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Ireland De-Facto Visa

12467…12

Comments

  • #152
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    summerstar12 wrote: »
    I spoke to someone in immigration a few weeks back and she advised that once we get the application in and receive the letter of acknowledgement, that it automatically extends his holiday visa and allows him to stay till a decision is made. Does anyone know if we have to go in and get another 90 holiday visa stamp on his passport? As his current holiday visa expires on the 18th of this month.

    not sure if this is the case - for us, confirmation that an application was in process meant he could remain whilst it was being processed, but we still had to go to Burgh Quay to get an extension on the actual visa. Even if you don't HAVE to do this, I would anyway - otherwise there will be stamps in the visa that have expired and no new ones, so it will look like a gap. If your OH ever wants to apply for citizenship it is done based upon stamps, so it is best not to have any breaks between them. Its best for continuity IMO. You just show them the letter and give them your case reference number and ask them to extend the holiday visa. Depending on how long it takes to process your application, you might have to do this more than once, but personally I think it is worth it, so that all the i's are dotted and t's crossed. Better that then find out in a few years that there is a problem or something is more complicated simply because it looks like a visa expired and wasn't renewed.


  • #153
    adublinguy
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭adublinguy


    Hi All

    Applying for this tomorrow with my non EEA girlfriend.

    Have a huge portfolio of photos, emails, bank statements, everything we can think of...

    my girlfriend is also pregnant with our first child, we had already decided to apply for defacto before we even knew, and we plan to marry next year but dont want to marry just for the sake of a visa.

    one thing concerning me is my lack of savings, i have been in full time employment for the last 7 years and i am paid quite well, but had a car loan etc for the last few years, but have managed to finish paying it off. i could easily support us both if needed.

    also my GF's visa was extended for 3 months in sept so we could apply for this (as we were waiting for her birth cert to arrive from brazil)

    does anyone know if the fact she is pregnant will help?

    if refused we are in a serious problem

    any advice would be greatly appreciated.


  • #154
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    summerstar12 wrote: »
    Just to update you all, I submitted the de-facto application on Friday, hand delivered the massive folder to the offices on Burgh Quay, and got a letter today to confirm they received it! We are shocked to have received a response so quickly, so hope that it is a good sign! Now the anxious wait to see if they grant him a visa to stay or not!

    I spoke to someone in immigration a few weeks back and she advised that once we get the application in and receive the letter of acknowledgement, that it automatically extends his holiday visa and allows him to stay till a decision is made. Does anyone know if we have to go in and get another 90 holiday visa stamp on his passport? As his current holiday visa expires on the 18th of this month.

    Also if they deny our de-facto visa, how long do they give a person to leave the country and can we appeal?

    Sorry just so anxious and apprehensive, as it would be totally devastating if they refuse us, as we already had to do nearly 18 months long distance due to me over staying my visa in Australia so I got a 3 year ban and couldn't go over to him, and it took him so long to get to me due to finance issues!

    Always have an up to date stamp on your passport. Even if it means getting a Stamp 3 and paying 150 euro for the privilege. The first thing I did when I got back from Australia was to get a stamp 3 so I had it in my passport while I was waiting for the application. You could be waiting for months for a decision.
    We are going to put our application in tomorrow just a few more letters to write and include in it. Going to be a nerve wracking wait then to see if they grant him the visa. I don't know what we will do if it is denied as I can't go back to Australia with him because I stupidly overstayed my visa back in 2010 and got a 3 year ban! Aside from the fact we just don't have much money at the moment.

    I know it's too late now but did the Australian Immigration Department put a stamp in your passport to say that you got deported? The gards ask for a copy of every page of your passport when you submit in an application.


  • #155
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    adublinguy wrote: »
    Hi All

    Applying for this tomorrow with my non EEA girlfriend.

    Have a huge portfolio of photos, emails, bank statements, everything we can think of...

    my girlfriend is also pregnant with our first child, we had already decided to apply for defacto before we even knew, and we plan to marry next year but dont want to marry just for the sake of a visa.

    one thing concerning me is my lack of savings, i have been in full time employment for the last 7 years and i am paid quite well, but had a car loan etc for the last few years, but have managed to finish paying it off. i could easily support us both if needed.

    also my GF's visa was extended for 3 months in sept so we could apply for this (as we were waiting for her birth cert to arrive from brazil)

    does anyone know if the fact she is pregnant will help?

    if refused we are in a serious problem

    any advice would be greatly appreciated.
    Don't know if you will get around to reading my reply before you post it. I don't have any kids with my fiancee but you would think that they fact that your partner is pregnant should have a positive influence on their decision. To separate a family would be very harsh. Due to the well being of your partner and case I am guessing in the scenario of a Stamp 4 refusal they may offer her a Stamp 3 which will allow her to stay for 12 months but with no working rights. She will probably decide on not working but a Stamp 4 will have more clout with the Department of Social Protection. I doubt you can get social welfare benefits on a Stamp 3.

    You should put in your letter that you plan to marry and raise your child in Ireland. That will prove that you want your family to have a life in the country. If your worried about debts it might be an idea to include that you have paid off your car loan to say that you have no debts.


