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Gardai corruption or have we become a nation of cynics?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Funny -- adrag spells garda backwards.
    Odd choice of name.:D

    Well I'll be damned I never COPped it, the letters represent numbers, nice one for spotting that


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    adrag wrote: »
    Well I'll be damned I never COPped it, the letters represent numbers, nice one for spotting that

    Yes. I should have been a evitceted. :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    mariaalice wrote: »
    I don't know what the answer is, look up what social and cultural capital is, lots of people have social ties and connection to other people that bring them advantage's could we or should change that, is it realistic to expect that the Garda be above reproach in every way even in very trivial matters ( not saying penalty point is a trivial matter ) Maybe we should expect that I don't know, I do think Irish society is changing and we are becoming much less tolerant of the wink and nod culture.
    People are fed up with the nod and wink culture in this country. And the gaurds are a part of this culture, a mammoth task to change it, they fought cctv been put into rooms were questioning was going on, and then the ombudsman they nearly had a micky fit


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    Callanan didn't impress me today. Protect the force above all else it seems.

    As the old adage goes- what do you expect from a pig but a grunt

    Many excellent members of AGS let down by the inner circle protecting the image.

    Reminds me of the RCC


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,626 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    mariaalice wrote: »
    I don't know what the answer is, look up what social and cultural capital is, lots of people have social ties and connection to other people that bring them advantage's could we or should change that, is it realistic to expect that the Garda be above reproach in every way even in very trivial matters ( not saying penalty point is a trivial matter ) Maybe we should expect that I don't know, I do think Irish society is changing and we are becoming much less tolerant of the wink and nod culture.

    The thing is that it shines a light on a much wider issue within Irish society. The reporter who initially investigated the issue of penalty points being quashed was fired for being a "rogue reporter". Her name was tarnished by her bosses because she had the barefaced cheek to do her job as an investigative journalist, and dared to ask questions of Martin Callinan

    http://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2013/sep/17/irish-independent-ireland

    The relationship between the 'pillars' of Irish society (police, media, judges, politicians) is far too comfortable, and always has been. It's one of the reasons the church was able to exercise so much power here for so long. Things need to change, and if the issue of penalty points is the catalyst for that then that's fine with me.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Could someone tell me what Garda rank can wipe out penalty points please.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Funny -- adrag spells garda backwards.
    Odd choice of name.:D

    Hope you are not suggesting that im a backwards garda haha


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    adrag wrote: »
    Hope you are not suggesting that im a backwards garda haha

    Is that you Maurice?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Is that you Maurice?

    Yeah who are you


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    adrag wrote: »
    Yeah who are you

    John of course.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    John of course.

    Well hows things


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    adrag wrote: »
    Well hows things

    Telling .... very telling.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Telling .... very telling.

    Have u lost that bit of weight mucker


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3 bad_breath


    callinan sent out a strong message today

    ignore institutional wrongdoing or if your conscience is annoying you , keep it inhouse


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,581 ✭✭✭TouchingVirus


    Could someone tell me what Garda rank can wipe out penalty points please.

    I've been told it's an Inspector or above who does the cancelling, requests can come from regular Gardai though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Anyone know what Garda rank can scrap penalty points lads/ Heard it has to be a senior member of the Garda. An ordinary Garda couldn't do it surely.

    Sorry. Didn't see the last post.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3 bad_breath


    Anyone know what Garda rank can scrap penalty points lads/ Heard it has to be a senior member of the Garda. An ordinary Garda couldn't do it surely.

    Sorry. Didn't see the last post.

    you need " pull " with AGS in some shape or form


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Anyone know what Garda rank can scrap penalty points lads/ Heard it has to be a senior member of the Garda. An ordinary Garda couldn't do it surely.

