World Vaping Organisation

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 11:56am #1

MANIFESTO
We are a non-profit organisation. We are here to become the muscle of vaping worldwide. We are here to defend against dubious politicians, rogue scientists, controlled media, bias public organisations, and anybody else who hides behind them. Our approach will be swift and powerful, with a team of scientists as advisors, a small army of white collar solicitors as executors, and a monstrous PR agency to spread our word.
We believe that Vaping is not smoking and eliquid is not a medicine, neither tobacco. In fact this is our only policy. It is about time that everybody out there learns that a vaping device is not another cigarette. It is about time all of us, vapers, vendors, reviewers, forums and trade organisations become united. We all may have differing agendas and there may be many ways to reach our targets but the aim is the same for all of us. We are NOT here to create policy within the vaping community and our industry, neither to take any ones side. We are here simply to defend vaping for you.
LET'S UNITE
This organisation is destined to become massive. It has to be in order to achieve it's purpose. It will be supported by scientists. lawyers and PR. Whenever it's necessary we will defend hard and we will strike at their weakest point. We have nothing to hide - they do. We may not be able to promise you a safe haven for the vaping cause, but we can promise to all of you that once WVO is operational everyone will have to think very carefully before attacking vaping again - we will respond fast and strike hard.
Fellow vapers, vendors, forums, reviewers, trade organisations, associations, LET'S UNITE NOW we are all simply vapers.
Fellow Vapers.
We are not just another organisation. We are here to take serious action and WE NEED YOU ALL. Please make no mistakes, do not dismiss this message. Please register on our website now www.worldvaping.org The membership is free, even though we have a paypal account for donations. Even one single euro will make a difference as our only source of funding is us.
Fellow Vapers, WVO is not a trade organisation. It will be run by you. You will be the biggest force behind it. You will elect the Board, and that means that the decisions will be made by you. We need you in huge numbers. Ask your family and friends to become members. It's about time we showed to the bureaucrats in the EU and National Governments that we have power and that we can bite hard. We do not need thousands, we need hundreds of thousands.
Fellow Vendors
We are not here to create policy or make policies within our industry. Be on our side. Become part of something big and let your voice be heard. Please become members as a vendor and request your staff to do the same as vapers. Membership is free but please donate to our paypal whatever you can spare. There will be several ways created in the near future for all vendors to help financially, within this organisation. WE NEED YOU ALL.
Fellow Organisations
We are not in competition. In fact we are here to work together and fight your legal battles if needed. We are your muscle. We do not aim to create policy. The fact is that when you negotiate, your position will be much stronger if your opponents know that behind you there is an organisation that bites. So, be part of WVO and become members as an Organisation. Please also request from all your members to do the same and become members of WVO either as vendors or vapers.
Forums and Reviewers
You are the biggest force of vaping. This Organisation needs you more than ever. Create threads, Youtube presentations of our cause, and spread the word to everybody. Please become part of the WVO.
eBaron
Temporary Chairman, on behalf of WVO Founder Members

Ionised · 15-12-2013 12:36pm

Just got this via email from House of Liquids....for a moment or two I wondered if it was real.

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 12:44pm

Its real

Ireland had alot to do with this, so we need your help guys!!

Ionised · 15-12-2013 1:28pm

Just got another email from your good self I do beleive!

Happy to help out in any way...I'll pass the word to my fellow vapers.

Gavb · 15-12-2013 4:16pm

Done. Let's kick some ass!

sakiboy · 15-12-2013 4:33pm

Registered.

colly10 · 15-12-2013 4:37pm

Just signed up, I'd encourage everyone to donate whatever they can to this.

georgia010 · 15-12-2013 8:21pm

Registered. Thanks for making this happen.

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 9:26pm

I am keeping my tinfoil hat firmly on my head for this one....:)

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 9:26pm

Folks,

just a quick update, 1300 members now in less than a day. There has been teething problems but an outstanding response nonetheless, fair play to you! Expect to see some bigger names getting involved this week

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 9:28pm

wingnut32 wrote: »

Folks,

just a quick update, 1300 members now in less than a day. There has been teething problems but an outstanding response nonetheless, fair play to you! Expect to see some bigger names getting involved this week

Bigger names....please explain?

