missing girls found alive

10-05-2013 03:27PM

In a tragic twist:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/cleveland-abduction-vic-gang-raped-jr-high-article-1.1339798

A year before her August 2002 disappearance, Knight was gang-raped while in junior high school and bore a child as a result of the ordeal, her great-aunt said Thursday. The boy, who she named Joey, was later taken from her and placed in foster care.

What that girl has endured thus far in her life is truly horrific.

GastroBoy · 10-05-2013 03:32PM

Haven't been following this on the news for a few days. Can someone tell me what happened to the other two brothers? Why are they just concentrating on this one guy now?

10-05-2013 03:33PM

GastroBoy wrote: »

Haven't been following this on the news for a few days. Can someone tell me what happened to the other two brothers? Why are they just concentrating on this one guy now?

The brothers have been released without charge after questioning.

GastroBoy · 10-05-2013 03:34PM

Candie wrote: »

The brothers have been released without charge after questioning.

I see, were they living in the house also? Crazy stuff!

10-05-2013 03:38PM

GastroBoy wrote: »

I see, were they living in the house also? Crazy stuff!

No, Castro was the only man living in the house. The girls had never been outside and were kept chained up in separate rooms for much of their ordeal.

The furthest the girls had been in the ten years was to the garage, briefly. The reports of three naked girls in dog collars are false, apparently. He seems to have acted alone.

Michelle seems to have borne the brunt of the brutality.

Allyall · 10-05-2013 03:40PM

GastroBoy wrote: »

I see, were they living in the house also? Crazy stuff!

No, they weren't living there. One brother was fined for Drunk & Disorderly from a year or two ago, and the other was charged with minor drug charges from years ago and they were quoshed.

Apoarently Ariel did it on his own.

refusetolose · 10-05-2013 03:42PM

GastroBoy wrote: »

I see, were they living in the house also? Crazy stuff!

no they weren't

Means Of Escape · 10-05-2013 03:42PM

SB2013 wrote: »

Kill him slowly? Why? Let him kill himself. World would be better off.

Agree. Calculate the cost of keeping him in jail over 10 years and give the money to the women to rebuild their lives.
Remove him permanently

iguana · 10-05-2013 03:47PM

Candie wrote: »

In a tragic twist:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/cleveland-abduction-vic-gang-raped-jr-high-article-1.1339798

What that girl has endured thus far in her life is truly horrific.

This is apparently why the police never took her disappearence seriously. According to her mother they suspected she'd left of her own accord because she blamed her mother for her losing custody of her son as the mother's then boyfriend injured him.

ilovesleep · 10-05-2013 03:50PM

me bolly wrote: »

Agree. Calculate the cost of keeping him in jail over 10 years and give the money to the women to rebuild their lives.
Remove him permanently

10 Years?

We're talking america here. Doubt they have the same legal system and punishments as here in Ireland where a man cheats reventue of tax on garlic gets 6 years and someone else doing a more serious crime, hurting another getting less in prison.

He'd get life in prison and over there life is life unlike us.

Calulate 40 years of keeping him in prison.

Means Of Escape · 10-05-2013 03:58PM

Allyall wrote: »

He'd be better off.

I think he should be made stay alive, in the same Hell he had those girls in, Every day waking up, knowing what's ahead of him, getting beaten, raped, then back to cell. Sleep or not.

Death is the easiest thing for him now, and he knows it.

TBH i don't care if he lives or dies, but if people want him punished for what he did, Keep him alive.
Also it may act as more of deterrent for others.
Many people that commit heinous crimes, often don't care if they die.
But knowing they'll be kept alive for the rest of their lives, in special made Hell, might make them think again.

Although Prison is no longer a Hell (In Ireland anyway). Some prefer being locked up then being outside..

Good old Charles Ng has taken up art , seeks pen pals and has improved his conditions through multiple court cases.
Death isn't easy for any of them and they will avoid it at all costs
Bundys offered to help in future murder cases that may arise in exchange for the death penalty
Paul Bernardo avoided the death penalty as it wasn't available in Canada.This idea of them being raped etc is nonsense
They are high profile prisoners and are removed from the general prison population
Ronald de feo the same , they live out their lives in jail and I'm certain if they were asked they prefer it than a plot in the local graveyard.
You only go around once
They show remorse only because they get caught and in most cases like Chandker have the attitude that " they can kiss my rosy red ass"( his quote)
They " convert " to Christianity to curry favour with the prison board and governor of their state.
People cannot forget the horror they inflict on their victims.

Allyall · 10-05-2013 03:59PM

Candie wrote: »

In a tragic twist:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/cleveland-abduction-vic-gang-raped-jr-high-article-1.1339798

What that girl has endured thus far in her life is truly horrific.

