Raiders steal tanker from army barracks

Nodin · 27-05-2013 08:19PM

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

No, but I know the UEL and LEL for diesel, and shooting at a tanker of 20,000l of diesel won't make it explode.

What a shame they didn't have you on speed dial. One lad could have handed the other his rifle while he and you exchanged the info.

Fr_Dougal · 27-05-2013 08:20PM

Nodin wrote: »

What a shame they didn't have you on speed dial. One lad could have handed the other his rifle while he and you exchanged the info.

No, I would have pressed the big red button and made everything go burney.

humbert · 27-05-2013 08:26PM

I really thought that's something a soldier would know. Not necessarily the technical details but that a vehicle isn't going to explode if you shoot at it, even if you hit the fuel tank. (Not saying the should, just thought they would)

Markcheese · 27-05-2013 08:33PM

Who do you call to stop a loaded artic getting to the boarder, the Gardai( if they'd been called in time) would have only been able to follow them to the border... Would the army be authorised to follow them if they did have a few jeeps..

My name is URL · 27-05-2013 08:34PM

humbert wrote: »

I really thought that's something a soldier would know. Not necessarily the technical details but that a vehicle isn't going to explode if you shoot at it, even if you hit the fuel tank. (Not saying the should, just thought they would)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwh07fYNdCY

Wicklowrider · 27-05-2013 08:36PM

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

No, but I know the UEL and LEL for diesel, and shooting at a tanker of 20,000l of diesel won't make it explode.

While I do not claim to be an expert, I am an ex soldier and also an ex firefighter. I believe diesel ignites above 200 degrees F and a 5.56 "in flight" is about 500 degrees F?

I would hold my fire ( and I was never gun shy

)

Fr_Dougal · 27-05-2013 08:49PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

While I do not claim to be an expert, I am an ex soldier and also an ex firefighter. I believe diesel ignites above 200 degrees F and a 5.56 "in flight" is about 500 degrees F?

I would hold my fire ( and I was never gun shy )

Tricky to get 20,000 litres of the stuff to 200 degrees, the diesel would self extinguish.

gobnaitolunacy · 27-05-2013 08:51PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

While I do not claim to be an expert, I am an ex soldier and also an ex firefighter. I believe diesel ignites above 200 degrees F and a 5.56 "in flight" is about 500 degrees F?

I would hold my fire ( and I was never gun shy )

If a bullet won't cause a petrol tank to explode, its a pretty safe bet a fuel with a lower flash point won't go kablooey like the movies either...

http://dsc.discovery.com/tv-shows/mythbusters/mythbusters-database/shooting-gas-tank.htm

humbert · 27-05-2013 08:52PM

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Tricky to get 20,000 litres of the stuff to 200 degrees, the diesel would self extinguish.

And that's assuming you pumped sufficient oxygen into the tank beforehand to give combustion a chance.

Nodin · 27-05-2013 08:58PM

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Tricky to get 20,000 litres of the stuff to 200 degrees, the diesel would self extinguish.

And if it spills all over the road/the driver gets killed and the rig crashes...? It's a poxy truck - its not worth the grief.

Wicklowrider · 27-05-2013 09:10PM

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Tricky to get 20,000 litres of the stuff to 200 degrees, the diesel would self extinguish.

Yes.
In theory. I've had a lot of theories go awry in fires. And where would the rounds then end up?

Its over 30 years since I was in that barracks and I cannot recall if you could open fire at that gate without endangering locals. Rifle shots can easily pass through a lorry. A few gallons of diesel against someone's life? Let them take it. You can all be certain of one thing. If anyone fcuked up they are truly in deep trouble. This isn't like your job. There aren't written warnings. There are serious consequences including military prison and dismissal.

Nodin · 27-05-2013 09:13PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

Yes.
In theory. I've had a lot of theories go awry in fires. And where would the rounds then end up?

Its over 30 years since I was in that barracks and I cannot recall if you could open fire at that gate without endangering locals. Rifle shots can easily pass through a lorry. A few gallons of diesel against someone's life? Let them take it. You can all be certain of one thing. If anyone fcuked up they are truly in deep trouble. This isn't like your job. There aren't written warnings. There are serious consequences including military prison and dismissal.

And guilt, if ye killed some innocent.

oppenheimer1 · 27-05-2013 09:15PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

Yes.
In theory. I've had a lot of theories go awry in fires. And where would the rounds then end up?

Its over 30 years since I was in that barracks and I cannot recall if you could open fire at that gate without endangering locals. Rifle shots can easily pass through a lorry. A few gallons of diesel against someone's life? Let them take it. You can all be certain of one thing. If anyone fcuked up they are truly in deep trouble. This isn't like your job. There aren't written warnings. There are serious consequences including military prison and dismissal.

Theres no point in arming the soldiers in the barracks then if they cannot fire then.

humbert · 27-05-2013 09:26PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

There aren't written warnings. There are serious consequences including military prison and dismissal.

We have prison and dismissal too.

marknjb · 27-05-2013 09:44PM

sounds like something out of the A-TEAM

pablomakaveli · 27-05-2013 09:46PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Theres no point in arming the soldiers in the barracks then if they cannot fire then.

