Advice please re RB dogs on loose

novicecyclist · 02-12-2012 06:16AM #1

Ok am moving into new home and spoke to one of the neighbours who in conversation mentioned that there are 3 large dogs down the road which are RB let run loose regularly in the back lane, as apparently the owner reckons they're harmless and doesn't muzzel them. The neighbour I spoke to is elderly and terrified of them. They are kept in the front garden of the house with low walls and a bush and a rickety builder type fence. I rarely walk past the house with toddler as i am worried they would get out indeed today I decided to bite the bullet and one of the dogs launched itself at me as i was about to walk by so i about turned.

This makes me nervous as I have a toddler and would like to get a dog myself but the fact that these dogs are wandering unsupervised leaves me nervous. I have seen the owner walking the three RB dogs unmuzzled together and tbh the owner is being dragged by the dogs and does not look like he is in control as the arm is pulled off him.

It has in a way made me nervous about moving into my new house any advice on what I can do about situation as the garden walls are low and am already worried about toddler in back garden and a dog if i get one.

please dont quote as would like to delete this later thanks

mikemac1 · 02-12-2012 06:51AM

What does RB mean?

I googled it but didn't find it

tuxy · 02-12-2012 07:09AM

mikemac1 wrote: »

What does RB mean?

I googled it but didn't find it

I had to google it too, it stands for restricted breed.

meoklmrk91 · 02-12-2012 07:21AM

OP contact your local dog warden, no dog be they Restricted breed or not should be roaming around, they are a potentialdanger to themselves and the general public, even if just by causing a car accident , the warden will most likely have a word with the owner and remind them of the laws regarding all dogs, and those for RB, I am not really a believer in RB legislation personally but I do believe that every dog owner should be in full control of their dogs at all times and they should under no circumstances be allowed to roam unsupervised. The warden will also check for licenses and hopefully that will be the end of it. As long as the owner complies there should be no issues.

horsemaster · 02-12-2012 07:52AM

OP, Have you talked to the Gardai about this? They might be able advise you. It does seem unsafe. What if a child walks by and the dog attacks?

novicecyclist · 02-12-2012 09:23AM

not yet horsemaster only discovered yesterday wasnt sure if they would take me seriously since i havent seen the dogs by themselves yet.

novicecyclist · 02-12-2012 09:29AM

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

OP contact your local dog warden, no dog be they Restricted breed or not should be roaming around, they are a potentialdanger to themselves and the general public, even if just by causing a car accident , the warden will most likely have a word with the owner and remind them of the laws regarding all dogs, and those for RB, I am not really a believer in RB legislation personally but I do believe that every dog owner should be in full control of their dogs at all times and they should under no circumstances be allowed to roam unsupervised. The warden will also check for licenses and hopefully that will be the end of it. As long as the owner complies there should be no issues.

Thanks will do. hopefully owner approachable but seeing how he thinks its ok i doubt it as the dogs are jumping walls into other peoples property hence worry about them getting into mine with a toddler.

meoklmrk91 · 02-12-2012 09:40AM

novicecyclist wrote: »

Thanks will do. hopefully owner approachable but seeing how he thinks its ok i doubt it as the dogs are jumping walls into other peoples property hence worry about them getting into mine with a toddler.

If he isn't approachable and continues to do what he is doing then the warden can take the dogs from him. You can try visiting your local Garda st. and see what their reaction is, they may pay a visit to the owner for you, but in my experience they are so over stretched as it is that dogs are quite low on their list of priorities, I mean that is what the dog warden is for. Still worth a try but I would definitely initiate contact with the warden.

novicecyclist · 02-12-2012 09:50AM

thank you

Melion · 02-12-2012 12:33PM

What breeds are they?

doubleglaze · 02-12-2012 01:18PM

I personally wouldn't have a restricted breed living in a built-up area.

Their presence stirs up fear among neighbours not comfortable with big dogs, which then draws trouble and strife and this sometimes ends up in litigation. At the same time, it's unnatural and unfair on these dogs to keep them on leashes all the time when out in public areas. That said, it is sometimes possible for city dwellers to drive to a quiet area and let them run/roam free as nature intended them to do (for an hour a day or so) in a place where they won't provoke anyone's fear.

doubleglaze · 02-12-2012 01:20PM

Melion wrote: »

What breeds are they?

