Airport Hopper - Maynooth-Dublin Airport new route

Victor

Richard Logue

Victor wrote: »

This sounds like a worthwhile service. However why do services have to have their own separate bus stops? All that does is unnecessarily increase the amount of street furniture.

Bus stops should be available for multiple operators. Surely Transport for Ireland should own and manage bus stops.

AlekSmart

Richard Logue wrote: »

This sounds like a worthwhile service. However why do services have to have their own separate bus stops? All that does is unnecessarily increase the amount of street furniture.

Bus stops should be available for multiple operators. Surely Transport for Ireland should own and manage bus stops.

Ireland does not do the ABC very well at all....we move directly to splitting the atom.

Can somebody please post up a picture of the Bus Stop forest of Westmoreland Street,an enchanted location,full of magic and .....???

n97 mini

I understand that the LA's insisted on sharing bus stops. For once, they did the right thing.

How did this come about, where they've their own bus stops? Was it DB, or was it the company themselves?

Losty Dublin

n97 mini wrote: »

I understand that the LA's insisted on sharing bus stops. For once, they did the right thing.

How did this come about, where they've their own bus stops? Was it DB, or was it the company themselves?

Local Gardaí and local authority's decide where stops go along with input from the carriers. If a stop is a busy one then one would expect the carrier to object to another company sharing it.

serfboard

Victor wrote: »

Interesting poster. One of the sentences doesn't end with an exclamation mark!

Moonbeam

brilliant:)I hope the service is regular.

LXFlyer

This will be a very welcome addition to the airport network.

AlekSmart

n97 mini wrote: »

I understand that the LA's insisted on sharing bus stops. For once, they did the right thing.

How did this come about, where they've their own bus stops? Was it DB, or was it the company themselves?

Remember,there is a distinction between a Bus Stop and a Bus Stop POLE.
The Stop,or Bay,usually marked is the fifedom of the Gardai,NTA,Local Authority or the G8.......The Pole however is at the Operators discretion....subject to planning

dowlingm

If things keep going like this the airport may turn into quite the bus hub for those who would rather avoid "An Lar".

Victor

Aircoach - Cork-Dublin Airport is route 704x
CityLink - Galway-Dublin Airport is route 760.
Airport Hopper - Maynooth-Liffey Valley-Dublin Airport is route 767.
Airport Hopper - Tallaght-Liffey Valley-Dublin Airport is route 777.

I detect an extended theme.

Moonbeam wrote: »

brilliant:)I hope the service is regular.

Ex-Glenroyal Hotel Maynooth - every two hours 04:00-20:00

Ex-Dublin Airport - 04:45, 06:45, then every two hours 08:50-20:50

Otherwise, use their Tallaght service to the Liffey Valley Footbridge and then the 66/67.

AlekSmart wrote: »

The Pole however is at the Operators discretion....subject to planning

Actually, if I remember correctly, a circular sign with the word "bus" is 'mandatory'.

n97 mini

Is there a licensing reason this doesn't serve the city centre?

joegriffinjnr

Is there a licensing reason this doesn't serve the city centre?

Why should it go anywhere near the city centre?

LXFlyer

n97 mini wrote: »

Is there a licensing reason this doesn't serve the city centre?

joegriffinjnr wrote: »

Why should it go anywhere near the city centre?

Could not agree more. Why would anyone living in Maynooth, Leixlip or Lucan want an Airport service to go via the city centre?

It's supposed to facilitate people going to/from the airport - hence the M50 is the most direct route.

n97 mini

lxflyer wrote: »

Could not agree more. Why would anyone living in Maynooth, Leixlip or Lucan want an Airport service to go via the city centre?

It's supposed to facilitate people going to/from the airport - hence the M50 is the most direct route.

That's not what I asked!

Again: is there a licensing reason why it does not (or can not) serve the city centre?

This thread is a follow on from the Ballina - Dublin Airport service which does serve the city centre.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

AlekSmart

n97 mini wrote: »

That's not what I asked!

Again: is there a licensing reason why it does not (or can not) serve the city centre?

This thread is a follow on from the Ballina - Dublin Airport service which does serve the city centre.

I'd suggest the operator has a finite amount of resources to allocate and this arrangement allows for the Tallaght/Maynooth services to be interworked ?

Victor

n97 mini wrote: »

That's not what I asked!

Again: is there a licensing reason why it does not (or can not) serve the city centre?

The operator bloody well doesn't want to go via the city centre. :rolleyes:

This thread is a follow on from the Ballina - Dublin Airport service which does serve the city centre.

Eh, not quite. that thread ran from 11-16 June. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056968642 but Airport Hopper didn't send out their pre-publicity e-mail until 17 June.