I was reading about her the other day. What seems really weird to me (And may seem like a horrible thing to say), is that it looks (to me) like the Mother is trying to leech off this story.

She is saying she never gave up, always used to fly back from Miami once a year to look for her, and did it all on her own. She gave the Police photographs of Michelle to post..

Police says they have no record of any photographs for posters on record.
Why didn't the Mother put posters around herself?
She thought she saw her daughter one day with a guy, and he pulled her away, so she ignored them..

Apparently the Mother was already estranged from her Daughter, and she is also estranged from her Son (Michelle's twin brother).

Link

Maureen Harper said cops were unable to contact Michelle's mother Barbara, to verify whether or not her daughter was still missing.

Harper said cops continued to work Knight's case, confirming with Barbara that her daughter was still missing through May 2003.
After that, cops were unable to reach the estranged mother by phone, with a detective noting Michelle's case "will remain invalid until new leads develop."
Missing adult advocate Kym Pasqualini said if Michelle's mom had called them for help "we would have had to say no" without an NCIC number to go with Knight's name.

Michelle is still in Hospital recovering.

Michelle was raped as a teen, became pregnant and lost the baby to social services just before she vanished in 2002. She was impregnated in the attack and had a child, which she then lost to state custody.

She wants hers Son back.

I wonder has he been given up for adoption.. I'd imagine so. It will be an interesting case, because surely they will have to give him back now?
She hasn't been able to fight for him for the last 11 years because she has been locked up..
Also be interesting to see if the three guys that gang raped her get imprisoned if they didn't already.

Means Of Escape · 10-05-2013 04:04PM

ilovesleep wrote: »

10 Years?

We're talking america here. Doubt they have the same legal system and punishments as here in Ireland where a man cheats reventue of tax on garlic gets 6 years and someone else doing a more serious crime, hurting another getting less in prison.

He'd get life in prison and over there life is life unlike us.

Calulate 40 years of keeping him in prison.

Factor in that he may pop his clogs after 10 being 52 years old
That would be a more accurate calculation than 40 years
Anything over 10 would be a bonus for the women

Allyall · 10-05-2013 04:12PM

Jaysus.. The Brother of Michelle Knight, says he didn't even know she was missing.

Woman held captive in Cleveland home rebuffs mother, grandmother

Neither Knight's grandmother nor her mother, who moved to Florida but flew back to Cleveland this week, have seen her.
"No, we haven't - on her request. She does not want to be seen by family," Deborah Knight, the grandmother, told Reuters.

During the women's captivity, CNN reported, their tormentor showed them televised coverage of vigils held by the Berry and DeJesus families, who have said they never gave up hope the girls would return home alive.
Knight's family did not hold vigils and her grandmother said they were certain Michelle Knight was dead.
"We didn't think we would see her again," Deborah Knight said.
Michelle Knight's mother filed a missing persons report after she disappeared.
Berry and DeJesus were welcomed home by cheering throngs of well-wishers and a crush of flowers, balloons and posters.
Now Deborah Knight's home is similarly festooned with balloons, flowers and stuffed animals in the hope that her granddaughter will move into the house.

Jaysus..
That's some beard on her Grandmother.. :eek:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/05/09/michelle-knight-cleveland-abduction/2149003/

10-05-2013 04:16PM

Allyall wrote: »

I wonder has he been given up for adoption.. I'd imagine so. It will be an interesting case, because surely they will have to give him back now?
She hasn't been able to fight for him for the last 11 years because she has been locked up..
Also be interesting to see if the three guys that gang raped her get imprisoned if they didn't already.

I hope that has very little impact on the decision.

I'd imagine it's the very opposite of the childs best interest that he's given back to a mother with a huge amount of recovery to do, after ten years plus with his adopted family.

Allyall · 10-05-2013 04:22PM

Candie wrote: »

I hope that has very little impact on the decision.

I'd imagine it's the very opposite of the childs best interest that he's given back to a mother with a huge amount of recovery to do, after ten years plus with his adopted family.

I'd imagine the public will be behind her. If the kid has been adopted. He could be with Foster Parents.
She wants him back. He was only just taken when she was abducted, some reports stating that he may have been as old as 4 when he was removed.
He'd probably remember her then.

Also, it's not likely that he would have been with an adoptive family for ten years even if he was adopted. Maybe 8 or less..

But more likely that he has been moved around from place to place.

Also, I don't get what you mean..

Candie wrote: »

I hope that has very little impact on the decision.

That she was unable to fight for him?

10-05-2013 04:30PM

Allyall wrote: »

Also, I don't get what you mean..

That she was unable to fight for him?