American Pit Bull Terrier
Bull Mastiff
Doberman Pinscher
English Bull Terrier
German Shepherd (Alsatian)
Japanese Akita
Japanese Tosa
Rhodesian Ridgeback
Rottweiler
Staffordshire Bull Terrier

Every other strain of cross of every breed or type of dog listed above.

SillyMangoX · 02-12-2012 01:22PM

doubleglaze wrote: »

I personally wouldn't have a restricted breed living in a built-up area.

Their presence stirs up fear among neighbours not comfortable with big dogs, which then draws trouble and strife and this sometimes ends up in litigation. At the same time, it's unnatural and unfair on these dogs to keep them on leashes all the time when out in public areas. That said, it is sometimes possible for city dwellers to drive to a quiet area and let them run/roam free as nature intended them to do (for an hour a day or so) in a place where they won't provoke anyone's fear.

Unnatural or not, it is the law unfortunately that they do have to be kept on a lead at all time. It's not a law I agree with, I think it should be down to the individual dog. I'm blessed in that my crossbreed doesn't look like her Rottie daddy too much so we have no bother letting her loose in the woods for a run and don't have to worry about anyone calling the warden etc because I couldn't stick having to muzzle her at all, she's such a sloppy dopey dog. But in this case, the neighborhood is clearly being hassled by these dogs, which by law shouldn't be roaming (RB or not) so if the neighbour can't be reasoned with I would be reporting it to the warden.

bluecherry74 · 02-12-2012 01:24PM

doubleglaze wrote: »

I personally wouldn't have a restricted breed living in a built-up area.

Their presence stirs up fear among neighbours not comfortable with big dogs, which then draws trouble and strife and this sometimes ends up in litigation. At the same time, it's unnatural and unfair on these dogs to keep them on leashes all the time when out in public areas. That said, it is sometimes possible for city dwellers to drive to a quiet area and let them run/roam free as nature intended them to do (for an hour a day or so) in a place where they won't provoke anyone's fear.

Not all RBs are big dogs though, staffies are medium size and relatively short, and there are dozens of much larger breeds that aren't on the RB list.

My two dogs (not RBs) are large-ish and I almost always keep them on the lead in public areas. It's for their own safety and there's nothing unnatural or unfair about it at all.

Melion · 02-12-2012 01:25PM

doubleglaze wrote: »

American Pit Bull Terrier

Bull Mastiff

Doberman Pinscher

English Bull Terrier

German Shepherd (Alsatian)

Japanese Akita

Japanese Tosa

Rhodesian Ridgeback

Rottweiler

Staffordshire Bull Terrier

Every other strain of cross of every breed or type of dog listed above.

I know what RB are, i meant what breeds are causing this person trouble.

I have one of those dogs and refuse to muzzle her.

ISDW · 02-12-2012 03:54PM

doubleglaze wrote: »

I personally wouldn't have a restricted breed living in a built-up area.

Their presence stirs up fear among neighbours not comfortable with big dogs, which then draws trouble and strife and this sometimes ends up in litigation. At the same time, it's unnatural and unfair on these dogs to keep them on leashes all the time when out in public areas. That said, it is sometimes possible for city dwellers to drive to a quiet area and let them run/roam free as nature intended them to do (for an hour a day or so) in a place where they won't provoke anyone's fear.

Really, nature intended domesticated animals to roam free?

I'm pretty scared of cattle, does that mean my neighbours shouldn't farm their cattle in the fields next to my home?

snollup · 02-12-2012 08:05PM

SillyMangoX wrote: »

Unnatural or not, it is the law unfortunately that they do have to be kept on a lead at all time. It's not a law I agree with, I think it should be down to the individual dog. I'm blessed in that my crossbreed doesn't look like her Rottie daddy too much so we have no bother letting her loose in the woods for a run and don't have to worry about anyone calling the warden etc because I couldn't stick having to muzzle her at all, she's such a sloppy dopey dog. But in this case, the neighborhood is clearly being hassled by these dogs, which by law shouldn't be roaming (RB or not) so if the neighbour can't be reasoned with I would be reporting it to the warden.