LXFlyer

n97 mini wrote: »

That's not what I asked!

Again: is there a licensing reason why it does not (or can not) serve the city centre?

This thread is a follow on from the Ballina - Dublin Airport service which does serve the city centre.

Because the licence holder applied for a direct airport service, having decided that was what they wanted.

They've no interest in serving the city centre - they want to serve the Airport DIRECTLY.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Is there a licencing reason why this doesn't serve Ratoath?

n97 mini

Victor wrote: »

The operator bloody well doesn't want to go via the city centre. :rolleyes:

And you know that for a fact do you? When were you speaking to them?

n97 mini

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

More than want to go to the airport, on a typical day.

It's great having an airport service and all that, but I'll only use it once a year, and even then I might not as it may be cheaper in a taxi if I'm travelling with the family.

If it went via city centre I would use it at least once a month as I'm in the city centre after Dublin Bus has stopped.

devnull

You may use it more if it goes through the city center, but the benefits of a quick and direct link would be lost which would have a big effect on demand for passengers for the airport since they may as well go and use a travel 90 and get two buses with DB to the airport.

It would also increase costs since you'd need more buses to run the timetable because of the extra end to end journey time, which would need an increase in fares.

The whole USP of the service is it is direct.

n97 mini

devnull wrote: »

You may use it more if it goes through the city center, but the benefits of a quick and direct link would be lost which would have a big effect on demand for passengers

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7, with the option of onward travel to the airport. I know I would, as aside from a taxi there is no other way to get to/from the city centre after 2330.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form. I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

I'd like to hear the opinion of others that live on this route too (MYOB)?

n97 mini

Victor wrote: »

Eh, not quite. that thread ran from 11-16 June. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056968642 but Airport Hopper didn't send out their pre-publicity e-mail until 17 June.

You brought Airport Hopper into that thread on post 15.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85073854&postcount=15

Con Logue

devnull wrote: »

You may use it more if it goes through the city center, but the benefits of a quick and direct link would be lost which would have a big effect on demand for passengers for the airport since they may as well go and use a travel 90 and get two buses with DB to the airport.

It would also increase costs since you'd need more buses to run the timetable because of the extra end to end journey time, which would need an increase in fares.

The whole USP of the service is it is direct.

I'm based in Celbridge and would use a direct Maynooth - Airport service but would never use a service that would go around the world for sport, ie a pointless journey via the City Centre. Dublin Bus' service from the Airport to and from Heuston is ridiculous enough as it stands.

devnull

n97 mini wrote: »

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7, with the option of onward travel to the airport. I know I would, as aside from a taxi there is no other way to get to/from the city centre after 2330.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form. I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

I'd like to hear the opinion of others that live on this route too (MYOB)?

It would make it a longer route, which would require more vehicles, more staff, and therefore need higher revenue and prices pushing the cost base up.

n97 mini

Con Logue wrote: »

I'm based in Celbridge and would use a direct Maynooth - Airport service but would never use a service that would go around the world for sport, ie a pointless journey via the City Centre. Dublin Bus' service from the Airport to and from Heuston is ridiculous enough as it stands.

Dublin Bus's service to Celbridge is woeful, and there is no point in comparing a direct city centre service to that.

AlekSmart

n97 mini wrote: »

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7, with the option of onward travel to the airport. I know I would, as aside from a taxi there is no other way to get to/from the city centre after 2330.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form. I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

I'd like to hear the opinion of others that live on this route too (MYOB)?

I think n97mini has a valid point,however,not in the context of the Airport Hopper service,which stands on its own merits.

The most valid issue is the lack of a 24 Hour core service on the Dublin Bus network.

With the company loudly declaiming it's precarious status,and apparently stuck in a rut which regards cutbacks,and conraction as the ONLY survival tactic,I see significant opportunities in offering expanded services (at an appropriate fare) to firstly establish then nurture a new Bus travel pattern.

One only has to look at the quite reasonable loadings on the first City Bound Luas from Tallaght each morning to get an idea of this demand.

I suggest that putting a regular,reliable and affordable 24 Hour core-route network in place would be a definite winner with the travelling public...however,when suggesting this,I usually wear protective equipment to ward off the responses !!!

Con Logue

n97 mini wrote: »

Dublin Bus's service to Celbridge is woeful, and there is no point in comparing a direct city centre service to that.

Indeed. That's why I use the train. Still wouldn't use a round the houses bus route to the airport.

n97 mini

Con Logue wrote: »

Indeed. That's why I use the train. Still wouldn't use a round the houses bus route to the airport.