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 9:34pm

dePeatrick its only day one and there are a number of people within the vaping community that are being contacted, so we could expect some of these people to come on board and support the org soon.

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 9:38pm

wingnut32 wrote: »

dePeatrick its only day one and there are a number of people within the vaping community that are being contacted, so we could expect some of these people to come on board and support the org soon.

So who are the people behind this organisation?

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 9:42pm

www.worldvaping.org Have a look at the board section. The driving force is the maker of your beloved cigarillos, Ebaron or Georgio Gearkios.

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 9:58pm

wingnut32 wrote: »

www.worldvaping.org Have a look at the board section. The driving force is the maker of your beloved cigarillos, Ebaron or Georgio Gearkios.

I took it that the concept...if it is a concept, is that it was driven by vapers, not by companies.....seems to be very company friendly to me tbh....an army of PR people, accountants, solicitors......

StickyIcky · 15-12-2013 9:59pm

They also have a facebook page here.

Everyone needs to register on their website and like their facebook page! Lets get the numbers of this thing into the hundreds of thousands and become and unstoppable force.

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 10:04pm

dePeatrick wrote: »

I took it that the concept...if it is a concept, is that it was driven by vapers, not by companies.....seems to be very company friendly to me tbh....an army of PR people, accountants, solicitors......

It will be driven by everyone, elections will soon take place for the board, the people that will pick the fights. It doesn't matter who you are when those elections take place. Membership to far is 75/25 vapers/vendors.

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 10:06pm

StickyIcky wrote: »

They also have a facebook page here.

Everyone needs to register on their website and like their facebook page! Lets get the numbers of this thing into the hundreds of thousands and become and unstoppable force.

Well said Simon.

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 10:14pm

wingnut32 wrote: »

It will be driven by everyone, elections will soon take place for the board, the people that will pick the fights. It doesn't matter who you are when those elections take place. Membership to far is 75/25 vapers/vendors.

So for every three vapers there is one vendor......seems very vendor driven to me...and not to forget click that button and give a euro to a "non profit org" where have we heard that before? And why just one vendor pushing this....where is bestshop, Vaperus etc.....???

Green Hornet · 15-12-2013 10:18pm

Think I saw most of the Irish sites on the list. Got a few emails today as well from a number of them.

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 10:21pm

dePeatrick wrote: »

So for every three vapers there is one vendor......seems very vendor driven to me...and not to forget click that button and give a euro to a "non profit org" where have we heard that before? And why just one vendor pushing this....where is bestshop, Vaperus etc.....???

dePeatrick have you read the site in the link I gave you..the full list of founding members is there including the best shop. To be honest I dont think you have heard it anywhere here in Ireland, why, because nothing has been done in Ireland before. There is no Vendors association or Consumers association here, sure there are great people who are in contact with MEP's who do great work but its fragmented. We are 5 years behind the UK, Vapers here have been calling for something like this for a long time now and guess what..its a start. And if we dont have a start we are nowhere.

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 10:35pm

I can't see any list of founding members, would you care to put it up here on Boards so we can all take a look at it?

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 10:48pm

No Problem :

