Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

NY Times: More Children in Greece Start to Go Hungry

Options
2

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    WayneMolloy wrote: »
    Lets say parents spend 50 quid a month on their kids lunches. Deduct child benefit by 45, they get an extra fiver as disposable income - and the state then has a 40 euro budget to provide their kids with a nutritious meal every lunchtime. Saving the state a fiver per nipper, too. Stews, fruits, soups, salads and the like are pretty inexpensive as the ingredients can be bought in bulk. In rural areas the state can put the contract out to tender and local companies can ply for it.

    The figures are not precise. Only using them as an example.

    Sound great in theory but i guarantee you if hot lunches were provided they would be min €10 per child a week, kids don't need two dinners a day and most parents cook an evening meal.
    I would not pay for the school to provide a sandwich when it's just as easy for me to make it at home.
    My problem would be if they did provide hot meals children on welfare would get it free while other kids are left out or parents have to pay.


  • Options
    #33
    conorhal
    Registered Users Posts: 6,986 ✭✭✭conorhal


    Seaneh wrote: »
    In ecuador every kid in primary school is given a cereal bar/biscuit/thing and a box of fortified juice (juice with added vitimins and dairy proteins/fats think like that dawn drink from a few years back?) when the arrive at school, the bar is designed to expand in their tummies and keep them feeling full for longer and it's a slow release energy so it keeps them awake during school, hungry kids find it hard to concentrate and stay awake and the initial sugar hit of the juice box gets them going for the day, giving them this small meal keeps them going until lunch time. From talking to teachers in ecuador pupil performance and attendance is drastically improved since the system was implemented and far more students are going on to 2nd and 3rd level and as a result the countries economy in improving because of a more skilled workforce.


    How hard would it be to implement something similar here in Europe?

    I think we can finally call EU integration a failed experiment once it has to start putting it's citizens on friggin' plumpy-nut....


  • Options
    #34
    southsiderosie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,565 ✭✭✭southsiderosie


    HondaSami wrote: »
    My problem would be if they did provide hot meals children on welfare would get it free while other kids are left out or parents have to pay.

    Isn't this the point?


  • Options
    #35
    WayneMolloy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 713 ✭✭✭WayneMolloy


    HondaSami wrote: »
    Are they nutritious really, always seemed like hospital food to me. I think children are better getting nutritious meals at home.

    Hospital food, by default, is very nutritious but unpalatable. The food is unseasoned as its sole aim is to get you better.

    Long term patients view salt sachets like prisoners view cigarettes.


  • Options
    #36
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    southsiderosie wrote: »
    Isn't this the point?

    Yes but what about families who are working but on low incomes, they would be pressured into paying for school meals.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    clairefontaine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,390 ✭✭✭clairefontaine


    southsiderosie wrote: »
    Kids don't need a hot lunch - a sandwich, a piece of fruit, and a carton of milk in a brown paper bag would be enough to make a difference.

    Have you ever ordered a sandwich in Ireland? It's two pieces of bread with A slice of cheese or A slice of ham with butter or mayonnaise.

    Far far far away from Katz deli.

    I get what you are saying though.


  • Options
    #38
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    conorhal wrote: »
    I think we can finally call EU integration a failed experiment once it has to start putting it's citizens on friggin' plumpy-nut....

    That's not exactly the same thing, now is it?

    It need not be on an EU level, but the reality is that poverty exists in the EU and in every state at that. Making sure kids at risk of going hungry don't, is something that should be considered because as I stated above, hungry kids don't perform in school, which means they don't progress and in the long run end up on welfare and costing the state a lot of money.

    Kids who are fed are kids who are attentive and alert and learn far better and therefore have a higher chance to going on to 3rd level, getting an education which will lead to a skilled job and contributing to the economy in a positive manner.

    It's not rocket science.


  • Options
    #39
    WayneMolloy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 713 ✭✭✭WayneMolloy


    HondaSami wrote: »
    Yes but what about families who are working but on low incomes, they would be pressured into paying for school meals.

    Every child gets a free lunch and then deduct child benefit payments accordingly.

    Not a fan of nanny state policies, but too many parents use the payment to fund their own lifestyle choices and not on their children.


  • Options
    #40
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    HondaSami wrote: »
    My problem would be if they did provide hot meals children on welfare would get it free while other kids are left out or parents have to pay.

    Well obviously you can opt out of the scheme. The issue thats being addressed is the kids whose parents for what ever reason, don't feed them in the morning or the evening get something in school.


