Stick your Promissory Note deal up your arse Kenny.

woodoo · 26-01-2013 06:49PM #1

The ECB have told Enda Kenny and Michael Noonan to stick their Promissory Note proposal where the sun don't shine.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/26/us-ecb-ireland-idUSBRE90P0DT20130126

Very Embarrassing for the government. It looks like we will have to pay back every last cent we supposedly owe?

3.1 billion is due to be paid on 31st March 2013. Should we just not pay the damn thing and see where that takes us.

mfceiling · 26-01-2013 06:54PM

Be funny alright.

Noonan on phone "about that 3.1 billion - we haven't got it. We looked everywhere and we don't have it. Sure listen if it turns up we'll give you a text. Good luck"

Biggins · 26-01-2013 07:02PM

Just read that elsewhere.
Once again after all his waffling of future deals, once again he's been exposed as full of empty results.

EURATS · 26-01-2013 07:06PM

Biggins wrote: »

Just read that elsewhere.
Once again after all his waffling of future deals, once again he's been exposed as full of empty results.

Full of empty results is a nice way of putting it.
Nothing but a winker.

Biggins · 26-01-2013 07:16PM

THE European Central Bank has rejected the Government's preferred solution to the cost of paying back money borrowed to rescue Anglo after the property market crash, EU sources have said.

The Government wants to avoid paying €3.1 billion a year until 2023 to service a promissory note it issued to underwrite Anglo Irish Bank during the financial crisis of 2008.

Finance Minister Michael Noonan had proposed converting the note into long-term government bonds that would be taken up by the Irish Central Bank with the intention of keeping the bonds in its portfolio for a long period.

The sources said the ECB's Governing Council discussed the plan for the first time at a meeting on Wednesday and Thursday and agreed that it amounted to "monetary financing" of the Irish government, banned under article 123 of the EU treaty.

Article continues: http://www.independent.ie/national-news/ecb-rejects-governments-preferred-deal-on-promissory-notes-3367619.html

GRMA · 26-01-2013 07:23PM

Good, the deal was ****e anyway, paying it out over a longer period is a joke, it shouldn't be paid at all.

massive debt write down is the only acceptable "deal"

EURATS · 26-01-2013 07:29PM

GRMA wrote: »

Good, the deal was ****e anyway, paying it out over a longer period is a joke, it shouldn't be paid at all.

massive debt write down is the only acceptable "deal"

Give them some horse meat and a kick in the holy jaysus

Kristopherus · 26-01-2013 07:30PM

Baldy should refuse everything till he gets a decent percentage write-down:(

Seaneh · 26-01-2013 07:34PM

The ECB are actually ****ing idiots.

They are the reason the Eurozone is in the **** and they are answerable to ****ing nobody, it's a joke.

mikom · 26-01-2013 07:37PM

Is there anything to be said for another mass atop Croagh patrick.........

3ndahalfof6 · 26-01-2013 07:40PM

I love the we, you mean the other (the people).

Conmaicne Mara · 26-01-2013 07:41PM

Nooney should pen a note back to the ECB.

"Ah, that's grand lads. Sure ye're not listening to us so we've no avenue left, ah, open except to, ah, default. Good luck with Italy, Spain, Portugal, and Greece after that. Hope ye can make it for the Gathering."

TheBody · 26-01-2013 07:42PM

Absolute shower of cnuts.

Pottler · 26-01-2013 07:48PM

TheBody wrote: »

Absolute shower of cnuts.

Which ones? Ye honestly think they really tried to get a deal? They couldn't negotiate with the village idiot, bunch of schoolteachers, where exactly do ye think they are going to get negotiating skills from? Years of experience convincing kids to do their homework? "Give us a deal on the borrowings or we'll send a letter home to your mammy and daddy"...

oppenheimer1 · 26-01-2013 07:48PM

Why do people bother listening to these press releases/leaks etc? This is all part of the negotiation game. Each side is using the media to advance their own position - this is just a response to the noises that were being made at Davos during the week, its a blunt reminder to everyone that the ECB has to be on board too.

Its in the ECB's interest that Ireland is viewed as a successful rescue. It doesn't want to pay too much for this. Ireland won't get all of its demands.

Praetorian Saighdiuir · 26-01-2013 07:49PM

Give it to 'em in scratchcards!

