In college in project my team refused to do anything, my counter measures too harsh?

Lone Stone · 13-04-2013 01:45AM

I had a group project once to make a short animated film, it went awfull like anything that could have went wrong went wrong, people didnt do the work people got pissed off. It started out well we all pitched in and worked on the idea, took in some guy who had no group a week in, one guy i lived with did feck all two lads tried their best but they just werent really up to it due to work outside of college etc,I ended up doing most of it myself was insanely stressed out over it we had like four weeks it was crap the worst in the class.

It went so bad we got really good marks you know because group projects arent all about what your making its about a learning experience of how you work with people and how you tried to resolve the problems and not so much about the what we were making.

You sound really bossy and over bearing, do you know if people have the same time to put into this that you do ? did they get any say in the project ? because people arent exactly enthusiastic to work on an idea that they had no part in especially students was it the same type of code they all used before is was it some type that you were use to ? Was it a group project or your project with people working on it. Because it sounds like it was your project.

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 01:54AM

Lone Stone wrote: »

I had a group project once to make a short animated film, it went awfull like anything that could have went wrong went wrong, people didnt do the work people got pissed off. It started out well we all pitched in and worked on the idea, took in some guy who had no group a week in, one guy i lived with did feck all two lads tried their best but they just werent really up to it due to work outside of college etc,I ended up doing most of it myself was insanely stressed out over it we had like four weeks it was crap the worst in the class.

It went so bad we got really good marks you know because group projects arent all about what your making its about a learning experience of how you work with people and how you tried to resolve the problems and not so much about the what we were making.

You sound really bossy and over bearing, do you know if people have the same time to put into this that you do ? did they get any say in the project ? because people arent exactly enthusiastic to work on an idea that they had no part in especially students was it the same type of code they all used before is was it some type that you were use to ? Was it a group project or your project with people working on it. Because it sounds like it was your project.

It was one of our group members idea, which was developed after first class we did brainstorming and came up with different ideas. Then since none of us had any clue about Android platform developing and those guys know I was really good with learning codes and adopting to new environments quickly so I offered them to learn android while I develop a mainframe from which each of them can work on.

Calhoun · 13-04-2013 03:23AM

arleitiss wrote: »

And yes I was following their progress over these 4 months, apparently it always ended up with: "I didn't know how to do it, I am doing it, I am reading it, it's gone, it didn't work or I don't know...", it got to the point where I wrote to someone on facebook and the guy read message but ignored me, I told one other team member that other team member ignored me and he was surprised because he knows we have to do project. That sub-lecturer told me to treat this project as real thing, that's why this module is called "project", we weren't thaught any kind of programming for it or anything, it was literally given task and thrown into a pit to sort out stuff ourselves. We've been set deadlines for things and that's it. Lecturer said we will write reflection (about other team members) how they worked or how they didn't work, and lecturer said that if project does not complete on time team leader is to take blame and will lose marks while the rest of team will have a bit higher marks.

So really? People are saying I should back off and just sit there and wait? Sounds like quite a crap plan to be honest.

And by the way, all team members have vote and right to change project however they want, if someone has idea - great, we use it always, if 3 out of 4 people don't like specific thing in project we remove it (for example, we removed our crappy logo that we had at start and we agreed we need new logo now and loading screen to be implemented), but the thing is that usually it's 1 person who does their own bit and starts to vote out parts of their bit just to avoid doing something.

Guess it's all my fault for choosing them all without knowing them well.

Sorry OP but i can't help but giggle a little when i read your posts, not to sound condescending but the human drama and immaturity/lack of experience is funny. Your post reminds me of past experiences and how i might have acted back then.

First, i piece of wisdom that was given to me when i started on the road of project management work is that the hardest job of a project manager is to motivate people who you don't manage to complete a collective goal. You can't force them to do the work for you, so you need to use all your people skills to influence them to work with you.

