Farming Chit Chat

Box09 · 05-02-2013 01:15PM

You can still see the payments via the following link.

http://farmsubsidy.org/IE/

The search facility is very poor so i think the only option is by county. It is not up to date and it is everyone, not just companies, well it is for my county anyway.

reilig · 05-02-2013 01:17PM

hugo29 wrote: »

Reilig, I used to fill in the insemenation dates in the record serve sub section under the fertility heading which in turn projected the calving date and then ticked the"in calf box" under the "preg check" heading after scanning, are you saying this now can be a task,
sorry if that a bit confusing, late night-and early morning, old age is catching up

2 separate tasks actually.

Scanning and ticking the in calf box is one task.

Filling in the insemenation dates and including Sire codes is a second task - however all sires used must be at least 4 1/2 stars in order to qualify for this task.

So if you did these 2 tasks only, you would qualify for the payment!!

Juniorhurler · 05-02-2013 02:07PM

rancher wrote: »

proper order...never should have been published in the first place

Disagree. Its public money. If you want the public spend to be accountable you must have ALL public spending available for scrutiny. It probably didn't need to be advertised as heavily but under freedom of information it would probably only take a written request to release the info anyhow.

JohnBoy · 05-02-2013 03:27PM

Then all public/civil servants pay, pensions, social welfare and hse payments should also be published.

Manoffeeling · 05-02-2013 03:34PM

Why was the thread closed regarding who is killing the eagles? Are farmers expected to turn a blind eye to whoever is doing it?

reilig · 05-02-2013 03:35PM

JohnBoy wrote: »

Then all public/civil servants pay, pensions, social welfare and hse payments should also be published.

All public and civil servant pay scales are public. All unvouched expenses by public servants are published and all vouched expenses can be found out using a FOI request.

As farmers, I think it would be more in our line to be demanding what happens to the money that we pay in levies to the IFA, ICMSA, NMA, etc.

€44 million was collected from farmers in 2012 - 90% of these collections were compulsory. yet no farmer representative organisation publishes how and where they spend the money!!!

reilig · 05-02-2013 03:42PM

Manoffeeling wrote: »

Why was the thread closed regarding who is killing the eagles? Are farmers expected to turn a blind eye to whoever is doing it?

The topic was a hot topic on here in the past and caused arguments and rows all day every day. The mods at the time decided that it was better to ban the discussion of eagles on this forum than to have to deal with 50 reported posts in their inbox every morning.

There are plenty of other forums on boards.ie where the discussion would be far more relevant and where the discussion is not prohibited.

This decision was made by mods before our time. In fairness, if people want us to discuss lifting the ban on discussion, we will discuss it. However, personally I would not be in favour of allowing discussion on eagles as it causes too much friction among contributors which ultimately makes more work for the mod's.

whelan1 · 05-02-2013 03:46PM

was walking across the yard after milking, looked in to cubicle shed and there was a cow after doing the splits, fecking gave lifter to a neighbour yesterday... so had to get it, think her hip is fooked, both legs spread out either side, fresh calved second calver, only went with milkers yesterday, have her in straw bedded shed now, put a rope on the legs.. fook it anyway

Timmaay · 05-02-2013 03:55PM

Ugh yeh hard to avoid the one or two incidents just after calving Whelan! I'm definitely putting down new concrete in afew places in the yard, and getting the slatts grooved this summer though, I've seen way too many cows slip and just about save themselves over the last few weeks!

Juniorhurler · 05-02-2013 03:59PM

JohnBoy wrote: »

Then all public/civil servants pay, pensions, social welfare and hse payments should also be published.

They are

reilig · 05-02-2013 04:05PM

Timmaay wrote: »

Ugh yeh hard to avoid the one or two incidents just after calving Whelan! I'm definitely putting down new concrete in afew places in the yard, and getting the slatts grooved this summer though, I've seen way too many cows slip and just about save themselves over the last few weeks!

Would grooving slats not weaken them?

JohnBoy · 05-02-2013 04:35PM

reilig wrote: »

All public and civil servant pay scales are public. All unvouched expenses by public servants are published and all vouched expenses can be found out using a FOI request.

Juniorhurler wrote: »

They are

So there's a website where I can browse to see by name and adress how much every civil/public servant receives, or public service pensioner, or dole recipient, single parents allowance, mortgage relief, child benefit, mortgage interest relief, farm assist, HSE special payments etc?

