Just wonder if anyone cares anymore....

StewartGriffin · 10-10-2013 12:56AM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

We spent out health fund bailing out the banks and the euro debt. We had the money and the finiances to put something good into place, we wasted it.

I think the health fund that could have made a difference was blown in Charlie McGreevy's budgets. Giveaways for a popular vote rather than investing in a reliable health system. It was too late by the time the banks went bust.

Missyelliot2 · 10-10-2013 12:57AM

longshanks wrote: »

But the JamesReilly is going to eradicate homelessness and cigarettes.

He hasn't got time to deal with people on trolleys, 36 hour shifts for junior doctors, or for actual problems. He's going to make-believe solve the unsolvable.

And ignore the real problems. He's definitely not a cunt.

You are so right ....big man stamping out cigarettes! But......what can I/We do? haven't a notion of voting any of those political cretins into power (ALL PARTIES INCLUDED!) -
Would love something to change......feels a tad like pseudo -China!
'Redemption Song' on Todayfm! NOW!

Hilly Bill · 10-10-2013 12:57AM

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Visitors? People awaiting an operation? Women in labour? (I don't agree with smoking then but they need a bed). People who are well do not get a hospital bed - saying silly stuff is not helpful to the OP.

This is Ireland it happens.

longhalloween · 10-10-2013 12:58AM

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Unfortunately more and more people are leaving the likes of VHI so they can pay their mortgage.

You have my sympathy OP

More and more are leaving because the younger generation aren't joining up, so there's less of a pool of healthy people to prop up the elderly who have expensive treatments.

So the price keeps increasing, up and up until the elderly (who need it the most) can no longer afford to have insurance.

Remember when risk sharing was such a big debate, when insurance providers with a younger client base were asked to give money to providers with an older client base?

Stheno · 10-10-2013 01:01AM

Overheal wrote: »

And it was touted as an Ideal system to the american public during the 2009 healthcare debates.

I still shudder at the thought. Is Mary still running the show from behind a bag of chips?

Nah, she's not even a TD anymore.

She got reelected as a male FFer with an even bigger gut, a dodgy ginger beard and various fingers in various pies.

Overheal · 10-10-2013 01:04AM

Stheno wrote: »

Nah, she's not even a TD anymore.

She got reelected as a male FFer with an even bigger gut, a dodgy ginger beard and various fingers in various pies.

fun. its good to see the electorate shows evidence of learning through past mistakes

deadeye187 · 10-10-2013 01:05AM

If i`m not mistaken the more urgent is seen first!..

So if your seen fast its not good!....

I was waiting 9hrs for a xray once.....9hrs!

Missyelliot2 · 10-10-2013 01:12AM

But...as the people WHAT can we do?

Incompetent muppets running and ruining our healthcare education etc.
Really brought it home to me this week - how vulnerable we all are -especially when sick and needing care.

deadeye187 · 10-10-2013 01:16AM

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

But...as the people WHAT can we do?

Incompetent muppets running and ruining our healthcare education etc.
Really brought it home to me this week - how vulnerable we all are -especially when sick and needing care.

Well it goes without saying that we are in a bad situation, the only way to change things is with out feet....but you need numbers and people who are passionate about what they are fighting for!

People like to talk a good fight, but when it come down to it they to lazy to get up and get together and do something about it!....

Lola18 · 10-10-2013 01:20AM

I was in hospital for 2 nights while pregnant they thought I had a lung clot. after a day and a half of tests they wanted to keep me in another night waiting on results. I insisted on discharging myself so they made a phone call got the results everything was ok just bruised ribs causing the pain and they sent me home.
Freeing up a bed which I probably would have been in until the next evening if I just waited for them to get results in there own time. My point here is that people who are well do take up beds with no need!

10-10-2013 01:21AM

triage, simple as that

deadeye187 · 10-10-2013 01:23AM

Deleted User wrote: »

triage, simple as that

This is what happens to a degree here!

Most urgent are seen first, no matter if you are waiting 2hrs if someone comes with a condition that is life threatening they will be seen before everyone, and rightly so.

SusieBlue · 10-10-2013 01:26AM

My friend's 82yr old grandmother is currently on a trolley on a corridor in A+E in the CUH. She's been there 2 days now. Dislocated shoulder, broken hip and a suspected heart attack. Poor woman is delirious and has no idea what's going on.

Staff and patients are walking up and down the corridor all night and the lights aren't turned off or anything. Family aren't allowed sit with her through the night.

This fall will realistically kill her and she isn't even comfortable or being looked after properly. No dignity at all. Its sickening.

10-10-2013 01:28AM

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

But...as the people WHAT can we do?

Incompetent muppets running and ruining our healthcare education etc.
Really brought it home to me this week - how vulnerable we all are -especially when sick and needing care.

well, Missy, writing to Dr Reilly, is not something you should do.

Take it from me, he would only send an automated response from his receptionist who will tell you hes looking onto the matter and will be back to you in due course.
This of course will not happen. Ive been waiting three years now. I stopped holding my breath a long time ago. He is an useful as an ashtray on a motorbike.

