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A&A Feedback

24567…37

Comments

  • #52
    Beruthiel
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 42,362 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beruthiel


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Is there an elevator?

    Doubtful.
    Perhaps we can fashion some stools together to simulate one?
    Will coffee be served?

    Possibly.
    Wine is my preferred beverage of choice in the evening though.

    Mods,
    Please lay the severely off topic discussion at Galvaseans feet.


  • #53
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    I want to know who's going to wear the hipster glasses and blue wig.


  • #54
    Sarky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,967 ✭✭✭✭Sarky


    They should both do it.


  • #55
    Bloodwing
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 881 ✭✭✭Bloodwing


    I don't post in here as much as I'd like to but I do spend a lot of time lurking and reading threads. For me there's no aspect of A&A that I think needs to be changed. The regulars are all very welcoming and the standards of debate are always very high until someone starts soapboxing and in fairness to the mods they're always very quick to move on the soapboxers!


  • #56
    Sin City
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    Its a grand forum but it lacks the old sacred heart pic and a crucifix in the hall, and a pic of Mary in the foyer apart from that its great.


  • #57
    Beruthiel
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 42,362 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beruthiel


    Sin City wrote: »
    Its a grand forum but it lacks the old sacred heart pic and a crucifix in the hall, and a pic of Mary in the foyer

    You'll find all of them in the darts room on the second floor.


  • #58
    Sin City
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    Beruthiel wrote: »
    You'll find all of them in the darts room on the second floor.

    Theres a second floor?:D:D


  • #59
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    Sin City wrote: »
    Its a grand forum but it lacks the old sacred heart pic and a crucifix in the hall, and a pic of Mary in the foyer apart from that its great.

    Sacred-Heart-of-Jesus.jpg

    P7100003_2.jpg

    Mary2.jpg

    Sorted.:D

    Next!


  • #60
    Sin City
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    Sacred-Heart-of-Jesus.jpg

    P7100003_2.jpg

    Mary2.jpg

    Sorted.:D

    Next!


    I suddenly feel uncomfortable

    Starting to look like my late Nans house


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  • #61
    Sarky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,967 ✭✭✭✭Sarky


    Sin City wrote: »
    Theres a second floor?:D:D

    Yes, but only to those who search with an open heart.



    It's mostly full of people who died from massive heart failure.


  • #62
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    Sorted.
    Next!
    Ah, bless you!


  • #63
    strobe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    What the hell is this hippy love in!? Haven't you people ever seen a feedback thread on this site before? It's supposed to be full of people point scoring and dredging up months and years old grudges, taking sneaky thinly veiled digs at the mods and casting wild and ludicrously libelous but indirect assertions at whole sections of the posting public.

    Someone throw a pie for Christ sake!


    Nah...nah... There isn't really anything I'd change. I tried to think of a couple of things, nothings perfect and all that. Best I could come up with was that accusing someone of being a troll shouldn't really be allowed, if they are a troll then report your suspicions but don't keep stating it on thread... but then again Robin and Dades usually do keep a lid on that kind of thing much more so than happens in the other forums on here...

    Bah, you're all beautiful and uncriticisable bastards. I hate the lot of you for it.

    Oh wait, I just thunked of one. Nah...nah... it's gone again.


  • #64
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    strobe wrote: »
    What the hell is this hippy love in!? Haven't you people ever seen a feedback thread on this site before? It's supposed to be full of people point scoring and dredging up months and years old grudges, taking sneaky thinly veiled digs at the mods and casting wild and ludicrously libelous but indirect assertions at whole sections of the posting public.

    We're all just waiting until Brown Bomber arrives.


  • #65
    Dades
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,558 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    strobe wrote: »
    Best I could come up with was that accusing someone of being a troll shouldn't really be allowed, if they are a troll then report your suspicions but don't keep stating it on thread...
    Actually, that's a good one. I wish people would stopped calling other people trolls and just hit the report button.


  • #66
    strobe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    Dades wrote: »
    Actually, that's a good one. I wish people would stopped calling other people trolls and just hit the report button.

