Airport Hopper - Maynooth-Dublin Airport new route

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 12:08PM

Con Logue wrote: »

Indeed. That's why I use the train. Still wouldn't use a round the houses bus route to the airport.

In terms of a service the train is worse! The poor location of the station (3km outside the town), the location of the terminus (Heuston, 2.3km from the city centre) and times (e.g. last train on Sunday 1855).

Bus Eireann 120/123 is the best option from Celbridge.

Victor · 19-06-2013 03:42PM

n97 mini wrote: »

And you know that for a fact do you?

I'm using the duck test - walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it is likely to be a duck. Why would it go near the city centre if it is an airport route and going via the city centre would likely nearly double the journey time.

When were you speaking to them?

E-mails exchanged:
03/10/2012
03/10/2012
Christmas 2012
14/02/2013
08/03/2013
08/03/2013
Easter 2013
17/06/2013
18/06/2013
19/06/2013

Mostly about the NTA journey planner, Christmas and Easter changes and a few suggestions on how to improve services and their website (I really don't like the text in pictures thing). These being 21 e-mails of perhaps 4,000-5,000 on bus issues since this time last year.

n97 mini wrote: »

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7

That is a perfectly reasonable point, but that is a different one to the market being targeted by this service. the question has to be asked, will people pay premium fares to get from Maynooth, Leixlip, Lucan, Palmerston, Ballyfermot to the city centre? I don't think they will.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form.

Personal travel patterns are useful for anecdotal and illustration purposes, but the bus operator needs to be able to make money, so anecdotes aren't enough..

I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

They aren't running any departures between 20:50 and 04:00.

notlongleft · 19-06-2013 03:50PM

Off topic but quick question as someone mentioned it - the 120/123 route does that drop off at O'Connell and is luas at Connolly and Heuston the only pick ups on way out of town? tks

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 04:18PM

Victor wrote: »

Personal travel patterns are useful for anecdotal and illustration purposes, but the bus operator needs to be able to make money, so anecdotes aren't enough..

Well, you are the one talking about ducks...

LXFlyer · 19-06-2013 04:19PM

notlongleft wrote: »

Off topic but quick question as someone mentioned it - the 120/123 route does that drop off at O'Connell and is luas at Connolly and Heuston the only pick ups on way out of town? tks

They pick up at Connolly LUAS stop, the bus stop beside the Ha'penny bridge at the start of Wellington Quay, Heuston Station and the stop adjacent to Liffey Valley Shopping Centre on the N4 just after crossing the M50.

LXFlyer · 19-06-2013 04:34PM

n97 mini wrote: »

Well, you are the one talking about ducks...

With respect you are the one that has turned what should be a good news story for all concerned (another direct link to/from the airport) to a rant about (let's be frank here) your personal grievances against the general bus service in west Dublin.

Given you have complained about the lack of a direct airport service in the past from Leixlip or Lucan, now when one is announced you have no good words to say about it but can only complain.

There is a significant difference between this service and Bus Eireann route 23. The Bus Eireann service has a dual purpose:
1) Linking the towns along the route from Ballina with Dublin City
2) Linking the towns along the route from Ballina with Dublin Airport.

They serve the Airport directly along the M50 at times when the Airport customer flow would be the main traffic flow, and operate to/from the airport via the city centre when the main flow is to/from the city.

The new service has nothing to do with the city centre - it is a direct express coach to/from the airport.

Funnily enough this service is not just for you, given you fly so infrequently. I'd imagine that the Intel site alone will have a reasonable traffic for such a service and I very much doubt they will want to go via the city centre to/from the airport. There are also several hotels en route which ought to generate traffic.

For once can you not find it within yourself to actually applaud someone for trying to provide people with a service, rather than immediately finding fault with it and condemning it to probable failure.

It's this sort of constant negativity that has this country in the situation we are in.

I would suggest starting a different thread on your issues with the bus service to/from west Dublin as that is frankly what you are complaining about, rather than hijacking a good news story about a new and long awaited bus service to/from Dublin Airport.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 04:36PM

Victor wrote: »

IWhy would it go near the city centre if it is an airport route and going via the city centre would likely nearly double the journey time.

How would it double the time when going by train to Drumcondra and then waiting for a bus takes so little longer than "direct"?

