Poetic Justice? Former Navy Seal Publicity-Seeking Sniper Chris Kyle Shot Dead

--Kaiser-- · 04-02-2013 04:28PM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Absolutely.

Iraq sits on some of the biggest proven oil reserves in the world. Those who imagine that oil, and more importantly, the control of it, played no part in the invasion are dupes of the corporate media.

But the US has no control over Iraqi oil. None. And what are blathering on about 'corporate media', where do you get your news, from merchants on camels? This is the level of debate I'd expect from the CT forum

Seaneh · 04-02-2013 04:37PM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

But the US has no control over Iraqi oil. None. And what are blathering on about 'corporate media', where do you get your news, from merchants on camels? This is the level of debate I'd expect from the CT forum

Excapt that the US awarded the contracts to rebuild the oil fields, to drill new wells, to process the oil and so forth until about 3 years ago and still has massive sway over the "government" of Iraq...

No control at all at all at all...

--Kaiser-- · 04-02-2013 05:01PM

Seaneh wrote: »

Excapt that the US awarded the contracts to rebuild the oil fields, to drill new wells, to process the oil and so forth until about 3 years ago and still has massive sway over the "government" of Iraq...

No control at all at all at all...

I see your point, they have so much sway over the Iraqi government that most of the lucrative contracts for oil fields went to Russia and China (who voted against the war you may remember)

Seaneh · 04-02-2013 05:11PM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

I see your point, they have so much sway over the Iraqi government that most of the lucrative contracts for oil fields went to Russia and China (who voted against the war you may remember)

No, some recent contracts went to China and Russia, the most lucrative ongoing contracts are still held by Halliburton and other american companies.

Chevron were banned from bidding because they did a deal with the kurds.

Mr Benevolent · 04-02-2013 05:12PM

I'm convinced the OP actually IS Joe Duffy.

--Kaiser-- · 04-02-2013 05:17PM

Seaneh wrote: »

No, some recent contracts went to China and Russia, the most lucrative ongoing contracts are still held by Halliburton and other american companies.

Chevron were banned from bidding because they did a deal with the kurds.

Wrong. US companies may have contracts for building infrastructure but the real power lies in whoever owns the oil fields

Chuck Stone · 04-02-2013 05:20PM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

But the US has no control over Iraqi oil. None.

Bless.

The US departure from Iraq is an illusion.

The US has a massive embassy in Baghdad with up to 20,000 people stationed there and has numerous consulates in other cities with thousands more people stationed there. The US has thousands of troops just over the horizon in Kuwait. The US controls Iraqi airspace. The US very much controls Iraq (and strategically they have good reason to because they fear the influence of Iran filling any vacuum they would leave if they didn't control Iraq).

This is the level of debate I'd expect from the CT forum

When you've run out of reasoned argument always cry 'conspiracy theory'. Your arguments have amounted to 'but, but, but' and unlike yourself, I've provided sources.

On the conspiracy theory thing - the entire act of attacking Iraq was predicated on the 45 minute threat of WMD being launched. What the hell else was that but a conspiracy to create the conditions for war? See it's fine for those in power to have conspiracies but if someone questions if those in power have them they're immediately branded a tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist - this actually shields useless bastards like the neocon chicken-hawks who pushed for the war from being called out on how ****ing dumb they are.

--Kaiser-- · 04-02-2013 05:28PM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Bless.

The US departure from Iraq is an illusion.

The US has a massive embassy in Baghdad with up to 20,000 people stationed there and has numerous consulates in other cities with thousands more people stationed there. The US has thousands of troops just over the horizon in Kuwait. The US controls Iraqi airspace. The US very much controls Iraq (and strategically they have good reason to because they fear the influence of Iran filling any vacuum they would leave if they didn't control Iraq).

When you've run out of reasoned argument always cry 'conspiracy theory'. Your arguments have amounted to 'but, but, but' and unlike yourself, I've provided sources.

