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Teen Seeking Help After Car Accident Rang Doorbell, Was Shot In The Head

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Comments

  • #92
    pablomakaveli
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    MadsL wrote: »
    I linked to four shootings that happened this week earlier in the thread. Two in Ireland, one in UK and one in Australia. Not a peep on AH.

    Yes a probable gang related shooting in Ireland. Great find. If we posted a thread about everyone of those that happened in America AH would be snowed under.


  • #93
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    wexie wrote: »
    Of course there is, I don't think you've ever heard me say 'Murica in anything other than a joking context.

    While I wouldn't necessarily agree with gun's being quite so available in the US I don't subscribe to the idea that all Americans are gun-toting-bloodthirsty-lunatics just waiting for the first opportunity to shoot someone.

    I absolutely believe there are many ills in the US society (as in most other ones) but I think one of the main reasons it's such a big issue round these parts is that in general the US doesn't seem to be getting great publicity.

    A lot of our news is focussed on the US and unfortunately bad / spectacular news is what sells.

    relax Wexie, wasn't talking to you with that comment. I was pointing out that you had in fact pointed out there may be more to the incident.


  • #94
    GreeBo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,518 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    im confused.
    its the middle of the night, you live in a scary town and the doorbell rings.
    why answer it with a gun? just ignore it maybe?


  • #95
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,478 ✭✭✭wexie


    MadsL wrote: »
    relax Wexie, wasn't talking to you with that comment. I was pointing out that you had in fact pointed out there may be more to the incident.

    Am I not always the voice of reason?

    :D


  • #96
    P_1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    GreeBo wrote: »
    im confused.
    its the middle of the night, you live in a scary town and the doorbell rings.
    why answer it with a gun? just ignore it maybe?

    Good point, also I'd be highly skeptical that anybody trying to break in to your house would knock on the door beforehand


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  • #97
    MadYaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    MadsL wrote: »
    I linked to four shootings that happened this week earlier in the thread. Two in Ireland, one in UK and one in Australia. Not a peep on AH.

    When was the last time you heard of and innocent person being shot in the head on a doorstep in Ireland? When was the last time you heard of somebody bringing a gun to a military base/school/cinema and killing a load of people in Ireland.

    You are comparing these shootings to scumbag drug dealers shooting each other in backalleys on the northside of Dublin. You aren't comparing like with like.

    As has been pointed out already Ireland has a relatively high level of gun ownership yet we see none of these crazy stories that you get in the USA. This would suggest to me that guns and lax gun control laws, while not helping, are not the main cause of the problem. The main cause of the problem is crazy people which can be found anywhere, not just in the USA. Unfortunately in the case of the USA it seems to be very easy for these people to get their hands on high powered weapons. Logic would suggest that much stricter gun control laws and laws relating to where guns can be kept in a house would be a good idea.


  • #98
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,909 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    MadsL wrote: »
    OK - justify your 'Merika comment as to how a single shooting reflects on 317,015,000 people and 50 States all with different gun laws and we will count how many legs you have.

    Go.

    Here you go. http://asset-a.soup.io/asset/5937/4441_a798_500.jpeg


  • #99
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    pablomakaveli wrote: »
    Yes a probable gang related shooting in Ireland. Great find. If we posted a thread about everyone of those that happened in America AH would be snowed under.

    And an accidental shooting of a kid in the UK...No comment from AH.

    Kid in US shoots sister accidentally. Everyone loses their minds.


  • #100
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    MadsL wrote: »
    I linked to four shootings that happened this week earlier in the thread. Two in Ireland, one in UK and one in Australia. Not a peep on AH.

    How many shootings happened in the US alone this week?

    There are an average or 30 gun related murders and 162 people wounded by firearms in america daily, as well as 53 suicides by firearms.

    So that's what, 1486 people killed or wounded by firearms PER WEEK in the US or 77272 per year.

    So each thread on AH about an incident involving a firearm = reporting of 0.001294129827104255% of the total incidents per year.

    So really, there should be a lot more threads when you think about it.


  • #101
    P_1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Here you go. http://asset-a.soup.io/asset/5937/4441_a798_500.jpeg

    Americans do seem more likely to use guns alright when compared to Europeans. Is that down to greater access to guns or is it some kind of frontier mentality or perhaps a combination of the two?


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  • #102
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,478 ✭✭✭wexie


    MadYaker wrote: »
    You are comparing these shootings to scumbag drug dealers shooting each other in backalleys on the northside of Dublin. You aren't comparing like with like.

