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Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2013/14

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Comments

  • #1262
    Paulegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,175 ✭✭✭Paulegend


    nothing stupid about it. it shows that brendan is building a team that doesnt rely on just one player


  • #1263
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,968 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    This thread is just desperate for a fight.


  • #1264
    Kirby
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,084 ✭✭✭✭Kirby


    jesus_thats_gre wrote: »
    Provide one single piece of factual evidence that shows that Rodgers is a superior manager to AVB.

    He can't. It's subjective opinion and isn't provable. Like most things in football.


  • #1265
    Mr Alan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    Paulegend wrote: »
    i think avb is a great manager but to say he is better than rodgers is purely speculative nonsense

    No it's not.

    Just to clarify, in addition to your earlier comment that Rodgers had built a great Liverpool team (even without Suarez)...are you also now saying that you think Rodgers is a great manager?


  • #1266
    Pedalstool
    Closed Accounts Posts: 805 ✭✭✭Pedalstool


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    I'd give AVB 8/10 and Rodgers 6/10.

    If Rodgers performance last season was 7/10, I'd be worried. Average/poor in the league, poor in all cup competitions. ****e summer transfer window, very good Jan window. 6/10 is more than fair I think.

    Spurs didn't make it past the 4th round of either cup, before going out to Basel in the quarter finals of the EL.

    In the league they finished with one more point than they did with Redknapp.

    I'd give AVB a 6/10.

    Rodgers I would give a 6/10 also, mostly based on the improvement of the team towards the end of the season.


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  • #1267
    NukaCola
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,983 ✭✭✭✭NukaCola


    This clears up, IMO, the BR vs AVB debate quite well....too long to quote

    AVB and Brendan Rodgers stats/approach/etc


  • #1268
    NukaCola
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,983 ✭✭✭✭NukaCola


    Pedalstool wrote: »
    Spurs didn't make it past the 4th round of either cup, before going out to Basel in the quarter finals of the EL.

    In the league they finished with one more point than they did with Redknapp.

    I'd give AVB a 6/10.

    Rodgers I would give a 6/10 also, mostly based on the improvement of the team towards the end of the season.

    Club record points haul last season....


  • #1269
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Rodgers isn't better than AvB as a manager.

    Just going by achievements alone tells you that.

    In the future he may be who knows, but currently no.


  • #1270
    Dont be at yourself
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,609 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    Kirby wrote: »
    Take your pick. Qualifying for the champions league twice in recent memory. The fact that one of those times Chelsea won it and they lost out is highly unlucky and doesn't change the fact that they got top 4. Plus they only missed out last season on the last day of the season and also due to a stellar run from Arsenal. They are also excellent in the transfer market.

    What have they won? Well, nothing yet but they are still a successfully run club.

    Ah, the North London definition of success.


  • #1271
    Paulegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,175 ✭✭✭Paulegend


    jesus_thats_gre wrote: »
    Provide one single piece of factual evidence that shows that Rodgers is a superior manager to AVB.

    im not saying that he is a better manager

    im saying that its premature to state that either is a better manager.

    they are both relativly new at their clubs and this year and maybe next we will see how their teams are forming. to say that avb is a better manager based purely on the Portuguese league is very simplistic.

    i think avb is a great manager but he hasnt actually done anything more than redknapp even though he walked into a team already competing for the top 4. where rodgers has had the clean up job of the management team before him


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  • #1272
    Mr Alan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    mike65 wrote: »
    This thread is just desperate for a fight.

    The thread, or a lot of people in it, is desperate to just be allowed bask in silly positively spun pro-Liverpool opinions & if anyone dares challenge the nonsense it all kicks off.

    It's a shame the thread has gone the route of delusional nonsense seemingly being preferred over informed, well thought out opinion.


  • #1273
    tap28
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 351 ✭✭tap28


    I like Rodgers and in the main I think he is doing a decent job and is very much constrained by FSG.

    However, as things stand at this moment AVB would have to be ahead, better or more successful manager than Rodgers.

    Taken from Wikipedis - In his one season with Porto "Villas-Boas went on to immense success with Porto, leading them to an undefeated season in the Primeira Liga - only the second time this had ever been achieved - and winning the title by more than 20 points, having conceded only 13 goals all season. Villas-Boas went on to follow up this success by leading Porto to win both the Portuguese Cup and the UEFA Europa League, thus completing a treble in his first season in charge. By doing so, Villas-Boas became the third-youngest coach ever to win the Primeira Liga and the youngest manager ever to win a European competition, at the age of 33 years and 213 days.

