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"Freemen" try to stop Gardaí arresting mother

1235

Comments

  • #122
    hansfrei
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 915 ✭✭✭hansfrei


    srsly78 wrote: »
    In IT circles many people knew there were shenanigans going on. Remember ECHELON and stuff like that? Remember the time everyone was putting keywords like "bomb" in their email signature to swamp their surveillance?

    I do. It wasn't widely accepted by the vast majority at the time.


  • #123
    who the fug
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,042 ✭✭✭who the fug


    hansfrei wrote: »
    Rewind yourself there. None or few of the practices of the NSA were expected ten years ago. Nonsense post is nonsense.

    O really Mark Thomas had a look at them in 1999


  • #124
    take everything
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,995 ✭✭✭take everything


    returnNull wrote: »
    A little more info on the muppet in the OP's video

    http://corkindependent.com/20131114/news/gardai-on-trial-community-court-tries-to-put-gardai-on-trial-S75582.html

    Not sure if this has been posted,but he's in flying form :)

    Shocking.
    How was he not arrested.
    Feel really sorry for people like the young woman in the OP getting taken in by this guy.


  • #125
    hansfrei
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 915 ✭✭✭hansfrei


    MilanPan!c wrote: »
    Sorry but trying to backtrack to hide your BS is transparent and childish.

    Two people have calls you on your ridiculous claim.

    Either say what you mean or expect to be called out for saying silly crap.

    The nonsense post was nonsense. Don't be upset.


  • #126
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    hansfrei wrote: »
    I do. It wasn't widely accepted by the vast majority at the time.

    10 years ago the Total Information Awareness program was so widely discussed that the Congress defunded it.

    The discussion about it was basically everything that you claim no one could even fathom.

    You really are clueless about this.


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  • #127
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    hansfrei wrote: »
    The nonsense post was nonsense. Don't be upset.

    Yea. Endlessly paraphrasing tired memes isn't adding to your credibility.


  • #128
    returnNull
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,235 ✭✭✭returnNull


    who the fug wrote: »
    O really Mark Thomas had a look at them in 1999

    that was brilliant , remember his show on c4 iirc.


  • #129
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    "The most pernicious of these is titled Total Information Awareness, a Defense Department program headed by Adm. John Poindexter, a former national security official in the Reagan administration and a leading figure in the Iran-Contra scandal. Already, $128-million has been invested in TIA, and the Defense Department's appropriations bill for fiscal year 2003 includes an additional $112-million. The idea behind it is simple: Intelligence officials believe if they know every move, transaction and personal connection made by every person in this country, they can discern who among us are terrorists."

    A quote from one of dozens of articles in 2003 about exactly the thing you said wasn't treated seriously back then.

    Talked about, debated about and defunded by Congress (though they obviously just ignored that). All in 2003.

    If you missed it, that's on you.


  • #130
    Jimoslimos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,930 ✭✭✭Jimoslimos


    ch750536 wrote: »
    I remember someone back in 2001 being ridiculed when he stated
    -The world was run by lizards
    -A prime minister of the UK was killing children for kicks
    -Jimmy Saville was a paedo & arranged kids for the rich & powerful through a network of childrens homes.

    So, I've learnt that normally there is some truth in almost everything. Both sides are likely acting the bollix, truth is somewhere in the middle.
    Poor signal to noise ratio.


  • #131
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,909 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    MilanPan!c wrote: »
    Two people have calls you on your ridiculous claim.
    Funny that they each gave a different account with no links though :P


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  • #132
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Funny that they each gave a different account with no links though :P
    Well.. you can google the history of the NSA and decide for yourself...

    Also google the Church Committee... Actually, if you're too lazy to use google: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_Committee

    You can read about their NSA discoveries here: http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/church/reports/book3/pdf/churchb3_10_nsa.pdf

    Then you can decide what's what.


  • #133
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    srsly78 wrote: »
    In IT circles many people knew there were shenanigans going on. Remember ECHELON and stuff like that? Remember the time everyone was putting keywords like "bomb" in their email signature to swamp their surveillance?

    Comedians like Mark Thomas were making shows about it 15 years ago.