    Those more likely than not weren't legally owned guns so gun laws probably wouldn't have much of an effect on gangland killings, either here or there.
    MadYaker wrote: »

    As has been pointed out already Ireland has a relatively high level of gun ownership yet we see none of these crazy stories that you get in the USA. This would suggest to me that guns and lax gun control laws, while not helping, are not the main cause of the problem. The main cause of the problem is crazy people which can be found anywhere, net just in the USA.

    Just lots and lots more of them in the US.
    MadYaker wrote: »
    Unfortunately in the case of the USA it seems to be very easy for these people to get their hands on high powered weapons. Logic would suggest that much stricter gun control laws and laws relating to where guns can be kept in a house would be a good idea.

    I think you're probably onto something, but there's more to it than that I'd say. Canada has quite high gun ownership as well (although entirely different legislation) and we very rarely hear stories like these coming from there. (they happen, they just don't make the news over here)


  • #103
    MadYaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    P_1 wrote: »
    Americans do seem more likely to use guns alright when compared to Europeans. Is that down to greater access to guns or is it some kind of frontier mentality or perhaps a combination of the two?

    Combination of the two. They have a deep seeded attachment to their guns in some parts of the USA. This and their fanatical protection of the second amendment I always find hard to understand.


  • #104
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    P_1 wrote: »
    Americans do seem more likely to use guns alright when compared to Europeans. Is that down to greater access to guns or is it some kind of frontier mentality or perhaps a combination of the two?



  • #105
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    pablomakaveli wrote: »
    Probably because we don't get much oppurtunity. It's not a weekly occurence here.
    Weekly? Try hourly.

    http://www.juancole.com/2012/07/58-murders-a-year-by-firearms-in-britain-8775-in-us.html

    58 firearm murders in the UK last year - a little over one a week. 8,775 in the US, which if you divide by 365 works out to 24.04 per day, or literally just over one per hour.

    The US does have a population roughly five times larger than the UK though, so to be fair we round them up to 290 - one every 30 hours.

    Going by that as a rough guide, you are 30 times more likely to get shot in the USA than in England.
    MadsL wrote: »
    Cities also have gun ordinances. Counties may also vary.
    I've taken a quick look on Wiki though, and I am struggling to find many notable differences within any individual states though. However on a state-to-state basis, there tends to be far more variance which makes it easier to get an accurate idea, and on a broader scale (e.g. urban/rural divides, socio-economic conditions, etc).

    Another reason why not to go strictly by the cities is obvious with a quick glance at the top 10: Detroit Michigan, New Orleans Louisiana, St Louis Missouri, Baltimore Maryland, Newark NJ, Oakland CA, Stockton CA, Kansas City Missouri, Philadelphia PA, Cleveland Ohio.

    There's a huge variance here in terms of gun laws, so that is not the common denominator. The common denominator in these cities are related to poverty, lack of industry/opportunity/etc, and ultimately as a result... massive gang culture.


  • #106
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,909 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    P_1 wrote: »
    Americans do seem more likely to use guns alright when compared to Europeans. Is that down to greater access to guns or is it some kind of frontier mentality or perhaps a combination of the two?

    Those and more I think. The "now" thing is more deep-seated over there. How much of what's now built on in North America was there 50 years ago? How much will look the same in 50 years? Add poverty, possibilities of astronomical wealth from breaking the law in certain ways, access to guns, less regard for right to life (in favour of death penalty, killing black people at home and brown people abroad) and a few other things and there ya have it.


  • #107
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,521 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    SparkySpitfire wrote: »

    EDIT: To elaborate, they're not available to the public here and those awful things happened, they're available to the American public (after getting licences obvs) and we're seeing story after story of senseless murders like this one.

    They are available to the public here and there is no such thing as a firearms licence in the US.


  • #108
    czx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 544 ✭✭✭czx


    Seaneh wrote: »
    A lot more about not having people shooting each other than anywhere in the US, that's for ****ing sure.

    I dunno, I'm sure there's some Sinn Féin voters in Galway


  • #109
    pablomakaveli
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    MadsL wrote: »
    And an accidental shooting of a kid in the UK...No comment from AH.

    Kid in US shoots sister accidentally. Everyone loses their minds.

    The UK incident is a pretty rare one here so your scraping the barrel there as well. It's far more common in the US.


  • #110
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    czx wrote: »
    I dunno, I'm sure there's some Sinn Féin voters in Galway

    Oh look, it's this fella again.

    You seem to have some sort of obsession with me.

    Do you have no life of your own?


  • #111
    czx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 544 ✭✭✭czx


    Seaneh wrote: »
    Oh look, it's this fella again.

