Dissedent Republicans Warn Irish from Joining British

seamus · 08-01-2013 10:05AM

Hey, CIRA and RSF. Last time I checked, nobody voted for you. You have no authority to speak for the Irish people and you do not have my permission to do anything in my name except FOAD please. Thanks.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar · 08-01-2013 10:05AM

pithater1 wrote: »

Well, yes. Technically.

Soldiering for some could be compared with/ defined as, say, playing football for your local team.

Lets say one team doesn't play matches, all they do is train. Another team does play matches.

Now it would be understandable if somebody would actually want to play a match so they go and join the team who play the matches.

Now for others soldiering could be compared with/ defined as , as you said, killing people in a foreign country.

It all depends on how you compare/define something. Last time I checked, we were in a democracy so that leaves you free to compare/define something as you see fit provided that it's legal.

The BA is a legal organisation so joining it is legal.
The IRA is an illegal organisation so joining it is illegal.

oh yeah im sure it's a rush and gives young men a great sense of purpose in life, I wasn't trying to say all soldiers are evil baby killing monsters I just don't have much sympathy for people who sign up for a volunteer army to fight in an aggressive war.

philologos · 08-01-2013 10:06AM

lcrcboy wrote: »

News article from Journal.ie:
http://www.thejournal.ie/death-threat-british-army-744725-Jan2013/

Limerick Leader:
http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/local/republicans-issue-threat-to-british-army-targets-1-4652249

So what do you reckon lads is this starting to get out of hand?? should the government use a firm hand when dealing with these fringe groups.
Do you reckon this is all down to the recession or is it to do with something else.

I think we're worse to give disproportionate attention to it. The sooner most people in the North forget tribalism of all kinds the better.

laugh · 08-01-2013 10:06AM

Apparently they were planning to kill a young man who is a british soldier when he came home to Dublin for Christmas.

If they kill an innocent irish national in these times, they will get a real idea of what the public sentiment is towards them.

P_1 · 08-01-2013 10:08AM

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

oh yeah im sure it's a rush and gives young men a great sense of purpose in life, I wasn't trying to say all soldiers are evil baby killing monsters I just don't have much sympathy for people who sign up for a volunteer army to fight in an aggressive war.

As is your right, however that wouldn't give you the right to publicly threaten to kill them.

Not that I'm suggesting that you, in particular, would do such a thing, just making the point.

Matt_Trakker · 08-01-2013 10:08AM

RoyalMarine wrote: »

Career, money, something to do, experience and so on and so forth.

Wouldn't you have earned more with the BA? And you certainly would've had more to do, seen more action anyway, are the Irish lads even involved in anything at the minute?

RoyalMarine · 08-01-2013 10:22AM

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

Wouldn't you have earned more with the BA? And you certainly would've had more to do, seen more action anyway, are the Irish lads even involved in anything at the minute?

I was 16 at the time and joined the reserves. I wanted a career in the military and joining the reserves gave me enough insight into what area I wanted to go into.

Financially, at 16 getting paid for annual camp, gratuity etc was great.

Always had plenty to do. Got to learn to drive, shoot and so on..

Matt_Trakker · 08-01-2013 10:29AM

RoyalMarine wrote: »

I was 16 at the time and joined the reserves. I wanted a career in the military and joining the reserves gave me enough insight into what area I wanted to go into.

Financially, at 16 getting paid for annual camp, gratuity etc was great.

Always had plenty to do. Got to learn to drive, shoot and so on..

OK, but what was it swung you to join the Irish rather than the British?
I'm presuming you had a choice or did you just join the Irish because you moved here? I really know sweet FA about both armies and I'm interested to know why a foreign national would join another country's army.
Did the Irish army offer better chances for you regarding what you wanted to do? Surely the British army would offer more seeing as it's so much bigger/more resources etc.
Forgive my ignorance but I really don't know much about the subject and I'd like to know a bit more about it.

