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Judge tells victims of crime: use full force on raiders (who he calls'knacker's)

24

Comments

  • #32
    Rasheed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Rasheed


    To me, a knacker is a scumbag and therefore the lads that robbed this man are knackers.

    But the judge shouldn't have used to word in court as it has left himself open to people questioning his comment.


  • #33
    conorhal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,096 ✭✭✭conorhal


    mikemac1 wrote: »
    Empty words

    No sympathy required, just proper sentencing

    18 & 22 months, the boys will likely be out this time next year

    Hard to argue with that, as far as I'm concerned the most offensive word a judge can use during a sentencing hearing is 'suspended'.


  • #34
    The Gride
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 200 ✭✭The Gride


    conorhal wrote: »
    Hard to argue with that, as far as I'm concerned the most offensive word a judge can use during a sentencing hearing is 'suspended'.


    I could be wrong but I think the most a District Court Judge can give is 22 months. I remember reading somewhere that a District Cort Judge gave a higher sentence to someone by mistake and they got the complete conviction and sentence overturned as the Judge had only the power to give out 22 months in total.


  • #35
    LiamMc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 906 ✭✭✭LiamMc


    The Gride wrote: »
    I could be wrong but I think the most a District Court Judge can give is 22 months. I remember reading somewhere that a District Cort Judge gave a higher sentence to someone by mistake and they got the complete conviction and sentence overturned as the Judge had only the power to give out 22 months in total.

    I was just going to post that Judge Browne is only a District Court Judge. If people used maximum force than any trial would be heard in the High Court.

    It is unfortunate that self-entitlement people like Judge Browne are part of are society and actual believe themselves to be successful in my Community.


  • #36
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    Il Trap wrote: »
    I'd hazard a guess that the two perpetrators were indeed of the 'travelling' variety in which case the judge's comments would seem quite pointed and deliberate. Not faulting him for it either.

    believe me if they were travellers the paper would have highlighted it, but sure don't let me stop you getting a cheap dig inat travellers.
    Just goes to prove that the judge was wrong to the term he did though as so many smallminded bigots (not you obviously) will now attribute these crimes to the travelling community.
    District Court Judges in this country are a joke!


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  • #37
    Kinzig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 222 ✭✭Kinzig


    Enough of the pussyfooting around Knackers!!..Theres a crime wave in Donegal at the moment which is mainly caused by this section of the community..these scummers need dealt with..when they break in-shoot on sight I say!!


  • #38
    Show Time
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,637 ✭✭✭Show Time


    A few more judges like him would do the country the world of good.


  • #39
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    Even if true, it's awfully unprofessional, undignified language for a judge to use in public and in their professional capacity.`

    Plus, advising people to break the law? Grand for him to say it when it won't land him in jail.

    Kangaroo court stuff. A judge is supposed to be a spokesperson for the law, not stirring up people's emotions. His opinions may be understandable but shouldn't come into him doing his job. If you agree with him, it still doesn't make it "right" for him to say all this stuff as a judge.


  • #40
    fasttalkerchat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,652 ✭✭✭fasttalkerchat


    Another idiot judge. He used a word that could be misinterpreted and land him in trouble and then he advised a victim to use maximum force with no legal basis to do so.

    The conviction could have been quashed because a potentially racist term was used and the victim might take the judges advice in future and find himself behind bars.


  • #41
    Boombastic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,496 ✭✭✭Boombastic


    mikemac1 wrote: »
    Empty words

    No sympathy required, just proper sentencing

    18 & 22 months, the boys will likely be out this time next year


    Sooner would be my guess
    conorhal wrote: »
    Hard to argue with that, as far as I'm concerned the most offensive word a judge can use during a sentencing hearing is 'suspended'.


    Followed closely by 'concurrently'



    This judge is dead right. People should and will use force.


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  • #42
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    Apparently these two brothers are responsable for three breakins to the same place between them.

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/judge-tells-victims-of-crime-use-full-force-on-raiders-3364342.html

    Sounds like the judge got angry and forgot his political correctness.


  • #43
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,685 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Madam_X wrote: »
    Even if true, it's awfully unprofessional, undignified language for a judge to use in public and in their professional capacity.`

    Plus, advising people to break the law? Grand for him to say it when it won't land him in jail.

    Kangaroo court stuff. A judge is supposed to be a spokesperson for the law, not stirring up people's emotions. His opinions may be understandable but shouldn't come into him doing his job. If you agree with him, it still doesn't make it "right" for him to say all this stuff as a judge.

    Agree with this, sounds like he completely lost the run of himself.


  • #44
    elefant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,697 ✭✭✭elefant


    Madam_X wrote: »
    Even if true, it's awfully unprofessional, undignified language for a judge to use in public and in their professional capacity.`

    Plus, advising people to break the law? Grand for him to say it when it won't land him in jail.

    Kangaroo court stuff. A judge is supposed to be a spokesperson for the law, not stirring up people's emotions. His opinions may be understandable but shouldn't come into him doing his job. If you agree with him, it still doesn't make it "right" for him to say all this stuff as a judge.

    By law aren't people allowed to use a reasonable level of force in protecting their, or someone else's, property though? For a 70 year old, I don't think having a hurl to beat off thieves is the limits of reasonable, and if maximum force is what it takes elderly people to defend themselves, he's right in saying that people should use maximum force.

    Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, it's been a while since I studied Criminal Law.