  • Options
    #41
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    clairefontaine wrote: »
    Have you ever ordered a sandwich in Ireland? It's two pieces of bread with A slice of cheese or A slice of ham with butter or mayonnaise.

    Far far far away from Katz deli.

    I get what you are saying though.

    Two pieces of bread, a slice of ham and a slice of cheese when paired with an apple/banana/pear/orange is a pretty decent fecking meal, in fairness. Plenty of carbohydrate, plenty of protein and plenty of fibre. It's not the "best" meal in the world but it's far from the worst.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    WayneMolloy wrote: »
    Every child gets a free lunch and then deduct child benefit payments accordingly.

    Not a fan of nanny state policies, but too many parents use the payment to fund their own lifestyle choices and not on their children.

    So parents have no choice in the matter, how's that going to work? if my kids don't like what's provided i pay anyway and provide my own lunch for them?

    I agree some parents might use the CB for different things but not all parents do and not all parents should be treated the same.


  • Options
    #43
    WayneMolloy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 713 ✭✭✭WayneMolloy


    Seaneh wrote: »
    That's not exactly the same thing, now is it?

    It need not be on an EU level, but the reality is that poverty exists in the EU and in every state at that. Making sure kids at risk of going hungry don't, is something that should be considered because as I stated above, hungry kids don't perform in school, which means they don't progress and in the long run end up on welfare and costing the state a lot of money.

    Kids who are fed are kids who are attentive and alert and learn far better and therefore have a higher chance to going on to 3rd level, getting an education which will lead to a skilled job and contributing to the economy in a positive manner.

    It's not rocket science.

    Many former eastern bloc but now EU countries provide kids with both breakfast and lunch in the schools. The facilities available to school children in these so called 'poor' countries put ours to shame. We could learn a lot from them, in this regard.


  • Options
    #44
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    davet82 wrote: »
    yeah but they still have sunshine and swimming pools, the little feckers

    And space for trampolines...


  • Options
    #45
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    syklops wrote: »
    Well obviously you can opt out of the scheme. The issue thats being addressed is the kids whose parents for what ever reason, don't feed them in the morning or the evening get something in school.

    Don't feed them? is this can't be arsed or cannot afford to feed them?
    Parents who neglect their kids should be taken to task imo, not feeding them is neglect.


  • Options
    #46
    WayneMolloy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 713 ✭✭✭WayneMolloy


    HondaSami wrote: »
    So parents have no choice in the matter, how's that going to work? if my kids don't like what's provided i pay anyway and provide my own lunch for them?

    I agree some parents might use the CB for different things but not all parents do and not all parents should be treated the same.

    A large pot of stew, soup, few cold cuts of sandwich meat, veggies, breads and some lettuce would be pretty cheap and cater to most childrens tastes. Parents would not lose money, as its one less expense they would have to cater for. In fact, if done properly and not used as a vehicle to enrich a select few - both the state and the parents could save themselves money and no child goes hungry.


  • Options
    #47
    ArmaniJeanss
    Registered Users Posts: 13,313 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    southsiderosie wrote: »
    What I cannot buy is the idea that children anywhere in Europe should be going hungry in school. This is a disgrace. At a minimum, the EU should be somewhat engaged in food security issues among member states: for example, given how much the EU spends in agricultural subsidies, it does not seem unreasonable that some of that food should be redirected to ensure that children get at least one decent meal during the school day.

    When the Irish government, via an EU scheme to address food 'mountains', gave free blocks of cheese out they were very much condemned and laughed at (Its jobs and money we need not cheese etc)

    I don't know if the Greeks would have the same attitude if their government came up with a few hundred container loads of Danish ham and Austrian schitnzel.

    Sometimes 'charity' can be taken in a very negative way.


  • Options
    #48
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    HondaSami wrote: »
    Don't feed them? is this can't be arsed or cannot afford to feed them?
    Parents who neglect their kids should be taken to task imo, not feeding them is neglect.

    Did you even read the article? Both. Neither. What does it matter? The point is its happening for 22% of school children in Greece and for a similar number in Ireland.


  • Options
    #49
    Gyalist
    Registered Users Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭Gyalist


    My son's school serves a 3-course lunch at €6 and at my daughters old school it is about the same.

    What always surprises me is the amount of primary school children I see having their breakfast in McDonalds.


  • Options
    #50
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users Posts: 33,080 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    southsiderosie wrote: »
    I can buy the argument that Greece has dug itself into this hole with its numbers-fudging and out of control government spending.

    I can buy the argument that many European countries need to make painful labor market reforms.