    Ah it's a site wide (internet wide) issue, and like I say, at least here I've seen it being discouraged. Should really be covered under the 'personal abuse' section of the site wide rules IMO. I know, personally, being called a troll while trying to articulate an unpopular opinion would irritate me far far more than being called a cunt or a dickhead or anything like that.

    I know there are genuine trolls that are just posting whatever purely to wind people up, for whatever reasons, but yeah, would be better I think for people to report it rather than using it as a response to an opinion (whether that opinion is legitimately held or not) and for that to be enshrined in the general rules.


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  • #67
    Corkfeen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,940 ✭✭✭Corkfeen


    Dades wrote: »
    Actually, that's a good one. I wish people would stopped calling other people trolls and just hit the report button.

    I've probably been guilty of such at some point. But that incident that occured on that feminist atheist site or whatever did sort of open my eyes on why it is becoming far too overused. Not the worst on the forum but would be nice to cut it all out.

    Also, i'll also say that ye're fantastic mods...... Plus your word is infallible. :pac: Sorry, the latter is the pope.


  • #68
    Improbable
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭Improbable


    strobe wrote: »
    What the hell is this hippy love in!? Haven't you people ever seen a feedback thread on this site before? It's supposed to be full of people point scoring and dredging up months and years old grudges, taking sneaky thinly veiled digs at the mods and casting wild and ludicrously libelous but indirect assertions at whole sections of the posting public.

    Someone throw a pie for Christ sake!


    Nah...nah... There isn't really anything I'd change. I tried to think of a couple of things, nothings perfect and all that. Best I could come up with was that accusing someone of being a troll shouldn't really be allowed, if they are a troll then report your suspicions but don't keep stating it on thread... but then again Robin and Dades usually do keep a lid on that kind of thing much more so than happens in the other forums on here...

    Bah, you're all beautiful and uncriticisable bastards. I hate the lot of you for it.

    Oh wait, I just thunked of one. Nah...nah... it's gone again.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8kXna0Vx8c


  • #69
    Canis Lupus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,893 ✭✭✭Canis Lupus


    I heart A+A. Don't change a thing.


  • #70
    joseph brand
    Registered Users Posts: 4,537 ✭✭✭joseph brand


    This is the first forum I visit when I open Boards.ie, and often the only forum.

    The level of discourse, the tolerance of troll posters, the quality of posts (e.g. oldrnwisr), lack of small-minded prejudice and the adult humour, surpass any of the other forums.

    The mods are extremely reasonable and fair minded.

    I have to say also, it's a busy forum. Keeps it fresh!


  • #71
    Galvasean
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Stop deleting my feedback posts where I criticize the Moderation! :mad:


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  • #72
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,630 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You guys do a great job. The best mods in the world, without question. Especially Robin.









    _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    Last edited by robindch; 05-10-2012 at 20:30. Reason: Correcting erroneous remarks


  • #73
    Daftendirekt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,312 ✭✭✭Daftendirekt


    These days I'm probably more of a lurker than a poster (free time is less abundant), but this is one of the few forums I still check frequently.

    Can't add much to what's already been said, but I like the mix of serious debate and WTFery, and the modding is unintrusive without letting things slide into complete chaos.

    In short: A&A good, don't change stuff.


  • #74
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    gvn wrote: »
    You guys do a great job. The best mods in the world, without question. Especially Robin.


    _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    Last edited by robindch; 05-10-2012 at 20:30. Reason: Correcting erroneous remarks

    Eh? What just happened there?! Can mods edit other user's posts? Hmmmm. :eek: Oh, wait....ahh, get it now, lol:-)


  • #75
    Improbable
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭Improbable


    I've just remembered: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=67975691

    Kissing ass before it was cool.

    hipster-cat.jpg?w=500


  • #76
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    Improbable wrote: »
    I've just remembered: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=67975691

    Kissing ass before it was cool.

    hipster-cat.jpg?w=500

    Clearly a troll.


