Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 12/13

Melion · 29-11-2012 03:50PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Amazingly, Kenny has well over twice as many top flight management games under his belt since 1995 compared to Rodgers (this is not a good thing for the latter btw) - but he's managed for a handful of those 17 years. You need to stop saying 'what has he done in 17 years?' like it is some damning indictment of his managerial ability. He wasn't managing for the vast majority of that time period - and he has still won as much as Harry ****ing Redknapp despite it.

I dont care how many top flight matches he has managed for, couldnt give a toss really. Thats not the issue being discussed.

In all of those games, which would you deem as succesful?
Taking over a potentially title winning team in Newcastle and finished 2nd before destroying the team and finishing 13th the next year?

Not much else to go on to deem as a success.

Jayob10 · 29-11-2012 03:50PM

daithijjj wrote: »

Some people just have no vision, be it the running of the club or whatever.

If any of you think Sterling shouldnt get rested for at least 4 or 5 games you dont really know how things should work. You are probably the same crew who thought Insua had come on great and after xmas thought he was a joke player.

It isnt about level of performance, its about nurturing talent and not letting players get burnt out, which happens quicker at that age. Insua got burnt out, we dont need that happening to Sterling.

A small rest during a season (or long period of starting every game) for whatever reason does wonders for some players, Enrique's performances over the last 3 games is an example in our own set up.

it goes without saying that Sterling should be rested periodically, any sane fan would know he needs proper handling.

daithijjj · 29-11-2012 03:51PM

Melion wrote: »

Who would you like in his place for 5 matches?

Take a few moments to reflect on what is being said and you might come to the conclusion that it doesnt matter who plays instead of him. The welfare of the player is of the utmost importance, not who fills in for a few games.

Leiva · 29-11-2012 03:52PM

OK I think a line in the sand needs to be drawn with all the Rodgers 'vs' Kenny stuff and comparing and guess work.

It's silly at this stage.

We should discuss the here and now and what we see each game.

Then we can talk about Rafa's return and how the club will be a massive success again and we fly up the league and CL league tables.:P

all pigs fed and ready to fly.

Melion · 29-11-2012 03:52PM

daithijjj wrote: »

Take a few moments to reflect on what is being said and you might come to the conclusion that it doesnt matter who plays instead of him. The welfare of the player is of the utmost importance, not who fills in for a few games.

Well im sorry but i would have an issue with Downing playing, i want our best players on the pitch as much as possible :rolleyes:

I notice neither yourself or Lloyd cared enough to discuss my points earlier about Rooney and Fabregas.

Kess73 · 29-11-2012 03:54PM

Melion wrote: »

Since 1995?
Both have had 1 meaningless trophy win at Wembley.

Have to disagree with ya there. The League cup may get slagged off and what not, but winning it is not meaningless.

It does not come with the same level of prestiege as the FA cup or the league in Domestic terms, but it is something that any supporter should be happy for their team to win should they make the final.

Speaking for myself I know that when Cardiff missed their final whistle I was over the moon to see us win some silverware. The season as a whole may have been a damp squip, but the actual winning of something is never a bad thing for a club.

29-11-2012 03:55PM

What I'd give for a league cup this year tbh.

Melion · 29-11-2012 03:57PM

Kess73 wrote: »

Have to disagree with ya there. The League cup may get slagged off and what not, but winning it is not meaningless.

It does not come with the same level of prestiege as the FA cup or the league in Domestic terms, but it is something that any supporter should be happy for their team to win should they make the final.

Speaking for myself I know that when Cardiff missed their final whistle I was over the moon to see us win some silverware. The season as a whole may have been a damp squip, but the actual winning of something is never a bad thing for a club.

Thats all well and good but im sure the Swansea players and fans were a lot happier at winning their trophy at Wembley than the Liverpool players and fans. Obviously, if you get to the semi-final then you want to win the trophy but in the grand scheme of things its fairly meaningless.

IMO all that win did was paper over a lot of cracks that were appearing in the team last March and let Kenny think he was untouchable.

Melion · 29-11-2012 03:58PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

What I'd give for a league cup this year tbh.

League cup or an extra 10 league points?

I know which id prefer and it wouldnt involved a trip to Wembley.

29-11-2012 04:03PM

Melion wrote: »

League cup or an extra 10 league points?

I know which id prefer and it wouldnt involved a trip to Wembley.

10 extra league points would have moved us one place from 8th to 7th last year.

Plus, there'd be no european competition at all.

15/20 points different story.

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:06PM

I think if given the option in August then a lot of people would have preferred to have no european football this season, its stretching our already weak squad way too thin.

29-11-2012 04:10PM

Melion wrote: »

I think if given the option in August then a lot of people would have preferred to have no european football this season, its stretching our already weak squad way too thin.

I think the games are proving good for the squad players this season tbf.

Hidalgo · 29-11-2012 04:10PM

Whilst players like Sterling need to be managed very carefully, he doesn't necessarily need a 4-5 game rest. For arguments sake, sya he's rested this Saturday, play him again the following weekend and the game after, then rest him for another week-10 days.