    What I cannot buy is the idea that children anywhere in Europe should be going hungry in school. This is a disgrace. At a minimum, the EU should be somewhat engaged in food security issues among member states: for example, given how much the EU spends in agricultural subsidies, it does not seem unreasonable that some of that food should be redirected to ensure that children get at least one decent meal during the school day. And whatever other cuts that the ECB/IMF call for, there should be some minimum standard for cutting social service programs: school lunches are relatively cheap in the greater scheme of things, especially when you consider the negative effect that hunger has on learning.

    Modern politics is about caring for the voters. Children don't vote. Ergo...

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Options
    #51
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    WayneMolloy wrote: »
    A large pot of stew, soup, few cold cuts of sandwich meat, veggies, breads and some lettuce would be pretty cheap and cater to most childrens tastes. Parents would not lose money, as its one less expense they would have to cater for. In fact, if done properly and not used as a vehicle to enrich a select few - both the state and the parents could save themselves money and no child goes hungry.

    The parents have to eat and a meal is still cooked in the evening, kids will eat another dinner, parents will be paying on the double.
    I think a family meal is important, it's when everyone sits down in the evening to talk about the day.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    WayneMolloy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 713 ✭✭✭WayneMolloy


    Gyalist wrote: »
    My son's school serves a 3-course lunch at €6 and at my daughters old school it is about the same.

    What always surprises me is the amount of primary school children I see having their breakfast in McDonalds.

    That menu looks more appetising than most cafe and bar menus in Ireland.

    Not too shabby at all.


  • Options
    #53
    mikom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    southsiderosie wrote: »

    What I cannot buy is the idea that children anywhere in Europe should be going hungry in school.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrexhus-8kw


  • Options
    #54
    southsiderosie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,565 ✭✭✭southsiderosie


    HondaSami wrote: »
    The parents have to eat and a meal is still cooked in the evening, kids will eat another dinner, parents will be paying on the double.
    I think a family meal is important, it's when everyone sits down in the evening to talk about the day.

    Are you just making up things to argue about now? The issue here is that there are kids who aren't getting family meals. In many of these cases, the parents aren't eating much either - did you miss the part in the article where the father mentions that taking a nap is a good 'cure' for feeling dizzy from hunger?


  • Options
    #55
    WayneMolloy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 713 ✭✭✭WayneMolloy


    HondaSami wrote: »
    The parents have to eat and a meal is still cooked in the evening, kids will eat another dinner, parents will be paying on the double.
    I think a family meal is important, it's when everyone sits down in the evening to talk about the day.

    To f*ck with this. I'm out.


  • Options
    #56
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    southsiderosie wrote: »
    Are you just making up things to argue about now? The issue here is that there are kids who aren't getting family meals. In many of these cases, the parents aren't eating much either - did you miss the part in the article where the father mentions that taking a nap is a good 'cure' for feeling dizzy from hunger?

    Was it you who asked was there school meals in Ireland? the conversation turned to school meals.


  • Options
    #57
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    HondaSami wrote: »
    The parents have to eat and a meal is still cooked in the evening, kids will eat another dinner, parents will be paying on the double.
    I think a family meal is important, it's when everyone sits down in the evening to talk about the day.

    They wouldn't be eating "another dinner".

    At hot meal at lunch time isn't a dinner, it's still lunch!


  • Options
    #58
    lazygal
    Registered Users Posts: 12,644 ✭✭✭✭lazygal


    Seaneh wrote: »
    They wouldn't be eating "another dinner".

    At hot meal at lunch time isn't a dinner, it's still lunch!

    It's a dinner in some parts of the country. Then you have your tea at dinner time. Or something.


  • Options
    #59
    HondaSami
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,713 ✭✭✭HondaSami


    Seaneh wrote: »
    They wouldn't be eating "another dinner".

    At hot meal at lunch time isn't a dinner, it's still lunch!

    Depends on what you eat, if you eat a sandwich it's lunch if you eat meat veg potato it's dinner imo


  • Options
    #60
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    HondaSami wrote: »
    Depends on what you eat, if you eat a sandwich it's lunch if you eat meat veg potato it's dinner imo

    No.

    Just no.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #61
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    lazygal wrote: »
    It's a dinner in some parts of the country. Then you have your tea at dinner time. Or something.

    This comes from an agricultural background where you'd be out in the fields and working by 6am and come home by 2pm for your main meal, they still had 2 meals before that, a breakfast before leaving the house and sandwich or something later in the morning. They ate at 2pm, but that was near the end of their day and it was their main meal.


    Having a hot lunch isn't the same as having dinner. It's a smaller portion, it's not designed to get you through to bed time.


Advertisement