In terms of a service the train is worse! The poor location of the station (3km outside the town), the location of the terminus (Heuston, 2.3km from the city centre) and times (e.g. last train on Sunday 1855).

Bus Eireann 120/123 is the best option from Celbridge.

Victor

n97 mini wrote: »

And you know that for a fact do you?

I'm using the duck test - walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it is likely to be a duck. Why would it go near the city centre if it is an airport route and going via the city centre would likely nearly double the journey time.

When were you speaking to them?

E-mails exchanged:
03/10/2012
03/10/2012
Christmas 2012
14/02/2013
08/03/2013
08/03/2013
Easter 2013
17/06/2013
18/06/2013
19/06/2013

Mostly about the NTA journey planner, Christmas and Easter changes and a few suggestions on how to improve services and their website (I really don't like the text in pictures thing). These being 21 e-mails of perhaps 4,000-5,000 on bus issues since this time last year.

n97 mini wrote: »

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7

That is a perfectly reasonable point, but that is a different one to the market being targeted by this service. the question has to be asked, will people pay premium fares to get from Maynooth, Leixlip, Lucan, Palmerston, Ballyfermot to the city centre? I don't think they will.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form.

Personal travel patterns are useful for anecdotal and illustration purposes, but the bus operator needs to be able to make money, so anecdotes aren't enough..

I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

They aren't running any departures between 20:50 and 04:00.

notlongleft

Off topic but quick question as someone mentioned it - the 120/123 route does that drop off at O'Connell and is luas at Connolly and Heuston the only pick ups on way out of town? tks

n97 mini

Victor wrote: »

Personal travel patterns are useful for anecdotal and illustration purposes, but the bus operator needs to be able to make money, so anecdotes aren't enough..

Well, you are the one talking about ducks...

LXFlyer

notlongleft wrote: »

Off topic but quick question as someone mentioned it - the 120/123 route does that drop off at O'Connell and is luas at Connolly and Heuston the only pick ups on way out of town? tks

They pick up at Connolly LUAS stop, the bus stop beside the Ha'penny bridge at the start of Wellington Quay, Heuston Station and the stop adjacent to Liffey Valley Shopping Centre on the N4 just after crossing the M50.

LXFlyer

n97 mini wrote: »

Well, you are the one talking about ducks...

With respect you are the one that has turned what should be a good news story for all concerned (another direct link to/from the airport) to a rant about (let's be frank here) your personal grievances against the general bus service in west Dublin.

Given you have complained about the lack of a direct airport service in the past from Leixlip or Lucan, now when one is announced you have no good words to say about it but can only complain.

There is a significant difference between this service and Bus Eireann route 23. The Bus Eireann service has a dual purpose:
1) Linking the towns along the route from Ballina with Dublin City
2) Linking the towns along the route from Ballina with Dublin Airport.

They serve the Airport directly along the M50 at times when the Airport customer flow would be the main traffic flow, and operate to/from the airport via the city centre when the main flow is to/from the city.

The new service has nothing to do with the city centre - it is a direct express coach to/from the airport.

Funnily enough this service is not just for you, given you fly so infrequently. I'd imagine that the Intel site alone will have a reasonable traffic for such a service and I very much doubt they will want to go via the city centre to/from the airport. There are also several hotels en route which ought to generate traffic.

For once can you not find it within yourself to actually applaud someone for trying to provide people with a service, rather than immediately finding fault with it and condemning it to probable failure.

It's this sort of constant negativity that has this country in the situation we are in.

I would suggest starting a different thread on your issues with the bus service to/from west Dublin as that is frankly what you are complaining about, rather than hijacking a good news story about a new and long awaited bus service to/from Dublin Airport.

n97 mini

Victor wrote: »

IWhy would it go near the city centre if it is an airport route and going via the city centre would likely nearly double the journey time.

How would it double the time when going by train to Drumcondra and then waiting for a bus takes so little longer than "direct"?



In fact going from Leixlip Confey via Drumcondra is quicker than going direct using Airport Hopper in a lot of cases.

n97 mini

lxflyer wrote: »

With respect you are the one that has turned what should be a good news story for all concerned (another direct link to/from the airport) to a rant about (let's be frank here) your personal grievances against the general bus service in west Dublin..

I think you seem to be mistaking a news story for a good news story.

This provides a direct service to the airport that is little if any quicker that going via Drumcondra, and is probably more expensive.

With due respect I think you fail to recognise that more buses and a better service are not the same thing. This sort of thinking is the reason public transport is such a mess.

n97 mini

lxflyer wrote: »

I'd imagine that the Intel site alone will have a reasonable traffic for such a service

Business travellers tend to get taxis as the company is paying. I'm sure Intel has an account with a local firm.

devnull

n97 mini wrote: »

I think you seem to be mistaking a news story for a good news story.