There is a couple more to be added to the list but this is the core,

House Of Liquid UK / Vendor
Concept Liquids / Vendor
House Of Mods / Vendor
T- Juice / Vendor
Worm N Proton / Reviewers
Romastino / Reviewer
Smoke For Fun / Vendor
Vapoclope / Vendor
Vapologue / Reviewer
House Of Liquid Germany / Vendor
Julio Ruades Esteban / Reviewer
Todo Vapor / Vendor
House Of Liquid Spain / Vendor
ezSmoke.ie / Vendor
Vaporium - The Ploom Room / Vendor
The Best Shop / Vendor
Stefan Ludwig / Vaper
Andrew Watchorn / Reviewer
e-Smoke Ireland / Vendor
House Of Liquid Ireland / Vendor
Ecirette Solutions / Vendor
Vaporium / Vendor
Vapourpal / Vendor
House Of Liquid Morocco / Vendor
Sweet Point SARL / Vendor
House Of Liquid Italia / Vendor
New Cigarette / Vendor
LTD Trent / Vendor
Atomo Sales / Vendor
Dogaru Moiara Mirela
DKS e-liquid
Gewre / Reviewer
SmartSmoke / Vendor
Atmokipos / Vendor
Vaporsolutions.gr / Vendor
Ellanios / Vaper
Dr Anti-Smoke / Vendor
Kyr Fanis / Vendor
Mpixlimpidi / Vendor
ReplaceSmoke / Vendor
Hlektroniko Tsigaro Katerini / Vendor
Greek Vapes / Vendor
NicQuid E-Liquids Europe / Vendor
Vapeclub / Vendor
iPath / Vendor
Ellines Atmistes / YouTube Channel
Tobaccoland.gr / Vendor
Vape Store / Vendor
El Toro Hellas / Vendor
House Of Liquid Greece / Vendor
Vapeland.gr / Vendor
House Of Liquid Australia / Vendor
Ecig Life / Vendor
Hause Of Vapers / Vendor
House Of Liquid Philippines / Vendor
House Of Liquid Malaysia / Vendor
Thirsty Vapors / Vendor
SecondHand Vapor / Reviewer
House of Liquid Russia / Vendor
Marko Lepisto / Forum

dePeatrick · 15-12-2013 10:53pm

Thank you, as you can see, this new organisation is based on vendors.....fair enough....but I am not at all happy with you saying it is vaper driven, it is not, it is vendor driven....and rushing towards paying PR machines, accountants and solicitors......where have we seen this all before?

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 10:59pm

Im sorry you feel that way, you dont have to donate or even sign up. In fairness when it comes to legal issues etc. people have to be paid thats just the way the world works. The fight we are fighting is against people with lots of money! And again you will have not seen anyone in Ireland asking for a penny vaping related before

Cheers

Paul.

wingnut32 · 15-12-2013 11:35pm

I have to put this laptop down now as my eyes are watering after 11 hours..lol. I just wanted to say a big thanks to all the vapers who have signed up and donated it really has been incredible.

Im sure some have you have gotten comments from people about how ecigs are worse than cigarettes, and that they are bad for you etc. These comments have come from people that have been misinformed by bogus articles/reports in the media. This organisation is going to stop the bogus brown envelope media crap and hold people accountable for what they say through the media. We have a voice and it will be heard.

This country has had nothing like this before and with your help we will put Ireland on the map, defend your right for a healthy alternative.

achieve · 15-12-2013 11:52pm

As a vendor, I don't normally post here, but do pop in for a look every now again. The WVO is setup to represent all vapers. The easiest way to get the word out was by using the vendors. The board as of yet has to be elected, and although I think that vendor participation is important, the WVO will ONLY work if there is huge support from vapers, and I would be very surprised if vapers do not have a major role to play in the WVO. It will not succeed without the support of the vaping public.

tommy2bad · 16-12-2013 1:16am

OK. This is a good idea. An org to represent vapers is needed and vapers are in no way going to do this off their own backs until it's too late. The problem is it's vendor start point, talk about astro truff allegations? this plays right into their hands. Unfortuniatly it will be tainted by any connection to a vested interest.

None the less a large movement is needed to give a voice to users, a proper voice not just twitter or facebook groups.
One that has some PR muscle, some legal acumen and some public health credibility. I can't see how this could happen any other way.
If the TPD goes through as it's currently rumored to be then any vendor support will make this organisational illegal, we have a clear and present danger so the rush is understandable. This needs to be up and running as proposed as soon as possible.
I'v signed up and will make a donation when its up and running. I wish (and I'm sure the founders do too ) that this had happened spontaneously from the grassroots but nothing ever dose so lets thank who ever actually did make the first move. Lets get behind this because we will need all hands on deck to fight our case in the next 12 to 18 months.

As to having concerns about the money, as long as a clear account is kept and published we should be ok. I say should as donations have taken a bit of a beating recently, don't let that put you off either from supporting this (or any other charity) if you like wait and see how you feel when it going. But sign up now!
Lets be Big Juice, or Big eCig, or Big Whatever the Daily Mail call us.