    EDIT: Didn't notice fug got there first


  • #134
    Genghiz Cohen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    So, if you are outside the law, that Garda could have beat the everloving **** out of him, straight up murdered him and no law would have convicted the Garda?


  • #135
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    So, if you are outside the law, that Garda could have beat the everloving **** out of him, straight up murdered him and no law would have convicted the Garda?

    Ah no... the laws they like are ok...


  • #136
    who the fug
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,042 ✭✭✭who the fug


    Grayson wrote: »
    Comedians like Mark Thomas were making shows about it 15 years ago.


    EDIT: Didn't notice fug got there first

    Don't have time to watch it now, but is it in that show they mentioned BT diverted a main line to make it easier for them to intercept


  • #137
    Jimoslimos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,930 ✭✭✭Jimoslimos


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    So, if you are outside the law, that Garda could have beat the everloving **** out of him, straight up murdered him and no law would have convicted the Garda?
    It's the other way around according to these nutcases...but then again since the Gardaí in question are already outlaws might as well get hung for a sheep as a lamb!


  • #138
    Me?
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 269 ✭✭Me?


    Haven't time to read the whole thread, should I make time?


  • #139
    MonstaMash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,425 ✭✭✭MonstaMash


    Me? wrote: »
    Haven't time to read the whole thread, should I make time?
    Nah, don't bother ;)


  • #140
    Me?
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 269 ✭✭Me?


    MonstaMash wrote: »
    Nah, don't bother ;)

    Thanks.


  • #141
    tomtucker81
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 422 ✭✭tomtucker81


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    So, if you are outside the law, that Garda could have beat the everloving **** out of him, straight up murdered him and no law would have convicted the Garda?

    Not really. According to them, common law is their rules/guidelines. In common law you cant steal, assault or murder. Common law covers the basic things, as it was needed hundreds of years ago.
    Since then we have various acts making new laws as needed, as society evolved. Stealing is covered under the theft and fraud offences of 2001, giving modern definition and penalties for offences. Similarly the public order act replaced the common law breach of the peace. And so on.
    although I think murder is still contrary to common law.
    ive met a few freemen, and they are full of terminology that sounds all legal, and probably would've worked 500 years ago. Alas it is pure nonsense nowadays!!


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  • #142
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    tomtucker81 wrote: »
    Not really. According to them, common law is their rules/guidelines. In common law you cant steal, assault or murder. Common law covers the basic things, as it was needed hundreds of years ago.
    Since then we have various acts making new laws as needed, as society evolved. Stealing is covered under the theft and fraud offences of 2001, giving modern definition and penalties for offences. Similarly the public order act replaced the common law breach of the peace. And so on.
    although I think murder is still contrary to common law.
    ive met a few freemen, and they are full of terminology that sounds all legal, and probably would've worked 500 years ago. Alas it is pure nonsense nowadays!!

    Common Law, Brehon Law or any number of things are used to justify their scams, but in the end they're just scams...

    They're no different than that Nigerian Prince email scam.


  • #143
    endacl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,443 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    MilanPan!c wrote: »

    They're no different than that Nigerian Prince email scam.

    That's not a scam. I emailed off my bank details last year. Expecting a BIG payday any day now! I've kept all the emails so I'm covered in any eventuality.


  • #144
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    It is pure and unadulterated b0llocksology, and nothing more. Vulnerable and naieve people are being led down the garden path by this cult and getting into very serius legal difficulties because of it...

    It should be labled as a cult and stamped out


  • #145
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    Foxhound38 wrote: »
    It is pure and unadulterated b0llocksology, and nothing more. Vulnerable and naieve people are being led down the garden path by this cult and getting into very serius legal difficulties because of it...

    It should be labled as a cult and stamped out

    Spot on.

    Especially considering that the most devoted cult members tend toward all sorts of other illegal behaviour and on, many occasions, violence.

    Sure, Ben Gilroy compared - in passing - the Gardai to Nazis on his website. He also sells the "service" of copywriting people's names.

    Common criminal masquerading as some sort of freedom fighter.

    Same as it ever was with this lot.