Second, i disagree that they haven't taught you anything for this task it looks like it is doing exactly what it should which is teach how to work in a team. I don't want to burst your bubble but your a long way off being a project manager your people skills definitely seem to be lacking, dont confuse good individual task management with project management work which is team based in nature.

Third, you really don't come off well in this one, you claim that there is voting mechanisms in place ect and the team is run like a democracy but from your original post you basically describe everything been driven by you. You also describe that there was another PM but you took over, if your posts here are anything to go by i would guess that the team have lost complete confidence in you.

I would also guess that you are coming across as a dictator to them and they in turn are using avoidance rather than having to deal with you. This in turn will probably leading them to uniting against the common torn in their side yourself and will lead to some interesting reflections. I wonder would your team mates view you like this?

Group Member 4 (me): 19 years old, I love programming and I love getting as high scores in tests and projects as possible especially when project is really simple one.

No? i didn't think so, you have two weeks to turn this around what do you do? You could dig your head in the sand further and blame everyone else but the reality of the situation is the PM job that you took over comes with responsibility, regardless of what the others did you are in charge of delivering on time and you are in charge of uniting the team to do this. As you havent done this you run risk of not completing the task.

Alternatively you could start giving this task the respect that it deserves as you have found out team dynamics are anything but simple. Look inward to reflect on how you could do better as a team lead and what it would take from you to motivate the others to complete on time.

I hope this helps, i do think these thoughts are at the back of your head otherwise you wouldnt have posted here. Good luck and hopefully you get a good grade.

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 03:56AM

Calhoun wrote: »

Sorry OP but i can't help but giggle a little when i read your posts, not to sound condescending but the human drama and immaturity/lack of experience is funny. Your post reminds me of past experiences and how i might have acted back then.

First, i piece of wisdom that was given to me when i started on the road of project management work is that the hardest job of a project manager is to motivate people who you don't manage to complete a collective goal. You can't force them to do the work for you, so you need to use all your people skills to influence them to work with you.

Second, i disagree that they haven't taught you anything for this task it looks like it is doing exactly what it should which is teach how to work in a team. I don't want to burst your bubble but your a long way off being a project manager your people skills definitely seem to be lacking, dont confuse good individual task management with project management work which is team based in nature.

Third, you really don't come off well in this one, you claim that there is voting mechanisms in place ect and the team is run like a democracy but from your original post you basically describe everything been driven by you. You also describe that there was another PM but you took over, if your posts here are anything to go by i would guess that the team have lost complete confidence in you.

I would also guess that you are coming across as a dictator to them and they in turn are using avoidance rather than having to deal with you. This in turn will probably leading them to uniting against the common torn in their side yourself and will lead to some interesting reflections. I wonder would your team mates view you like this?

Group Member 4 (me): 19 years old, I love programming and I love getting as high scores in tests and projects as possible especially when project is really simple one.

No? i didn't think so, you have two weeks to turn this around what do you do? You could dig your head in the sand further and blame everyone else but the reality of the situation is the PM job that you took over comes with responsibility, regardless of what the others did you are in charge of delivering on time and you are in charge of uniting the team to do this. As you havent done this you run risk of not completing the task.

Alternatively you could start giving this task the respect that it deserves as you have found out team dynamics are anything but simple. Look inward to reflect on how you could do better as a team lead and what it would take from you to motivate the others to complete on time.

I hope this helps, i do think these thoughts are at the back of your head otherwise you wouldnt have posted here. Good luck and hopefully you get a good grade.

Never said I am becoming PM straight off college, in fact no body does after getting just bachelors degree, it's kind of silly to say that I have somewhere wrote something like: "Once I get my degree, I am becoming PM" obviously not nor I see place where you read I am.

Secondly: Yes maybe my team is willing to do things, maybe they want to do them, but I have this feeling they are simply just as to say... technically unable to do them. As much of study they tried doing, they are taking risk of being expelled over plagiarism rather than learning, android platform is a good bit to learn (in case you aren't familiar with it), as much as I tried helping and pretty much teaching them (I have skill to explain and give lessons of individual things, I was accepted and working in first semester as one of those sub-lecturers (pretty much helping lecturer during labs and answering peoples questions and I am getting more hours in semester 1 in next academic year). I tried a lot but that simply didn't work, either they simply don't want to do it or they just can't .