I dont have a problem with all of that info and the SFP, DAS, AEOS, REPS etc schemes being published, as said it's all public money. but it should be all or nothing.

reilig wrote: »

As farmers, I think it would be more in our line to be demanding what happens to the money that we pay in levies to the IFA, ICMSA, NMA, etc.

€44 million was collected from farmers in 2012 - 90% of these collections were compulsory. yet no farmer representative organisation publishes how and where they spend the money!!!

Can't argue with any of that. out of interest does anyone know how the NFU is funded?

reilig · 05-02-2013 04:48PM

JohnBoy wrote: »

So there's a website where I can browse to see by name and adress how much every civil/public servant receives, or public service pensioner, or dole recipient, single parents allowance, mortgage relief, child benefit, mortgage interest relief, farm assist, HSE special payments etc?

You can see pay scales for every civil service position. You can see pension rates, dole rates, single parent allowances, mortgage interest relief rates, child benefit rates, farm assist rates etc. - these are all fixed payments. Anything that you cannot find online is easily found out with a FOI request. You cannot see what each individual receives because they are individuals as opposed to businesses.

The reason why people can see the amounts paid to farmers is because every farm is a business and the publication of grant money paid to businesses is considered fair by the EU.

bbam · 05-02-2013 04:54PM

JohnBoy wrote: »

Then all public/civil servants pay, pensions, social welfare and hse payments should also be published.

In fairness it pretty much is.
It's no big leap to look up someone's pay scale and know how long they are working there will let you know close enough how much they earn.
Politicians pay, expenses and pensions are all public record.

Only privately earned revenue should be hidden.

This is where clarity is important. A teacher/guard receives a salary for their work, direct payment for their services yet I know within a few thousand what they earn and what pension they pay.
If I'm claiming SW the rates are widely known.

Farmers receive what exactly ? Public money.
So if you claim a grant to aid building a shed it should be hidden but if a company gets funding to extend it should be public.

We have nothing to hide. The money is drawn down fairly and legally. We only get it if we qualify and comply with all the conditions laid out. Let it be known.

JohnBoy · 05-02-2013 05:17PM

But the SFP and DAS are not grants, they're income supplements.

The farm waste management scheme was a grant. I have zero issue with details of grants being published.

AEOS and REPS are grey areas imho, they have both income supplement and grant scheme elements in them.

The logic that you can work out how much a civil servant roughly earns isnt valid to me. there's no list published containing the names and adresses of the parties involved. A look over a farmer's ditch and knowledge of the DED average of SFP payments could allow you make a rough guess of his SFP too, but it's not being published.

Like I say, I'm in favour of it being published, but I'm in favour of every other cent this country spends being published to the same level of detail.

hugo29 · 05-02-2013 05:33PM

bbam wrote: »

In fairness it pretty much is.
It's no big leap to look up someone's pay scale and know how long they are working there will let you know close enough how much they earn.
Politicians pay, expenses and pensions are all public record.

Only privately earned revenue should be hidden.

This is where clarity is important. A teacher/guard receives a salary for their work, direct payment for their services yet I know within a few thousand what they earn and what pension they pay.
If I'm claiming SW the rates are widely known.

Farmers receive what exactly ? Public money.
So if you claim a grant to aid building a shed it should be hidden but if a company gets funding to extend it should be public.

We have nothing to hide. The money is drawn down fairly and legally. We only get it if we qualify and comply with all the conditions laid out. Let it be known.

is there not an increment situation in public sector where you earn more based on qualifications, years of service etc, so unless you know all that info you will never get a clear picture of any particular salary

JohnBoy · 05-02-2013 05:35PM

Or the myriad of allowances paid in different areas.

hugo29 · 05-02-2013 06:00PM

the boss (wife) has just informed me we are going to cinema tonight, 2 for the price of 1 tuesday, her turn to pick, "Les Miserables" I cant fcuking wait

i wonder if i told her wrong time and we ended up late and had to go to Lincon or django unchained both of which are on 15mins later:D, how would that go down

bogman_bass · 05-02-2013 06:08PM

hugo29 wrote: »

the boss (wife) has just informed me we are going to cinema tonight, 2 for the price of 1 tuesday, her turn to pick, "Les Miserables" I cant fcuking wait

i wonder if i told her wrong time and we ended up late and had to go to Lincon or django unchained both of which are on 15mins later:D, how would that go down

if it makes you feel any better the brother saw it last week and said it was actually supprisingly decent

awaywithyou · 05-02-2013 06:41PM

reilig wrote: »

Would grooving slats not weaken them?