Franticfrank · 08-01-2013 10:35AM

I really know sweet FA about both armies and I'm interested to know why a foreign national would join another country's army.

Irishmen have fought in foreign armies for centuries. Look at cases like the Spanish Civil War, Vietnam, etc. Irishmen were even fighting in an SS unit at the gates of Berlin just before the war ended. For many, the Irish army doesn't offer a true military career. For somebody searching for a career in a tank unit, the Irish military just isn't an option so they go elsewhere.

And I don't understand why Irish lads joining the British army is the main topic of discussion. What about the French Foreign Legion? Quite a few Irish soldiers joined that unit and enjoyed interesting military careers all over the world. Taking the French and British militaries into question, they offer things the Irish army simply can't. When you join the legion, you learn French, are perhaps stationed in South America, make a huge pool of international contacts and really experience something unique. It can't be compared to the Irish military.

Terrontress · 08-01-2013 10:38AM

I heard it said before by someone in military recruitment that those from the 26 counties are amongst the most dedicated personnel in the UK forces. If you live in England, Scotland or Wales you can walk in to a recruitment office in the town centre, next door to Starbucks and be in a training camp in a month's time. If you live in Northern Ireland it takes three months to do security checks on you after having been to an army base. If you live South of the border, you face the disdain of your neighbours, you have to travel to an Army recruitment office and then it takes nine months for security checks. After all that if you are still prepared to join you can bet you are going to be a very dedicated soldier or officer.

seamus · 08-01-2013 10:57AM

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

I really know sweet FA about both armies and I'm interested to know why a foreign national would join another country's army.

Happens all the time all over the place. There can be a number of reasons;
- Someone may feel that the training or opportunities in a foreign army are superior that those offered at home
- There may be ideological reasons why they dislike their own country's forces or prefer another country's; e.g. some American citizens were found in Iraq with Iraqi insurgents, fighting against American forces
- They may be restricted or prevented from joining the forces at home but can qualify in another country

The French foreign legion had a reputation as a magnet for vaggabonds, people who were trying to escape a poor life in their home country or leave behind a criminal past. That kind of stuff has pretty much ended now but it's still popular and regarded as an elite force worth working for if solidering is your thing.

Military work is generally seen as a career vocation as much as, if not more than, an ideological one. While patriotism plays a part, many soldiers join the military to be a solider, not because they want to protect their country.

The_Kew_Tour · 08-01-2013 11:14AM

HoggyRS wrote: »

Who do you consider "there(sic) own people"? The CIRA have only killed a handful of people, which ones do you consider their own?

Well they say they represent the Republic right?(not in mine or 99.9% of people)

All the IRA are the same be it CIRA or whatever.

the_syco · 08-01-2013 11:22AM

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

The hell with that, Irish army Defence Force and neutrality FTW.

The one with a freeze on recruitment? I've also heard of some people joining the BA as there's a glass ceiling in the Irish Defence Forces, but not sure how true that is.

Matt_Trakker · 08-01-2013 11:26AM

the_syco wrote: »

there's a glass ceiling.

A wha?

awec · 08-01-2013 11:29AM

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

A wha?

He means your career can only progress so far before you sort of hit a wall and can't go any further. I think.

seamus · 08-01-2013 11:33AM

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

A wha?

An invisible barrier.
The glass ceiling meaning that as you progress, you can see the guys at the top and you get the impression that you can progress in your career to become one of the guys at the top, but at some point you hit the glass ceiling and find you are prevented from progressing any further.

It also refers to instances where companies claim to have a transparent and open promotions process, when in reality you will never progress to the upper echelons unless you're one of the chosen few.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass_ceiling

Even though that article refers to women and minorities, the phrase is now in general use to describe any company which engages in the "old boys club" promotions mentality rather than promotions on merit.

tim9002 · 08-01-2013 11:38AM

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

by soldiering do you mean kill people in a foreign country? not all that different from what the republicans want to do.