The anti ecig ban campaigns slogan is Nothing about us, without us, this is where 'us' get a say!

colly10 · 16-12-2013 1:16am

I can't understand the issue with there being a large number of vendors involved. We all have a lot to loose but they stand to loose the most so it makes sense that they would make up a good percentage of the numbers.

I would image that they are likely to be providing most of the funding and the more funding the better for us because their interests are our interests.

What's wrong with positive PR and legal representation, this is what the vaping world needs, currently the fight is only coming from the opposition.

Even if vaping is banned and nothing is solved , I am still happy to support a group that ensures that people who spread lies with no basis are punished and the more I see this happen the more I will happily support the group.

stuff.hunter · 16-12-2013 9:19am

great stuff...signed in

Wiggy · 16-12-2013 11:01am

Tried to register, but nothing happens.
Is it incompatible with Internet Explorer 10?

dePeatrick · 16-12-2013 11:19am

wingnut32 wrote: »

I have to put this laptop down now as my eyes are watering after 11 hours..lol. I just wanted to say a big thanks to all the vapers who have signed up and donated it really has been incredible.

Im sure some have you have gotten comments from people about how ecigs are worse than cigarettes, and that they are bad for you etc. These comments have come from people that have been misinformed by bogus articles/reports in the media. This organisation is going to stop the bogus brown envelope media crap and hold people accountable for what they say through the media. We have a voice and it will be heard.

This country has had nothing like this before and with your help we will put Ireland on the map, defend your right for a healthy alternative.

I too had to put the laptop down as had been writing all day too

Yes of course I have seen the reactions of some people to vaping and how surprisingly hostile a very small percentage are to it. I think it is very good that someone has eventually decided to do something about organising vapers.

You will get much harder criticism than I can give you and you have to be prepared for it. Transparency is of the utmost importance with this. Every piece of financial information should and must be published on the Internet

It is very important to understand that the Public are sick to death of organisations that swallow up public money and feather their own nests. In order to make this work you have to tackle that perception and turn it to the WVOs benefit by clarifying right from the start exactly how accountable and transparent it is going to be.

Vaperus · 16-12-2013 12:08pm

I have said a few times before that everybody needs to be working together on this regardless of any pass friction.
1 Big group will always have more clout than a few small ones
This could be a step in the right direction and great work getting it started

EGriff · 16-12-2013 2:30pm

Shouldn't the mafacturers be kicking in the vast majority of the money to this thing, innokin, joyetech, kanger ect? They are the ones making the big money after all. Asking for donations to set up what is basically a lobbying/PR group seems odd to me.

tommy2bad · 16-12-2013 8:22pm

EGriff wrote: »

Shouldn't the mafacturers be kicking in the vast majority of the money to this thing, innokin, joyetech, kanger ect? They are the ones making the big money after all. Asking for donations to set up what is basically a lobbying/PR group seems odd to me.

Well yes it's a lobbying group but to lobby on behalf of the end users not the manufactures or vendors. Look who instigated this, small vendors and producers, not the BT sellers. This is closer to the organic growers groups than to Forrest, it seem to me. And who knows if this gets big enough the big players might join in.
At some stage vaping will surpass smoking or die out as a passing fad. I suspect the former and a group of mainly artisan and hobbyists representing users is better than BAT fighting our corner.

dePeatrick · 16-12-2013 8:26pm

I think vaping will pass out smoking, and will itself die a death as there are no new takers....end of an era.....but maybe a fitting way for tobacco to die after all....overtaken by technology......

StickyIcky · 16-12-2013 9:40pm

dePeatrick wrote: »

So for every three vapers there is one vendor......seems very vendor driven to me...and not to forget click that button and give a euro to a "non profit org" where have we heard that before? And why just one vendor pushing this....where is bestshop, Vaperus etc.....???

I'm all for vendors getting together and starting something and helping to grow the numbers by reaching out to their mailing lists and letting all their customers know about it. In the end I believe that power = numbers and also funds. In order for this to work we need the help of every vaper who wants to see vaping remaining essentially unchanged AND we need the help of vendors and manufacturers and any one else who is willing to help pitch in funding / donations for when the time comes that we as an organisation may need to take these facists to back to court. God forbid it ever happens, but if it does I want the WVO to be as strong as possible. That means vapers AND vendors.