  • #156
    summerstar12
    Registered Users Posts: 4 ✭summerstar12


    FalconXV wrote: »
    Always have an up to date stamp on your passport. Even if it means getting a Stamp 3 and paying 150 euro for the privilege. The first thing I did when I got back from Australia was to get a stamp 3 so I had it in my passport while I was waiting for the application. You could be waiting for months for a decision.



    I know it's too late now but did the Australian Immigration Department put a stamp in your passport to say that you got deported? The gards ask for a copy of every page of your passport when you submit in an application.

    Hi Falconxv, we are still waiting on a decision put the defacto application in the start of August. The Australian Immigration department didn't actually stamp my passport when I got my 3 year ban, I didn't get deported because I didn't get caught while still in the country and forced to leave I was just stopped while leaving through Brisbane airport because I had over stayed 7 months and the officer advised me of my 3 year ban. Nerve wreaking still waiting on the decision and really hard to survive on just my money! So hope we get the decision we want soon.


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  • #157
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    summerstar12 wrote: »
    Hi Falconxv, we are still waiting on a decision put the defacto application in the start of August. The Australian Immigration department didn't actually stamp my passport when I got my 3 year ban, I didn't get deported because I didn't get caught while still in the country and forced to leave I was just stopped while leaving through Brisbane airport because I had over stayed 7 months and the officer advised me of my 3 year ban. Nerve wreaking still waiting on the decision and really hard to survive on just my money! So hope we get the decision we want soon.

    Time to start writing to your TD to try and get a decision.


  • #158
    adublinguy
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭adublinguy


    FalconXV wrote: »
    Don't know if you will get around to reading my reply before you post it. I don't have any kids with my fiancee but you would think that they fact that your partner is pregnant should have a positive influence on their decision. To separate a family would be very harsh. Due to the well being of your partner and case I am guessing in the scenario of a Stamp 4 refusal they may offer her a Stamp 3 which will allow her to stay for 12 months but with no working rights. She will probably decide on not working but a Stamp 4 will have more clout with the Department of Social Protection. I doubt you can get social welfare benefits on a Stamp 3.

    You should put in your letter that you plan to marry and raise your child in Ireland. That will prove that you want your family to have a life in the country. If your worried about debts it might be an idea to include that you have paid off your car loan to say that you have no debts.


    thanks alot for your reply..

    yes i did put all this in our application...the only thing worrying me is that they refuse on not having any savings, but at the same time, if they refuse on that and issue her a stamp 3, this goes against the refusal as she will be unable to to work with this.so we;d be obviously in a better situation with a stamp 4 as she could work also(until she becomes too large and tired!0..so im hoping all will be well


  • #159
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    adublinguy wrote: »
    thanks alot for your reply..

    yes i did put all this in our application...the only thing worrying me is that they refuse on not having any savings, but at the same time, if they refuse on that and issue her a stamp 3, this goes against the refusal as she will be unable to to work with this.so we;d be obviously in a better situation with a stamp 4 as she could work also(until she becomes too large and tired!0..so im hoping all will be well

    If you read through the thread people have posted that they got approved without substantial savings but don't use that to get your hopes up. It is done on a case by case basis. It would be daft to award her a Stamp 3 and expect her to live in the state while pregnant just on her savings. It would put massive pressure on you and not fair on the child when it is born. Delaying the decision doesn't help your family either.

    I am not sure if there is another visa you could apply for based on your family situation in case of a rejection. It might be worth looking in to even though the GNIB website is a dog's breakfast.
    Just to update you all, I submitted the de-facto application on Friday, hand delivered the massive folder to the offices on Burgh Quay, and got a letter today to confirm they received it! We are shocked to have received a response so quickly, so hope that it is a good sign! Now the anxious wait to see if they grant him a visa to stay or not!

    A notification letter might sound promising but in reality you still could wait months for a decision.


  • #160
    adublinguy
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭adublinguy


    FalconXV wrote: »
    If you read through the thread people have posted



    A notification letter might sound promising but in reality you still could wait months for a decision.


    yeah we got out notification letter 3 days after we submitted out application too, im guessing it will be weeks before anything happens at least

    thanks alot for your help mate.


  • #161
    Liger87
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭Liger87


    I applied in August for defacto for my girlfriend who spent 3 months but has had to go home as her tourist visa is up, is there any rough time frame anyone can suggest when I will receive an answer about my request, stressed not the word :(


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  • #162
    DonovanPR
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭DonovanPR


    Hello everyone,

    I'm going to apply for the DeFacto relationship visa, for my GF, she is Japanese citizen and im Spanish EEU Citizen living and working in Ireland for over 2 years.

    Just wanted to be sure that this is the right address to send all the documentation?


    De Facto Applications,
    3rd Floor,
    Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service,
    13-14 Burgh Quay,
    Dublin 2.


    Thank you in advance guys.

    Regards,


  • #163
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    DonovanPR wrote: »
    Hello everyone,

    I'm going to apply for the DeFacto relationship visa, for my GF, she is Japanese citizen and im Spanish EEU Citizen living and working in Ireland for over 2 years.

    Just wanted to be sure that this is the right address to send all the documentation?


    De Facto Applications,
    3rd Floor,
    Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service,
    13-14 Burgh Quay,
    Dublin 2.


    Thank you in advance guys.

