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Breaking Bad Episode 15: Granite State

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    #572
    old hippy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,441 ✭✭✭old hippy


    Mr Freeze wrote: »
    I'm going to subscribe to this theory.

    My first thoughts were that he was going to get revenge on GM, but it is more likely that he will try to be remembered as Heisenburg as Walter White is being written out of GM's history.

    I really hope Jessie survives this whole thing, but he has suffered so much at this stage now, its hard to know what will happen to him.

    Walt will off the nazis and give his product to Jesse. In an act of symbolism, he'll hand Jesse the black hat. "You're Heisenberg, now" or something like that. Jesse can't go back to his old life, he's empty inside now. The perfect Hesienberg. Oh and Skyler will off Walt.


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    #573
    Quixoticelixer
    Closed Accounts Posts: 324 ✭✭Quixoticelixer


    Deleted User wrote: »
    One thing is for sure we know Walt is good at turning something around on people. I just think they have to answer the question of what happened with GM in the final episode as it was never answered and from the meetings early in the show between Gretchen and Walt you could see how hurt he was.

    Of all the things that they have to answer in the finale, the back story with Gretchen and GM is very far down the list.


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    #574
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    Quixoticelixer wrote: »
    Apparently so. Despite the fact it would be totally out of character, people seriously believe that will be his motivation in the finale. A lot of people forgetting that Walt only kills people he has perceived to be a threat to him, be that as a threat to his life, a threat to outing him as Heisenberg, or a threat to his family (or Jesse in one instance).

    It just wouldn't make sense.

    Which category does Mike fall into?


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    #575
    Mr Freeze
    Registered Users Posts: 6,618 ✭✭✭Mr Freeze


    old hippy wrote: »
    Walt will off the nazis and give his product to Jesse. In an act of symbolism, he'll hand Jesse the black hat. "You're Heisenberg, now" or something like that. Jesse can't go back to his old life, he's empty inside now. The perfect Hesienberg. Oh and Skyler will off Walt.

    Oh, I really don't see that happening. I think there is too much bad blood between Jessie and Walt now, especially after the last episode.

    I don't want to see any reconciliation between the two, I don't think Walt deserves it.


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    #576
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Quixoticelixer wrote: »
    Of all the things that they have to answer in the finale, the back story with Gretchen and GM is very far down the list.

    Is it really though? The whole reason Walt did all this was money. They screwed him in some way that is for sure. There was a big deal made out of the relationship between Gretchen and Walt early on I can't see them not addressing it.


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    #577
    vitani
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,824 ✭✭✭vitani


    I thought the Grey Matter backstory was fairly obvious, no? Gretchen left Walt for Elliott - or started dating him after she and Walt broke up. He felt betrayed, decided to leave the company, got his $5000 and they went on to make billions. Do we need to know much more?


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    #578
    whitewave
    Registered Users Posts: 397 ✭✭whitewave


    Mr Freeze wrote: »
    Oh, I really don't see that happening. I think there is too much bad blood between Jessie and Walt now, especially after the last episode.

    I don't want to see any reconciliation between the two, I don't think Walt deserves it.

    Agreed, things have gone too far for them to reconcile. They might have had a chance of working things out...but the venom and hatred as Walt told him about Jane, and sent him off with the nazis, and the hurt in Jesse's eyes...no chance IMO.

    Cannot wait for next week, I keep changing my mind about what I think will happen!


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    #579
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,341 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Quixoticelixer wrote: »
    Of all the things that they have to answer in the finale, the back story with Gretchen and GM is very far down the list.

    I don't think so. I think what happened with Grey Matter is what made him Heisenberg, rather than the meth. It's what made him resentful and egotistical, and gave him his drive to keep making more and more money, even after he had enough. It was just a part of him that was lying dormant until the cancer and meth came along. I think it's been something that's been gnawing away inside of him for years. It's pretty central to why Walt became like he is. I don't think they need to spend too much time on it though, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it addressed in some shape or form.


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    #580
    Essien
    Registered Users Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭Essien


    Mousewar wrote: »
    Which category does Mike fall into?

    Mike's nine guys in prison were a threat to Walt, as long as they were allowed to live, they could incriminate him. He did kill Mike in a fit of rage so to speak, but either way, Mike had to die to protect Walt's interests as far as he was concerned. If Walt had killed them with Mike still alive, Mike would have became a direct threat.


