Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN Mod Warning Post #1

losthorizon · 23-10-2013 09:32PM

Its being reported by Sky News that a Vietnamese looking girl has been taken off her parents by the Gardai in Newcastlewest until DNA results have been confirmed.

23-10-2013 09:33PM

namloc1980 wrote: »

Wow really... you HAVE to get a new passport photo every year??? You totally made that up didn't you?

Sarcasm dear.

23-10-2013 09:35PM

losthorizon wrote: »

Its being reported by Sky News that a Vietnamese looking girl has been taken off her parents by the Gardai in Newcastlewest until DNA results have been confirmed.

I wonder if any troll with a fiver phone credit might start reporting anyone who's made foreign adoptions. There'd be more grounds and doubts in such cases, the Gardai can't be expected to know what birth certs and the like look like from other countries.

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 09:35PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

was not just the cops , the HSE , a judge and the hospital were complicit in this
and you are assuming they did not check it but were told it did not match by the hospital ,m or the hse or the judge

but feel free to kick the cops

I will on terrible police work you keep going on about doing this is basic police work. If they had done basic police work then this would not have happened

Roger_007 · 23-10-2013 09:36PM

losthorizon wrote: »

Its being reported by Sky News that a Vietnamese looking girl has been taken off her parents by the Gardai in Newcastlewest until DNA results have been confirmed.

I'm getting worried. I have a Portugees water dog that doesn't look a bit like me...:rolleyes:

constance tench · 23-10-2013 09:36PM

EmptyTree wrote: »

They did contact the hosiptal, no records were found.

..but did they go to view them?...pretty shoddy investigation IMO, considering they may have been taking a child from her Natural parents!

Having said that, it's highly probable they were influenced by the outcome of the Greek abduction...even so, no excuse.

BlaasForRafa · 23-10-2013 09:37PM

oceanman wrote: »

that poor little child must have been totally terrified, what an ordeal to put through at that young age. at least now she is back now where she belongs..

Perhaps the roma community can look at recent events and reflect on why they have such a bad reputation and take steps to do something about it.

Foxhound38 · 23-10-2013 09:37PM

5littleangels wrote: »

Clearly you are not a parent.

In fairness, that is not an argument.

Cases where intervention by the State is necessary happen all the time. The only difference is that usually hack tabloid journalists don't hop on it before thw facts are ascertained by the relevant authorities in the hopes of starting a crusade against an ethnic group. In a case where there is a reasonable suspicion of danger to the child, the State has a duty to step in, investigate and if necessary to call a halt. Do not let your emotions as a parent affect your judgement in this - not all parents are capable or even arsed with providing a safe and secure environment for their kids. Most, the vast majority are - but not all. Many an absolute horror show has been averted or put an end to because of necessary intervention by the Gardai, the HSE and the State in dangerous situations.

These two specific cases were cock-ups - there's no denying that. But that doesn't mean the principle of necessary intervention should be thrown out. I have to believe that the gardai acted in good faith with the best information they had. It's no benefit to them or the force to take away peoples children erroneously for the craic.

Pompey Magnus · 23-10-2013 09:37PM

Balaclava1991 wrote: »

Pictures, passports and birth cert can be faked and while the Gardaí have their backs turned submitting them to a check to make sure they aren't fake the parents could have done a runner with the kid.

So if Gardai receive a complaint tomorrow relating to a different child what in your books can that child's parent's realistically do to not have their child taken into custody if pictures, passport and birth certs do not meet your criteria as they could be faked?

strandroad · 23-10-2013 09:37PM

Roger_007 wrote: »

I'm getting worried. I have a Portugees water dog that doesn't look a bit like me...:rolleyes:

I have two labs, one is black, one is yellow, I am white!

tayto lover · 23-10-2013 09:38PM

Roger_007 wrote: »

I'm getting worried. I have a Portugees water dog that doesn't look a bit like me...:rolleyes:

I bet your parrot does

Balaclava1991 · 23-10-2013 09:38PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think that means what you think it means.

Don't be ridiculous.