I am staying back every day for 3-4 hours after college I am helping 4 other groups with their project, I love programming so I don't mind helping my good friends who are in other groups. I have asked my team to stay back lots of times, they always had excuses.

I know it's all my own fault for choosing such....as to say: incompetent team members.

I might go the way some people suggested... use seperate branch to finish all their bits, then if they don't finish them, merge them with main project and write reflections as they are.

Guess I will just do as most suggested: completely leave them alone, I am sure that will pretty much stall/stop any progress but well at least they wont' feel any pressure if their main priority is to not do anything and lose marks - let it be so.

Thanks for suggestions.

Calhoun · 13-04-2013 05:58AM

arleitiss wrote: »

Never said I am becoming PM straight off college, in fact no body does after getting just bachelors degree, it's kind of silly to say that I have somewhere wrote something like: "Once I get my degree, I am becoming PM" obviously not nor I see place where you read I am.

Secondly: Yes maybe my team is willing to do things, maybe they want to do them, but I have this feeling they are simply just as to say... technically unable to do them. As much of study they tried doing, they are taking risk of being expelled over plagiarism rather than learning, android platform is a good bit to learn (in case you aren't familiar with it), as much as I tried helping and pretty much teaching them (I have skill to explain and give lessons of individual things, I was accepted and working in first semester as one of those sub-lecturers (pretty much helping lecturer during labs and answering peoples questions and I am getting more hours in semester 1 in next academic year). I tried a lot but that simply didn't work, either they simply don't want to do it or they just can't .

I am staying back every day for 3-4 hours after college I am helping 4 other groups with their project, I love programming so I don't mind helping my good friends who are in other groups. I have asked my team to stay back lots of times, they always had excuses.

I know it's all my own fault for choosing such....as to say: incompetent team members.

I might go the way some people suggested... use seperate branch to finish all their bits, then if they don't finish them, merge them with main project and write reflections as they are.

Guess I will just do as most suggested: completely leave them alone, I am sure that will pretty much stall/stop any progress but well at least they wont' feel any pressure if their main priority is to not do anything and lose marks - let it be so.

Thanks for suggestions.

Stop being petty, the advice i gave was relevant no matter when you became a PM, now or in 10 years and is actually more geared for interpersonal skills than anything else.

On your second point, have you thought that maybe they dont want your help? You come across as someone who has a very big ego, is condescending and is judgmental. Answer me this if someone came to you and advised that they would teach them how would you take it? Your there peer you can offer support but they dont have to take it and from how you describe them i wouldnt take your help either.

I am staying back every day for 3-4 hours after college I am helping 4 other groups with their project, I love programming so I don't mind helping my good friends who are in other groups. I have asked my team to stay back lots of times, they always had excuses.

Bigger the fool the spends his time doing other peoples work and not his own

, i'm sure your friends love your help as they get free support without having to deal with you as their PM. I would hazard a guess they inflate the ego a little bit, its what i would do have you eating out of me hand and doing what i wanted (sound like they have good influencing skills. Meanwhile why you busy yourself your real job is falling apart.

I know it's all my own fault for choosing such....as to say: incompetent team members.

If thats all you feel you have learned you have got nothing from this exercise, i feel from what you have said that your fault is that you inserted yourself into a role of people management and you do not have the skillset to get the job done. You really should have met as a team and nominated one of the others to do it so you could focus more on singular tasks which you are better at.

I would be very careful of the reflections, one of the other things you will learn about team dynamics is how a negative contributor to a team can unite the remaining members. If i was in their shoes and i knew there was no way back i would be hanging this on your head but you don't really want to get into this situation.