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    #581
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    vitani wrote: »
    I thought the Grey Matter backstory was fairly obvious, no? Gretchen left Walt for Elliott - or started dating him after she and Walt broke up. He felt betrayed, decided to leave the company, got his $5000 and they went on to make billions. Do we need to know much more?

    So obvious that they never made it clear what exactly happened? Bringing them back in to the show with an episode to go has happened for a reason I can't see how they can't not be involved in the end in some shape or form. I think it will be something to do with the money side of things.


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    #582
    snausages
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,225 ✭✭✭snausages


    It was already explained pretty clearly during Walt's empire spiel last year.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DslPaayoB30


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    #583
    luketitz
    Registered Users Posts: 685 ✭✭✭luketitz


    IvaBigWun wrote: »
    Brilliant

    Someone took the time to "build" this as a usable character

    ku-xlarge.jpg


    As per one comment here - http://kotaku.com/you-can-play-gta-v-as-breaking-bads-heisenberg-basica-1335445084

    'Looks more like a nerdy Jason Statham' :D


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    #584
    murpho999
    Registered Users Posts: 28,441 ✭✭✭✭murpho999


    Essien wrote: »
    I'm not doubting that they were instrumental in making Walt the man he became, that's completely right. The problem is they've had almost no input throughout the course of the show, to introduce them as a target at this stage would be completely nonsensical.

    Now while it might satisfy some wishy washy sense of poetic justice for some viewers, the reality is it makes absolutely no sense in the context of the show. Not only the fact that they've been introduced so late in the game but they really haven't done anything wrong, ever.

    Has Walt/Heisenberg ever killed anyone who didn't pose some degree of a threat to the safety / livelihood of someone he cared about? He certainly hasn't killed anyone who was as far removed from his criminal activities as the Schwartz's are. They just don't fit the bill, it shouldn't happen and if it does it will be ridiculous.

    I think it's made Walt realise that if he dies now he lives behind a legacy being a just being a Meth cook and drug dealing criminal, and i don' think he wants that.

    I think the Grey Matter interview has acted as a instigator for him to do something to improve his name rather than the two people becoming targets. He doesn't kill people unless it furthers his cause.


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    #585
    Dman001
    Registered Users Posts: 5,534 ✭✭✭Dman001


    Padraig Mor wrote: »
    My highly improbable prediction for the finale:
    Walt knows from the GM interview and Jr's reaction that any hope of a legacy for Walter White is gone. A Heisenberg legacy is the only thing he has left, and now even that's being taken from him by the renewed blue meth production. He let GM take his work and profit from it (or so he believes); he's not going to let Jesse and the Nazis do the same. The ricin is to be put into a batch of meth, with the resulting mass sickness forever associating blue meth with substandard product - except when it was produced by Heisenberg, the producer of the best meth in history....
    Interesting theory, but I'm not sure if a mass exodus is in Walt's interest. I think the ricin will be used to get the Nazi's attention some way - possibly used on Todd or Lydia. It was emphasised again in this episode how Todd respects Walt still, so Walt will probably use this to his advantage.

    I reckon GM will only get another passing mention, possibly through conversation between Skylar and Walt. Maybe Walt opening up to Skylar as to why he has done what he has done, before a final farewell?? Or maybe even a flashback explaining why he left, a reason that ties in with the final showdown between Walt and the Nazis? I'm still not fully convinced GM deserves a spot in the finale, as we haven't seen it being an open arc in the last few seasons. I'll have to go back and rewatch Season 1 and 2 to see was there intentional mystery left around the reason why Walt left GM.


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    #586
    Essien
    Registered Users Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭Essien


    murpho999 wrote: »
    I think it's made Walt realise that if he dies now he lives behind a legacy being a just being a Meth cook and drug dealing criminal, and i don' think he wants that.

    I think the Grey Matter interview has acted as a instigator for him to do something to improve his name rather than the two people becoming targets. He doesn't kill people unless it furthers his cause.

    I agree, the GM comments were just a trigger, whatever he does next week was kicked off by those comments. That's clearly what made him go from turning himself in to doing whatever he's about to do. I just don;t think his new mission has anything to do with seeking revenge on 2 completely innocent people over a petty grievance.