    Regards,

    Yeah and good luck. I sent mine by registered post as there was a lot of personal stuff in there. Have to be grateful that you don't have to post your passport (which you have to do with the UK).


  • #164
    jmelynzoe
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭jmelynzoe


    Hi all,
    Since we found the boards to be quite helpful when preparing my application for an Irish defacto relationship visa, I decided to go ahead and pay it forward by sharing our own (recent) successful experience in obtaining my visa, including some info on our background and application. I hope it’ll help someone out there. First, let me say that we posted the application by registered mail to INIS (General Immigration Division, 3rd floor, 13/14 Burgh’s Quay, Dublin 2) on September 18th, a confirmation letter that it had arrived was posted by INIS on September 21st, and finally, the letter granting me the (initially 12 month) Stamp 4 visa was posted by INIS on February 6th. So, if you’re counting, it came to roughly 4 ½ to 5 months of wait time for us.

    In the interim, we did try to contact the helpline (01-6167700 or *LoCall 1890 551 500 (Select Option 3 then Option 5)) a couple of times to see how things were coming along, but the line is only open on Thursdays from 10:00am-12:30pm. And more often than not I was greeted with a recording stating that, due to high call volumes, they were no longer bothering to take calls and all enquiries must be made by post. **Here’s a tip though: if you hang up and redial about 12 times in a row, a glitch in the system seems to finally put your call through to a representative (I know it sounds psychotic). Overall though, no one could really tell me where I stood or how much longer it would take. In the early stages, they were sort of helpful in answering questions related to what to put in the application, though. Just keep that in mind.

    Moving on…

    About our background: I am a 28-year-old American woman, and my boyfriend is 30 years old and Irish. We met in Cork in 2007 when I was living in Ireland as a full-time volunteer in social services for a year. We began a relationship in January 2008, but I moved back to the U.S. in July of that year. From July 2008 until June 2012, we carried on long distance seeing each other for a couple weeks, a couple times a year in our respective countries. I was able to stay with him in Ireland for 3 months of my summer break in 2011 and decided then to return in Summer 2012 on a 12 month working holiday visa (http://www.dfa.ie/home/index.aspx?id=73713). So, after graduating with my Masters degree this May, I came over on the visa at the beginning of June. At the time we applied for the defacto visa in September, we had been living together 3 months, plus the 3 months before. However, he was the only tenant named on the lease, the utilities were all in his name, and we didn’t (and still do not) have a joint bank account. I was lucky enough to also have a job offer, which I have since started, that came just before I finally decided to post the application, so I do think that that helped my case. As well, my partner is gainfully employed in a pretty specialized occupation here. We each had a bit of savings in our own accounts, too, so I guess all of these things add up.

    The application we sent was massive, but here’s a run down of what we included:
    I. Letters of Intention—from both
    *Basically stated the duration and lasting nature of our relationship, our desire for me to live and work in the country, that I intend to be a productive member of society here, etc., etc.
    II. Passport and Endorsements—me
    III. IDs, GNIB Registration Card and PPS Letter—me
    IV. Job Offer Letter and Working Holiday Authorization—me
    V. Certificate of Medical Insurance—me
    *The woman at INIS told me this was necessary. Luckily, I had to have it already to come over on my current visa.
    VI. Diplomas, Transcripts, Social Work License and Irish Recognition of Credentials—me
    VII. Curriculum Vitae—me
    VIII. Bank Statements and Past 12 Months Work Pay Information—me
    IX. Passport and Endorsements—him
    X. Lease and Utility Bills—him
    XI. Diploma—him
    XII. Curriculum Vitae—him
    XIII. Bank Statements and Past 12 Months Work Pay Information—him
    XIV. Travel Documentation—from both
    *Flight tickets, hotel confirmation emails, etc.—anything that proved that we were going back and forth to see each other and taking trips together.
    XV. Greeting Cards and Letters—from both
    *Valentines, Christmas cards, letters—plus we had some with envelopes date-stamped by the post office going back to the beginning
    XVI. Email Inbox Records—from both
    *Lots and lots of emails from 2007 to the present. We just printed out screen shots of our entire inboxes.
    XVII. Text Message Records—from both
    *Records of text messages sent and received to each other in our mobile bills. We did skype too, but didn’t include any skype records in the application.
    XVIII. Joint Wedding Invitations/Thank You Cards—from both
    *From weddings that we attended together. This shows that we are involved with each other’s social groups and attended these events together, as a couple.
    XIX. Photos—from both
    *About 50 in total. Photos together or ones that were obviously from trips we had taken together. I added the dates of each of the photos and what they were from myself.

    So, I do hope this hasn’t been too overwhelming, but I know there are a lot of questions about the whole process. If anyone wants to reply to my post, I will try my best to get back here and answer any questions. I wish you all the very best of luck.


  • #165
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    Folks....quick question.

    applying for citizenship for the OH. We both recently got a new passports and so we need to get a certified copies done. The only solicitor in my area open on a Saturday wants €30 to do a colour certified copy!! (€20 for a normal one, extra €10 for colour! madness). Plus, I phoned her and she is not open tomorrow morning as is attending a funeral, so will have to wait til next saturday.