Hope your Father in law makes a quick recovery .

deadeye187 · 10-10-2013 01:30AM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

My friend's 82yr old grandmother is currently on a trolley on a corridor in A+E in the CUH. She's been there 2 days now. Dislocated shoulder, broken hip and a suspected heart attack. Poor woman is delirious and has no idea what's going on.

Staff and patients are walking up and down the corridor all night and the lights aren't turned off or anything. Family aren't allowed sit with her through the night.

This fall will realistically kill her and she isn't even comfortable or being looked after properly. No dignity at all. Its sickening.

I`d say at her age its a life threatening condition, when older people fall, this is a very serious situation and should be looked after quick. And yes when older people have a serious fall death is a lightly outcome, or it can come days to weeks later.

Ps. Sorry to hear about all your misfortune, and I hope it goes well for all of you.

Hilly Bill · 10-10-2013 01:32AM

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

But...as the people WHAT can we do?

Incompetent muppets running and ruining our healthcare education etc.
Really brought it home to me this week - how vulnerable we all are -especially when sick and needing care.

Not a lot apart from going private if that would make a difference.

It all depends on the hospital and how busy it is when you arrive, there are only so much spare beds available at any one time.
Ive waited to see the triage nurse ( spelling?) for a couple or hours or so in agony and once assessed and saw that i was in agony i was taken straight through and seen by a doctor, given a pain killer and hooked up to a drip and left sat on a plastic chair in agony because there was no trollies and then sent home a few hours later after an x-ray because of no beds. Fair enough i thought at the time as i was given tablets to take home. It turned out that they had diagnosed me wrong and i ended back in A&E a week later still in pain.
This time once i was seen by the doctor i was put on a trolley in a cubicle and after some tests i was brought up to a ward within a few hours of arriving in A&E twice this happened both late at night.

Stheno · 10-10-2013 01:32AM

THere is fundamental reform needed in our HSE.

Why is it that many years after the Health Boards were abolished, we still have localised "boards/regions" rather than centralised administration of the systems?

Why is it that we have no end to end system in place so that once I go for an x ray, my doctor gets emailed the analysi.s via a patient management system?

I believe its partly due to unions, partly due to an unwillingness to change, and sheer inefficiency.

I still remember the HR manager in the HSE and their infamous comment about there being a couple of thousand too many staff in HR.

Wtf type of organisation full stop needs a couple of thousand HR staff? I doubt even IBM or HP or the likes have that?

Hilly Bill · 10-10-2013 01:38AM

deadeye187 wrote: »

This is what happens to a degree here!

Most urgent are seen first, no matter if you are waiting 2hrs if someone comes with a condition that is life threatening they will be seen before everyone, and rightly so.

What also is happening is people on medical cards clogging up A&E after the pubs close for some silly reason like a graze from falling whilst drunk .
People would be seen quicker if people used some cop on before going to A&E and not be going there for some trivial reason just because they are on the medical card.

brokenarms · 10-10-2013 01:39AM

I broke my ankle and fingers last year after a fall.
I was on a trolley for a few hours in Naas but the level of care I got was exceptional.
Staff where very caring and did their very best to comfort me. They are under staffed. I'm better now so it does work

I lived in NYC and it was worse

I also lived in England for a time. Same as here . All under staffed.

Go private.

deadeye187 · 10-10-2013 01:43AM

brokenarms wrote: »

I broke my ankle and fingers last year after a fall.
I was on a trolley for a few hours in Naas but the level of care I got was exceptional.
Staff where very caring and did their very best to comfort me. They are under staffed. I'm better now so it does work

I lived in NYC and it was worse

I also lived in England for a time. Same as here . All under staffed.

Go private.

with a name like yours i`d say your no stranger to A+E!:D

take everything · 10-10-2013 02:03AM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

My friend's 82yr old grandmother is currently on a trolley on a corridor in A+E in the CUH. She's been there 2 days now. Dislocated shoulder, broken hip and a suspected heart attack. Poor woman is delirious and has no idea what's going on.

Staff and patients are walking up and down the corridor all night and the lights aren't turned off or anything. Family aren't allowed sit with her through the night.

This fall will realistically kill her and she isn't even comfortable or being looked after properly. No dignity at all. Its sickening.

Christ.
What a stupid fcuking country this is.

IvaBigWun · 10-10-2013 02:10AM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

My friend's 82yr old grandmother is currently on a trolley on a corridor in A+E in the CUH. She's been there 2 days now. Dislocated shoulder, broken hip and a suspected heart attack. Poor woman is delirious and has no idea what's going on.

Staff and patients are walking up and down the corridor all night and the lights aren't turned off or anything. Family aren't allowed sit with her through the night.

This fall will realistically kill her and she isn't even comfortable or being looked after properly. No dignity at all. Its sickening.

This makes me sad.

Anyone care to re-write the above with someone who comes in with the same problems ... Except this time has a VHI card in her hand?

deadeye187 · 10-10-2013 02:12AM

IvaBigWun wrote: »

This makes me sad.