Are you seriously trying to tell me that in the wake of the case in Greece that the Irish authorities are going to take a chance when an almost identical case presents itself?

And what if the children had been abducted and the gypsies did a runner or killed the children?

There was an estranged father a few years ago who did a runner a few years ago with his daughter. The guy was living in squalor and his daughter was living like an animal. The Gardaí called to the door as part of a routine check up about some other matter. The guy blew his little daughter's face off with a shotgun before taking his own life.

That's why the Gardaí have been given these powers.

If they think there is something off they take no chances.

So cut the crap.

Roger_007 · 23-10-2013 09:39PM

mhge wrote: »

I have two labs, one is black, one is yellow, I am white!

Then you are clearly not the natural parent of either...:rolleyes:

dj jarvis · 23-10-2013 09:39PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

I will on terrible police work you keep going on about doing this is basic police work. If they had done basic police work then this would not have happened

as i said it was not just them involved - they were provided with info , and acted on it until they done the checking , that is how it works

all the time , with almost every investigation , hold and check

they were doing what they are paid to do until further info came to light,
you are aware that the garda arrest innocent people all the time , and after checking them , let them go

is basic stuff you are arguing against here

EmptyTree · 23-10-2013 09:42PM

constance tench wrote: »

..but did they go to view them?...pretty shoddy investigation IMO, considering they may have been taking a child from her Natural parents!

I don't know if they went to the hosital, if they rang teh hospital or if they used smoke signals. What exactly were they supposed to view when they were told the records didn't exsist?? (using the information they provided to the hospital at the time)

jobeenfitz · 23-10-2013 09:42PM

I think the Guards done what they done with the best of intentions. Maybe they had reasons for taking the actions they took. Maybe they made mistakes out of fear and/or prejudice?

This could have been caused by hysteria from the Greek case and even though many of us may be suspicious of or even dislike Roma people, it shows we have to be careful and keep our prejudice in check.

I also believed that two brown eyed parents could not have a blue eyed child, just shows i wasn't paying attention in biology.

As others have said it must have been a terrifying experience for the child and the parents and lessons have to be learned all round.

Roger_007 · 23-10-2013 09:42PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I bet your parrot does

That's true, especially when I wear my yellow trousers and bright green jumper....you couldn't tell us apart.:D

dj jarvis · 23-10-2013 09:43PM

constance tench wrote: »

..but did they go to view them?...pretty shoddy investigation IMO, considering they may have been taking a child from her Natural parents!

Having said that, it's highly probable they were influenced by the outcome of the Greek abduction...even so, no excuse.

normally its worked on the assumption that the person at the end of the phone in the hospital records office knows their job, understands what is being asked of them , and can do this task that they are paid for

so they should second guess every phone call they make , and send a guy round , just to make sure , come on???

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 09:44PM

EmptyTree wrote: »

I don't know if they went to the hosital, if they rang teh hospital or if they used smoke signals. What exactly were they supposed to view when they were told the records didn't exsist?? (using the information they provided to the hospital at the time)

If only we had some kind of automated machine for storing information that can be searched instantly for matching information.

AnonoBoy · 23-10-2013 09:45PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

they were provided with info

As a matter of interest does anyone know what info was provided? Was it just "that kid is blonde, I think she's stolen?"

Because surely the child had been with the parents all her life - it's not like she suddenly just appeared in the house and aroused suspicion - surely neighbours would have seen her about a bit before.

Are we going to see any white woman with a mixed race baby having her child taken now because she may no longer be in a relationship with the father?

namloc1980 · 23-10-2013 09:45PM

EmptyTree wrote: »

I don't know if they went to the hosital, if they rang teh hospital or if they used smoke signals. What exactly were they supposed to view when they were told the records didn't exsist?? (using the information they provided to the hospital at the time)

How come a journo found it and how come nobody from the Gardai involved thought to search under the woman's maiden name? Pretty shoddy work.

Roger_007 · 23-10-2013 09:45PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

If only we had some kind of automated machine for storing information that can be searched instantly for matching information.