In fact going from Leixlip Confey via Drumcondra is quicker than going direct using Airport Hopper in a lot of cases.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 05:25PM

lxflyer wrote: »

With respect you are the one that has turned what should be a good news story for all concerned (another direct link to/from the airport) to a rant about (let's be frank here) your personal grievances against the general bus service in west Dublin..

I think you seem to be mistaking a news story for a good news story.

This provides a direct service to the airport that is little if any quicker that going via Drumcondra, and is probably more expensive.

With due respect I think you fail to recognise that more buses and a better service are not the same thing. This sort of thinking is the reason public transport is such a mess.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 05:27PM

lxflyer wrote: »

I'd imagine that the Intel site alone will have a reasonable traffic for such a service

Business travellers tend to get taxis as the company is paying. I'm sure Intel has an account with a local firm.

devnull · 19-06-2013 06:14PM

n97 mini wrote: »

I think you seem to be mistaking a news story for a good news story.

This provides a direct service to the airport that is little if any quicker that going via Drumcondra, and is probably more expensive.

But it is a direct service and a direct service involves getting one bus tends to be more reliable than a route which uses several modes which any link in the chain has a problem then you are very much screwed.

Bear in mind that the transport for Ireland site, whilst good bases stuff on theory. I would always prefer to get a direct service to the airport rather than getting a train, a short walk and then getting a bus, since it's less hassle, far less can go wrong and it avoids most of the worst traffic.

It's all very well saying it only takes 20 minutes more, but the real acid test is to take that route a few times and see if it works out like that in reality and if it is just worth the hassle of the increased stress.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 06:49PM

devnull wrote: »

It's all very well saying it only takes 20 minutes more,

For me it will probably be a bit slower than going via Drumcondra, which I have to say is no stress at all, as there is a very good selection of airport buses from outside the door of the station.

I will try it, but I would be surprised if it's still running in 3 years time.

LXFlyer · 19-06-2013 06:51PM

n97 mini wrote: »

I think you seem to be mistaking a news story for a good news story.

This provides a direct service to the airport that is little if any quicker that going via Drumcondra, and is probably more expensive.

With due respect I think you fail to recognise that more buses and a better service are not the same thing. This sort of thinking is the reason public transport is such a mess.

n97 mini wrote: »

Business travellers tend to get taxis as the company is paying. I'm sure Intel has an account with a local firm.

Again a totally negative approach. If we all were that negative then nothing would ever get done.

As for time taken - it depends on where you are coming from of course. You are only looking at it from your personal perspective in Captains Hill - which is fair enough given there is a big hill, but that doesn't apply to everybody along the route.

Having used the existing Airport Hopper in the mid-evening peak traffic conditions from Liffey Valley (Clarion Hotel forecourt) to the Airport on several occasions, it took no more than 20 minutes to do the trip, and that was with a loop around Liffey Valley. Add 18 minutes from Leixlip and another 12 from Maynooth, you are looking like at a realistic journey time of 50 minutes from Maynooth, 38 from Leixlip. There is also the fact that only one journey is being made rather than several if you use multi-mode.

Maybe it doesn't suit your personal individual needs (personally I suspect no transport provider ever will), but that is not necessarily the best way to critique a new service. There may well be plenty of people who it will suit.

L1011 · 19-06-2013 07:43PM

n97 mini wrote: »

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7, with the option of onward travel to the airport. I know I would, as aside from a taxi there is no other way to get to/from the city centre after 2330.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form. I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

I'd like to hear the opinion of others that live on this route too (MYOB)?

I'm fairly certain a 24/7 route to the city would be more viable than an airport-specific service also.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 08:03PM

lxflyer wrote: »

Again a totally negative approach. If we all were that negative then nothing would ever get done.

Again, wrong attitude. It's not about quantity it's about quality.

This service is not a significant improvement over existing arrangements in journey times, departure times, or price.

Rather than discuss it ad nauseum, how about we wait and see how it does.

devnull · 19-06-2013 08:32PM

No, it's a big improvement in convenience which is generally what airport express bus services are about.

LXFlyer · 19-06-2013 08:37PM

The point is you are bringing two completely different services into one discussion.

A 24/7 city service is nothing to do with Airport Hopper - that's a completely different service and business model and a totally different discussion to be had.