On the conspiracy theory thing - the entire act of attacking Iraq was predicated on the 45 minute threat of WMD being launched. What the hell else was that but a conspiracy to create the conditions for war? See it's fine for those in power to have conspiracies but if someone questions if those in power have them they're immediately branded a tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist - this actually shields useless bastards like the neocon chicken-hawks who pushed for the war from being called out on how ****ing dumb they are.

Where is the money for Iraqi oil going? Iraq and mostly non-US companies. Great control of oil there. Good return from a trillion dollars.

I generally cry 'conspiracy theory' when people post unfounded and disproven bull****. And I have also provided sources

karma_ · 04-02-2013 05:29PM

Is this really a man who can be held up and called a hero? Upward of 250 people gunned down, and by his own word, felt no sympathy over?

I've seen some nauseating bs written about this lad in the last fey days, in the end though, a suitably ironic death.

WakeUp · 04-02-2013 05:50PM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

On the conspiracy theory thing - the entire act of attacking Iraq was predicated on the 45 minute threat of WMD being launched. What the hell else was that but a conspiracy to create the conditions for war? See it's fine for those in power to have conspiracies but if someone questions if those in power have them they're immediately branded a tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist - this actually shields useless bastards like the neocon chicken-hawks who pushed for the war from being called out on how ****ing dumb they are.

As far as "conspiracy theorists" go Bush, Blair and their lackies will take some beating. The Iraq war was based on lies and fantasy as has since been proven. This lot are the mother of all conspiracy theorists they should have been given an oscar for this sh1t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPJCPcYCupY

Seaneh · 04-02-2013 05:56PM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Where is the money for Iraqi oil going? Iraq and mostly non-US companies. Great control of oil there. Good return from a trillion dollars.

I generally cry 'conspiracy theory' when people post unfounded and disproven bull****. And I have also provided sources

The money is going form US Tax Payers to US contractors, and most of the oilfield maintance and exploration since 2003 has gone to us companies.

Nobody said this was the US government trying to control Oil for the US, it's the US government looking after their friends and paymasters in companies like Halliburton et al at the expense of the US tax payer while also screwing over the Iraqi's.

Gatling · 04-02-2013 11:26PM

karma_ wrote: »

Is this really a man who can be held up and called a hero? Upward of 250 people gunned down, and by his own word, felt no sympathy over?

I've seen some nauseating bs written about this lad in the last fey days, in the end though, a suitably ironic death.

160 confirmed kill he wasn't trained to be a bleedin heart tree hugging liberal ,he was trained to kill and that's what he was ordered to do , and add to the fact US snipers had rediculous restrictions on there rules of engagement which actually cost lives because they weren't allowed to act so yeah he deserves to be respected his actions saved lives and to quote a certain "Capt Wales" sometimes you have to take lives to save lives

Esel · 04-02-2013 11:28PM

Was it a head shot, does anyone know?

Gatling · 04-02-2013 11:30PM

Esel wrote: »

Was it a head shot, does anyone know?

BOoM

karma_ · 04-02-2013 11:47PM

Gatling wrote: »

160 confirmed kill he wasn't trained to be a bleedin heart tree hugging liberal ,he was trained to kill and that's what he was ordered to do , and add to the fact US snipers had rediculous restrictions on there rules of engagement which actually cost lives because they weren't allowed to act so yeah he deserves to be respected his actions saved lives and to quote a certain "Capt Wales" sometimes you have to take lives to save lives

Snowballs chance in hell that I'll ever respect a man who goes to someone else's doorstep to kill a boatload of people then have the temerity to plead that lives were lost because he couldn't kill some more.

Not to mention the fact that he went on to profit from his 'deeds' by penning a book. So fúck his respect, he doesn't get it from me.

That whole argument is insane by the way, bat guano insane. 'Capt Wales' was also fúcking daft to come out with that tripe too. That boy could end up being the head of the Church in England, and he has killed.