Whether or not she was able to fight for him is immaterial to what is in his best interests. That is the only consideration that should be taken.

It may not even be in her best interests to give her that amount of responsibility after such an ordeal.

What the child's circumstances are, we can only speculate on. If he is well, happy and cared for where he is, that is where he should remain.

It sounds harsh, but he was taken for a reason and he has another life that could be scarred forever if he's taken out of it and given back to the care of a stranger who is likely to struggle with demons for many years to come.

She seems to be greatly lacking in family support, which is the minimum she'd need to provide a stable environment in which to raise her son.

allym · 10-05-2013 04:37PM

Allyall wrote: »

That she was unable to fight for him?

I presume the poster means the whole her being in the spotlight now thing? As in she lost custody for a reason (I'm not sure what that was) and that child could well be living with his foster/adoptive family since then.
If the child's now 14ish, is it really in his best interests to be removed from his current living situation to be with someone who he doesn't know that well and probably thought was dead just because it's in the news?

I'd hope they'd let the child have the biggest say in what happens.

Allyall · 10-05-2013 04:52PM

Candie wrote: »

Whether or not she was able to fight for him is immaterial to what is in his best interests. That is the only consideration that should be taken.
It may not even be in her best interests to give her that amount of responsibility after such an ordeal.
What the child's circumstances are, we can only speculate on. If he is well, happy and cared for where he is, that is where he should remain.
It sounds harsh, but he was taken for a reason and he has another life that could be scarred forever if he's taken out of it and given back to the care of a stranger who is likely to struggle with demons for many years to come.
She seems to be greatly lacking in family support, which is the minimum she'd need to provide a stable environment in which to raise her son.

True. And what i meant about being unable to "fight" for him, was that she wasn't given time enough to sort her life out, and prove that she was able to be the Mother he deserved.

Many people turn their lives around when something as big as having their child removed from them happens.

Maybe some of the reasons were beyond her control, and she was looking at a better job and better living arrangements. Who knows.
But it seems that the child was the one thing on her mind when she was abducted, as all versions of her abduction time period, states it happened at the same time (give or take a couple of weeks).

Also the first thing on her mind now she's out. She won't (As you said) be in the right frame of mind to look after her child, but she may be stronger than we all think. She may be able to meet him, and over time help get both of their lives on some sort of track. It would be a shame if she wasn't even given the opportunity after everything she has gone through.

She has had 11 years to think about it, and I'd say there was little else on her mind at her darkest hours.

10-05-2013 04:57PM

Allyall wrote: »

True. And what i meant about being unable to "fight" for him, was that she wasn't given time enough to sort her life out, and prove that she was able to be the Mother he deserved.

Many people turn their lives around when something as big as having their child removed from them happens.

Maybe some of the reasons were beyond her control, and she was looking at a better job and better living arrangements. Who knows.
But it seems that, the child was the one thing on her mind when she was abducted, as all versions of her abduction time period, states it happened at the same time (give or take a couple of weeks).

Also the first thing on her mind now she's out. She won't (As you said) be in the right frame of mind to look after her child, but she may be stronger than we all think. She may be able to meet him, and over time help get both of their lives on some sort of track. It would be a shame if she wasn't even given the opportunity after everything she has gone through.

She has had 11 years to think about it, and I'd say there was little else on her mind at her darkest hours.

I have nothing but compassion for the poor woman, she's been through hell with her apparently useless family, a gang rape, early motherhood as a result of that rape, and then abduction, abuse, depravity and repeated miscarriages after calculated beatings and starvation. She has a very long road to walk down, and it must be incredibly lonely to know so few other people in the world can understand what you've been through.

You just couldn't put a 14 year old in that mix and expect a happy outcome, sadly. It would be making two victims instead of one.

I'm not sure meeting the son would be a great idea anyway. It might give her some comfort, but it would be a terrible burden for any teenager to know they were the product of rape, and all that this boys mum has been through.

Sadly, I don't see any happy ending with this one.:(

errlloyd · 11-05-2013 10:44PM

Bit of a weird interview with Charles Ramsey

Convicted of domestic violence himself, I guess he seems reformed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUUrvTf-qmM

syklops · 11-05-2013 11:40PM

errlloyd wrote: »

Bit of a weird interview with Charles Ramsey

Convicted of domestic violence himself, I guess he seems reformed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUUrvTf-qmM

You say 'himself', like this is a case of domestic abuse also.

Means Of Escape · 11-05-2013 11:46PM

syklops wrote: »

You say 'himself', like this is a case of domestic abuse also.

Castro knocked out his wife's teeth in the mid 90s
Guess he's referring to the similarity there .

Allyall · 12-05-2013 03:58PM

Christ. This Girl has been through proper hell. sounds like he was using her to vent his anger.