    I work a few doors away from an embassy (not the embassy of OH's country, another one). They only charge €15 for a certified copy, even in colour, and will put both passports on . Do you think INIS would accept it certified by the other embassy? I am trying to work it out - if it was certified by my husbands embassy they would accept it, so why not the embassy of another country? They are legally notarised etc.

    do you think it is worth a shot? Really eager to get this all sent off. If I can get it notarised by the other embassy we can do that on Monday and send it that afternoon.

    Any thoughts???


  • #166
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    Little Ted wrote: »
    Folks....quick question.

    applying for citizenship for the OH. We both recently got a new passports and so we need to get a certified copies done. The only solicitor in my area open on a Saturday wants €30 to do a colour certified copy!! (€20 for a normal one, extra €10 for colour! madness). Plus, I phoned her and she is not open tomorrow morning as is attending a funeral, so will have to wait til next saturday.

    I work a few doors away from an embassy (not the embassy of OH's country, another one). They only charge €15 for a certified copy, even in colour, and will put both passports on . Do you think INIS would accept it certified by the other embassy? I am trying to work it out - if it was certified by my husbands embassy they would accept it, so why not the embassy of another country? They are legally notarised etc.

    do you think it is worth a shot? Really eager to get this all sent off. If I can get it notarised by the other embassy we can do that on Monday and send it that afternoon.

    Any thoughts???

    Ring them up. Ask if you can get it notarised by the Gards or Commissioner of Peace.


  • #167
    ballooba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭ballooba


    FalconXV wrote: »
    Ring them up. Ask if you can get it notarised by the Gards or Commissioner of Peace.
    +1


  • #168
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    Oh gosh thanks...why didn't I think of that?? :rolleyes:

    If only it were that simple! If you read through the earlier posts you will see that phoning is not really an option given that they don't answer the phones and the lines are only open for a very short window of time. No commissioner of oaths open in my area on Sat other than the solicitor mentioned and she will be closed this Saturday. The local peace commissioner can't do certified copies as he can't make copies and a document can only be certified if he makes the copies himself! He can only witness signatures essentially.

    Anyone who has actually presented documents to INIS advise if they ever presented docs certified by an Embassy? Their own or any other embassy? I'mbasically wondering if will they accept a certified copy from the embassy of your nationality? If so what's the difference accepting a certified copy from another embassy? Eg if I'm say French and applying for Irish citizenship and get my docs certified by the French embassy, then what's the difference if an Aussie gets the same French embassy to certify their docs? I mean, the authority of the French embassy doesn't change...they are not verifying the authenticity of the doc just certifying that the copy in question is a true copy of the original.

    Anyone get embassy certified docs for something of this nature?


    BTW garda can't certify copies...they are not notaries. They can only witness signatures.


  • #169
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    My local Garda station have stamped and signed copies that I have sent to various Government departments including the INIS. The Australian embassy in Dublin can't issue Apostille stamps so you have to send them to the Department of Foreign Affairs in Australia. I have to send my Australian birth certificate there before I can register with the state to get married.


  • #170
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    I know that a lot of Gardai do stamp copies, but we were told by INIS that legally they should not do this. In order for a copy to be legally certified, the certifying officer needs to make the copy themselves. They are basically saying, I made a copy of the original, and to my knowledge it is a genuine and true copy of the original document as presented to me. If you give them the copy, it could be doctored slightly and the garda might not notice. I know this as one of our documents for the stamp 4 was certified by a garda. He would not make a photocopy so sent us off to get a copy and then stamped it when we returned. The official in INIS obviously knew that most garda stations won't offer the service of making copies and so refused to accept it. She did however accept the witnessed signatures, but not the certified copy.

    As for Apostille - if the country concerned is a member of the Hague Convention then the only way to get an apostille is in the country that issued the document. They can authenticate it though.

    Just popped into the embassy next door and asked their opinion - they said that they regularly certify for their own citizens, and have a few times certified the citizen and their non-citizen spouse (IRish and other nationalities) documents for stamp 4 applications and none have been refused to their knowledge. They said that they are not authenticating the document (i.e confirming it as legit) they are just certifying that the copy they have made is a true copy of the original document presented to them, so they can't see why there would be an issue as if they are authorised to certify a doc for their own citizen, they would be equally authorised to certify any document. I think I will just give it a go, otherwise, I will have to wait for the next lot of bills to arrive, otherwise our bills for id won't meet the 6 mth criteria.

    Will let you know how we get on.


  • #171
    ballooba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭ballooba


    God forbid that the cop would actually read something before signing it .:rolleyes: Sounds typical of INIS.


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  • #172
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    well to be fair, the cop didn't give more than a passing glance to the passports and copies before stamping them. So I suppose I can see where they are coming from. I have no issue with it TBH - in fact I would suggest even more tightening up of the systems and checks is needed. I actually think that will make the processing time and ease of application easier for the genuine cases.


  • #173
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    Little Ted wrote: »
    I know that a lot of Gardai do stamp copies, but we were told by INIS that legally they should not do this. In order for a copy to be legally certified, the certifying officer needs to make the copy themselves. They are basically saying, I made a copy of the original, and to my knowledge it is a genuine and true copy of the original document as presented to me. If you give them the copy, it could be doctored slightly and the garda might not notice. I know this as one of our documents for the stamp 4 was certified by a garda. He would not make a photocopy so sent us off to get a copy and then stamped it when we returned. The official in INIS obviously knew that most garda stations won't offer the service of making copies and so refused to accept it. She did however accept the witnessed signatures, but not the certified copy.