    :pac:


  • #77
    pauldla
    Registered Users Posts: 2,247 ✭✭✭pauldla


    I'll throw in my tuppence worth. Like others, it's the only forum on the boards that I visit daily, and basically it's because I like the regulars, and the mods keep the iron beneath the velvet. Some smart, witty, civilised mo-fo's on these pages. I always have a laugh and I always learn something when I visit. Thanks to you all.


  • #78
    Mark Hamill
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭Mark Hamill


    To respond to both this feedback thread and the thread asking "Anything good about religion at all?" I would say that this forum is best thing to come about because of religion. Keep up the good work :)


  • #79
    Gbear
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,775 ✭✭✭✭Gbear


    Dades wrote: »
    Actually, that's a good one. I wish people would stopped calling other people trolls and just hit the report button.

    One thing I was wondering. How annoying is it to deal with reported posts?

    I usually err on the side of caution and neither brand the person a troll or report them.

    The internet has taught me that true trolls aren't as common as people with silly opinions.:pac:


  • #80
    Dades
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,558 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    Reported posts aren't annoying at all. They only ever appear in volume when there's serious muppetry which is exactly what we want to happen. Also, I've no problem ignoring a RP if I think intervening would be premature. They're usually only from people newish to the forum who are aghast at what people can say.

    You can't feel compelled to act all the time - I get the reported posts from 100+ forums! :pac:


  • #81
    oldrnwisr
    Registered Users Posts: 1,594 ✭✭✭oldrnwisr


    Sarky wrote: »
    Perhaps you could force Oldrnwisr to post more often? Treasure trove of knowledge, that guy.


    Thanks Sarky. Appreciate it.

    I would love to post more often but I'm balls deep in holiday cover at the moment and haven't got a lot of time.


    As for the feedback, as many other posters have commented, don't change anything, this forum is just perfect as it is.


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  • #82
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    Good forum. But a couple of things seeing as its feedback:

    The place does sometimes seem a bit one-sided. And that's to be expected naturally, as it is a forum for atheists and agnostics to talk about things after all.

    In saying that, for instance there doesn't seem to be too many regular posters from the Christianity forum on here as there are regulars from A+A on there. Maybe i'm wrong about that now, but that's how it seems.

    Nor is there much in the way of general opposing views to the discussions from theists in general or from neutral observers. Could be wrong about that too; i don't read most threads.
    There are of course some brave exceptions i see regularly, like Jank and Philogos. But other than that i don't really come across many who would be going against the grain of the usual topics here.


  • #83
    Mae Crashing Beer
    Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Mae Crashing Beer


    Well if they don't want to, that's up to them


  • #84
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    Good forum. But a couple of things seeing as its feedback:

    The place does sometimes seem a bit one-sided. And that's to be expected naturally, as it is a forum for atheists and agnostics to talk about things after all.

    In saying that, for instance there doesn't seem to be too many regular posters from the Christianity forum on here as there are regulars from A+A on there. Maybe i'm wrong about that now, but that's how it seems.

    Nor is there much in the way of general opposing views to the discussions from theists in general or from neutral observers. Could be wrong about that too; i don't read most threads.
    There are of course some brave exceptions i see regularly, like Jank and Philogos. But other than that i don't really come across many who would be going against the grain of the usual topics here.

    Possibly because many of those who inhabit the Christianity forum find that an argument based entirely upon the Bible doesn't really cut the mustard here. Particularly when there appears to be cherry picking of which bits of scripture are 'true', which bits 'need to be taken in context' and which bits are 'parables'.


  • #85
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    In normal everyday friendly discussion there's a firewall called, "That's just my belief", which for an individual with any vague notion of social etiquette is a signal to back down and change the subject.

    Charging through this firewall is really only acceptable in a debating scenario, primarily because "that's just my belief" isn't an acceptable defence in a debate.

    The main reason why few religious people venture onto this forum is because their primary justification for their POV is, "That's just my belief", which won't be tolerated.