What you need to do is realize that you either win together or you sink together, the team that looks good in this situation is the one that overcame diversity and incompatibility to deliver something on time as a team. The team that looks bad is the team that delivers something but poisons any achievement with tit for tat right ups/reviews.

Last point is your only 19 allot of what i said above and allot of what others said you have already discounted, you will eventually get to a position where we see more eye to eye as you will have experience and matured. You can make the next few years a little bit easier on yourself by taking some of the advice in this thread.

13-04-2013 08:16AM

arleitiss wrote: »

I know it's all my own fault for choosing such....as to say: incompetent team members.

arleitiss wrote: »

Guess it's all my fault for choosing them all without knowing them well.

The majority of the posts here are trying to tell you different and you're refusing to listen. They're not incompetent. They're lazy, at most, but realistically I'd say they're just people who have been driven demented by you and no longer want to stay in contact about the project or put much effort into it. Again: because of you.

I'm finishing up 4th year now. I've done group work many times, and yes, there's usually someone in the group who doesn't pull their weight as much as you want them to. On a few occassions the majority of the group didn't pull their weight as much as the rest of the team wanted them to. Once, I had to stay up all night, working till 8am the next day (hand in was at 9) on a project I had finished 2 weeks beforehand, because the person who was meant to put all the different parts together fell through, and every other member only handed their part in at 12 the previous night, one of whom I spent half the night chasing for references, and it turned out he'd plagairised the lot, which I had to then redo. So I get what it's like to want more from your team and not get it.

But these people you're with, they're NOT incompetent. They're exasperated about the project because they have an absolute nightmare PM.

Systemic Risk · 13-04-2013 09:00AM

true-or-false wrote: »

The majority of the posts here are trying to tell you different and you're refusing to listen. They're not incompetent. They're lazy, at most, but realistically I'd say they're just people who have been driven demented by you and no longer want to stay in contact about the project or put much effort into it. Again: because of you.

I'm finishing up 4th year now. I've done group work many times, and yes, there's usually someone in the group who doesn't pull their weight as much as you want them to. On a few occassions the majority of the group didn't pull their weight as much as the rest of the team wanted them to. Once, I had to stay up all night, working till 8am the next day (hand in was at 9) on a project I had finished 2 weeks beforehand, because the person who was meant to put all the different parts together fell through, and every other member only handed their part in at 12 the previous night, one of whom I spent half the night chasing for references, and it turned out he'd plagairised the lot, which I had to then redo. So I get what it's like to want more from your team and not get it.

But these people you're with, they're NOT incompetent. They're exasperated about the project because they have an absolute nightmare PM.

This Op is the problem. You are probably demotivating the team. I would have been very dilligent when it came to college projects and quite often would have assumed a leadership role. However if i was in your group i would have definitely rebelled.....i would have probably done it differently than your group and had a mutiny to oust you as PM but i can see why they are avoiding staying in to work late with you.

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 09:13AM

If many say "rebelled", "disliked", "demotivated" and so on...

Another question appears: Why the hell do they not say anything? I said that they should write if they think it's fair or not, I asked their opinions, I always ask their opinions on my parts, they never say anything.

So far from all advices only solution I've seen is: ease off and let project sink/fail and lose marks.

Is there any perhaps other suggestion of actually how to make it to be finished on time?

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 09:20AM

Also for part where people said I am pretty much stupid for helping others:
What's bad explaining and helping out friends you have and who helped you before in maths and business modules in first year where I could've failed?

I don't get some of the community, on one hand people are saying I shouldn't be an asshole who forces team and should sit back and leave everyone alone, and on another hand I should be a complete dick to other people in course? - seriously , I don't get this logic. Explain please?

woodchuck · 13-04-2013 09:24AM

OP the message just doesn't seem to be sinking in for you. I think virtually everyone on this thread has agreed that YOU are the problem. It sounds like your interpersonal skills are seriously lacking and that is an absolutely vital part of project management. It doesn't matter how good you are at doing and delegating tasks; if you can't manage people then it's all pointless.