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    #587
    Da Shins Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,048 ✭✭✭Da Shins Kelly


    If the final episode revolves around Walt taking revenge on Gretchen and Elliott, I'll be pretty disappointed. Yes, they are the reason he's bitter and resentful and egotistical, but Gray Matter has always simply acted as a trigger for Walt. It was the catalyst for the creation of the Heisenberg persona in the first place, and now it is acting as the catalyst for the resurrection of Heisenberg. A catalyst is all it is, and all it should be, in my opinion. It simply ignites an ambition in Walt.


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    #588
    cloudatlas
    Registered Users Posts: 3,709 ✭✭✭cloudatlas


    Da Shins Kelly wrote: »
    If the final episode revolves around Walt taking revenge on Gretchen and Elliott, I'll be pretty disappointed. Yes, they are the reason he's bitter and resentful and egotistical, but Gray Matter has always simply acted as a trigger for Walt. It was the catalyst for the creation of the Heisenberg persona in the first place, and now it is acting as the catalyst for the resurrection of Heisenberg. A catalyst is all it is, and all it should be, in my opinion. It simply ignites an ambition in Walt.

    Surely the cancer was the catalyst, impending death not wanting to become a burden on his family, as Gus said 'even if he isn't appreciated a man provides'. Walt walked out on Gretchen and he sold off his share in the company, we don't know exactly what went on but he walked away. The purpose of the Gray Matter story line was to show that Walt could have been good, successful and rich, Elliott and Gretchen offered him the chance to work with them again which is very revealing, if they had pushed Walt out why would they do that? His pride gets in the way and he decides to be bad successful and rich.


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    #589
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    cloudatlas wrote: »
    Elliott and Gretchen offered him the chance to work with them again which is very revealing, if they had pushed Walt out why would they do that? His pride gets in the way and he decides to be bad successful and rich.

    Yep, this is one of the reasons I think he has dirt on them. That and how much they wanted to help him when he was first diagnosed.


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    #590
    Dman001
    Registered Users Posts: 5,534 ✭✭✭Dman001


    Da Shins Kelly wrote: »
    If the final episode revolves around Walt taking revenge on Gretchen and Elliott, I'll be pretty disappointed. Yes, they are the reason he's bitter and resentful and egotistical, but Gray Matter has always simply acted as a trigger for Walt. It was the catalyst for the creation of the Heisenberg persona in the first place, and now it is acting as the catalyst for the resurrection of Heisenberg. A catalyst is all it is, and all it should be, in my opinion. It simply ignites an ambition in Walt.
    This is true. I think the whole thing with GM is viewers once again looking too much into the reason as to why we were presented with such a scene, much like Walt's phone call to Skylar last week when the cops were there listening. Some questioned as to why Walt spilled everything, and were there any other motives. It all credits back to the genius of the show though, we are never happy to accept the most obvious reasoning as we are so often wrong as the plot twists and turns. Sometimes the most obvious reasoning is the right one.


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    #591
    LizardKing82
    Closed Accounts Posts: 50 ✭✭LizardKing82


    This may already have been covered but my one reservation about last nights episode is this:

    How will Walt manage to evade capture by the cops? Surely he can't outrun them now they are aware of his approximate location


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    #592
    crazygeryy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,065 ✭✭✭crazygeryy


    A trivial little thing but what was the drink mr white ordered at the bar near the end? I can't make out what he said?


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    #593
    Mousewar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    LizardKing82 wrote: »
    This may already have been covered but my one reservation about last nights episode is this:

    How will Walt manage to evade capture by the cops? Surely he can't outrun them now they are aware of his approximate location

    He has hair now and different glasses. That'll totally gazump them. Another example of Heisenberg genius.


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    #594
    cloudatlas
    Registered Users Posts: 3,709 ✭✭✭cloudatlas


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Yep, this is one of the reasons I think he has dirt on them. That and how much they wanted to help him when he was first diagnosed.

    Perhaps, he sends information of bad practice to the press as a parting shot. I still think it was just a plot device to show that Walt didn't have to break bad to be successful, so the audience doesn't have an excuse - i.e. well how else would he have made the money etc.. Walt is obviously a genius who decided initially not to exploit his talent.