    I'm sure most of us would love the opportunity for civil discussion with varied religious people on here, but you tend to find that those who engage are either already in a very questioning mode about their faith and not afraid to lose it, or they're so confident in their belief that they do not fear the debate.
    The third group - those who are afraid to lose their faith and who do not have the confidence to debate it - are unlikely to ever join in.


  • #86
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    seamus wrote: »
    In normal everyday friendly discussion there's a firewall called, "That's just my belief", which for an individual with any vague notion of social etiquette is a signal to back down and change the subject.

    Charging through this firewall is really only acceptable in a debating scenario, primarily because "that's just my belief" isn't an acceptable defence in a debate.

    The main reason why few religious people venture onto this forum is because their primary justification for their POV is, "That's just my belief", which won't be tolerated.

    I'm sure most of us would love the opportunity for civil discussion with varied religious people on here, but you tend to find that those who engage are either already in a very questioning mode about their faith and not afraid to lose it, or they're so confident in their belief that they do not fear the debate.
    The third group - those who are afraid to lose their faith and who do not have the confidence to debate it - are unlikely to ever join in.

    I agree that saying "that's just my belief" may not be an acceptable defence in a debate, but this is not a debating hall. It's a discussion forum. I'm sure you agree it's acceptable to say that here though and shouldn't be not acceptable as such as in it precludes you from the forum.

    You've set out your 3 neat groups there, but there are plenty of threads unrelated to belief, (ie the question of faith itself), that the above doesn't really apply to.
    The current "Anything good about religion" thread would be one that comes to mind. One where a theist could participate without reference to faith or belief. It seems they're under-represented there too. Any idea why that is?


  • #87
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    ..........
    In saying that, for instance there doesn't seem to be too many regular posters from the Christianity forum on here as there are regulars from A+A on there. Maybe i'm wrong about that now, but that's how it seems.

    Nor is there much in the way of general opposing views to the discussions from theists in general or from neutral observers. Could be wrong about that too; i don't read most threads.
    There are of course some brave exceptions i see regularly, like Jank and Philogos. But other than that i don't really come across many who would be going against the grain of the usual topics here.

    I'm inclined to agree, in some respects, and not in others. I think there may be more oppositional debate than you say. As a fairly new contributor to boards, I came in on the A+A forum because I was looking for what people had been discussing in relation to abortion and I found it here first. Also, I am an atheist, by upbringing and by reason (two different things, in my case at least). I found very much dispute and debate on the A+A forum on this subject. All walks of pro-life were represented well, to my mind - I considered this challenging, which is what I want, in order to further my understanding of different viewpoints.

    I then got a bit braver and branched out. Finding a debate on the Christian forum and reading some of the posts, I was encouraged by the Christian presence on the A+A thread and started to discuss my atheist pro-choice views on the Christian forum. I found a similar level of disrespect/kindness on that forum as I have in this one towards the religious.

    Of course, I am in the minority on the forum that does not represent in any way, my beliefs. Religious people are in the minority on this one. But I think that it comes down to those who put themselves forward for debate versus those that don't, regardless of belief. Many, many members of boards just read/look on and take it all in. Some of them post regularly, some seem to live here. I think it is less about belief and more about personal characteristics though, whether you dive into the deep end or not.

    Meant to say...the way I agree with you is around the general consensus that is found on these forums. This is a place, not only to discuss and debate, but to find like-minded people who support your views, or at least, support you by virtue of your belief. That isn't a bad thing, but it depends on what you are looking for. Me, I'm happy to find both.


  • #88
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    I agree that saying "that's just my belief" may not be an acceptable defence in a debate, but this is not a debating hall. It's a discussion forum.
    A+A, insofar as it's possible, sticks to dialectic debate -- the kind of discussion where there are rules about what you can and cannot claim, where there are generally-agreed rules for what constitutes legitimate reasoning, and where facts must be backed up by observation or temporarily suspended from discussion. And most especially, where people agree ahead of time that they're not wedded to any particular point of view, but agree to be guided by the same rules, reason and facts, hopefully, to come to a common understanding of the topic under discussion. Thesis + Thesis = synthesis; etc, etc.