Gatling · 04-02-2013 11:59PM

$3000 a month pay risking his ass for a bunch of politician's so yeah he writes a book makes money gets raped by the taxman profit from removing armed nut job's out to kill him and his friends welcome to the real world some people tell there life story's on Facebook he wrote a real book and yes people bought it millions actually and I can say anyone else in that situation would do it

karma_ · 05-02-2013 12:13AM

Gatling wrote: »

I can say anyone else in that situation would do it

Can you? Or is that just another ridiculous generalisation?

This man went to war, killed and claims he felt no remorse. The truth is he went to war and didn't learn a dammed thing. That millions bought his book is tragic in itself, so many good books about war that there already is.

Gatling · 05-02-2013 12:23AM

Why should he have felt remorse. He was a Trained killer, a skilled killer at that ,
And yes anybody with an interesting story would make money off if they could don't say you wouldn't,
And yes there's thousands of books about war personally I've read a few hundred of them but there's very few written by snipers fresh from actual combat

karma_ · 05-02-2013 12:24AM

Gatling wrote: »

Why should he have felt remorse. He was a Trained killer, a skilled killer at that ,
And yes anybody with an interesting story would make money off if they could don't say you wouldn't,
And yes there's thousands of books about war personally I've read a few hundred of them but there's very few written by snipers fresh from actual combat

Sounds like you haven't been reading the right books to be fair.

Goodnight!

Gatling · 05-02-2013 12:26AM

Sorry must have missed the bleeding heart liberal tree hugging times

Chuck Stone · 05-02-2013 12:33AM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Where is the money for Iraqi oil going? Iraq and mostly non-US companies.

It's not all about selling oil - there are related services before the oil ever reaches the market. I've already highlighted that US companies stand to gain tens of billions from oil related services.

In fact, American drilling companies stand to make tens of billions of dollars from the new petroleum activity in Iraq long before any of the oil producers start seeing any returns on their investments.

nytimes.com

Great control of oil there. Good return from a trillion dollars.

The 'trillion dollars' numbers were beyond the wildest dreams of even the most negative commentators in 2003. If the people of the US had been told that the Iraq adventure was going to cost them thousands of young men and hundreds of billions in treasure do you think it would have went ahead? Ofc not.

I generally cry 'conspiracy theory' when people post unfounded and disproven bull****.

Do you accept that the whole '45 minutes 'til doom' WMD thing was a conspiracy to manipulate public opinion in support for an Iraqi invasion?

EoghanIRL · 05-02-2013 12:34AM

A evidence on his murder will my accidentally misplaced , wink wink

Durz0 Blint · 05-02-2013 12:35AM

Biggins wrote: »

* I believe he was doing his duty as ordered by the Army?

* How did he make an industry out of killing?

* He got that position by some serious testing in regards to skill, mental capacity and stableness.
(USA snipers are one of the most tested soldiers in the whole army and snipers are most certainly not 'typical' soldiers also)

* How was he "Gung-ho?" Any shots he would have took, would have been with express permission/clearance to open fire beforehand by top brass above him, in regards to single shots or continuous fire over a period of warfare.

* Snipers in fact are more stable soldiers and PTSD is much less in them later also. Snipers in fact make much less psychiatric outpatients.

* How did he glory in his actions? He wrote a book about the effects such action have on a persons mind during warfare.

* Had he indeed been "psychopathic" - he would NEVER have even got in the army, never mind being allowed to be a much checked and trained sniper.

* I personally don't see he being religious as being a detrimental factor.

Agree with all except the psychopathic part.

Psychopaths tend to make excellent soldiers and would have the perfect set of traits (calm, unemotional etc..) to make great snipers.

Most special forces units have high levels of psychopathy, don't think it's ever been tested in snipers but it wouldn't be hard to imagine many of them possess similar traits.

Poetic Justice? Former Navy Seal Publicity-Seeking Sniper Chris Kyle Shot Dead

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