    As for Apostille - if the country concerned is a member of the Hague Convention then the only way to get an apostille is in the country that issued the document. They can authenticate it though.

    Just popped into the embassy next door and asked their opinion - they said that they regularly certify for their own citizens, and have a few times certified the citizen and their non-citizen spouse (IRish and other nationalities) documents for stamp 4 applications and none have been refused to their knowledge. They said that they are not authenticating the document (i.e confirming it as legit) they are just certifying that the copy they have made is a true copy of the original document presented to them, so they can't see why there would be an issue as if they are authorised to certify a doc for their own citizen, they would be equally authorised to certify any document. I think I will just give it a go, otherwise, I will have to wait for the next lot of bills to arrive, otherwise our bills for id won't meet the 6 mth criteria.

    Will let you know how we get on.

    I had statements and letters witnessed by the commissioners of peace.

    Some folk in the INIS wouldn't know the difference between their a... and their elbow. No different to the Gards.

    I went in to the local newspaper here to get a colour photocopy of my passport as they are the only place in town that has a colour photocopier and they wouldn't allow me to do it as I needed to get approval first for a copy to be made. I told them that my passport is Australian Government property and outside of your jurisdiction so you have no right to say that I can't get my passport copied.


  • #174
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    well it is a legal issue within the state you reside in (i.e Ireland) and you are not supposed to make colour copies of passports or legal tender. In fact there is a disclaimer notice stuck on almost every photocopier to that effect. REgardless of it being Aus government property, you are in Ireland and as such the laws do state that you shouldn't make colour copies of such documents without prior approval. So the newspaper offices were 100% correct in what they told you.
    This is what I think is laughable as it clearly says in the application for citizenship that you must have colour copies of the passport certified. Even when I asked the embassy to do it, they questioned it, but I showed them the section on the application that states it and they reluctantly agreed, but found it very strange that a government agency would request a colour copy of a passport. If they need to see the detail of it that badly, they should instruct you to send it in and then once they have personally sighted the documents return them to you (in the same way they do with visa applications).

    There is also a difference between getting a document witnessed and getting it certified. A peace commissioner can notarise a signature/ witness a signature. That is a different thing again.


  • #175
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    Little Ted wrote: »
    well it is a legal issue within the state you reside in (i.e Ireland) and you are not supposed to make colour copies of passports or legal tender. In fact there is a disclaimer notice stuck on almost every photocopier to that effect. REgardless of it being Aus government property, you are in Ireland and as such the laws do state that you shouldn't make colour copies of such documents without prior approval. So the newspaper offices were 100% correct in what they told you.
    This is what I think is laughable as it clearly says in the application for citizenship that you must have colour copies of the passport certified. Even when I asked the embassy to do it, they questioned it, but I showed them the section on the application that states it and they reluctantly agreed, but found it very strange that a government agency would request a colour copy of a passport. If they need to see the detail of it that badly, they should instruct you to send it in and then once they have personally sighted the documents return them to you (in the same way they do with visa applications).

    There is also a difference between getting a document witnessed and getting it certified. A peace commissioner can notarise a signature/ witness a signature. That is a different thing again.
    As it is an Australian document not an Irish document it is not relevant and none of their business. They should not tell Australian citizens that they cannot photocopy an Australian legal document.


  • #176
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    oh don't be so arrogant. Yes it is an australian document, but you are bound by the laws of the country you are in. In Ireland, you are not permitted to photocopy a passport - ANY passport in colour without approval. The law is what it is - the fact your passport is not an irish passport is totally irrelevant and to be honest spouting that nonsense makes you look rather foolish.


  • #177
    FalconXV
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭FalconXV


    Little Ted wrote: »
    oh don't be so arrogant. Yes it is an australian document, but you are bound by the laws of the country you are in. In Ireland, you are not permitted to photocopy a passport - ANY passport in colour without approval. The law is what it is - the fact your passport is not an irish passport is totally irrelevant and to be honest spouting that nonsense makes you look rather foolish.

    I am not being arrogant and of course I know that I am bound to the laws of the land. No one in Ireland should tell me when or where I can't photocopy my Australian passport. It has nothing to do with Ireland. I am not in Australia and it is not an Irish legal document, end of. Thankfully there are more places now open in town that will let me do my own copies. The INIS hasn't pulled me up for sending uncertified copies of my Australian passport.


  • #178
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    Ok you are totally missing the point but I'm not going to get into it with you.

    I'll post back in a few weeks and update as to whether they accepted the copies or not.


  • #179
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,084 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    FalconXV wrote: »
    No one in Ireland should tell me when or where I can't photocopy my Australian passport. It has nothing to do with Ireland. I am not in Australia and it is not an Irish legal document, end of. Thankfully there are more places now open in town that will let me do my own copies.

    If you don't like Irish laws, feel free to talk to your TD about getting them changed.

    In the meantime, if you have made a colour photocopy of a passport (yes even an Aussie one) within the Republic of Ireland, then you have broken the law. Sending evidence of this to a government authoriity might not be the cleverest of things to do.