    Lots of people get mixed up all the time between a dialectic discussion (what non-religious people think is happening) and a lecture (what religious people think is happening). If somebody shows up and says "I believe that the moon is made of green cheese because I think it says it in this book and I think that this book is the final authority for everything", then that denies a common understanding of the words "fact", "reasons" and "rules" and one may as well go off down the pub and have a few beers.

    If you'd like to see an example of this dialog of the deaf, have a look here.


  • #89
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    Ah ha! Gotta lot to learn here...hmm.:)


  • #90
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    Obliq wrote: »
    I'm inclined to agree, in some respects, and not in others. I think there may be more oppositional debate than you say. As a fairly new contributor to boards, I came in on the A+A forum because I was looking for what people had been discussing in relation to abortion and I found it here first. Also, I am an atheist, by upbringing and by reason (two different things, in my case at least). I found very much dispute and debate on the A+A forum on this subject. All walks of pro-life were represented well, to my mind - I considered this challenging, which is what I want, in order to further my understanding of different viewpoints.

    I then got a bit braver and branched out. Finding a debate on the Christian forum and reading some of the posts, I was encouraged by the Christian presence on the A+A thread and started to discuss my atheist pro-choice views on the Christian forum. I found a similar level of disrespect/kindness on that forum as I have in this one towards the religious.

    Of course, I am in the minority on the forum that does not represent in any way, my beliefs. Religious people are in the minority on this one. But I think that it comes down to those who put themselves forward for debate versus those that don't, regardless of belief. Many, many members of boards just read/look on and take it all in. Some of them post regularly, some seem to live here. I think it is less about belief and more about personal characteristics though, whether you dive into the deep end or not.

    Meant to say...the way I agree with you is around the general consensus that is found on these forums. This is a place, not only to discuss and debate, but to find like-minded people who support your views, or at least, support you by virtue of your belief. That isn't a bad thing, but it depends on what you are looking for. Me, I'm happy to find both.

    Very interesting. It is what it is. Am pretty much playing devils advocate; have no major issues with the forum at all; for the most part it hums along nicely, and the say-what-you-feel attitude does have many benefits.

    The question is does it does possibly alienate or preclude the more thoughtful posters, those who couldn't be bothered going through the mill of ad homs that get 'overlooked' on here in the interests of 'freedom'..
    Not to say that religious posters are particularlarly sensitive or anything. But there is a definite thing on here of "oh the religious are stupid people full stop."


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  • #91
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    robindch wrote: »
    A+A, insofar as it's possible, sticks to dialectic debate -- the kind of discussion where there are rules about what you can and cannot claim, where there are generally-agreed rules for what constitutes legitimate reasoning, and where facts must be backed up by observation or temporarily suspended from discussion. And most especially, where people agree ahead of time that they're not wedded to any particular point of view, but agree to be guided by the same rules, reason and facts, hopefully, to come to a common understanding of the topic under discussion. Thesis + Thesis = synthesis; etc, etc.

    Lots of people get mixed up all the time between a dialectic discussion (what non-religious people think is happening) and a lecture (what religious people think is happening). If somebody shows up and says "I believe that the moon is made of green cheese because I think it says it in this book and I think that this book is the final authority for everything", then that denies a common understanding of the words "fact", "reasons" and "rules" and one may as well go off down the pub and have a few beers.

    If you'd like to see an example of this dialog of the deaf, have a look here.

    That's all well and good but i feel that you should not be compatmentalising the population into religious people and non-religious people in terms of how they process information. It displays a measure of arrogance tbh and seems to be a barrier for polite discussion and an open welcoming forum.

    And that's coming from an apparent member of this exhalted club you speak of; the purveyors of reason as you put it.