    You should have been tnaegres evitceted in the ucd or ure


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,581 ✭✭✭TouchingVirus


    What I find even more interesting is that this isn't the first time Garda Maurice McCabe blew the whistle. Apparently back in 2008 he reported corruption/bad practices in Mullingar and Cavan. An internal inquiry found no evidence of corruption (surprise?) but did find evidence of failure to follow procedures investigating serious crimes. It's probably no wonder he didn't go internal with these issues if he still believes the force to be corrupt. And then Callinan talks about disciplining him over it :rolleyes: It should be no surprise really, the force is about as open to reform as I am to a kick in the stones


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bad_breath wrote: »
    you need " pull " with AGS in some shape or form

    I know.
    I paid up and got my 80 euro fine and 2 points :mad:


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    I know.
    I paid up and got my 80 euro fine and 2 points :mad:

    Quashed by myself because im a gaurd is wat this sentence should've finished like


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    adrag wrote: »
    Quashed by myself because im a gaurd is wat this sentence should've finished like

    Would you really do that for me? :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,626 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    They're on about this on Vincent Browne now. Shane Ross tore Callinan apart at the meeting today.. the man doesn't seem to understand why independent inquiries are important. Is he seriously that far up his own hole?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Would you really do that for me? :)

    Like the way you did that DS john, your pal callinan doesnt look happy today


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    Telling .... very telling.

    Are you in at 6,u may get a bit of shut eye pal


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,489 ✭✭✭Yamanoto


    mariaalice wrote: »
    Of course penalty point have been squashed, that sort of thing is part of social and cultural capital in our society and is part of the web of connection and ties that bind, however is that corruption? I am not so sure.

    Sleep on it, hopefully you'll find clarity in the morrow.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,059 ✭✭✭WilyCoyote


    Today's Irish Times:

    Question of why gardaí had no faith in procedures hangs in air
    Age-old dilemma of who will police the police remains a vital one

    Garda Commissioner Martin Callinan strongly criticised the behaviour of what he called two “so-called whistleblowers”.





    First published:
    Fri, Jan 24, 2014, 01:00
    0

    Is the Public Accounts Committee the correct forum for airing allegations about corruption within the Garda Síochána?
    That’s the question that hung in the air yesterday as Garda Commissioner Martin Callinan strongly criticised the behaviour of what he called two “so-called whistleblowers” over the widespread cancellation of penalty points.
    The commissioner’s view was clear. There were internal procedures for making complaints, and it was “disgusting” to bring allegations before a committee primarily involved with examining “revenue streams”.
    Not only that, he also said it would be “impossible” for the committee to make a judgement on allegations of corruption based on the documentation supplied to it. The two whistleblowers, former garda John Wilson and a serving sergeant Maurice McCabe, had supplied the committee with data from the Pulse computer system showing trends in cancellations.

    Internal investigation
    But the commissioner said you could only understand why cancellations took place by looking behind the “screenshots”, and following the paperwork. It had taken six superintendents and 28 dedicated members of the Garda to do this as part of its own internal investigation. “I don’t believe it’s possible” for the committee to “see the full picture”, he said.
    The commissioner has a point, and he may well marshal other such points in an effort to stop either of the two whistleblowers giving evidence next Thursday.
    But then he might also pause to think why exactly have we reached this juncture. The controversy surrounding the penalty points system would never have entered the public domain if it wasn’t for the two whistleblowers.
    While the Comptroller and Auditor General had raised concerns about the non-collection of fixed penalty fines in three successive reports, it took the action of the two officers to highlight certain failings.
    Commissioner Callinan stressed the need to maintain discipline in the force and said he should not be “usurped by subordinates”, and again this is an understandable sentiment.
    However, it should be of concern to the Garda that two members would find it necessary to go outside the force to air their concerns.
    Under existing rules, gardaí can only make complaints internally to a senior officer, albeit in confidence. Whether this is sufficient to encourage officers to come forward to report any allegation of wrongdoing against a fellow garda is debatable.
    The Garda Síochána has not done itself any favours by the manner in which it has engaged with the Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission (GSOC), the primary agency for external oversight. Last year, the GSOC cited an “unacceptable” level of co-operation in its inquiries.
    It is ironic, therefore, that the commissioner has chosen to take action against Wilson – in a written complaint this week to the GSOC about him.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,059 ✭✭✭WilyCoyote


    Anyone know what Garda rank can scrap penalty points lads/ Heard it has to be a senior member of the Garda. An ordinary Garda couldn't do it surely.

    Sorry. Didn't see the last post.

    Not paying attention ............ that'll be 2 points - or I'll see you in the pub carpark tonight!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 153 ✭✭TheMza


    Filth


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 208 ✭✭adrag


    TheMza wrote: »
    Filth

    Who ?


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