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    #595
    Padraig Mor
    Registered Users Posts: 9,543 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    We never got an explanation as to what happened with Walt and GM at the end. While Walt is obviously seriously resentful and thinks he was screwed over, I have my doubts he was. Way back (season 2?) when he met Gretchen in the cafe, she seemed genuinely shocked that that was how he thought. She says that she came back from a break and he was gone (or something very similar). This implies that (i) they were an 'official' item (their relationship wasn't hidden) and (ii) he didn't leave because she had an affair with Elliot (surely she would then have known why he left?). So why did he leave? We don't know. Maybe they were dishonest/fraudulent/whatever in their business/science back then and that's why he left. Maybe he'll reveal this somehow and GM will be screwed. I've even seen it suggested that GM is actually a counterpart to Madrigal - a front for drug smuggling. I doubt we will get this level of time devoted to it next episode, if at all - only thing I could imagine would be a brief revelatory camera set up at the end - a la lily of the valley at the end of season 4.


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    #596
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Forget Walt going balls to the wall on the Nazi compound with an M60, forget his desire to get some revenge for Hank, forget him getting some more screen time with Skyler and family, forget about the other $60m of his that the Nazis have, forget about one more dramatic scene with he and Jesse or he and Todd, forget Lydia...No, next week we are going to see Walt skulking around some upper-class Cali neighbourhood with the internal struggle of 'Do I use the Scarface gun or the horror poison on my 2 old unsuspecting friends who only publicly defended their company on TV?'

    That really would be the worst finale to a show I could remember in recent years.


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    #597
    cloudatlas
    Registered Users Posts: 3,709 ✭✭✭cloudatlas


    crazygeryy wrote: »
    A trivial little thing but what was the drink mr white ordered at the bar near the end? I can't make out what he said?

    Haig's 'Dimple'- Blended scotch whiskey, very pricey.


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    #598
    Padraig Mor
    Registered Users Posts: 9,543 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    crazygeryy wrote: »
    A trivial little thing but what was the drink mr white ordered at the bar near the end? I can't make out what he said?

    Thought this too. I mean, how far can he have gone? It was surely only minutes between his leaving and the cops arriving. I'm guessing he stole/bought a car and is going straight to ABQ.


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    #599
    Nerdlingr
    Registered Users Posts: 4,385 ✭✭✭Nerdlingr


    LizardKing82 wrote: »
    This may already have been covered but my one reservation about last nights episode is this:

    How will Walt manage to evade capture by the cops? Surely he can't outrun them now they are aware of his approximate location

    Was thinking that too. Two went in the front, two in the back. No way of outrunning them really. Talking to the bar staff they would know they're looking for some bearded guy with glasses walking around town with a box under his arm. Unless of course he ordered a taxi and got out of there a few minutes before they actually arrived :). Also, would the sheriff send 4 armed officers to a remote location in a different state to check up on an anonymous caller claiming to be walter white??


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    #600
    Neil McCauleys Cooler Brother
    Registered Users Posts: 167 ✭✭Neil McCauleys Cooler Brother


    If reports are to be believed, Walt Jr and Jesse are sharing a scene next week. How in the hell is that going to come about? I'm thinking, for the whole show to tie up all the loose ends and stuff going on, the Nazi compound scene will have to very early in the episode - maybe even the first one. Walt, now with Jesse (maybe voluntarily, maybe not) and Todd (he doesn't kill Todd...just yet), arranges a meeting with Lydia. Bye bye Lydia. And then all the stuff with Skyler, Walt Jr, Marie, and the DEA. Not to mention fleeting appearances by Badger, Skinny Pete. And, of course, Huell.


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    #601
    cloudatlas
    Registered Users Posts: 3,709 ✭✭✭cloudatlas


    Padraig Mor wrote: »
    I've even seen it suggested that GM is actually a counterpart to Madrigal - a front for drug smuggling.

    I thought that may be a possibility as well, perhaps Walt is sickened by their hypocrisy and Vince is leaving it till the very end for everything to come out in the wash 'ha ha you thought they were the good guys but no one remains untainted on this show!' except for Holly and Flynn. Would be a great twist :D


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