  • #92
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    there is a definite thing on here of "oh the religious are stupid people full stop."
    As above, this forum generally tries, as best it can, to stick to a mature discussion in the traditional dialectic sense so perhaps you can understand why it's a PITA when somebody comes along and delivers one or more posts which deny the dialectic that everybody else is taking part in.

    It's a bit like you're having dinner at home with a few friends, cracking the odd joke, making the occasional deeper point and generally letting conversation flow along smoothly as it would amongst friends. And then somebody arrives in through the open door from the street, produces a tupenny foghorn, parps it repeatedly, and then gets offended when somebody else asks them to stop being stupid and put it away.

    As mod of this forum for the last handful of years, I'd say at least 75% of the latter are religious posters and, again as above, they have a very hard time indeed distinguishing between a lecture and a discussion, perhaps because in religious terms, a lecture from the pulpit is as close to a religious discussion as they'll ever get. It's a discontinuity of expectation on the forum's part and theirs.

    You can, if you want to, distill this observation about the forum's expectation into a belief on your part that the regulars in A+A believe that all religious people are stupid. However, that's an inappropriate conclusion to draw, since it's at least equally plausible that a lot of the forum regulars believe that the majority of religious people are fundamentally honest people, but mislead.


  • #93
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    Not to say that religious posters are particularlarly sensitive or anything. But there is a definite thing on here of "oh the religious are stupid people full stop."
    I would like to believe that atheist/agnostic people are no more insensitive than religious people. I think that the difference of opinion is enough that each side of the divide feels that the other is denying their belief, merely by strongly asserting it.

    I'll give the following as an example of something that I considered incredibly insensitive towards a person who had had an abortion, given that they might not have any belief in Jesus. To a catholic, it seems forgiving, I suppose. To acknowledge that this is both insensitive and forgiving is to say that there are different points of view, equally valid in different arenas, but you must choose your own beliefs.

    "Such an argument wouldn't cut much ice, if somebody had killed a born child ... and it isn't a much better reason for killing an unborn child either.
    Could I say that I am not judging you ... let he who is without sin and all that.

    Can I also say that your unborn child is likely in Heaven and has also likely forgiven you for what you did ... and Jesus loves you and will also forgive you if you believe on Him to Save you.

    Some of the most amazing pro-life people have had abortions themselves ... or performed thousands of abortions as doctors ... and now have reconciled themselves with God and with what they have done."


  • #94
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    robindch wrote: »
    As above, this forum generally tries, as best it can, to stick to a mature discussion in the traditional dialectic sense so perhaps you can understand why it's a PITA when somebody comes along and delivers one or more posts which deny the dialectic that everybody else is taking part in.

    It's a bit like you're having dinner at home with a few friends, cracking the odd joke, making the occasional deeper point and generally letting conversation flow along smoothly as it would amongst friends. And then somebody arrives in through the open door from the street, produces a tupenny foghorn, parps it repeatedly, and then gets offended when somebody else asks them to stop being stupid and put it away.

    As mod of this forum for the last handful of years, I'd say at least 75% of the latter are religious posters and, again as above, they have a very hard time indeed distinguishing between a lecture and a discussion, perhaps because in religious terms, a lecture from the pulpit is as close to a religious discussion as they'll ever get. It's a discontinuity of expectation on the forum's part and theirs.

    You can, if you want to, distill this observation about the forum's expectation into a belief on your part that the regulars in A+A believe that all religious people are stupid. However, that's an inappropriate conclusion to draw, since it's at least equally plausible that a lot of the forum regulars believe that the majority of religious people are fundamentally honest people, but mislead.

    Perhaps i'm being too hard on you and the forum, but just to go on what you've said in your last few posts, you seem to be over-generalising and creating a false barrier based on your own bias towards this forums regulars.

    I don't believe that you think religious people are dishonest; just a litle bit dim maybe or incapable of logical enquiry? That's the feeling i'm getting. Unfortunately. I feel that's a faulty generalisation.


  • #95
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    Perhaps i'm being too hard on you and the forum, but just to go on what you've said in your last few posts, you seem to be over-generalising and creating a false barrier based on your own bias towards this forums regulars.