Anyone care to re-write the above with someone who comes in with the same problems ... Except this time has a VHI card in her hand?

hmmm..the term can of worms comes to mind!

laserlad2010 · 10-10-2013 03:27AM

As a doctor I'd like to try to shed some light on the matter. I worked in a large tertiary hospital in Dublin until I moved to New Zealand to work (more on that later).

1. Of the 450 beds in the hospital, 100 were taken up by elderly patients awaiting nursing home beds. We would see them every day - a requirement - which was a waste of our time.

Why was it a waste of our time? Because these patient's weren't sick, they were just old. At first, every day we would ring the social worker asking when this patient could be discharged to a NH bed - and the same answer always floated down the line. "Paperwork's not ready" or "Funding not approved". e2000 a day in an acute tertiary level hospital, with major surgery going on on the floor above and an acute medical unit below, when the average cost of a NH bed was e1400 A WEEK. The average length of stay for a NH pending patient is around 3 months.

2. We would go on take (on call) - admitting every patient who needed it during a 24 hour period. I'll outline the surgical and the medical systems. Medical - every patient was seen by a consultant within 24 hours, and at least 2 separate doctors within 5 or 6. As soon as the first doctor sees them tests and treatment start. We would ask for them to be brought to the ward. No beds, we are told.

We always tried to get the elderly up first. They get disorientated at night in ED because sick people don't come in just from 9-5, and we can't just "turn the lights off" as another poster said, but we try to dim them as much as possible. Inevitably, people spend ages in ED. For one of the many reasons, refer yourselves to point 1.

Surgery was pretty good. The experience described in Spain by another poster is exactly the same as here. I should know, I've operated on a few appendixes myself and you're home within 2 days.

3. I did 36 hour shifts. My very FIRST experience of my medical career was a 37 hour shift IN THE HOSPITAL on my feet all day with a sandwich for food. I slept for 45 minutes. How can I be so specific? Because myself and my colleague split the 90 minutes before our day job started to get some sleep.

For every 36 hour shift I did, I would (after I had seen all the patients the next day) go for breakfast in the canteen. At precisely 0845 every morning, a bunch of people would arrive to start their day. HR, Finance, Admin, all these f*****g suits swanning in to attempt to justify their bloody positions for 8 hours before p*****g off.

Everyone else was protected. Porters, don't let me get f*****g started on them. They literally did nothing outside their contract. Ourselves and the nurses (who in fairness had some protection) would have to fill the cracks just to get tasks done.

You want an insiders opinion on how to fix the system?
1. Fire the suits
2. Hire more ward secretaries and attendants
3. Upskill the nurses to perform procedures
4. Fund as much as possible in the community - IV antibiotics/NH beds/Physio/Rehabilitation

You, the taxpayer, will have to pay more for MAXIMUM 5 years. Then the cost of inpatient healthcare will drop.

Here in New Zealand, if it can be provided in the community, it's done. NH approval within 3 days. IV antibiotics given by GPs. More ward secretaries and attendants. Nurses do procedures. I do less hours and train more.

They have a population of around 5 million, but spread out over 10 times the area of Ireland. Go figure.

laserlad2010 · 10-10-2013 03:29AM

Oh, and before anyone tells me to shut up because I abandoned the system...

I'm coming back in a few months. Stockholm Syndrome.

Esel · 10-10-2013 03:42AM

Going 'private' does not make any difference in A&E. Going in to A&E in an ambulance might.

OP: I hope your grandfather makes a complete and swift recovery.

shedweller · 10-10-2013 03:46AM

Mary Hearney went to NZ to check out their healthcare system but either couldnt be arsed copying it or wasnt let. I'd say she wasnt let because theres too many vested interests making serious money out of the current system. That includes the private healthcare due to people fleeing the public system.
I would say it would take a complete revolt on our behalf to change anything. Until then nothing will change.

remsburgsgirl · 10-10-2013 10:51AM

laserlad2010 wrote: »

.....Here in New Zealand, if it can be provided in the community, it's done. NH approval within 3 days. IV antibiotics given by GPs. More ward secretaries and attendants. Nurses do procedures. I do less hours and train more...

That bit about GP's, giving an IV anything, made me laugh...I have been to my GP many many times for things that they could have easily treated...they have become too accustomed to easily passing the book onto the hospitals I think

Potatoeman · 10-10-2013 11:05AM

Every time this comes up its the same problems. People in a&e that shouldnt be there. People in beds that shouldnt be there. No wonder the health system is broken. Why cant the get some out patient facilities?

krudler · 10-10-2013 11:09AM

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Well when my nana was dying in 1996 she had to be moved from the hospital to a nursing home, in order to free up a hospital bed.

Who the **** like that gets a hospital bed?

I live near the Regional hospital in Limerick, see it every time I pass it. There's no smoking on the grounds so everyone goes out to the wall near the roundabout and lights up. Best one ever was a fat guy with an oxygen tank beside him smoking, saw him when I was going in for an x-ray once, fcking moron.

Just wonder if anyone cares anymore....

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