Who cares who started it or who's driving it as long as the aim is to keep things basically the way they are now.

edit: like someone else said earlier I have also gotten emails off a number of vendors to make me aware of it.

edit edit: an organisation can be non-profit and ask for donations too to help with costs of growing the organisation, publicity and solicitors cost a shed load. No one has to donate but the people that do will be helping the organisation to insure that vaping has a greater chance of not being overrun by a bunch of twats in the EU that want to see it squashed.

StickyIcky · 16-12-2013 9:42pm

Wiggy wrote: »

Tried to register, but nothing happens.
Is it incompatible with Internet Explorer 10?

I think there was an issue with registrations but it's back up and running again now Wiggy.

StickyIcky · 16-12-2013 9:43pm

dePeatrick wrote: »

I took it that the concept...if it is a concept, is that it was driven by vapers, not by companies.....seems to be very company friendly to me tbh....an army of PR people, accountants, solicitors......

I'd be quite happy to have an army of PR and solicitors behind us on this one

tommy2bad · 16-12-2013 9:56pm

StickyIcky wrote: »

I'd be quite happy to have an army of PR and solicitors behind us on this one

Oh absolutely! what we need most is media savie people to represent us. Next we need credible health professionals to support our cause and then some legal people who can work on the court cases that will be needed if the TPD goes through as leaked. Though that remains to be seen, it looks like a removal of ecigs is possible. We will need the legal end more if this comes down to individual member states regulating them piecemeal. Their will be a lot of individual battles to be fought.

StickyIcky · 16-12-2013 10:20pm

tommy2bad wrote: »

Oh absolutely! what we need most is media savie people to represent us. Next we need credible health professionals to support our cause and then some legal people who can work on the court cases that will be needed if the TPD goes through as leaked. Though that remains to be seen, it looks like a removal of ecigs is possible. We will need the legal end more if this comes down to individual member states regulating them piecemeal. Their will be a lot of individual battles to be fought.

Absolutely Tommy, agree with you 100% here.

I'm not sure who the core founders of the WVO are planning to handle things as the come up or what needs to be done next etc, but I think your ideas of getting credible health professionals, a list of them, their contacts etc together is a big one. Then legal people too. This is a bit like project management in a way and I think that organisations work best when there are people who are strongest suited.

The only health professional I know of is a dentist but I'm sure I could get him on our side. I'll talk to him and see what he says. Anyone else got any other people they can think of here that could join the cause? Medical professionals, PR people, legal type peoples?

iba · 17-12-2013 11:27am

Was going to sign up but I did not like the request to submit:

1)Full Name

2)Address with Country

3)Telephone Number

These details seem superfluous to me.

So sorry Wingnuts, I am out or rather not in.

Regards

Vaperus · 17-12-2013 11:31am

iba wrote: »

Was going to sign up but I did not like the request to submit:

1)Full Name

2)Address with Country

3)Telephone Number

These details seem superfluous to me.

So sorry Wingnuts, I am out or rather not in.

Regards

They need to be able to keep in touch with you for updates etc

StickyIcky · 17-12-2013 11:45am

This is true Wingnuts if you're going to ask for peoples details make them non compulsory (and make it clear it's non compulsory) and if they are compulsory and it's not obvious explain why.

The same goes for eCommerce checkout processes. If you ask for a persons phone number when you already have their email address they're going to think “Look, why do they need my phone number? What do they need that for? They don’t need it!”

The fact is people don't like giving out personal on the internet and I wouldn't be surprised to find out that hundreds more people were not signing up because of the point that iba brought up.

iba · 17-12-2013 11:46am

Vaperus wrote: »

They need to be able to keep in touch with you for updates etc

Vaperous,

Are they going to post a letter to me, email me, phone me and send me a text?

Email would suffice surely.

Regards

Vaperus · 17-12-2013 11:54am

I agree it shouldnt be compulsory
Address you could just put the county
Telephone should probably be optional

StickyIcky · 17-12-2013 11:59am

Exactly. Why are WVO requesting this information, why does it seem to be 'mandatory' ? Surely people can provide it if they want to and if they don't want to then they can still sign up with just their email address?