Sorry to go off topic here but this really winds me up. It would not be practical to have a law based on the individual dog. SillyMango, you chose to get a dog who is a RB cross so you should have done your research first relating to the laws. Why do you think you have a right to pick what laws you feel like abiding by?

Sorry, rant over!

OP, just be careful in that if you first approach your neighbor and then have to turn to the Guards/Dig Warden he will know it was you that alerted them. Could you get a few of your other neighbors to approach him with you?

SillyMangoX · 02-12-2012 08:22PM

I didnt choose what breed my dog would be. We were getting a golden retriever x red setter from a friend but the dog was mis mated. When the pups came out black we originally thought the father was a black Labrador so why would we have changed what we were doing just because she developed brown eyebrows? I know all about the laws but as far as I am concerned she is a black golden retriever.

fatmammycat · 02-12-2012 08:29PM

snollup wrote: »

Sorry to go off topic here but this really winds me up. It would not be practical to have a law based on the individual dog.

Actually it's perfectly practical to have a law based on individual dogs, and we had just that before 1991. The RB legislation is a knee jerk UK-based bad law, and I for one don't follow it to the letter either (neither do I have my RB dog loose in public, but then neither would I have ANY large breed dog with questionable recall loose in public).

Odysseus · 02-12-2012 08:40PM

snollup wrote: »

OP, just be careful in that if you first approach your neighbor and then have to turn to the Guards/Dig Warden he will know it was you that alerted them. Could you get a few of your other neighbors to approach him with you?

Is that wise, getting a group of people to knock in at the same time doesn't seem to be the best way of tacking it.

snollup · 02-12-2012 08:55PM

fatmammycat wrote: »

Actually it's perfectly practical to have a law based on individual dogs, and we had just that before 1991. The RB legislation is a knee jerk UK-based bad law, and I for one don't follow it to the letter either (neither do I have my RB dog loose in public, but then neither would I have ANY large breed dog with questionable recall loose in public).

I never knew that about per 91. I still do not think it is very practical to legislate on a case by case basis. I can't think of any other examples of where the law operates in that way.

Odysseus wrote: »

Is that wise, getting a group of people to knock in at the same time doesn't seem to be the best way of tacking it.

To clarify, I mean to approach in a friendly civil manor. If it is an issue that concerns the whole neighbourhood maybe it could be dealt with collectively and not left to the op alone.

Rommie · 02-12-2012 09:21PM

snollup wrote: »

I never knew that about per 91. I still do not think it is very practical to legislate on a case by case basis. I can't think of any other examples of where the law operates in that way.

Murderers perhaps? You know, instead of locking up everyone because they might cause harm, you lock up the ones known to have caused harm. I dont see why it should be any different with dogs, it's just prejudice against certain breeds whereas all breeds are quite capable of attacking, hurting and killing someone. Same as all humans are

time lord · 02-12-2012 09:22PM

doubleglaze wrote: »

American Pit Bull Terrier

Bull Mastiff

Doberman Pinscher

English Bull Terrier

German Shepherd (Alsatian)

Japanese Akita

Japanese Tosa

Rhodesian Ridgeback

Rottweiler

Staffordshire Bull Terrier

Every other strain of cross of every breed or type of dog listed above.

Don't forget the Bandog:)

snollup · 02-12-2012 09:46PM

Rommie wrote: »

Murderers perhaps? You know, instead of locking up everyone because they might cause harm, you lock up the ones known to have caused harm. I dont see why it should be any different with dogs, it's just prejudice against certain breeds whereas all breeds are quite capable of attacking, hurting and killing someone. Same as all humans are

It is generally the owner that makes for the dogs temperament/personality alright I guess! My problem is with people deciding that they will decide will not follow these laws and then trying to justify it. At the end of the day the law is the law regardless of our option of it. Maybe get out and try to lobby your local TD. I think the speed limit is to low on certain roads around where I live but that does not give me right to break them!

Anyway, I do see your point regarding the RB laws. I think OPs thread has been hijacked enough, sorry!