    Now I know it wasn't one of the big leagues or the champions league but they still took winning. It was a very impressive achievement.

    I like the style Rodgers is trying to bring in and in time I hope he far ahead of AVB but as of now he is not.


  • #1274
    Grayditch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,347 ✭✭✭✭Grayditch


    Paulegend wrote: »
    nothing stupid about it. it shows that brendan is building a team that doesnt rely on just one player

    Without Suarez, we'd have lost to Newcastle, City twice, Chelsea and more. You need to look more at his actual little legs pegging around the field, and less on numbers. Ask any defender in the league, would you rather defend against Liverpool with or without Suarez.

    Jesus why am I typing this?

    Rodgers: Last season, we based our team around his qualities.


  • #1275
    jesus_thats_gre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Kirby wrote: »
    He can't. It's subjective opinion and isn't provable. Like most things in football.

    Honours, win percentages, league table and relegations are factual. AVB wins on them all.

    It isn't black or white but note that this discussion spawned out of the assertion that those Liverpool fans who rate AVB higher than they do Rodgers only believe so in order to indirectly have a pop at Rodgers.

    AVB is, by most reasonable measures of success, a better, even slightly, manager than Rodgers. Not massively so but sufficiently so in order to dismiss the original dismissal.


  • #1276
    djPSB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭djPSB


    Lads calm the fook down and watch this. Should ease the stress levels.



  • #1277
    Pedalstool
    Closed Accounts Posts: 805 ✭✭✭Pedalstool


    jesus_thats_gre wrote: »
    Yup, his time at Porto is the leg up that I refer to. He had a leg up but it is very easy to bottle it at that level, even when you have the leg up. The fact that he exploited the leg up so effectively warrants respect.

    He had a major disadvantage at Chelsea in fairness and it didn't work out. For all the talk of how badly he handled it and him failing there, his win percentage is still higher than Rodgers is presently for Liverpool. Not proof that he is a better manager but puts the view of his time at Chelsea being a failure into perspective, no?

    I think that he has done well at Spurs, slightly better than Rodgers has done at Liverpool. Only slightly mind you - as reflected in win percentage.

    I have to admit to being slightly biased in my views though. I favour the conservative and controlled tactics that the likes of AVB, Jose and Rafa employ. I firmly believe that you can't realistically expect to consistently compete and predictably perform while first the defence isn't solid and second the spine of the team isn't solid. You may have picked up that fact based on my repeated posting on our need for a very good CB and DM to be added to the team.

    I believe that, only when you have the back line and spine are taking shape, should you start shifting your focus to the offensive and, in particular, the flare players. I posted a year ago that Rodgers seems far more focused on the offensive element of our play and that still seems to be the case - given the players being signed.

    To put it into context, it is for this same reason that I have less respect for Barca over the past few seasons than most would have. I fundamentally do not like the disregard they have for defensive responsibilities and took a little bit of pleasure recently when opposing teams figured out just how to exploit that.

    Edit: Forgot that Chelsea won the CL the season that AVB was at Chelsea - sacked half way through the campaign having secured qualification from the group stages. Note that the manager who took over and won the CL wasn't able to secure qualification out of the group the season after.

    Very well explained. I can see exactly where you're coming from.


  • #1278
    Paulegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,175 ✭✭✭Paulegend


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    No it's not.

    Just to clarify, in addition to your earlier comment that Rodgers had built a great Liverpool team (even without Suarez)...are you also now saying that you think Rodgers is a great manager?

    yes i think rodgers has been great. he has us playing football. will he be a success i dont know but he has done much better with both the media and the fans compared to managers before him. when he was at swansea they where praised for playing the "barca football" and where said to be playing better football than arsenal. now we are playing better football than the "pretty football" arsenal.

    as io said i dont know if he will win anything with us but so far he has been great


  • #1279
    googled eyes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,629 ✭✭✭googled eyes


    mike65 wrote: »
    This thread is just desperate for a fight.

    Seems like it.


  • #1280
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Kolo Toure on Luis Suarez:
    "It's no problem having Luis back. We love him"


  • #1281
    NukaCola
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,983 ✭✭✭✭NukaCola


    mike65 wrote: »
    This thread is just desperate for a fight.

    Thats fighting talk!!