Unless you're willing to eat some humble pie (which I highly doubt from the tone of your posts) then I'd leave well enough alone here. If you to contact them about anything it should just to be to pull the final bits of the project together in the final week. But to be honest from the way you've treated them up until now it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't do their bit purely out of spite.

It sounds like you have enough to pass at this stage so I would just try to accept a lower mark than you're used to and view this as a life lesson. What should you have learned? You're terrible at managing people. The next time there is a group project make sure you are NOT the project manager. You could seriously benefit from seeing how someone else handles the situation. They might not be the best at it, but to be honest I don't see how their people skills could be any worse than yours. You need to learn how to work within a team before you try to lead one.

If project management is something you're really serious about pursuing down the line then it's your interpersonal skills you need to work on. Hopefully this will come somewhat naturally with time and experience, but you really need to accept your own limitations in this area in order to try and improve yourself.

woodchuck · 13-04-2013 09:39AM

arleitiss wrote: »

Another question appears: Why the hell do they not say anything? I said that they should write if they think it's fair or not, I asked their opinions, I always ask their opinions on my parts, they never say anything.

They obviously don't see you as an approachable person. It all feeds into the poor interpersonal skills. If you had good interpersonal skills they'd be much more likely to pipe up with any questions/suggestions/concerns etc. I'm no expert at this myself, but I'm sure there are courses/workshops (or even online material) to advise on the best way to deal with people. It's little things like how the question is phrased, tone of voice and body language that make all the difference.

arleitiss wrote: »

Also for part where people said I am pretty much stupid for helping others:
What's bad explaining and helping out friends you have and who helped you before in maths and business modules in first year where I could've failed?

I don't get some of the community, on one hand people are saying I shouldn't be an asshole who forces team and should sit back and leave everyone alone, and on another hand I should be a complete dick to other people in course? - seriously , I don't get this logic. Explain please?

I don't think think it's bad to help out other people in your course (although they may be taking advantage of you...), but there is a big difference between doing a favour for someone who wants your help vs managing a team.

Lawliet · 13-04-2013 09:45AM

arleitiss wrote: »

So far from all advices only solution I've seen is: ease off and let project sink/fail and lose marks.

Is there any perhaps other suggestion of actually how to make it to be finished on time?

You can't make it be finished on time, bar by doing it yourself. Such is group work. You can drag a horse to water and all that. The reason you're being told to ease off is because you've been so over-bearing about this project for months, and it didn't work. So you became even worse. Everyone is telling you that that's not going to work either, but you won't listen. You need to back off and stop treating your classmates like your incompetent employees. It might not get the project done, but it'll improve the atmosphere and people are a lot more willing to meet you half way when you're not breathing down their neck giving orders.

Neyite · 13-04-2013 10:02AM

arleitiss wrote: »

Also for part where people said I am pretty much stupid for helping others:
What's bad explaining and helping out friends you have and who helped you before in maths and business modules in first year where I could've failed?

Its not "bad". Its just unwise when you are up against deadlines, to focus your attentions elsewhere. Posters are trying to point out to you that the very people you are trying to help will leave you high and dry when you need the help to meet a deadline.
Working on other peoples work at the expense of your own projects = pushover.
Working on other peoples work after you have done what is necessary on your own projects = helpful and friendly.

wrote:

I don't get some of the community, on one hand people are saying I shouldn't be an asshole who forces team and should sit back and leave everyone alone, and on another hand I should be a complete dick to other people in course? - seriously , I don't get this logic. Explain please?

Why do you feel that your only choices are either being a dick or being an asshole? You can be nice, but still firm and get your point across. And I think that maybe you were either/or with your team, and thats why it didn't go well.

OP, you are a perfectionist, and a high achiever. This is great, and employers will love it. BUT, they also have to see the big picture. They want to make stuff to sell at a profit. They dont want to divert their energies to sorting out staff squabbles because one team member likes to plan ahead and do their work in a timely manner and another is a "last minute" kind of person. In a real world situation, (and this is what people here are trying to explain to you) you are LESS of an ideal employee than the team members you are disparaging, because you come across as intolerant of their work methods if they are not like yours.