It would be deadly to see three aul biddies and Mario Draghi up there. We could have Noonan and Honohan in the crowd with homemade plackards.

I hope he gets to spin the wheel.

Sand · 26-01-2013 08:02PM

No surprise really. The ECB isnt going to set a far reaching and (in it's eyes and the eyes of the Germans) dangerous precedent for Ireland. Official Ireland have been making fools of themselves for the past few years thinking otherwise. They happily splurged on debt to bail out banks and delay spending cuts for as long as possible. They were convinced some "grand bargain" was coming down the tracks and they only had to play for time. Well, they were wrong. The administration from 2007 onwards took a bad situation and made it much worse. And Irish people are going to have to pay for that mistake for decades.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Why do people bother listening to these press releases/leaks etc? This is all part of the negotiation game. Each side is using the media to advance their own position - this is just a response to the noises that were being made at Davos during the week, its a blunt reminder to everyone that the ECB has to be on board too.

Its in the ECB's interest that Ireland is viewed as a successful rescue. It doesn't want to pay too much for this. Ireland won't get all of its demands.

Nonsense. The ECB couldn't care less if Ireland is viewed as a successful rescue. It wants the promissory notes paid back, on schedule to the very last cent plus interest. Once it gets that it couldn't give a damn about Irish sob stories. Especially when presented by Irish civil servants on amazing salaries and pensions.

However, once it gets paid back on schedule to the very last cent plus interest its not bothered what we do - so expect to see a "deal" like the one from last March announced soon.

Dyr · 26-01-2013 08:08PM

Seaneh wrote: »

The ECB are actually ****ing idiots.

They are the reason the Eurozone is in the **** and they are answerable to ****ing nobody, it's a joke.

They are answerable to ze germans

conorhal · 26-01-2013 08:11PM

The EU and it's entities like the ECB are nakedly corporatist and will always protect corporate interests against those of nation states and their citizens, and I say that as sombody that has no time for 'anti-capitalists' and their irrational gibberish.
We have ceeded so much power to the centralised bureaucratic corporatist entity that is the EU that they can bend us over a barrel if they like because we have no power to hold them accountable, we sold it long ago.

I really think the brits are correct at this stage with their demands for a retrenchment of powers and a return to an EU (or relationship with the EU) closer to that of the old EEC, I wish them the best of luck with that, there's at least some chance for them to save themselves.
Ireland at this stage have all the negociating strength of a Donegal county councillor crying about a hospital closure, so it really doesn't matter what we propose,even if it was the most rational and brilliant proposal in the world, it's easily ignored. The truth is that we have no negociating position because we have no power to negociate, only beg like a serf, our only hope is some sop thrown in our direction just to shut us up.
At least when we had our own currency and laws Noonan and Co. had to pay some lip service to the public and notions of statehood, nationalism and the common good every few years to keep their jobs, there was at least the prospect of accountability. This ain't the case with the EU.

The more power we agree to centralise with these unaccountable scum the more we will suffer, remember that the next time you're asked to vote on an EU referendum.

squod · 26-01-2013 08:16PM

.

http://youtu.be/RUHQWi0Bs-0?t=2m59s

TLDL ; Throw us a bone to keep us from having an uprising. National banks buying government bonds to tie their debts into sovereign debt.

TLDR; politicians are scum.

Lingua Franca · 26-01-2013 08:17PM

Stealth Recce wrote: »

Give it to 'em in scratchcards!

It would be deadly to see three aul biddies and Mario Draghi up there. We could have Noonan and Honohan in the crowd with homemade plackards.

I hope he gets to spin the wheel.

This has me in bits, thanks for the laugh!

woodoo · 26-01-2013 08:29PM

Seaneh wrote: »

The ECB are actually ****ing idiots.

They are the reason the Eurozone is in the **** and they are answerable to ****ing nobody, it's a joke.

Trichet who made the decision is lying with his feet up now in the south of France without a worry in the world.

oppenheimer1 · 26-01-2013 08:43PM

Sand wrote: »

No surprise really. The ECB isnt going to set a far reaching and (in it's eyes and the eyes of the Germans) dangerous precedent for Ireland. Official Ireland have been making fools of themselves for the past few years thinking otherwise. They happily splurged on debt to bail out banks and delay spending cuts for as long as possible. They were convinced some "grand bargain" was coming down the tracks and they only had to play for time. Well, they were wrong. The administration from 2007 onwards took a bad situation and made it much worse. And Irish people are going to have to pay for that mistake for decades.

