Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN Mod Warning Post #1

namloc1980 · 23-10-2013 06:42PM

My child is blonde but I have dark hair. When can I expect the HSE to call around?

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:43PM

Diarmuid wrote: »

Not to mention for a lot of posters and thankers on this thread

Hardly.

You obviously dont care much for child protection then.

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:44PM

namloc1980 wrote: »

My child is blonde but I have dark hair. When can I expect the HSE to call around?

That makes sense alright... The percentages were not in favour of this outcome as im sure you know well. And the initial investigation (of which the guards are bound to perform) turned over little evidence of parentage so child welfare has to come into play.

So whats your point ?

The law is there to protect children.

Galwayguy35 · 23-10-2013 06:46PM

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Massive embarrassment for the Gardaí and HSE. I call for resignations for this farcical episode.

Why?

Because the Gardai did their job is it?

Nodin · 23-10-2013 06:48PM

"Gardai visited the house after they received a claim from a TV3 journalist - via the public - that the seven-year-old girl was not the householders' daughter.
The journalist was given the information about the girl, who is blonde and has blue eyes, on Facebook.
During a two-hour visit to the house, officers interviewed the two adults about the girl and sought proof that she was their daughter.
They had concerns about the child's identity, and as a result of the interview and their attempts to check out the information given by the adults, they decided after two hours to use emergency powers contained in section 12 of the Child Care Act to take the girl from the family and hand her into the care of the HSE overnight.
The family produced a passport for the girl, but the photo used was of a small child and could not be immediately matched with the girl.
Gardai were also told by the family, who have other children, that the girl was born at the Coombe Hospital in 2006, but preliminary checks could not confirm that.
However, an independent examination by the Irish Independent of the Coombe records yesterday showed that the woman had given birth to a daughter on the day she mentioned in 2006.
At the time of the birth, the parents of the infant did not live in Tallaght, but had another address in Dublin. They have been residing in Tallaght for several years.
The child's first name on the birth record differed from the name used by the girl, but it was accepted that this was not unusual."
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/dna-test-proves-girl-7-belongs-to-roma-family-29694850.html

A depressing farce.

Nodin · 23-10-2013 06:49PM

listermint wrote: »

Embarrassing how so? Taking child welfare into consideration. Following through with investigations due to poor/no initial proof of parentage.

Sure we'd all be giving out sh%t in here if it turned out the guards did nothing.

.

....there's a medium to be found between doing nothing and hysterical overreaction.

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 06:49PM

listermint wrote: »

That makes sense alright... The percentages were not in favour of this outcome as im sure you know well. And the initial investigation (of which the guards are bound to perform) turned over little evidence of parentage so child welfare has to come into play.

So whats your point ?

The law is there to protect children.

So as a parent your rights can be trampled over ? farcical episode i agree there should be some resignations on this one. To much hysteria to little thought.

bgrizzley · 23-10-2013 06:51PM

namloc1980 wrote: »

My child is blonde but I have dark hair. When can I expect the HSE to call around?

You'll be ok as long as you arent part of any minority group.

Sad days for Ireland...

tayto lover · 23-10-2013 06:52PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Fair enough. If both of these cases turn out to be biological parents then what. My other problem is with children in care of the state that have been left to die where were the garda then ?

FFS now you're trying to convict the authorities from both sides of the argument.

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:52PM

Nodin wrote: »

....there's a medium to be found between doing nothing and hysterical overreaction.

Explain the hysterical part. Im interested

Galwayguy35 · 23-10-2013 06:53PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

So as a parent your rights can be trampled over ? farcical episode i agree there should be some resignations on this one. To much hysteria to little thought.

Imagine if the Greek authorities decided to do nothing, better to be safe than sorry.

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 06:53PM

listermint wrote: »

Explain the hysterical part. Im interested

child reported for having blond hair blue eyes

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:54PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

So as a parent your rights can be trampled over ? farcical episode i agree there should be some resignations on this one. To much hysteria to little thought.

Yes, Im sorry but thats why its called 'child protection'.

Nothing really to do with the rights of the parents, the legislation is there to look after childrens welfare.

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 06:56PM

listermint wrote: »

Yes, Im sorry but thats why its called 'child protection'.

Nothing really to do with the rights of the parents, the legislation is there to look after childrens welfare.

And the child's right not to be taken from it's biological parents for no reason other than proving there related ? I'm sorry but this better safe than sorry lark is ridicules.. there might be a monster under your bed go look better safe than sorry.

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:56PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

child reported for having blond hair blue eyes

Reported a roma family with a child that bears no resemblance to the rest of the family yes.

Guards investigated and after a number of hours they were still not happy with the responses given or that of the childs certification. Which every child in the country has.

So they did exactly as our law dictates.

If you have a problem with the law right to you local TD

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 06:57PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Why?

Because the Gardai did their job is it?