Essentially, your team dont take college as seriously as you. They dont CARE about getting top marks in this. They just want to scrape a pass. And it sounds like it will. They are looking at the big picture, and thinking "this is second year, next year and the year after will be all business and hard work, now is the time to coast a little".

I'm sorry to say, it wont change much after graduation. The difference is that you will be working on projects with your Supervisor, or your Managing Director who will leave you hanging. How are you going to handle that when it happens? You cant give them deadlines, or complain about them to the client. So what do you do? All you can do is fulfil your part of the task, document your tasks for proof that you did all that you were supposed to do, and pitch in at the last minute to tie up the loose ends, regardless of who let the team down.

This is what I suggest you do now. Clearly document your input, prepare the final elements of the project that are critical in case your team members dont deliver, be professional when discussing your project, (imagine its a client) be tactful and accept the pass mark.

imitation · 13-04-2013 10:08AM

I think the comments are a little unfair on the op, perhaps college flashbacks for some ? You can trot out people skills as an excuse for the others behaviour but the real problem is the gulf in commitment levels between the others and op. Not too suprising as it's second year college. At the end of the day though this is the purpose of group projects, some real world experience, just like a real project people will go at different speeds. That lecturer was wrong to say treat it like the real world, in the real world you can motivate up to certain point and then call he. You can't do this, best you can do is a plea. Setting iron clad goals or 6 page targets will make you look like a loon and still won't get you an A, but may lead to a miserable remainder of college. I think it's obvious to the lecturers what's happening so I'd just do what you can in reason and move on.

Solair · 13-04-2013 10:15AM

Did you ever stop to consider that maybe they can't do it?
The idea of a project is that it's a learning experience, not a bunch of tasks to be divided up and worked on your own.

You're in 2nd year computer science, maybe building an android app is actually way too complicated a task?

If you're that keen on doing it, you really need to pool your knowledge and help each other. All you've done is attempt to break the task up and then get angry because people can't do it.
They've actually said they can't do it, yet you're still pushing it ?!!

In a company, you'd start to see people resigning and going on sick leave if you tried that!

Did the lecturer set the project or did you pick it yourself(s)?

You should probably check what the actual requirements are as to me that sounds beyond the abilities of a 2nd year CS student. Maybe if you all work as a group it might be doable, but not on your own like that!

I've done plenty of projects over my time in college and they were always enjoyable. We literally worked together as a team around one big desk figuring stuff out.

I think you're going about this all wrong.

1) Read/discuss the requirements and set yourselves an achievable task not something that's worthy of a final year / postgraduate project ! It only has to hit the targets requires not show off.

2) work as a proper team! You may have better programming skills than your teammates. If so, help them out! That's what team work is about.
Someone else may be better concentrating on the write up, designing the UI or whatever. Skills vary !
Your task as a project manager is to get the best out of people. You sound like you're trying to compete with them.

emuhead · 13-04-2013 10:25AM

OP, something you may want to bear in mind is that your team mates could well be working in the same area in the future. Yes, you are only on the degree with them for 2 years more, but your interpersonal relationships with the team (and probably the class, as I'm sure they are talking to the rest of the class about this) could well have a bigger impact on your career than a top grade for a 2nd year project.

Personal recommendations go a long way in any industry. Rightly, or wrongly, the people on your team could well be in a position to recommend you for a job in the future. I understand that you want a high grade for this project, but I would recommend chalking this down to experience and trying to sit down at the end and calmly ask for feedback from your team on your role. If you can take this on board it will go a long way towards improving your project manager skills and showing that you have learned from this experience.

I've been on projects where people don't pull their weight and it's frustrating, but as other posters have pointed out, it does continue to postgrad and after (on the job), so team skills are just as important as technical skills.