Nonsense. The ECB couldn't care less if Ireland is viewed as a successful rescue. It wants the promissory notes paid back, on schedule to the very last cent plus interest. Once it gets that it couldn't give a damn about Irish sob stories. Especially when presented by Irish civil servants on amazing salaries and pensions.

However, once it gets paid back on schedule to the very last cent plus interest its not bothered what we do - so expect to see a "deal" like the one from last March announced soon.

I'm afraid it does care. If Ireland cannot be saved by following the bailout programme slavishly than what future has the single currency got.

While the ECB mightn't care much for Ireland, it does care about the integrity of the currency. The success of Ireland (or not as the case may be) will influence the view of credibility of the currency and its institutions in many peoples eyes. Remember its only trust that keeps the system hanging together and without it it will all fall apart quite quickly.

conorhal · 26-01-2013 08:55PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

I'm afraid it does care. If Ireland cannot be saved by following the bailout programme slavishly than what future has the single currency got.

While the ECB mightn't care much for Ireland, it does care about the integrity of the currency. The success of Ireland (or not as the case may be) will influence the view of credibility of the currency and its institutions in many peoples eyes. Remember its only trust that keeps the system hanging together and without it it will all fall apart quite quickly.

Trust isn't the only method of maintaining control, fear works pretty well too, the ECB could view our citizens as acceptable collatoral damage and or a harsh lesson to the rest of the Euro zone states to keep them in line, we after all, are not 'too big to fail'.

petersburg2002 · 26-01-2013 09:03PM

So the Greeks get massive writedowns and pay no interest for a decade while the best behaved pupil in Europe gets fcuk all. You couldn't make it up.

Seaneh · 26-01-2013 09:22PM

petersburg2002 wrote: »

So the Greeks get massive writedowns and pay no interest for a decade while the best behaved pupil in Europe gets fcuk all. You couldn't make it up.

Yeah, it's a joke.
Do what you're told and get shafted again and again, defy the masters and get special treatment.

Time to start telling the rest of europe to go **** themselves and look after ourselves first for once!

conorhal · 26-01-2013 09:39PM

Seaneh wrote: »

Yeah, it's a joke.
Do what you're told and get shafted again and again, defy the masters and get special treatment.

Time to start telling the rest of europe to go **** themselves and look after ourselves first for once!

Lets be honest, nobody respects a subserviant, sniveling arse-lick, so it's no surprise that they beat us up for our lunch money...

Bullseye1 · 26-01-2013 09:44PM

conorhal wrote: »

Lets be honest, nobody respects a subserviant, sniveling arse-lick, so it's no surprise that they beat us up for our lunch money...

Agreed. Noonan is out of his league as are most if not all Dail members. And the civil servants are not fit for purpose.

force eleven · 26-01-2013 09:44PM

The ECB is run by the German banks. The German banks lent billions to zombie banks promoting high falutin' pyramid schemes. They knew the risks. The bet failed. Now they want you to pay everything. It's the way the world works now. Central Banks are evil greedy lending corporations in effect, who control governments.

Mark200 · 26-01-2013 10:11PM

Pottler wrote: »

Which ones? Ye honestly think they really tried to get a deal? They couldn't negotiate with the village idiot, bunch of schoolteachers, where exactly do ye think they are going to get negotiating skills from? Years of experience convincing kids to do their homework? "Give us a deal on the borrowings or we'll send a letter home to your mammy and daddy"...

Um the IMF have been on our side on this issue for a long time, calling for a debt deal. And so have Germany. The ECB rejected the proposed solution due to legal issues. Germany have also said before that they consider Ireland to be a special case, but that it's up to us to ensure that any proposed deal would not open the door for other programme countries to get the same deal. Obviously this balance was not achieved in the plan that the ECB reviewed. It's not all down to "negotiating skill", it's down to legal technicalities.

ThreeLineWhip · 26-01-2013 10:17PM

Ireland need to get up off it's knees and develop a backbone. Default.

Stick your Promissory Note deal up your arse Kenny.

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