  • #146
    rovoagho
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,151 ✭✭✭rovoagho


    MilanPan!c wrote: »
    Common Law, Brehon Law or any number of things are used to justify their scams, but in the end they're just scams...

    They're no different than that Nigerian Prince email scam.

    Personally, I think it's hugely different. It's the difference between someone "buying" the Eiffel Tower, and 900 men, women and children drinking Jim Jones' Kool Aid.


  • #147
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    Stinicker wrote: »
    Where were the guards when the real criminals in the banks were committing financial terrorism? Why is it the entire Fianna Fail cabinet of 2007-2011 has not been apprehended for their crimes against the state?

    I have respect for the guards trying to do a job but who I do not have respect for is the Irish military a bunch of total cowards. Look over at Thailand this week thousands of people marching the streets of Bangkok and the military of that country preparing tentatively for another coup d'etat.

    We have no government in this country as far as I am concerned because they are not governing as instructed to do by us the people. Where is democracy if it is broken? A democratically elected Government is of no use if that government is corrupt and conspiring against its own people. The Gardai are supposed to be the keepers of the peace and the military the defenders of the nation, well our nation is under attack from its own within and this is where the Military should intervene and govern properly. There is more personal and financial freedom in China today than there is in the United States or here for that matter. So long as there is a Fianna Fail party in existence in this country then there will only be corruption and oppression of peoples freedom.

    There's a special glaze that comes over my eyes when someone goes on an off-topic rantfest about the politicians and the bankers. Don't get me wrong, they are cnuts - but that's not what we were discussing here.

    Fairly sure the thread could be about how nice crisp sandwiches are with a cup of tea, and it'd still only be a matter of time before someone went off on a massive rant like the one above...


  • #148
    MilanPan!c
    Site Banned Posts: 4,415 ✭✭✭MilanPan!c


    rovoagho wrote: »
    Personally, I think it's hugely different. It's the difference between someone "buying" the Eiffel Tower, and 900 men, women and children drinking Jim Jones' Kool Aid.

    Sorry, I wasn't comparing the threat, but the "truth" behind the scam. Freeman scams are no more "true" or meaningful than the Nigerian Prince nonsense. It's just a big lie. Nothing more.

    As for the threat, yes, the Freeman/Sovereign Citizens/et al pose a much bigger threat than an email phishing scam.


  • #149
    TeddyTedson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,758 ✭✭✭✭TeddyTedson


    The Guard was 100% professional and did his best to diffuse the situation. Fair play to him.
    A bit stupid for one of the men to first start asking the guards if they thought this was right and trying to persuade them not to act on it, then to start having a go at one of them for wearing a nike hat, asking if that was official uniform.
    Hypocrisy.


  • #150
    rovoagho
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,151 ✭✭✭rovoagho


    MilanPan!c wrote: »
    Sorry, I wasn't comparing the threat, but the "truth" behind the scam. Freeman scams are no more "true" or meaningful than the Nigerian Prince nonsense. It's just a big lie. Nothing more.

    As for the threat, yes, the Freeman/Sovereign Citizens/et al pose a much bigger threat than an email phishing scam.

    Absolutely. Personally, I think they need to be stopped now before they get too much traction, by dealing with them within the letter of the law, and via an education campaign of commentary in the media by Guards and lawmakers every time the idiots in the media give them an ounce of publicity.

    That Garda had it just right, engage with the troublemakers as little as possible, while engaging with the key subject in a calm, reasonable manner. The other Gardai should have followed his example to the letter.

    The only major error in that case was the aggressive use of the camera by the plainclothesman. If it was me, I'd be looking at less aggressive options, such as an omni on the roof of a car, or a body-mounted gopro-style camera on one or more regular Gardai.

    There is also a tendency of Gardai to get shouty way too quickly, but this is an endemic problem in my opinion, I'd guess training led. It's dangerous, it allows some of the more aggressive Gardai to think it's OK to lose their temper. That's another discussion though.


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  • #151
    srsly78
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,156 ✭✭✭srsly78


    The Guards could have arrested every one of those loons for obstruction, but they went easy.


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