Best of luck

Big Bag of Chips · 13-04-2013 10:31AM

To answer your question... Yes, your counter measures are too harsh.

Even though you were well intentioned, you handled this terribly, and rather than pulling your team together and encouraging/helping them, what you have actually done is pushed them away where they are afraid to work with you.

You love programming, you love learning new languages... Not everyone on a CS Degree Course feels the same. People straight out of secondary school pick college courses for all sorts of reasons.

The one lesson you need to take from this project is that not everyone shares your love for programming and application development... And that oftentimes being a project manager needs more than being good at delegating tasks, and drawing up timetables, deadlines and rules.

You're in 2nd year. You have another 2 years college, and about 15 years working before you'll 'get it'... Life experience is a great educator.

username123 · 13-04-2013 10:34AM

Whats the consequence if the others dont pull their weight? You do it anyway.

So, they dont like how you are running the show and know if they do nothing you'll still get them the marks.

You really set yourself up for this, dont be surprised if no one does anything from here to the end.

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 10:49AM

Alright, to brief my assignment in college here I've literally downloaded PSD file with module description and uploaded it:
The description outlines all the requirements,, one of outcomes is to learn to meet strict (keyword) deadlines and others are to learn to work in a team. It briefly states project leader requirements and role.

-snip-

I've asked nicely people to stay back or come to class before, never worked probably because people are just too used to skipping college as well.

13-04-2013 11:05AM

OP I have snipped your private docs - they could be personally identifying

Solair · 13-04-2013 11:06AM

LO 3: is where you're falling down.

There's a lot of psychology to project management. If you're new to it, maybe read some books in your college library on HR and team management ?

Teams generally have to be formed :

You go through several stages:

*Forming - getting it together
*Storming - arguments can happen here (you're here)
*Norming - systems and working relationships get worked out.
*Performing - job gets done.

Have a look at Truckman's work on group formation sometime

You're very much stuck at the storming level which means you need to sit down with your teammates and find out what's gone wrong and resolve your differences figure out a strategy to move forward as a team.

Otherwise you'll never get to the stage 4 of group formation !

Big Bag of Chips · 13-04-2013 11:08AM

OP - can I ask what you want from this thread?

There are 4 pages of posts from people all telling you roughly the same thing - you need to change your approach.

And you don't seem to accepting any of it as valid advice, or taking any of it on board?

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 11:16AM

bluewolf wrote: »

OP I have snipped your private docs - they could be personally identifying

they are not, it's just general project description, no names or anything. can you return it back?

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 11:17AM

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

OP - can I ask what you want from this thread?

There are 4 pages of posts from people all telling you roughly the same thing - you need to change your approach.

And you don't seem to accepting any of it as valid advice, or taking any of it on board?

I am accepting advice, but I just have few points to make to clear out and get as best advice as possible.

13-04-2013 11:18AM

Wow, the way you are posting and acting right now, I really wouldn't want you to be my project manager. You definitely need to change your approach. The way you are, especially the long list of rules, would actually put me off doing any work rather than encouraging me to do any.

In all honesty, I wouldn't be surprised if some actually drop out over it.

Group work is difficult. Incredibly so. You are always going to get the people that won't want to pull their weight or are just happy with floating along. This is probably the first you've experienced of it and, believe me, it won't be the last. Especially since you're going to be in an industry where the majority of it is going to be team-based, then you're seriously going to have to change your attitude.

arleitiss wrote: »

I am accepting advice, but I just have few points to make to clear out and get as best advice as possible.

Reading through your replies to people giving advice, it sounds really aggressive. Perhaps something you need to work on.

Big Bag of Chips · 13-04-2013 11:25AM

arleitiss wrote: »

I am accepting advice, but I just have few points to make to clear out and get as best advice as possible.

So do you accept that you handled this badly?

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 11:30AM

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

So do you accept that you handled this badly?

I stated "yes" few posts ago, in many points:

1) Got wrong team, I should've agreed for different team.