    You seem to have some sort of obsession with me.

    Do you have no life of your own?

    Some say 'Murica, I say Sinn Féin


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  • #112
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Here you go. http://asset-a.soup.io/asset/5937/4441_a798_500.jpeg

    My point exactly.

    Nonsense made up statistic. It was 2011, and they fired 85 times, at criminals 36 of those times.

    http://gawker.com/5909283/german-police-really-dont-like-shooting-at-people-used-only-85-bullets-last-year

    But don't let that get in the way of your pathetic pew pew jokes.

    I can show you whole cities in the US with lower crime rates than parts of Germany. Berlin has a homicide rate of 1.8 - four and a half times higher than Plano, Texas.
    http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/nov/30/new-york-crime-free-day-deadliest-cities-worldwide

    But keep up the mindless memes.


  • #113
    MadYaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    If anyone wants info on Irish gun laws the shooting forum on here is a good place to start. Its far from easy. There all kinds of rules and regulations that have to be adhered to before you'll be granted a license. You have to have a certain type of safe in your house which the guns will be stored in when not in use. It has to be bolted into the wall and you have to be very careful about who has access to it. When you apply the Gardai will go through your record and your entire families records and if there is even a hint of anything suspicious about you or any family member you won't get the license. If you're declined they don't have to tell you why, the superintendent can decide on a whim that you aren't getting a license and that's that. It can take months before you get an answer. This is how it should be imo.

    I don't know first hand but I would guess that in most states in America it's a little different. You apply, quick background check, provided you aren't just out of prison for a multiple homicide you're good to go.


  • #114
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    czx wrote: »
    Some say 'Murica, I say Sinn Féin

    Less people died in the entirety of the troubles, on all sides, than are killed yearly by firearms in the US.

    So try harder.


  • #115
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    A teenager came to a door at night and was shot in the face.

    After that very little is known,


  • #116
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,909 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    MadsL wrote: »
    My point exactly.

    Nonsense made up statistic. It was 2011, and they fired 85 times, at criminals 36 of those times.

    http://gawker.com/5909283/german-police-really-dont-like-shooting-at-people-used-only-85-bullets-last-year

    But don't let that get in the way of your pathetic pew pew jokes.
    Yup, totally comparable to American cops now.
    I can show you whole cities in the US with lower crime rates than parts of Germany. Berlin has a homicide rate of 1.8 - four and a half times higher than Plano, Texas.
    http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/nov/30/new-york-crime-free-day-deadliest-cities-worldwide
    Why are you tarring a whole city by comparing it to somewhere 20 times smaller!?!?!? etc. etc.
    But keep up the mindless memes.
    They're more lucid than the "points" you make tbh.


  • #117
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    MadYaker wrote: »

    I don't know first hand but I would guess that in most states in America it's a little different. You apply, quick background check, provided you aren't just out of prison for a multiple homicide you're good to go.

    Most US states don't even have background checks.


  • #118
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Those and more I think. The "now" thing is more deep-seated over there. How much of what's now built on in North America was there 50 years ago? How much will look the same in 50 years? Add poverty, possibilities of astronomical wealth from breaking the law in certain ways, access to guns, less regard for right to life (in favour of death penalty, killing black people at home and brown people abroad) and a few other things and there ya have it.

    One of the highest rates of income inequality in the world has a hell of a lot to do with it in my book...

    That and the fact that mental health is rarely covered on medical insurance, if you have insurance...


  • #119
    czx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 544 ✭✭✭czx


    Seaneh wrote: »
    Less people died in the entirety of the troubles, on all sides, than are killed yearly by firearms in the US.

    So try harder.

    More people are killed yearly by firearms in countries that aren't the US than are killed yearly by firearms in the US


  • #120
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,521 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    MadYaker wrote: »
    When you apply the Gardai will go through...your entire families records and if there is even a hint of anything suspicious about you or any family member you won't get the license. If you're declined they don't have to tell you why, the superintendent can decide on a whim that you aren't getting a license and that's that

    That's all incorrect.


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  • #121
    pablomakaveli
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Weekly? Try hourly.

    http://www.juancole.com/2012/07/58-murders-a-year-by-firearms-in-britain-8775-in-us.html

    58 firearm murders in the UK last year - a little over one a week. 8,775 in the US, which if you divide by 365 works out to 24.04 per day, or literally just over one per hour.

    That article doesn't show gun deaths with legally held firearms opposed to illegally held in the UK. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the majority of that 58 were gang-related deaths with illegally held weapons.


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