    Little Ted, is it also illegal in the North - could someone cross the border, make a copy, and croos back before using it?


  • #180
    ballooba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭ballooba


    Little Ted wrote: »
    well to be fair, the cop didn't give more than a passing glance to the passports and copies before stamping them.
    We should give that (wo)man a pay rise.;)


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  • #181
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    Little Ted, is it also illegal in the North - could someone cross the border, make a copy, and croos back before using it?

    Thanks for the suggestion, but I don't fancy taking a day off work to travel to the north just to make a photocopy - this thing is costing enough as it is, what with the €175 application fee and the cost of certifying documents. And if its successful almost €1000 to get the citizenship cert :eek: But that is the price one must pay to be one of gods chosen people! :p

    The embassy made the colour copies, but the consul said she would be raising this with the DFA the next time she meets with them, as it is unreasonable to ask an embassy or government agency to ignore the rules and regulations set in place by another government agency. She wanted to put a note in with our documents, but I managed to persuade her not to...don't want to be getting anyone's back up until after the application is processed!;)


  • #182
    Guofu
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭Guofu


    Just rang the vaunted INIS helpline this morning to ask about getting a defacto visa for my Taiwanese girlfriend (I'm an Irish citizen) only to be told that it would only be considered after we'd been living together IN IRELAND for 2 years. Either the guy didn't know what he was talking about (I hope) or things have just got a lot more difficult. We've been in a relationship for 4 years and lived together in Australia and Taiwan for around 2 years all told.


  • #183
    ballooba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭ballooba


    You could try get an appointment with crosscare or consult a solicitor. Doesn't sound like that would fly though. Might have to get married either. :)


  • #184
    OldNotWIse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,468 ✭✭✭✭OldNotWIse


    I have heard varying reports as to how long decisions take for de facto relationships. We applied 2 months ago, and I had thought the normal "4-6 week" turnaround for visa applications applied? When we were coming through customs last week my partner showed docs to say she had an application pending and was told she can now only stay for a month. I'm not sure how this will pan out now as her visa has expired. If the month passes before we get word from INIS will she be staying on illegally, even though there's an app pending?


  • #185
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    no - if you have not heard anything before the visa expires, then you need to visit Brugh Quay together, advise them that there is an application pending, they can then check the system. They can either extend the visa, or they might not do this, but will instead ensure that there is no deportation order issued on her. It is really important that you do this. If she overstays her visa without their approval, chances are they will refuse your de-facto application. she cannot leave the country once the extension is given AFAIK.

    Many times immigration at the airport will only give a lesser visa period, as they have no way to check the system properly that what you claim is true about your ongoing application. Instead they give a minimum amount of time at the port of entry, and then it is up to you to request an extension. If you have an ongoing application they are usually fairly decent in allowing the extension.

    This is what happened for us. We ended up having to ask for 2 extensions (spouse visa) before the final decision came through, but there was no issue with them giving the extension. But if you overstay with out them approving it, you will screw your chances of getting the defacto or any other visa for that matter. It could also cause problems if she ever wants to travel elsewhere as it is not taken very kindly by any country if you overstayed a visa. She might even have trouble getting a schengen if she ever needed it.


  • #186
    OldNotWIse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,468 ✭✭✭✭OldNotWIse


    Little Ted wrote: »
    no - if you have not heard anything before the visa expires, then you need to visit Brugh Quay together, advise them that there is an application pending, they can then check the system. They can either extend the visa, or they might not do this, but will instead ensure that there is no deportation order issued on her. It is really important that you do this. If she overstays her visa without their approval, chances are they will refuse your de-facto application. she cannot leave the country once the extension is given AFAIK.

    Many times immigration at the airport will only give a lesser visa period, as they have no way to check the system properly that what you claim is true about your ongoing application. Instead they give a minimum amount of time at the port of entry, and then it is up to you to request an extension. If you have an ongoing application they are usually fairly decent in allowing the extension.

    This is what happened for us. We ended up having to ask for 2 extensions (spouse visa) before the final decision came through, but there was no issue with them giving the extension. But if you overstay with out them approving it, you will screw your chances of getting the defacto or any other visa for that matter. It could also cause problems if she ever wants to travel elsewhere as it is not taken very kindly by any country if you overstayed a visa. She might even have trouble getting a schengen if she ever needed it.

    oh sh1t, ok thanks for the information. Better head over on Monday as visa already lapsed. Thanks so much for your advice :)


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  • #187
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    just apologise, play stupid. Tell them you thought that the fact there was an application pending meant you didn't need to renew and only just discovered that in fact you need to extend it. Grovel a bit. plead ignorance. Hopefully they will be ok with it. Better that then she be refused the defacto or get refused upon her next entry as there is a deportation order against her.


  • #188
    foreign99
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭foreign99


    Hi all,
    I just want to share with you my (bad) experience with this de facto visa thing.
    My fiancé is irish, I am not european and we have been in a relationship for nearly 3 years, living together for nearly 2 and a half years now. We will get married in september.
    last year, in october, I applied for a stamp4 visa. (i have been living here with a student visa) I sent all the documents that you can imagine (even the pet passport of our cat) from the beginning of our relationship (july/2010) until october 2012. 2 weeks ago we got an answer. A letter asking us to send ALL the documents again. That is just ridiculous. We are sending back everything, but if they take another 5 months to give an answer, I will have to leave ireland.
    If someone has any suggestion to make the process run faster please tell us. We emailed them asking about the documents that we sent in october, but they just answered asking to send everything back again.