2) Shouldn't have set deadlines and pin point group members and force them to do anything, instead - should've approached them and talked to them try and encourage them to work on project freely without any rush or forcing.

3) Shouldn't have started project mainframe myself, should've just been in 1 pit with the rest of the group and let everyone do their own thing the way they want it.

4) Shouldn't agree to be team leader (not in college anyway)

5) and last but not least: Shouldn't agree for this project idea proposed by other group member as it turned out to be good but too hard for 4 people (either needs more time, or more members)

13-04-2013 11:36AM

You'll probably have a project in your 3rd or 4th year, where either your lecturers will put you together or you'll pick your own team. Something else you could do is instead of appointing yourself as the leader, put it to a vote.

Then make sure you all sit down for an afternoon and discuss your backgrounds, your skills, strengths and weaknesses, so people can be assigned tasks based on these. In a previous project, I found I was the best at coding, someone else at design, and someone else at the marketing/business/documentation side, so we assigned everything around these. Everybody felt comfortable with what they were doing.

arleitiss · 13-04-2013 11:45AM

Deleted User wrote: »

You'll probably have a project in your 3rd or 4th year, where either your lecturers will put you together or you'll pick your own team. Something else you could do is instead of appointing yourself as the leader, put it to a vote.

Then make sure you all sit down for an afternoon and discuss your backgrounds, your skills, strengths and weaknesses, so people can be assigned tasks based on these. In a previous project, I found I was the best at coding, someone else at design, and someone else at the marketing/business/documentation side, so we assigned everything around these. Everybody felt comfortable with what they were doing.

In 1st year I had Introduction to Programming module, we were given random teams, we had to develop a lottery application in semester 1 year 1, and well... I was put into team with two mature students (42 and 46 as far as I remember), as much as we discussed how to make it, I ended up making it all by myself alone, but for respect to older people I assigned equal marks to everyone in team.

In semester 1 year 2, we had Object Software Engineering, and were given random teams, we had no leader for that team as no one wanted to be one nor voted to be anyone else, so we all ended up doing our own individual bits, then we had to make a prototype of our idea, yet again our idea was too advanced so I ended up learning C# in a week time and developing a mini game on Unity game engine. We got full 100% marks for prototype as lecturer was really amazed and surprised with 2nd year, 1st semester students being able to develop a fully functional game with 3D models etc.. (I was game developer and 3D modeller + texture artist before) so I ended up getting 78% for that module the rest of team got 72% as they assigned me most marks and told lecturer that it was mostly me making prototype.

This time.. this just doesn't work out.

kflynn · 13-04-2013 11:45AM

arleitiss wrote: »

1) Got wrong team, I should've agreed for different team.

This isn't accepting you got something wrong, it's pushing the blame back to the team. Even though they have some responsibility here, as project manager, if the team doesn't perform it is your fault.

arleitiss wrote: »

2) Shouldn't have set deadlines and pin point group members and force them to do anything, instead - should've approached them and talked to them try and encourage them to work on project freely without any rush or forcing.

This should be listed as number 1.....as if this was rectified, you may not have had the other problems.

arleitiss wrote: »

4) Shouldn't agree to be team leader (not in college anyway)

Of course you should have! And fair play! It is far better to learn in a college environment than in a real career....that's what college is for. You will learn from this and become a better PM for it!

arleitiss wrote: »

5) and last but not least: Shouldn't agree for this project idea proposed by other group member as it turned out to be good but too hard for 4 people (either needs more time, or more members)

Again this is pushing blame. You agreed to do this project and not only that but lead it. All decisions have consequences.

Many lessons learned here, but the fact that you are on looking for advice is good! But everyone is just giving you advice, not saying you can't be a PM or improve. - You can but it will take time.

As a side note, I would talk to your team and explain that you were stressed. As someone else mentioned, making friends is also a very important part of the college experience!

Don't let this put you off being PM again - Definitely do it, just keep some of the points here in mind.

In college in project my team refused to do anything, my counter measures too harsh?

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