ISDW · 02-12-2012 09:59PM

snollup wrote: »

I never knew that about per 91. I still do not think it is very practical to legislate on a case by case basis. I can't think of any other examples of where the law operates in that way.

Its actually still in Irish law. If a dog that isn't on the RB list causes problems, the owner can be taken to court and the dog can be labelled a Dangerous Dog, and certain conditions imposed up on it. So the legislation exists to treat all dogs in the same way, regardless of breed. In fact, even if a dog is on the RB list, it can still be 'tried' under that legislation.

03-12-2012 01:16PM

From someone who owns a well behaved, socialised American Akita who is just 16 months old, the LAST thing I'd ever want to encounter in a dark park is someone else's Akita off the leash roaming around without a muzzle. To say that would terrify me would be an understatement. I'd be terrified for my own dog that he'd get attacked/in a fight.

This was reinforced the other night when we encountered a German Shepard/Alsation who was staring at my dog like a maniac from the minute he saw him, we purposely went the other way to avoid him and a few hundred metres up, we see the same dog off the leash in Kilbogget Park in Cabinteely, we thankfully saw him and continued to avoid him but my Akita who currently weighs over 50KG (and growing) has been attacked in the public by a variety of dogs from miniature schnauzers in Killiney Hill to white Samoyeds (male) who love to start fights with my dog. I'm not sure if it's because my dog has a completely black face and he scares them or that he is not neutered but it's not pleasant at all and I hate dealing with it. I'm 15 stone myself and 6 foot tall so can take care of myself but this definitely makes me and my girlfriend nervous.

If you can't control your dog or if your dog likes to attack dogs three times their size, keep the maniac on a leash please!!!

ISDW · 03-12-2012 01:25PM

Deleted User wrote: »

From someone who owns a well behaved, socialised American Akita who is just 16 months old, the LAST thing I'd ever want to encounter in a dark park is someone else's Akita off the leash roaming around without a muzzle. To say that would terrify me would be an understatement. I'd be terrified for my own dog that he'd get attacked/in a fight.

This was reinforced the other night when we encountered a German Shepard/Alsation who was staring at my dog like a maniac from the minute he saw him, we purposely went the other way to avoid him and a few hundred metres up, we see the same dog off the leash in Kilbogget Park in Cabinteely, we thankfully saw him and continued to avoid him but my Akita who currently weighs over 50KG (and growing) has been attacked in the public by a variety of dogs from miniature schnauzers in Killiney Hill to white Samoyeds (male) who love to start fights with my dog. I'm not sure if it's because my dog has a completely black face and he scares them or that he is not neutered but it's not pleasant at all and I hate dealing with it. I'm 15 stone myself and 6 foot tall so can take care of myself but this definitely makes me and my girlfriend nervous.

If you can't control your dog or if your dog likes to attack dogs three times their size, keep the maniac on a leash please!!!

but the fact that your dog has been attacked by dogs who aren't on the RB list negates your argument. it is obviously the owners of the dogs who haven't trained and socialised their dogs who have caused the issue, not the breed of dog.

03-12-2012 01:45PM

My argument wasn't about RB solely. I have an RB.

My point is this: If you can't control your dog or if your dog likes to attack dogs three times their size, keep the maniac on a leash please!!!

Plus, I don't ever believe Akitas (THE BREED I HAVE) should be allowed roam in a public place.

Get me?

Whispered · 03-12-2012 01:55PM

When you say roam, do you mean offlead with their owner present, or do you mean roam, as in wander about on their own?

03-12-2012 02:38PM

Off the leash with their owner present is fine in areas where the dogs are allowed or where there are no people around but if you can't control your dog or if your dog likes to attack dogs three times their size, keep the maniac on a leash please!!!

That's fair enough.

toadfly · 03-12-2012 02:51PM

Deleted User wrote: »

My point is this: If you can't control your dog or if your dog likes to attack dogs three times their size, keep the maniac on a leash please!!!

Exactly, but the breed shouldnt come into it. There are a lot of large breeds not on the list that are capable of the same damage as a RB.

Edit: here is a list of large dog breeds and from a quick glance only 5 are on the RB list...doesnt make sense.

http://www.justdogbreeds.com/large-dog-breeds.html

Advice please re RB dogs on loose

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