Ah sure isn't that only science fiction......;)

Ace2007 · 23-10-2013 09:46PM

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

Perhaps the roma community can look at recent events and reflect on why they have such a bad reputation and take steps to do something about it.

Seriously?

Balaclava1991 · 23-10-2013 09:47PM

Pompey Magnus wrote: »

So if Gardai receive a complaint tomorrow relating to a different child what in your books can that child's parent's realistically do to not have their child taken into custody if pictures, passport and birth certs do not meet your criteria as they could be faked?

And what happens if they don't take a report of a suspected child abduction seriously and the kid is murdered?

There have been cases where cops have called to a house and the person who abducted killed the kid and then killed themselves.

This has happened in Ireland before. A guy blew his abducted daughter's face off with a shotgun and then shot himself.

A couple visited a funeral parlor to have the family fitted for coffins, the Gardaí called over to see what was going on and when the parents said nothing was wrong, the Gardaí left and the parents killed themselves and the kids.

Of course if that happened you be having a go at the Gardaí for doing nothing wouldn't you?

EmptyTree · 23-10-2013 09:47PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

If only we had some kind of automated machine for storing information that can be searched instantly for matching information.

It would still only work if you provide the correct information in the first place I'd imagine......so I doubt your automated machine would have helped very much in this instance.

dj jarvis · 23-10-2013 09:47PM

AnonoBoy wrote: »

As a matter of interest does anyone know what info was provided? Was it just "that kid is blonde, I think she's stolen?"

Because surely the child had been with the parents all her life - it's not like she suddenly just appeared in the house and aroused suspicion - surely neighbours would have seen her about a bit before.

Are we going to see any white woman with a mixed race baby having her child taken now because she may no longer be in a relationship with the father?

from what i can gather , that would be the heart of it , some one watching sky news , seen Greece and bingo , dropped the jurno a line

what was said to the cops then is anyone's guess , but i really can see them acting on just that , has to be more to it

Giblet · 23-10-2013 09:48PM

Balaclava1991 wrote: »

It's just sh*t stirring nonsense.

Someone would have to a total ape to not see that the Gardaí were right.

Ridiculous that people are having a go at the Gardaí over this when they would be having a go at them if it turned out the kids were actually abducted.

Unreal.

Don't feel the troll people.

AnonoBoy · 23-10-2013 09:49PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

what was said to the cops then is anyone's guess , but i really can see them acting on just that , has to be more to it

I'd like to think there was more to it but the kid was who they said she was so perhaps not.

Some loon ringing up saying "I seen someone blonde with someone who I don't think could have a blonde kid, IT'S A KIDNAPPING. OMG!" -

Phoebas · 23-10-2013 09:49PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

normally its worked on the assumption that the person at the end of the phone in the hospital records office knows their job, understands what is being asked of them , and can do this task that they are paid for

so they should second guess every phone call they make , and send a guy round , just to make sure , come on???

IF they are going to make a decision to place a child in protective custody based on this information, then Yes, of course they should send someone around to make sure.

23-10-2013 09:50PM

Pompey Magnus wrote: »

So if Gardai receive a complaint tomorrow relating to a different child what in your books can that child's parent's realistically do to not have their child taken into custody if pictures, passport and birth certs do not meet your criteria as they could be faked?

Simple, be white.

Balaclava1991 wrote: »

Don't be ridiculous.

Are you seriously trying to tell me that in the wake of the case in Greece that the Irish authorities are going to take a chance when an almost identical case presents itself?

False dichotomy. And when we start policing based on hysteria we're pretty ****ed.

And what if the children had been abducted and the gypsies did a runner or killed the children?

Can say that about anyone.

There was an estranged father a few years ago who did a runner a few years ago with his daughter. The guy was living in squalor and his daughter was living like an animal. The Gardaí called to the door as part of a routine check up about some other matter. The guy blew his little daughter's face off with a shotgun before taking his own life.

You're leaving out the most important thing, what race was he?

That's why the Gardaí have been given these powers.

If they think there is something off they take no chances.

There's no line at all?

So cut the crap.

Right back at ya.

Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN *Mod Warning Post #1*

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Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN Mod Warning Post #1