None of us living in Dublin have a 24/7 service to/from the city, but quite a few have direct routes to the airport (2 Aircoach, 2 Airport Hopper and 4 Dublin Bus), and more are needed. That is what this discussion should be about. City bus services per se are a totally different topic!

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 08:43PM

Victor wrote: »

Ex-Glenroyal Hotel Maynooth - every two hours 04:00-20:00

a-b.ie seems to think the first departure is at 0600, not 0400?

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 08:48PM

lxflyer wrote: »

The point is you are bringing two completely different services into one discussion.

No, you're misunderstanding. In my opinion this service is not a significant improvement over existing travel arrangements to the airport.

devnull · 19-06-2013 08:59PM

n97 mini wrote: »

No, you're misunderstanding. In my opinion this service is not a significant improvement over existing travel arrangements to the airport.

By that definition we should stop all airport routes and instead only run one bus from the city center that people connect to.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 09:03PM

devnull wrote: »

By that definition we should stop all airport routes and instead only run one bus from the city center that people connect to.

Despite the sarcasm there is a lot of logic to that! A bus network, rather than a heap of standalone routes.

markpb · 19-06-2013 09:09PM

n97 mini wrote: »

Despite the sarcasm there is a lot of logic to that! A bus network, rather than a heap of standalone routes.

It's been said already but it's worth repeating: when travelling to the airport, people prefer a single mode of transport. No changing buses, no swapping bags between buses, no dragging children along, no worrying that the second bus won't turn up. Airport transfers are not the same as regular city public transport.

Victor · 19-06-2013 09:14PM

n97 mini wrote: »

a-b.ie seems to think the first departure is at 0600, not 0400?

It won't show the 0400 from the Glenroyal to Dublin Airport as the Bus Éireann route 22 and 23 operate non-stop between those points. If you add a 'via', e.g. the Intel stop the 0400 will show.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 09:16PM

markpb wrote: »

It's been said already but it's worth repeating: when travelling to the airport, people prefer a single mode of transport. No changing buses, no swapping bags between buses, no dragging children along, no worrying that the second bus won't turn up. Airport transfers are not the same as regular city public transport.

I think it goes without saying that regardless of where people are going they would prefer not to change. The airport's not unique in that regard.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 09:18PM

Victor wrote: »

It won't show the 0400 from the Glenroyal to Dublin Airport

Why not?

Victor · 19-06-2013 09:24PM

n97 mini wrote: »

Why not?

Because the other bus is faster between those two points.

GCU Flexible Demeanour · 19-06-2013 09:42PM

A two hour gap between services seems too long. You could get to the Airport and back twice over while you were waiting. If it was every hour, it might get past some psychological barrier.

Still, best of luck to them with it.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 09:52PM

Victor wrote: »

Because the other bus is faster between those two points.

I didn't realise/forgot there was such direct competition for passengers in Maynooth.

LXFlyer · 19-06-2013 10:47PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

A two hour gap between services seems too long. You could get to the Airport and back twice over while you were waiting. If it was every hour, it might get past some psychological barrier.

Still, best of luck to them with it.

To be fair I don't think people going to the airport are going to show up on spec - they will go out for a specific bus.

Where you may have a point is on the return journey from the airport, where flight arrival times can vary, people may decide to get a taxi or take another public transport route home rather than wait for a lengthy period.

All that being said the Tallaght route operates every two hours and I can't imagine the service would not be expanded if that were not performing well.

LXFlyer · 19-06-2013 10:50PM

markpb wrote: »

It's been said already but it's worth repeating: when travelling to the airport, people prefer a single mode of transport. No changing buses, no swapping bags between buses, no dragging children along, no worrying that the second bus won't turn up. Airport transfers are not the same as regular city public transport.

Exactly - quite frankly people are not going to be extricated from their cars by being told that they can take a bus/train to town and another bus to the airport.

That simply will not work.

What is needed are more direct bus services to the airport - particularly from parts of the north side and north county Dublin.

n97 mini · 19-06-2013 10:57PM

lxflyer wrote: »

Exactly - quite frankly people are not going to be extricated from their cars by being told that they can take a bus/train to town and another bus to the airport.

Eh, airport car parking charges have ensured they will. Observe Drumcondra station any day of the week. You'd be safe in assuming those alighting with suitcases aren't heading for Quinns.

Airport Hopper - Maynooth-Dublin Airport new route

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