No... the grooves are not too deep.. and for slats the grooves are in one direction.. no 'squares' are made... just lines if that makes sense! ill try and take a decent pic of ours and stick it up later

pakalasa · 05-02-2013 07:50PM

hugo29 wrote: »

..i wonder if i told her wrong time and we ended up late and had to go to Lincon or django unchained both of which are on 15mins later:D, how would that go down

Lincoln isn't great. Actually it's crap.

moy83 · 05-02-2013 08:26PM

pakalasa wrote: »

Lincoln isn't great. Actually it's crap.

You can say that again

Juniorhurler · 05-02-2013 08:29PM

JohnBoy wrote: »

But the SFP and DAS are not grants, they're income supplements.

The farm waste management scheme was a grant. I have zero issue with details of grants being published.

AEOS and REPS are grey areas imho, they have both income supplement and grant scheme elements in them.

The logic that you can work out how much a civil servant roughly earns isnt valid to me. there's no list published containing the names and adresses of the parties involved. A look over a farmer's ditch and knowledge of the DED average of SFP payments could allow you make a rough guess of his SFP too, but it's not being published.

Like I say, I'm in favour of it being published, but I'm in favour of every other cent this country spends being published to the same level of detail.

The fact that they are income supplements and are mot earned as such means they should be published moreso than any public servants salary scale as it is not earned money as such.

It is easoer to work out a guards or a teachers salary than a sfp as you can assume a starting age and from their rough age then work out their point on a payscale. How do the public guess at your farm size or what stock you had ten years ago and how do they figure out how that was all calculated back then. As bbam says, we have nought to hide.

delaval · 05-02-2013 08:32PM

freedominacup wrote: »

Just reading an article on the Dairygold contracts, apparently legislation always made it clear that the rule book of a co-op constitutes a written contract between a member and their society. Anyone here got a copy of their societies rulebook and was it easy to get?

If you are a member you are entitled to copy on request. Failing this contact Company registrtion office ask for Friendly Societies section and they shoud be able to help.

Bizzum · 05-02-2013 08:45PM

hugo29 wrote: »

is there not an increment situation in public sector where you earn more based on qualifications, years of service etc, so unless you know all that info you will never get a clear picture of any particular salary

In the sector I work in, there is indeed an incremental scale, You just might get an increment for qualifications but it would be an exception. Certainly years of service. One every year, and then a couple of long service ones. When you get to the top, that's it.

If you are in the job over 14 years, you're at the top and thats that!

Bizzum · 05-02-2013 08:47PM

hugo29 wrote: »

the boss (wife) has just informed me we are going to cinema tonight, 2 for the price of 1 tuesday, her turn to pick, "Les Miserables" I cant fcuking wait

i wonder if i told her wrong time and we ended up late and had to go to Lincon or django unchained both of which are on 15mins later:D, how would that go down

I'm told Django is good but I didnt see it. The last film I saw was The Hobbit, it was brilliant!

bob charles · 05-02-2013 09:18PM

bogman_bass wrote: »

if it makes you feel any better the brother saw it last week and said it was actually supprisingly decent

That says more about your brother than the quality of the film:D

freedominacup · 05-02-2013 09:25PM

delaval wrote: »

If you are a member you are entitled to copy on request. Failing this contact Company registrtion office ask for Friendly Societies section and they shoud be able to help.

I would have thought that but during the recent Glanbia furore rulebooks were hard to come by.

1chippy · 05-02-2013 09:30PM

Bizzum wrote: »

I'm told Django is good but I didnt see it. The last film I saw was The Hobbit, it was brilliant!

Went to see it and enjoyed it. cant say it was a great film though.
A bit dragged out and not just as clever as most his films.

vanderbadger · 05-02-2013 09:47PM

1chippy wrote: »

Went to see it and enjoyed it. cant say it was a great film though.
A bit dragged out and not just as clever as most his films.

ya saw it, was a bit disappointed as well, samuel L deserves an for his role but other than that a bit weak

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