  • #45
    Boombastic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,496 ✭✭✭Boombastic


    Why are there no pictures of these guys alongside the article?


  • #46
    Chemical Burn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Chemical Burn


    nuxxx wrote: »
    Knacker to me means scumbag, along with other things, not just travellers

    Also that judge is pretty cool :)

    +1


  • #47
    omahaid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭omahaid


    I've no issue with the judge calling them knackers because they are (nothing whatsoever to do with travellers). However advising people to use "maximum force" isn't helpful because you'll be locked up if you do.


  • #48
    seamey beag84
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 247 ✭✭seamey beag84


    The judges emotions definitely came out here but it was of no help. "Knackers" was just a slip of the tongue i'd say but "Maximum Force". As far as I know, using maximum force would land the person being robbed in jail..


  • #49
    MaxSteele
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭MaxSteele


    A judges personal opinion should be the last thing to be worrying about when dealing with two little toerags like this. This formal do and don't say policy is fairly outdated and means feck all really to the wider public. A judge is entitled to his opinion like anyone else.

    Why should he pretend to hold a more politically correct view than the average joe.


  • #50
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    MaxSteele wrote: »
    A judges personal opinion should be the last thing to be worrying about when dealing with two little toerags like this. This formal do and don't say policy is fairly outdated and means feck all really to the wider public. A judge is entitled to his opinion like anyone else.

    Why should he pretend to hold a more politically correct view than the average joe.

    Because he is not an average joe!


  • #51
    gobnaitolunacy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭gobnaitolunacy


    Boombastic wrote: »
    Why are there no pictures of these guys alongside the article?

    They weren't photogenic?


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  • #52
    Yellowblackbird
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Yellowblackbird


    omahaid wrote: »
    However advising people to use "maximum force" isn't helpful because you'll be locked up if you do.

    No Jury will convict you for taking on an intruder in your house.

    I defy anyone to show a single case in the history of the state where such has happened.


  • #53
    Steodonn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 357 ✭✭Steodonn


    Judges encouraging people to break the law. Wont be leaving the District Court anytime soon
    No Jury will convict you for taking on an intruder in your house.

    Juries must follow the law if they a purposely letting someone off like that they could face legal action themselves and I don't think you'll get a jury unless you kill the intruder
    A judges personal opinion should be the last thing to be worrying about when dealing with two little toerags like this. This formal do and don't say policy is fairly outdated and means feck all really to the wider public. A judge is entitled to his opinion like anyone else.

    No a judge is not entitled to his own opinion. Now this causes no great problem in the district court but anything up form that judges rulings and what the say form part of the law
    . This is why judges take along time choosing their words carefully when coming to judgement


  • #54
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    Steodonn wrote: »
    Judges encouraging people to break the law. Wont be leaving the District Court anytime soon



    Juries must follow the law if they a purposely letting someone off like that they could face legal action themselves
    How? since juries hold their deliberations in absolute privacy.


  • #55
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    My Fiancee was telling me all about the Judge in question, Browne and to be honest, I agree with him and think he's epic for being open about it.


  • #56
    Yellowblackbird
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Yellowblackbird


    Steodonn wrote: »
    Juries must follow the law if they a purposely letting someone off like that they could face legal action themselves and I don't think you'll get a jury unless you kill the intruder

    No Juries don't face legal action. Actually that is such an idiotic remark I'm not even sure what it is you think you mean by it. What they do is they hear evidence and make a decision of guilt or innocence. No Jury in this country will ever find a man guilty for taking on an intruder in his home. This is worth pointing out because there is a widely held belief out there that if you defend yourself that you will go to jail. The media have contributed strongly to this myth. And it is baseless and people should have no fear.


  • #57
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    Personally I would reward anyones bravery to break into my home with a good kicking. If they die in the interim, I'll personally dig their grave with a spoon as punishment and to make sure their gone for good.


  • #58
    MaxSteele
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭MaxSteele


    WileyCoyote (Accelleratii Incredibus!) wrote: »
    Because he is not an average joe!

    So? why is he less entitled to it? Why would anyone have a problem with it? It's a shame more judges aren't like him or Sean MacBride. Faux Outrage.


  • #59
    MaxSteele
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭MaxSteele


    Steodonn wrote: »
    Judges encouraging people to break the law. Wont be leaving the District Court anytime soon



    Juries must follow the law if they a purposely letting someone off like that they could face legal action themselves and I don't think you'll get a jury unless you kill the intruder



    No a judge is not entitled to his own opinion. Now this causes no great problem in the district court but anything up form that judges rulings and what the say form part of the law
    . This is why judges take along time choosing their words carefully when coming to judgement

    But the Jury has already come to a verdict. A judge imposes the sentence, how would him calling two thieves "knackers" form a part of the law ?


  • #60
    NIMAN
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,344 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    It will be very interesting to see how the 1st case that comes along with a burglar being severely battered or killed, is handled by the courts.

    If the home owner gets off, it will open the flood gates.


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  • #61
    daithi1970
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 515 ✭✭✭daithi1970


    ..has the precedent not already been set with the McNally case? Certainly legislation has been updated to reflect the above..correct me if I am wrong, but is there not a provision which enables a homeowner to use force to counteract a burglary?

    daithi

    ps
    while the judge's comments are understandable I think whey might have been ill-advised-you dont want these scrotes to wangle themselves a mistrial if the presiding judge has shown himself to be predudicial in his/her utterings...


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