What can be equally useful is taking players off after 60 mins or so, especially if in control of a game (which is a rarity). The latter stages of a game are when players are under the most pressure, fatigue etc sets in, even small respites can help alleviate the potential of burnout.

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:13PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

I think the games are proving good for the squad players this season tbf.

For the squad players yes, but an injury to Suarez against Udinese and we are in trouble. Same goes for Johnson, Skrtel, Agger etc.

Ardent · 29-11-2012 04:14PM

Jayob10 wrote: »

Mascherano has not been replaced. Lucas, as influential as he is, has not played enough football to be classified as being at the level of Masch yet.

Mascherano was the best in his position in the world IMO.

Lucas is a cracking player, but he is getting better and better the more games he misses in alot of ways. Never have I seen a players value rocket, the more games he misses with injury.

I'm not having a pop, just saying that a little perspective is needed.

Andy Carroll was the like for like replacement for Torres

Well said. Lucas is so overrated by Liverpool fans it's hilarious. He has improved a lot since his first few disastrous seasons in a Liverpool shirt but he ain't no Mascherano. Nor Didi Hamann for that matter.

daithijjj · 29-11-2012 04:14PM

Melion wrote: »

Well im sorry but i would have an issue with Downing playing, i want our best players on the pitch as much as possible :rolleyes:

I notice neither yourself or Lloyd cared enough to discuss my points earlier about Rooney and Fabregas.

The best player in the world didnt play 30 games in a season until he was 20/21. Thats how you nurture players in the right way. Not everyone has a 28 yr olds body when they are 17 like Rooney (i didnt read your post on Rooney or Fabregas). Finding exceptions to the rule isnt how to go about it.

smileyj1987 · 29-11-2012 04:15PM

Best news all season !

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/rodgers-lucas-in-saints-contention

The boss said: "He's very much looking forward to it. He's worked tirelessly in his recovery. We're just trying to nudge him along and make sure it's the right time.
"He had a few weeks of training before he played his reserve game. He looked very capable in that game and he's had another week of training and I don't think he can go any further with regards to training.
"His next step is games, so hopefully in the next couple of weeks he'll get opportunities to play and improve his football fitness.
"Mentally he's a tough boy. His mental fitness is very strong and he's looking forward to helping the team.
"It's a big boost because he's well in tune with what we're trying to do here. He's been kicking his heels on the side wanting to help his mates and the group, so I am delighted to have him back.
"He's a good guy and has a lot to offer the team, both on and off the field, and it'll be great to have him back in the squad."

29-11-2012 04:15PM

Melion wrote: »

For the squad players yes, but an injury to Suarez against Udinese and we are in trouble. Same goes for Johnson, Skrtel, Agger etc.

We are walking a Suarez tightrope all season.

I'd still like to see us qualify obviously. If we can reinforce in Jan with a few players we can maybe have a shot at the comp.

Kess73 · 29-11-2012 04:15PM

Melion wrote: »

Thats all well and good but im sure the Swansea players and fans were a lot happier at winning their trophy at Wembley than the Liverpool players and fans. Obviously, if you get to the semi-final then you want to win the trophy but in the grand scheme of things its fairly meaningless.

IMO all that win did was paper over a lot of cracks that were appearing in the team last March and let Kenny think he was untouchable.

How can you know that the Swnasea players and fans were happier to win a play off than the Liverpool players and fans were to win the league cup?

That is simply not quantifiable.

Yes some used the league cup win as something to paper up cracks, but I would wager the vast majority of our support were just delighted to win something.

What you are saying sounds more like you are associating the cup win with later excuses rather than just enjoying the win for what it was in itself.

It is easy to say things like the league cup or the FA cup, or ask someone if they would prefer the league cup over a good league finishing place, but life does not work that way and quite often you get what you get and you can be happy about an achievement, and it is one, or try to run it down after the event.

I want as much silverware as is possible to be won by Liverpool FC each season. I want as good a league finish as is possible each season. I want my club to be contesting the league title and fighting for the CL. But unless you have the power to be the Devil to my Faust, I am going to have to be happy for any trophy the club wins, and I am going to celebrate the winning of each one as if it was the last the club would win.

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:16PM

daithijjj wrote: »

The best player in the world didnt play 30 games in a season until he was 20/21. Thats how you nurture players in the right way. Not everyone has a 28 yr olds body when they are 17 like Rooney (i didnt read your post on Rooney or Fabregas). Finding exceptions to the rule isnt how to go about it.

Messi had Deco and Ronaldinho ahead of him, he wasnt needed at Barcelona as much as Sterling is needed at Liverpool. Im in no way comparing the 2 before anyone says i am :rolleyes:

daithijjj · 29-11-2012 04:17PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

What I'd give for a league cup this year tbh.

As much as fans dont think it matters too much i could see many of the players thinking exactly that. 90% (maybe more) of that squad won their first medal for the club last year.

29-11-2012 04:17PM

smileyj1987 wrote: »

Best news all season !