And what do they do if someone comes in armed and opens fire on them?

Mr.Crinklewood · 27-05-2013 09:48PM

JustAThought wrote: »

Succeeded !

How embarrassing for the army.

Might as well start Decommissioning now.

They'll be sueing due to the harm done by the embarassement.

Wicklowrider · 27-05-2013 09:49PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Theres no point in arming the soldiers in the barracks then if they cannot fire then.

Nobody said they cannot open fire.
I SPECIFIED that some diesel MAY not have been worth it.

Wicklowrider · 27-05-2013 09:56PM

humbert wrote: »

We have prison and dismissal too.

Just as a matter of interest, what would get you a prison sentence directly from your occupation?

humbert · 27-05-2013 10:06PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

Just as a matter of interest, what would get you a prison sentence directly from your occupation?

Since my personal occupation has nothing to do with this discussion let me offer some examples from normal private sector jobs. Any type of professional driver could go to prison as a result of a mistake or negligence, as could doctors, or even construction workers, if ,just for example, improperly erected scaffolding fell on top of members of the public.

Wicklowrider · 27-05-2013 10:19PM

humbert wrote: »

Since my personal occupation has nothing to do with this discussion let me offer some examples from normal private sector jobs. Any type of professional driver could go to prison as a result of a mistake or negligence, as could doctors, or even construction workers, if ,just for example, improperly erected scaffolding fell on top of members of the public.

When you said "We" I took it to include you.

I just googled those occupations you mention and can't find recent examples - the driving thing is stretching it as EVERYONE could get prison for careless/dangerous driving as we could for any law breaking. But I can assure you there are soldiers locked up tonight specifically for being negligent in their duty.

Fr_Dougal · 27-05-2013 10:25PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

But I can assure you there are soldiers locked up tonight specifically for being negligent in their duty.

Well then that's pretty bad, would expect them to get a bit of a bollocking but locked up is a bit much.

Crooked Jack · 27-05-2013 10:28PM

these diesel washers are a shower of bastards, they have the south armagh, north louth, monaghan countryside destroyed but i have to give it to them on this one, right or wrong that was a pretty ballsy stunt they pulled

humbert · 27-05-2013 10:33PM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

When you said "We" I took it to include you.

I just googled those occupations you mention and can't find recent examples - the driving thing is stretching it as EVERYONE could get prison for careless/dangerous driving as we could for any law breaking. But I can assure you there are soldiers locked up tonight specifically for being negligent in their duty.

You are indeed correct, we includes me but as I said, my personal circumstances have nothing to do with this discussion and I don't suffer from a macho need to makes this a personal mano a mano affair.

I too did a quick google and couldn't find any recent examples of soldiers being locked up for being negligent in their duty.

It's also worth mentioning that if private security personnel failed to notice a truck being stolen until it was crashing out through the gates they'd surely be sacked and I have a strong suspicion that many would sooner take a stint in incarceration (without the consequences of a lifelong criminal record) than the loss of a job.

TheDB · 27-05-2013 10:36PM

The Irish Defence Forces are a joke. They can't even defend their bases hahaha

Geekness1234 · 27-05-2013 10:38PM

In light of nomads in the Negev desert stealing serviceable IAF F-16 Engines from an active base,I think we got off lucky lads.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 28-05-2013 01:06AM

humbert wrote: »

It's also worth mentioning that if private security personnel failed to notice a truck being stolen until it was crashing out through the gates they'd surely be sacked and I have a strong suspicion that many would sooner take a stint in incarceration (without the consequences of a lifelong criminal record) than the loss of a job.

Over half a billion euro in retail stock stolen every year

Link.

with over half a billions euros (€512 million) of retail stock stolen every year.

And I doubt there was a security man sacked in all of that HALF A BILLION STOLEN, compared to what ~ thirty grand of laundered diesel, and some people here want someone SHOT!!.. Get real.

Cody Pomeray · 28-05-2013 01:11AM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

EVERYONE could get prison for careless/dangerous driving as we could for any law breaking.

That's... the point.

Maximus Attractive Whirlwind wrote: »

some people here want someone SHOT!!.. Get real.

oh god.
really?
who wants people shot?

28-05-2013 01:20AM

This thread has completely lost the real issue.

The nations defence forces were unable to defend their own military compound.

Serious question - what do you learn when you join the army?

TheDB · 28-05-2013 01:20AM

Wicklowrider wrote: »

Yes.
In theory. I've had a lot of theories go awry in fires. And where would the rounds then end up?

Its over 30 years since I was in that barracks and I cannot recall if you could open fire at that gate without endangering locals. Rifle shots can easily pass through a lorry. A few gallons of diesel against someone's life? Let them take it. You can all be certain of one thing. If anyone fcuked up they are truly in deep trouble. This isn't like your job. There aren't written warnings. There are serious consequences including military prison and dismissal.

What if the raiders broke into the armoury and stole the all the stored rifles and just drove through the gate. Would it be ok to shoot at them? The soldiers at this barracks really ****ed up. They should be court martialed and discharged.

Raiders steal tanker from army barracks

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