There are lots of jobs in the army that don't involve killing people, or at least the opportunity you have to kill people is minimal. Not everyone is interested in joining the infantry, many are interested in becoming communications specialists, armourers, caterers, engineers, the list is almost endless.

the_syco · 08-01-2013 11:41AM

awec wrote: »

He means your career can only progress so far before you sort of hit a wall and can't go any further. I think.

This. I'm not too sure about it, but it was something to do with NCO to officer, and/or the lack of places/chances to get promoted above a certain level.

awec · 08-01-2013 11:43AM

I'd say that's down to the relatively small size of the IDF and the fact that there can only be a set number of individuals at each rank. You can't get promoted until someone above you gets promoted, and that means someone above them needs promoted etc.

knucklehead6 · 08-01-2013 11:45AM

awec wrote: »

I'd say that's down to the relatively small size of the IDF and the fact that there can only be a set number of individuals at each rank. You can't get promoted until someone above you gets promoted, and that means someone above them needs promoted etc.

What have the Israeli Defence Forces got to do with it???

P_1 · 08-01-2013 12:43PM

Expanding on the foolishness of the IRA just for a second:

If Irish people who join the British Armed Forces are considered a target, would that also mean that Irish people who join the US/French/German/etc. Armed Forces also be considered a target?

Expanding yet further...

Would Irish people who shop in British shops / follow British sports teams / consume British media / etc. also be considered as targets if you were to follow the same logic?

.jacksparrow. · 08-01-2013 12:44PM

pithater1 wrote: »

Expanding on the foolishness of the IRA just for a second:

If Irish people who join the British Armed Forces are considered a target, would that also mean that Irish people who join the US/French/German/etc. Armed Forces also be considered a target?

Expanding yet further...

Would Irish people who shop in British shops / follow British sports teams / consume British media / etc. also be considered as targets if you were to follow the same logic?

Em no,that's a silly comparison,they obviously see the British army as targets because of the British situation in the north.

P_1 · 08-01-2013 12:50PM

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

Em no,that's a silly comparison,they obviously see the British army as targets because of the British situation in the north.

Fair enough, but if you are 'at war' with somebody, which is clearly what the IRA view themselves being with Britain, would you not be targeting their economy as well as their military?

.jacksparrow. · 08-01-2013 12:54PM

pithater1 wrote: »

Fair enough, but if you are 'at war' with somebody, which is clearly what the IRA view themselves being with Britain, would you not be targeting their economy as well as their military?

They have done in the past,but they clearly aren't capable of pulling that off nowadays.

SEPT 23 1989 · 08-01-2013 01:02PM

Fighting the animals that are the Taliban or blowing up and murdering innocent men women and children who went out shopping on a Saturday

.jacksparrow. · 08-01-2013 01:06PM

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Fighting the animals that are the Taliban or blowing up and murdering innocent men women and children who went out shopping on a Saturday

I can assure you the British have killed innocent men women and children out shopping on a Saturday in Iraq and Afghanistan too.

gallag · 08-01-2013 01:17PM

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

I can assure you the British have killed innocent men women and children out shopping on a Saturday in Iraq and Afghanistan too.

I am not oblivious to things like the deplorable drone attacks on the Pakistan border but I can also tell the difference between deliberate and accadent. Planting a bomb in a shopping centre is different to a stray missile accidently hitting a shopping centre.

anncoates · 08-01-2013 01:19PM

It would make you almost want to join the British Army purely out of annoyance.

R P McMurphy · 08-01-2013 01:20PM

gallag wrote: »

I am not oblivious to things like the deplorable drone attacks on the Pakistan border but I can also tell the difference between deliberate and accadent. Planting a bomb in a shopping centre is different to a stray missile accidently hitting a shopping centre.

Could you tell the difference if you happened to be in the shopping centre, would it make any difference

Kess73 · 08-01-2013 01:25PM

Biggins wrote: »

Threats from out of date Neanderthals.

Stuff them!

Literally I hope.

Dissedent Republicans Warn Irish from Joining British

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