This provides a direct service to the airport that is little if any quicker that going via Drumcondra, and is probably more expensive.

But it is a direct service and a direct service involves getting one bus tends to be more reliable than a route which uses several modes which any link in the chain has a problem then you are very much screwed.

Bear in mind that the transport for Ireland site, whilst good bases stuff on theory. I would always prefer to get a direct service to the airport rather than getting a train, a short walk and then getting a bus, since it's less hassle, far less can go wrong and it avoids most of the worst traffic.

It's all very well saying it only takes 20 minutes more, but the real acid test is to take that route a few times and see if it works out like that in reality and if it is just worth the hassle of the increased stress.

n97 mini

devnull wrote: »

It's all very well saying it only takes 20 minutes more,

For me it will probably be a bit slower than going via Drumcondra, which I have to say is no stress at all, as there is a very good selection of airport buses from outside the door of the station.

I will try it, but I would be surprised if it's still running in 3 years time.

LXFlyer

n97 mini wrote: »

I think you seem to be mistaking a news story for a good news story.

This provides a direct service to the airport that is little if any quicker that going via Drumcondra, and is probably more expensive.

With due respect I think you fail to recognise that more buses and a better service are not the same thing. This sort of thinking is the reason public transport is such a mess.

n97 mini wrote: »

Business travellers tend to get taxis as the company is paying. I'm sure Intel has an account with a local firm.

Again a totally negative approach. If we all were that negative then nothing would ever get done.

As for time taken - it depends on where you are coming from of course. You are only looking at it from your personal perspective in Captains Hill - which is fair enough given there is a big hill, but that doesn't apply to everybody along the route.

Having used the existing Airport Hopper in the mid-evening peak traffic conditions from Liffey Valley (Clarion Hotel forecourt) to the Airport on several occasions, it took no more than 20 minutes to do the trip, and that was with a loop around Liffey Valley. Add 18 minutes from Leixlip and another 12 from Maynooth, you are looking like at a realistic journey time of 50 minutes from Maynooth, 38 from Leixlip. There is also the fact that only one journey is being made rather than several if you use multi-mode.

Maybe it doesn't suit your personal individual needs (personally I suspect no transport provider ever will), but that is not necessarily the best way to critique a new service. There may well be plenty of people who it will suit.

L1011

n97 mini wrote: »

Personally I think more people would prefer a quick, direct and cheap link to the city centre 24/7, with the option of onward travel to the airport. I know I would, as aside from a taxi there is no other way to get to/from the city centre after 2330.

Based on my own personal travel patterns (city centre at least once a week, airport one to four times a year) I can't see this service lasting in its current form. I think it would have better patronage if it served the city centre, on at least some services, even if it ran via the city centre from 2330 to 0600 only.

I'd like to hear the opinion of others that live on this route too (MYOB)?

I'm fairly certain a 24/7 route to the city would be more viable than an airport-specific service also.

n97 mini

lxflyer wrote: »

Again a totally negative approach. If we all were that negative then nothing would ever get done.

Again, wrong attitude. It's not about quantity it's about quality.

This service is not a significant improvement over existing arrangements in journey times, departure times, or price.

Rather than discuss it ad nauseum, how about we wait and see how it does.

devnull

No, it's a big improvement in convenience which is generally what airport express bus services are about.

LXFlyer

The point is you are bringing two completely different services into one discussion.

A 24/7 city service is nothing to do with Airport Hopper - that's a completely different service and business model and a totally different discussion to be had.

None of us living in Dublin have a 24/7 service to/from the city, but quite a few have direct routes to the airport (2 Aircoach, 2 Airport Hopper and 4 Dublin Bus), and more are needed. That is what this discussion should be about. City bus services per se are a totally different topic!

n97 mini

Victor wrote: »

Ex-Glenroyal Hotel Maynooth - every two hours 04:00-20:00

a-b.ie seems to think the first departure is at 0600, not 0400?

n97 mini

lxflyer wrote: »

The point is you are bringing two completely different services into one discussion.

No, you're misunderstanding. In my opinion this service is not a significant improvement over existing travel arrangements to the airport.

devnull

n97 mini wrote: »

No, you're misunderstanding. In my opinion this service is not a significant improvement over existing travel arrangements to the airport.

By that definition we should stop all airport routes and instead only run one bus from the city center that people connect to.

n97 mini

devnull wrote: »

By that definition we should stop all airport routes and instead only run one bus from the city center that people connect to.

Despite the sarcasm there is a lot of logic to that! A bus network, rather than a heap of standalone routes.