  • #189
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    No you won't necessarily have to leave Ireland while they are processing. See my answer above regarding requesting an extension. Usually (not always but the vast majority of the time) they will either give an extension to your existing visa or they will put a non-deportation notice against your GNIB number. This basically means that whilst your application is being considered you can stay. You won't be able to travel outside of the state (because upon return you will have problems at the boarder) but you will be able to reside.

    I have heard of them requesting information several times. This happened to us too for the original stamp 4 application - we sent copies of everything and they asked us for a lot of the same stuff again. When we asked why they need it again, they said they never received it first time, which is bullsh!t because if they have half the stuff and everything was sent in the one parcel then the only reason why half of it is missing is because they lost it! funnily enough, when we got the visa granted and they sent everything back, there were 2 copies of some of the stuff - wonder where they came from :rolleyes:

    Well for anyone who is interested, we sent the citizenship application off with certifications done by the embassy. It has been 'initially' processed 3 times now! How you can initially process something more than once I don't know. Anyway, first letter we got back is because the bank statements and wages we provided were for the period Aug - Jan (6 mth period as requested). I sent the application by registered post on the 27th Feb, they received it 28th Feb. But because it entered processing on the 1st March, they said that our bank statements and wages were out of date!! :eek: They wanted one for February. It took them a week to send us a letter asking for this. I sent it off immediately. Four days later got a receipt in the post for the fee and I thought grand, it must be ok so.

    But no! last week we then got a letter asking to confirm where we lived between x and y date. I was fuming - because this information WAS IN THE APPLICATION!!!! I swear to god! they highlighted the first line and said you have only specified where you lived from 2009 to present, please advise where you resided prior to 2009. They must be blind or stupid because literally the box below the one they highlighted has the address we were at up to 2009. It literally could not be clearer. I highlighted the form where the information was and sent it back. We've have no more letters since, but it's only been a week. So it has taken them 1 month, and it is still in initial processing. My hopes of having it in 6-8mths are receeding quickly! But so far it would seem that they have accepted the certifications we sent, so that at least is something.

    What is really infuriating is that it appears that as one processer gets the application they go through it until they find an issue (or non-issue because they are incapable of reading! :rolleyes: ). At that point everything halts, they send you a letter. You reply with what they want and then it gets passed to a different person who resumes the 'initial' processing. If they find another issue again it halts and they write to you. All this stop-start malarky is such a waste of resources - surely it would make more sense to go through the form, make a list of all and everything extra you need and then send one letter. This piecemeal approach is a joke. It is no wonder it takes so bloody long for them to get an application processed.

    Anyway, rant over! But I just wanted to give a heads up for anyone else applying.


  • #190
    foreign99
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭foreign99


    Little Ted wrote: »
    No you won't necessarily have to leave Ireland while they are processing. See my answer above regarding requesting an extension.
    Hi Little Ted, thanks for the answer. Yes, I know that I don't need to leave ireland while they are processing my application, but i probably will do that because I can't stand this situation anymore. I can't get a proper job with a student visa, so I feel like my career is going to the rubbish...
    I don't know what happens to the people that check the documents for the visa. either they are really stupid, or they don't really like their job. But I think that they are really stupid:pac:.
    well, let's wait and see how long this joke will take. I will keep you updated of the process. I really hope that it doesn't take more than 2 months from now. Good luck!


  • #191
    elizabeth11
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭elizabeth11


    Hi all,
    Thanks for this thread it has been really useful. I am an American citizen and applied last month for a defacto visa to remain here with my Irish boyfriend. We have been together for just over 2 years and long distance the whole time (although I was living in nearby London).
    I received the letter confirming our application about 2 days after we posted it. We included a huge binder with everything we could think of, all separated month by month.
    I am planning on calling the immigration number when they are open on Thursday to ask for an update. I have had to turn down a couple of job offers due to the fact that the visa hasn't come through yet so I may tell them this in the hopes of speeding it along.
    Just thought I'd share my story as well and I will keep you updated to our progress.
    Good luck all! :)


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  • #192
    KPJP
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭KPJP


    Hi all,

    Very interesting thread with lots of great information. My girlfriend (US citizen) and I (Irish citizen) have been together about 2 and a half years. Long distance the whole time but with lent of back and forth visits totalling about 4 months so far. We are looking at moving her here in September and applying for the de facto visa.

    One question which I have is in relation to the basic mechanics of the move as we obviously want to avoid doing any detrimental to our chances of a successful application.

    Specifically what she say when going through immigration on her way into Ireland? She will be coming in on a tourist visa but should she declare her intention to apply for the de facto at that sage or just wait until we go to the immigration bureau and make the actual application?

    Also, has anyone had an issues with one way tickets? Obviously given the unknown amount of time he application will take we don't want to go booking her a return flight to the US but does that cause issues at the border when coming into the country?

    You help on these questions as well as any other advice you have would be greatly appreciated. Cheers.


