odd time I might see something about these places that moves me but frankly they are essentially imaginary to me, thoughts that pop up like other thoughts, like 'is my dog lonely?'

For me, caring implies action, or at least offering, otherwise it's just self-indulgence.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 24-01-2014 05:27PM

Nodin wrote: »

I'll cut to the chase here and say that those incidents never happened and that the person doesn't actually exist.

Here's me wearing a Keffiyeh lol (photo was taken in Lebanon in 1988

).

And an Hezbollah t-shirt :eek:

RonnieRocket · 24-01-2014 05:48PM

Nodin wrote: »

I'll cut to the chase here and say that those incidents never happened and that the person doesn't actually exist.

Unfortunately he is very much real.
Facebook link

wes · 24-01-2014 05:58PM

Bianca Eager Bonus wrote: »

I think the first UN resolutions on the WB came after the 73 war, doesn't matter anyhow.. Either way the people weren't looking for their own lands under Jordanian rule despite the fact they were horribly treated by the Jordanians (with just cause some Jordanians would say)..

I often wonder were the Jordanians happy to be finally rid of their Palestinian problem.

So what? Again, they have a right not be stateless. Be that in there own state as per UN resolutions, or as citizens of a secular/bi-national Israel. The fact remains, the Palestinians are stateless, and they need some where to go.

Bianca Eager Bonus wrote: »

If the Palestinians would stop terrorizing people someone outside of nationalist Ireland might have an once of empathy with their cause.

Oh please, Palestinians in the West Bank have went out of there way to work with Israel, and this fact has been pointed out to you before:

Experts: Israeli-Palestinian security cooperation stronger than ever

That is from Israeli security experts. So you talking some proper nonsense imho. Now the Palestinians in the West Bank instead get even more settlements, with a bunch announced fairly recently. Now maybe when Israel stops there constant settlement expansion, and finally at least make some effort to stop there own settlers engaging in terrorism against Palestinian, they might have a leg to stand on.

seiphil · 24-01-2014 06:30PM

jimgoose wrote: »

I couldn't give a monkey's about them. If Israel was Arab, like all the other countries around that region, you wouldn't hear a peep out of the Palestinians.

So the Palestinians wouldn't give a toss that they were invaded and land taken off them if it was an Arab country?

Get real. It's quite simple why the Palestinians are fighting back and have done for many years. THEIR country/land has been taken from them by foreign forces. It does not matter what the race or religion of the people is doing it.

Fair enough you don't care about the situation but don't spout absolute rubbish like that.

Palmach · 24-01-2014 06:39PM

seiphil wrote: »

So the Palestinians wouldn't give a toss that they were invaded and land taken off them if it was an Arab country?

Get real. It's quite simple why the Palestinians are fighting back and have done for many years. THEIR country/land has been taken from them by foreign forces. It does not matter what the race or religion of the people is doing it.

Fair enough you don't care about the situation but don't spout absolute rubbish like that.

They have had many chances to have peace and their own land but they refused. There was a partition plan but they refused. They then, with other Arabs, invades the nascent Israeli state. After they have had chances to recognise Israel and accept its existence they have played the victim card and the gullible have believed them.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 06:41PM

RonnieRocket wrote: »

Unfortunately he is very much real.
http://imgur (dot) com/R6XDzFh

Your link doesn't work.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 06:43PM

Palmach wrote: »

They have had many chances to have peace and their own land but they refused. There was a partition plan but they refused. They then, with other Arabs, invades the nascent Israeli state. After they have had chances to recognise Israel and accept its existence they have played the victim card and the gullible have believed them.

Every now and again I come across a narrative so simplistic that I think it will never be exceeded. Years may pass but again and again I've been proved wrong. Your achievement may well stand for decades - I salute you Sir.

seiphil · 24-01-2014 06:44PM

Palmach wrote: »

They have had many chances to have peace and their own land but they refused. There was a partition plan but they refused. They then, with other Arabs, invades the nascent Israeli state. After they have had chances to recognise Israel and accept its existence they have played the victim card and the gullible have believed them.

Why should they settle for only a portion of their land?

Also I would not trust Israel to not continue to build on that land. Israel wants it all. They want all of Gaza and West Bank and they will not stop no matter what the UN or America say. So why would any right minded Palestinian trust the word of a Zionist!

Palmach · 24-01-2014 06:45PM

Nodin wrote: »

Every now and again I come across a narrative so simplistic that I think it will never be exceeded. Years may pass but again and again I've been proved wrong. Your achievement may well stand for decades - I salute you Sir.

Please explain how? Do you deny there was a UN partition plan and do you deny the Israelis kept their side of the bargain and the Arabs did not? Lets hear it then wise guy.

Palmach · 24-01-2014 06:52PM

seiphil wrote: »

Why should they settle for only a portion of their land?

Also I would not trust Israel to not continue to build on that land. Israel wants it all. They want all of Gaza and West Bank and they will not stop no matter what the UN or America say. So why would any right minded Palestinian trust the word of a Zionist!

They want Gaza so much they left taking all the settlers with them. *face palm* They invaded Israel. You declare war and lose there is a price to be paid. Should the Germans get the Sudetenland back?

Nodin · 24-01-2014 06:57PM

Palmach wrote: »

Please explain how? Do you deny there was a UN partition plan and do you deny the Israelis kept their side of the bargain and the Arabs did not? Lets hear it then wise guy.

Christ not this crap again.....They were both promised the land, then decades later there was a partition plan about which the Arabs were none too happy. And for fucks sake don't start going on about who owned how many dunums when, absentee landlords and the usual smoke and mirrors cack.

The real problems today are that there is no Palestinian stateand that Israel is still expanding into Arab East Jerusalem and the West Bank. There has been no effort by Israel to stop this, because there is no reason why it should. There are no sanctions on it from abroad, and the leadership of the Fatah faction is content to enjoy the fruits of co-operation and corruption while watching its own people being shafted. This leaves millions effectively stateless, leaderless and ripe for extremism.

Riddle101 · 24-01-2014 06:57PM

For me, Irish affairs are more important in my list of things I care about. Palestine/Israel is their own problem, and we have our own problems. So Ireland takes priority.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 06:58PM

Palmach wrote: »

They want Gaza so much they left taking all the settlers with them.

...and put them in the West Bank, where doubtless everyone was overjoyed to see them.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 07:06PM

RonnieRocket wrote: »

Unfortunately he is very much real.
Facebook link

Its not a link to facebook, its a link to a screenshot supposedly taken from facebook. And no, I don't believe it's genuine.

Palmach · 24-01-2014 07:08PM

Nodin wrote: »

Christ not this crap again.....They were both promised the land, then decades later there was a partition plan about which the Arabs were none too happy. And for fucks sake don't start going on about who owned how many dunums when, absentee landlords and the usual smoke and mirrors cack.
.

The UN voted for a partition plan which the Jews accepted and the Arabs didn't. Thanks for that.

Nodin · 24-01-2014 07:10PM

Palmach wrote: »

The UN voted for a partition plan which the Jews accepted and the Arabs didn't. Thanks for that.

Yet more over simplifications, yet more dragging it back so far its all irrelevant......

Santa Cruz · 24-01-2014 07:30PM

Nodin wrote: »

Yet more over simplifications, yet more dragging it back so far its all irrelevant......

Just testing. Nah Still don't give a ****e

Do you care about Palestine?

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