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/rodgers-lucas-in-saints-contention

The boss said: "He's very much looking forward to it. He's worked tirelessly in his recovery. We're just trying to nudge him along and make sure it's the right time.
"He had a few weeks of training before he played his reserve game. He looked very capable in that game and he's had another week of training and I don't think he can go any further with regards to training.
"His next step is games, so hopefully in the next couple of weeks he'll get opportunities to play and improve his football fitness.
"Mentally he's a tough boy. His mental fitness is very strong and he's looking forward to helping the team.
"It's a big boost because he's well in tune with what we're trying to do here. He's been kicking his heels on the side wanting to help his mates and the group, so I am delighted to have him back.
"He's a good guy and has a lot to offer the team, both on and off the field, and it'll be great to have him back in the squad."

He'll get some cheer on Sat

His first name is Lucas, is Lucas , is Lucas
His second name is Leiva, is Leiva, is Leiva
And that is why we like him, we like him, we like him
In fact we fúcking love him, we love him, we love him
WHOA WHOA WHOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
WHOA WHOA WHOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

daithijjj · 29-11-2012 04:18PM

Melion wrote: »

Messi had Deco and Ronaldinho ahead of him, he wasnt needed at Barcelona as much as Sterling is needed at Liverpool. Im in no way comparing the 2 before anyone says i am :rolleyes:

Wake up ffs, its isnt about who is in the team, stop being myopic.

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:19PM

Kess73 wrote: »

How can you know that the Swnasea players and fans were happier to win a play off than the Liverpool players and fans were to win the league cup?

That is simply not quantifiable.

Yes some used the league cup win as something to paper up cracks, but I would wager the vast majority of our support were just delighted to win something.

What you are saying sounds more like you are associating the cup win with later excuses rather than just enjoying the win for what it was in itself.

It is easy to say things like the league cup or the FA cup, or ask someone if they would prefer the league cup over a good league finishing place, but life does not work that way and quite often you get what you get and you can be happy about an achievement, and it is one, or try to run it down after the event.

I want as much silverware as is possible to be won by Liverpool FC each season. I want as good a league finish as is possible each season. I want my club to be contesting the league title and fighting for the CL. But unless you have the power to be the Devil to my Faust, I am going to have to be happy for any trophy the club wins, and I am going to celebrate the winning of each one as if it was the last the club would win.

An honest question, and im sorry for how short it is after you typing all that ^^^^. Would you prefer a league cup win and to finish 7th in the league or would you rather "punt" all cups,be knocked out in the first round and finished 4th in the league?

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:21PM

daithijjj wrote: »

Wake up ffs, its isnt about who is in the team, stop being myopic.

Sterling right now is essential to our first team, Messi at the same age was not essential to Barcelona. That is my point.

I would love if we signed someone in January who could take half the workload off Raheem and allow him to have a decent break. But at the moment, there is nobody in the squad capable enough to fill in for him. It is really that simple in my eyes.

Cartman78 · 29-11-2012 04:24PM

Melion wrote: »

League cup or an extra 10 league points?

I know which id prefer and it wouldnt involved a trip to Wembley.

(iirc Lucas got injured against Chelsea in the Carling Cup (?))

Here's another hypothetical 'would you rather' -

A) Winning the Carling Cup and Lucas getting injured for 12 months or

Getting knocked out of Carling Cup and Lucas being fit and mega for 12 months and.........(insert Kenny fantasy dreamland scenario)

daithijjj · 29-11-2012 04:27PM

Melion wrote: »

Sterling right now is essential to our first team, Messi at the same age was not essential to Barcelona. That is my point.

I would love if we signed someone in January who could take half the workload off Raheem and allow him to have a decent break. But at the moment, there is nobody in the squad capable enough to fill in for him. It is really that simple in my eyes.

Nobody is essential in this team right now apart from Suarez.

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:28PM

daithijjj wrote: »

Nobody is essential in this team right now apart from Suarez.

Sorry but Johnson, Agger and Sterling are essential in this team.

T-K-O · 29-11-2012 04:31PM

Melion wrote: »

He scored 6 league goals last season. He couldnt play 2 games in a row. What use was he?

He often played two games in a row and he gave more to the team than goals. Debating this is so one sided it's pointless.

Melion · 29-11-2012 04:38PM

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/brendan-on-sterling-contract

Brendan Rodgers is confident Raheem Sterling will soon put pen to paper on a new Liverpool deal.
raheem sterling

The 17-year-old has excelled so far this season having been given a regular run in the first team - and his manager is optimistic the winger will sign a new contact soon.

Rodgers told a press conference at Melwood: "The club and his representatives are in good dialogue and good communication, and hopefully we'll get that resolved very soon."

Sterling has made 21 appearances in 2012-13, while also earning a first senior cap with England.

Reporters asked Rodgers if he had any concern about the amount of minutes the No.31 had clocked up already this term.

The boss replied: "There will be at some point and we'll need to give him a breather, there's is no question [about that].

"He's a very young man and is still learning the game. He still has technical elements he needs to improve upon and tactical elements.

"But one of the biggest things is psycological at this level - real mental fatigue can set in.

"He's been terrific so far. He's got to this stage at the end of November and been absolutely brilliant, but at some point he will need that breather.

"He's been one of our leading players, but for the benefit of Raheem it'll be something I'll need to consider."

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 12/13

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