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  • #1282
    jesus_thats_gre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Paulegend wrote: »
    yes i think rodgers has been great. he has us playing football. will he be a success i dont know but he has done much better with both the media and the fans compared to managers before him. when he was at swansea they where praised for playing the "barca football" and where said to be playing better football than arsenal. now we are playing better football than the "pretty football" arsenal.

    Going to avoid turning this into a black or white argument but this is all subjective nonsense.

    It might work out in 2/3 seasons time and goodness me do I hope it works out but I am terrified that it won't. I am as much worried by whether the owners will back Rodgers enough to fully enable his approach too.


  • #1283
    rob316
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,699 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    There's far too much praise for AVB and Spurs on here, Bale dragged them to within a point of 4th last season. I would strongly argue we have a better team without Suarez than they do without Bale. Creativity wise we are definitely better.

    I like Spurs, and the two players I'd take straight away are Dembele and Vertonghen. They would be some addition to this liverpool team.


  • #1284
    Mr Alan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    Paulegend wrote: »
    yes i think rodgers has been great. he has us playing football. will he be a success i dont know but he has done much better with both the media and the fans compared to managers before him. when he was at swansea they where praised for playing the "barca football" and where said to be playing better football than arsenal. now we are playing better football than the "pretty football" arsenal.

    as io said i dont know if he will win anything with us but so far he has been great

    The usual suspects will pull this up as absolute tripe. Most will ignore it as its positive delusion. That's the biggest issue with this thread IMO.

    A post like the above should be scoffed at by all.


  • #1285
    Pedalstool
    Closed Accounts Posts: 805 ✭✭✭Pedalstool


    jesus_thats_gre wrote: »
    Going to avoid turning this into a black or white argument but this is all subjective nonsense.

    It might work out in 2/3 seasons time and goodness me do I hope it works out but I am terrified that it won't. I am as much worried by whether the owners will back Rodgers enough to fully enable his approach too.

    If Liverpool sign Willian, does that put the issue to bed or do you think they should be doing more?


  • #1286
    jesus_thats_gre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    djPSB wrote: »
    Lads calm the fook down and watch this. Should ease the stress levels.


    Hmmm far too many parallels to be drawn there to be frank. Feel for the poor bollox to be honest. He is the product of placating and misleading fans.


  • #1287
    Paulegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,175 ✭✭✭Paulegend


    Grayditch wrote: »
    Without Suarez, we'd have lost to Newcastle, City twice, Chelsea and more. You need to look more at his actual little legs pegging around the field, and less on numbers. Ask any defender in the league, would you rather defend against Liverpool with or without Suarez.

    Jesus why am I typing this?

    Rodgers: Last season, we based our team around his qualities.

    so your naming chelsea and city in teams we lost to without suarez?????? champions league teams????? title challenging teams??? against liverpool who have finished well outside the top 4 in the last few years???

    when exactly did we play these so called games???


  • #1288
    MD1990
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,740 ✭✭✭✭MD1990


    rob316 wrote: »
    There's far too much praise for AVB and Spurs on here, Bale dragged them to within a point of 4th last season. I would strongly argue we have a better team without Suarez than they do without Bale. Creativity wise we are definitely better.

    I like Spurs, and the two players I'd take straight away are Dembele and Vertonghen. They would be some addition to this liverpool team.
    strongly agree
    every signing Spurs make alot of fans on here autmatocally think there great
    Spurs lack creativity & are poor at the back & Bale will be a massive loss


  • #1289
    Paulegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,175 ✭✭✭Paulegend


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    The usual suspects will pull this up as absolute tripe. Most will ignore it as its positive delusion. That's the biggest issue with this thread IMO.

    A post like the above should be scoffed at by all.

    yea becuase your negative talk is much better


  • #1290
    djPSB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭djPSB


    jesus_thats_gre wrote: »
    Hmmm far too many parallels to be drawn there to be frank. Feel for the poor bollox to be honest. He is the product of placating and misleading fans.

    If we keep Suarez and sign Willian, I don't think fans can have can have many complaints about this summers' business.


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  • #1291
    jesus_thats_gre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Pedalstool wrote: »
    If Liverpool sign Willian, does that put the issue to bed or do you think they should be doing more?

    30 plus million, yes, without doubt.

    15m or so, not overly. In the context of more players leaving than being signed or the wage bill continuing to be reduced, no.

    When we are spending 40/50/60m net, then it will be completely put to bed.


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