  • #193
    perfectblue
    Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭perfectblue


    Hi all,
    Wondering if anyone has applied in the last 4-5 months and if anyone has a sense of how long the wait time is?

    I just applied (I'm American, boyfriend is Irish) at end of April, and wondering what we're in store for in terms of waiting. I'm not in a hurry to get a job as I do independent contract work (for orgs based in the US and Africa), but it would be nice to know if I get to stay here or not long-term, as BF and I have gotten an allotment and would like to get a dog. :)

    For the record, we submitted a HUGE binder of photos, facebook photos, facebook posts, screenshots of BF's email inbox, printouts of emailed flight confirmations, cards to/from each other and others, a couple of wedding invites, and a couple of letters. Also my CV, grad school transcript, copy of my medical insurance card (international), 6 months bank statements (both), utility bill with both our names on it, timeline of relationship, and letter from both of us. We mailed it (was told that was preferred) and then got the confirmation letter a few days letter via mail.
    We've been long-distance the whole time (3 years) having met in Asia. I came here in early-mid March and we currently live together. I'm heading back to the US in mid-June (approx 90 day mark) and back to Ireland about a month later. When I come through immigration again, I will let them know that I have an application pending (will have the letter with me), though I believe this means they might only give me 30 days instead of the usual 90? We'll be taking a road trip in September to Portugal, so hoping it comes before then, or it will be the same coming back. I'm not sure if going and coming is frowned upon?

    Anyway, would love to hear people's current experiences, especially with current wait times!

    Thanks!


  • #194
    perfectblue
    Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭perfectblue


    "Specifically what she say when going through immigration on her way into Ireland? She will be coming in on a tourist visa but should she declare her intention to apply for the de facto at that sage or just wait until we go to the immigration bureau and make the actual application?"

    I came through in March from the US and did not tell them at Immigration that I would be applying. They asked if I was visiting a friend, and I said "my boyfriend, who is Irish", and stamp and on my way (there was some banter there about traveling alone and not being alone for long before that).

    "Also, has anyone had an issues with one way tickets? Obviously given the unknown amount of time he application will take we don't want to go booking her a return flight to the US but does that cause issues at the border when coming into the country?"

    I had a one-way ticket and had a huge issue boarding at JFK. I came on a US carrier (US Airways, I think), and they wouldn't let me board without a ticket out of Ireland (usually a roundtrip, but could be a ticket to another country). I ended up sitting there at the gate and booking my ticket back to the US (had planned this anyway, but was going to wait to buy the ticket). I booked a roundtrip (DUB-DCA-DUB), and then had to show the email confirmation to the gate attendants before they would let me board. My ticket back to US is actually at 92 days, but they let me board anyway. They told me they are strict about this because if Irish immigration sends me back at the border, the airline is fined $10,000. That being said, no one at Irish immigration has ever asked me about leaving or about a return ticket (this was my 4th trip in 3 years), so I think they over-worry, but they are in charge! So be warned about the one-way ticket. At least consider a cheap outward ticket (within 90 days) to somewhere else in Europe. And make sure to have the email confirmation of that flight.


  • #195
    Cushie Butterfield
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    To confuse matters a bit further, also have a look at this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055529883&page=8


  • #196
    perfectblue
    Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭perfectblue


    Just wanted to follow up on my own message. Got my approval today! So it took about a month. Will hopefully go this week or next for the official stamp and registration card.


  • #197
    Cushie Butterfield
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    perfectblue wrote: »
    Just wanted to follow up on my own message. Got my approval today! So it took about a month. Will hopefully go this week or next for the official stamp and registration card.
    Congratulations!

    Naturally, every application wouldn't be as straightforward as yours must have been, but it just goes to show that putting in a bit of research & submitting clearly laid out documentary evidence is the way to go, ensuring less delays & a speedy outcome.

    Approaching the application submission with the mentality of making the job of whoever is dealing with it as easy as possible, without them having to blindly search through reams of paper for any particular document goes a long way towards it being dealt with in a swift manner.


  • #198
    perfectblue
    Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭perfectblue


    Well, we've been together for 3 years entirely long-distance. I was worried that wasn't enough. But, we did include everything we possibly could think of (it was massive). And yes, very clearly laid out. I did sections (labeled) by type of documentation (emails, facebook, flight info, etc, etc) and then chronological in each section. Also a timeline of our relationship up front. Good luck to others.


  • #199
    ballooba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭ballooba


    I would think that it depends on the case officer you are assigned as much as anything else.


  • #200
    vij
    Registered Users Posts: 3 ✭vij


    Hi there actually I need some hope some1 can help with that. I have applied my defacto visa since last year but my visa been expired ,am on a student visa and at work they are asking me my visa just want to know wen I have a case pending can I still work even my visa is expired. thnx anyone could help appreciate that


  • #201
    tatli_lokma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭tatli_lokma


    vij wrote: »
    Hi there actually I need some hope some1 can help with that. I have applied my defacto visa since last year but my visa been expired ,am on a student visa and at work they are asking me my visa just want to know wen I have a case pending can I still work even my visa is expired. thnx anyone could help appreciate that

    I'm afraid that no you can't work if your visa is expired regardless of you having a defacto application pending. When was the last time you heard anything about how your defacto is progressing? Since when last year have you been waiting? I would have expected for you to have heard something by now


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