She was released from Hospital of Friday.

Kidnap victim Michelle Knight is deaf in one ear and will need facial reconstruction surgery after years of brutal beatings at the hands of her captor.
Michelle Knight, 32, was beaten so badly she requires facial reconstruction surgery

Knight is in the care of Gina DeJesus' family following her release from the hospital

Her mother Barbara Knight has hired a lawyer to try to get access to her daughter

Michelle has asked for privacy to get over her trauma

Said to be in good spirits and grateful for fund to help the victims

Her Mother has some bálls. Hiring a lawyer to be part of the "healing process".

This.. is just gonna lead to all sorts..

Several women said neighbors need to be wary of houses where "things don't seem right" and to call police with their suspicions.
One man in the crowd went a step further.
"And we should not be afraid to break the door down ourselves if we have to," he shouted, red-faced. "This can't happen again."

errlloyd · 12-05-2013 04:00PM

syklops wrote: »

You say 'himself', like this is a case of domestic abuse also.

No Ramsey was convicted of domestic violence at one point, I think said he'd reformed.

Allyall · 12-05-2013 04:14PM

Candie wrote: »

I hope that has very little impact on the decision.

I'd imagine it's the very opposite of the childs best interest that he's given back to a mother with a huge amount of recovery to do, after ten years plus with his adopted family.

Just realised what part in particular you highlighted there.

What i meant at that time was, that they will surely be pressured into reopening the her case.
And they probably will. Already petitions going around in Ohio.

They might agree with you, and they may try to dismiss her before interviewing her and seeing if she is capable or not etc..
(I would agree with you, in that it is VERY unlikely she would be a fully capable mother, but if it is her Son that has kept her alive this long, God knows what she would do if they wouldn't let her at least see him.)

I'd imagine they will try and fob her off for x amount of time (didn't something like that happen before in the 60's or 70's), But they may have to face the reality, that she only wants to see her Son.

13-05-2013 05:37PM

Allyall wrote: »

(I would agree with you, in that it is VERY unlikely she would be a fully capable mother, but if it is her Son that has kept her alive this long, God knows what she would do if they wouldn't let her at least see him.)

I'd imagine they will try and fob her off for x amount of time (didn't something like that happen before in the 60's or 70's), But they may have to face the reality, that she only wants to see her Son.

I know it sounds very hard, and I know the thought of her son is part of what kept her going, but those aren't good reasons to facilitate a meeting between them.

Her son is 14, and 14 year olds are both impressionable and vulnerable even if we think we know everything at that age

.

Putting the twin burdens on that lad of knowing what his mother has endured, and that he himself is the product of a rape, is bordering on unendurable - even for an adult, but is nothing short of cruelty for a teenage kid who's sense of adult identity is only just forming.

I think the situation should be limited to one victim, rather than making two. She should certainly be reassured that he's doing well and is healthy and happy (assuming that is the case), but any meeting should be postponed a few more years until that 14 year old is a young man with the maturity to cope with the reality of his background.

I feel heartless just typing that, but there's more at stake than that poor womans feelings, and I think it would possibly add to her burden if all that knowledge caused harm to her sons development.

biko · 13-05-2013 08:05PM

Hmm, apparently Ramsey wasn't the one to save the girls (first on scene).
Aurora Marti (75) was?
http://www.vg.no/nyheter/utenriks/artikkel.php?artid=10103158

Allyall · 13-05-2013 08:56PM

biko wrote: »

Hmm, apparently Ramsey wasn't the one to save the girls (first on scene).
Aurora Marti (75) was?
http://www.vg.no/nyheter/utenriks/artikkel.php?artid=10103158

There's a video a few pages back about another guy that said he was first on the scene. Guy couldn't speak English. Youngish.

Ha, it's mad they all come out when they realise how profitable it may be.

The woman who called for help said that her name was Amanda Berry. But I said to her, "No, you're not Amanda Berry, she has been dead many years." I thought simply not there. When the woman answered, "No, I'm Amanda Berry. I have been kidnapped for 10 years, I have been held captive in this house for 10 years." Then I realised the gravity of the situation, and that it was probably a dangerous situation, she says on her own quiet way.

Jus saw he's in that article. Angel Cordero

ilovesleep · 20-05-2013 09:44PM

There was a program on channel 5 (i think) earlier on this - Ohio Slave Girls or something like that it was called.

There were people from that particular neighbourhood talking and they had good things to say about Ariel Sh1tebag. I mean, probably and obviously not now before this revelation he was described as charming and helpful.

Cúntbag is a psychopath with two personalities. One for pretend to outsiders and another for his s1ck, twisted little pleasures.

missing girls found alive

Comments