    I don't believe that you think religious people are dishonest; just a litle bit dim maybe or incapable of logical enquiry? That's the feeling i'm getting. Unfortunately. I feel that's a faulty generalisation.

    But I'd say generalising on A+A (and I don't think mod was) about religious people being incapable of logical enquiry would be the same as to say that on the christian thread people generally refer to "God's will" or "God's word" in answer to a plea for a logical answer (to a question from a non-religious person). It can get wearisome. I am generalising, but it happens. A lot. And I'm sure the religious are equally tired by the call for peer-reviewed scientific data. As you say, it is what it is.


  • #96
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    Obliq wrote: »
    But I'd say generalising on A+A (and I don't think mod was) about religious people being incapable of logical enquiry would be the same as to say that on the christian thread people generally refer to "God's will" or "God's word" in answer to a plea for a logical answer (to a question from a non-religious person). It can get wearisome. I am generalising, but it happens. A lot. And I'm sure the religious are equally tired by the call for peer-reviewed scientific data. As you say, it is what it is.

    :)Yeah. Well, actually he was making a big generalisation. It's there in black and white. But hey, it's only a silly discussion forum. No animals were harmed while we were chatting. And you're all really really nice people. Of that i have no doubt. Just a little biased that's all.;)


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  • #97
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    Ha! Hello kettle? You're a big black fella. Signed, pot.
    Also, it's not a generalisation in a dismissive way, if it's generally true.


  • #98
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,630 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    :)Yeah. Well, actually he was making a big generalisation. It's there in black and white. But hey, it's only a silly discussion forum. No animals were harmed while we were chatting. And you're all really really nice people. Of that i have no doubt. Just a little biased that's all.;)

    Are you reading the same posts as I am?

    Can you point out, exactly, where robindch is making the generalisation that all religious people are "just a litle bit dim maybe or incapable of logical enquiry"?

    I, for one, can't see where he has said anything of the sort.


  • #99
    Galvasean
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    Perhaps i'm being too hard on you and the forum, but just to go on what you've said in your last few posts, you seem to be over-generalising and creating a false barrier based on your own bias towards this forums regulars.

    I don't believe that you think religious people are dishonest; just a litle bit dim maybe or incapable of logical enquiry? That's the feeling i'm getting. Unfortunately. I feel that's a faulty generalisation.

    It's perfectly possible to disagree with people on any number of topics and not think they are less intelligent than you. That said, I do think a lot of religious folk think atheists think they are stupid. I think it stems, at least partially, from the 'smug atheists' stereotype.


  • #100
    The Bishop!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 175 ✭✭The Bishop!


    gvn wrote: »
    Are you reading the same posts as I am?

    Can you point out, exactly, where robindch is making the generalisation that all religious people are "just a litle bit dim maybe or incapable of logical enquiry"?

    I, for one, can't see where he has said anything of the sort.

    I'm sorry but i'm not interested in dragging up posts as proof. I appreciate your desire to stand up for something or other but if you deny there isn't an element of..whatever.

    ..The less said the better tbh.

    There is definitely a certain snottiness towards religious people on the forum. I don't want to single out anyone. I just go by what people type and presume that's what they mean..

    That's ok. It just seems silly to deny there is a bit of..whatever.


  • #101
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,630 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The Bishop! wrote: »
    I'm sorry but i'm not interested in dragging up posts as proof. I appreciate your desire to stand up for something or other but if you deny there isn't an element of..whatever.

    ..The less said the better tbh.

    There is definitely a certain snottiness towards religious people on the forum. I don't want to single out anyone. I just go by what people type and presume that's what they mean..

    That's ok. It just seems silly to deny there is a bit of..whatever.

    Your response is a paragon of the antithesis of the dialectical method, which robindch discusses above. Ironic, eh?

    If you're going to accuse a person of making gross generalisations — and derogatory, insulting ones at that — then the least you can do is point out where the generalisation has been made.


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