I didn't remember putting in my full name, home address, telephone number so I logged in to WVO and went to 'user profile' and I see these fields are blank. So I'm guessing these were added after I registered.

If you're shopping online then it's obvious you have to enter your name and address to have things posted out to you. If you ask for their email address on top of that, you should say 'this is so we can email you with status updates on your order, or incase there is any problem with your order' then people will think ah okay so I'll put my email in no problem. People don't even really like putting in their email address because email address usually = news letter which = spam. They dislike even more giving out their phone number because that = calls from weird numbers at god knows what hour of the day. Finally giving out their address = now I know where you live. At least to a large enough amount of people to make it an issue if your goal is power of numbers at the end of the day.

I would just get their email address and then you can always request they login and fill in as much other information as they feel comfortable with later. Or make it so when they sign up, then they're redirected to another page asking them for more information, why you're asking for that information, but making it clear the information is not compulsory (they're signed up at this stage anyway, so no chance of losing anyone, if you follow me)

iba · 17-12-2013 12:21pm

StickyIcky wrote: »

Exactly. Why are WVO requesting this information, why does it seem to be 'mandatory' ? Surely people can provide it if they want to and if they don't want to then they can still sign up with just their email address?

I didn't remember putting in my full name, home address, telephone number so I logged in to WVO and went to 'user profile' and I see these fields are blank. So I'm guessing these were added after I registered.

If you're shopping online then it's obvious you have to enter your name and address to have things posted out to you. If you ask for their email address on top of that, you should say 'this is so we can email you with status updates on your order, or incase there is any problem with your order' then people will think ah okay so I'll put my email in no problem. People don't even really like putting in their email address because email address usually = news letter which = spam. They dislike even more giving out their phone number because that = calls from weird numbers at god knows what hour of the day. Finally giving out their address = now I know where you live. At least to a large enough amount of people to make it an issue if your goal is power of numbers at the end of the day.

I would just get their email address and then you can always request they login and fill in as much other information as they feel comfortable with later. Or make it so when they sign up, then they're redirected to another page asking them for more information, why you're asking for that information, but making it clear the information is not compulsory (they're signed up at this stage anyway, so no chance of losing anyone, if you follow me)

That is very interesting that they have added the extra fields of; full name, home address and telephone number since you registered, I am guessing, a couple of days ago.

Call me cyncial if you will but I am really asking myself now why would they add these extra fields.

Regards

StickyIcky · 17-12-2013 12:31pm

Studies show that most 'test users' question why I website is asking for information that doesn't seem immediately obvious at to why it's necessary.

The fact that it's like this I'm sure is in no way 'sinister' I think it's just poorly implemented by the organisers. Possibly thinking 'of course if people are as passionate as us and they know us and they know we have their best interests at heart then of course it's no problem to ask for this info, of course people will be fine with giving it out.'

The other just as likely possibility is that's just the way the website framework was originally programmed and they've just left if that way it was without really considering it. Like I know they were having problems with registration, so possibly at first they removed these extra fields, registration bugs and problems were happening, so they reset it back to the way it was.

Be cynical / sceptical by all means but I can say with 99% certainty because I know some of the people involved with starting this up there's nothing to be sceptical about here.

dePeatrick · 17-12-2013 1:57pm

Vapers worldwide have been extraordinary good at making their voice heard, a representative body,that is paid for by vapers will shift the burden of responsibility to this organisation. I do not think this is a good thing at all.

One of the most interesting things about Vaping is how it has been a consumer led revolution with each individual inputting without the need for any umbrella organisation, quite a unique political concept....and so far it has worked extremely well and I for one want to watch it evolve not into yet another word wide .org but stay as it has been, a people's movement.

grindle · 17-12-2013 2:19pm

dePeatrick wrote: »

so far it has worked extremely well and I for one want to watch it evolve not into yet another word wide .org but stay as it has been, a people's movement.

And any possible legal action that needs to be brought before the ECHR would be organised how and by whom and how long would that take?

Twitterbombing is a means of publicising, writing to MEPs is a blind hope that opinions can be swayed, both do little for the practicalities involved in pushing as hard as we're getting pushed.

World Vaping Organisation

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