You would not say that if it was your child you would have the garda up in court pretty sharpish

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:58PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

And the child's right not to be taken from it's biological parents for no reason other than proving there related ? I'm sorry but this better safe than sorry lark is ridicules.. there might be a monster under your bed go look better safe than sorry.

As i said, if you have issue with it take it to your local TD. Its the law of the land.

People asking for heads to roll will be the first people on here complaining if the Guards do nothing at all.

Sure the Guards are always wrong and sure the HSE does nothing right.

yada yada etc etc etc

Faux outrage is no outrage

LionelNashe · 23-10-2013 06:59PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Why?

Because the Gardai did their job is it?

They got it wrong, just like most of the posters in this thread.

Phoebas · 23-10-2013 06:59PM

listermint wrote: »

Yes, Im sorry but thats why its called 'child protection'.

Nothing really to do with the rights of the parents, the legislation is there to look after childrens welfare.

How is the child's welfare being looked after if it turns out that the child has been taken from her family on the most flimsy of evidence without some simple investigation being properly conducted?

Galwayguy35 · 23-10-2013 06:59PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

You would not say that if it was your child you would have the garda up in court pretty sharpish

Don't presume to know what I would or wouldn't do Jack.

listermint · 23-10-2013 06:59PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

You would not say that if it was your child you would have the garda up in court pretty sharpish

You would not have a leg to stand on, they followed procedure.

It wasnt a simple case that they kicked the door in and took the child. They investigated first and drew conclusions from the investigation. It took chemical science to verify in the end.

Case closed.

tayto lover · 23-10-2013 07:00PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

You would not say that if it was your child you would have the garda up in court pretty sharpish

I think the authorities did the right thing.
They checked out the story and the child is now returned.
If they had left and later found out that things didn't match up and if the family then left the area they would have looked a lot worse and the same knockers would be arguing that they should be sacked for neglect.

darkpagandeath · 23-10-2013 07:01PM

listermint wrote: »

As i said, if you have issue with it take it to your local TD. Its the law of the land.

People asking for heads to roll will be the first people on here complaining if the Guards do nothing at all.

Sure the Guards are always wrong and sure the HSE does nothing right.

yada yada etc etc etc

Faux outrage is no outrage

Nice hypothetical that's not what happened 2 children were taken from their biological parents end off. We have the facts now stick to them should of cudda wudda nonsense.

listermint · 23-10-2013 07:01PM

Phoebas wrote: »

How is the child's welfare being looked after if it turns out that the child has been taken from her family on the most flimsy of evidence without some simple investigation being properly conducted?

Do i really have to explain that to you?

Or should we leave all children in plausible jeopardy where they are then ?

Phoebas · 23-10-2013 07:01PM

listermint wrote: »

People asking for heads to roll will be the first people on here complaining if the Guards do nothing at all.

Is 'nothing at all' and 'taking the child into protective custody' the only two avenues that were open?

listermint · 23-10-2013 07:02PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Nice hypothetical that's not what happened 2 children were taken from their biological parents end off. We have the facts now stick to them should of cudda wudda nonsense.

Exactly.

investigation closed.

I thought i said this already, does that mean you are agreeing with me.

yawn

listermint · 23-10-2013 07:03PM

Phoebas wrote: »

Is 'nothing at all' and 'taking the child into protective custody' the only two avenues that were open?

Well yes. Thats why we have these laws.

What should they do then if there is a potential chance the child was not theres or if there is a child in a possibly abusive situation.

Leave them there until we complete the investigation ?

Do you know how child protection works ? Its the same procedure in most european nations.

Ireland is no different.

Roger_007 · 23-10-2013 07:04PM

listermint wrote: »

Explain the hysterical part. Im interested

The Gardai could have done a more thorough investigation about the birth records before removing the child from her home and they could have kept the family under surveillance while that was being done. There is no suggestion from anyone that the child was being abused or mistreated so going for the 'nuclear' option was definitely an over-reaction. It was unprofessional and just downright stupid policing. I don't think the word hysterical is out of place.
This story has had massive international exposure and it's going to look like 'those stupid Irish' yet again.

Nodin · 23-10-2013 07:04PM

listermint wrote: »

Explain the hysterical part. Im interested

Two hours is suddenly sufficient to take away a child when there's been court battles for custody where people have sought to take a child from a junkie that have taken years? Yes, that's fucking hysterical overreaction.

dj jarvis · 23-10-2013 07:06PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Nice hypothetical that's not what happened 2 children were taken from their biological parents end off. We have the facts now stick to them should of cudda wudda nonsense.[/QUOTE]

so the cops doing their job is now cudda wudda nonsense ???

a complaint is made , they have to act
the family could not prove at that point in time that the child was theirs

what would you like them to do ???

cops were 100% correct in their actions and no amount of blowing smoke out ones arse is going to change this fact

its un arguable on a point of law.

well done the Garda - now i HOPE the child does turn out to be from the roma family , becasue that will mean its not a kidnap victim - wont that be a great outcome for everyone

Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN *Mod Warning Post #1*

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Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN Mod Warning Post #1