Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Time For A Bit of Forum Feedback

1…468910

Comments

  • #152
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    tbh wrote: »
    I really don't care, and I've no interest in discussing this with you any further. You've been sniping away at the mods all through this thread, based on assumptions. Those assumptions just demonstrate the contempt you have for the mods or the forums. The reasons you attribute for the decisions made are false - I was involved in most of those discussions and you're just wrong, period.
    Well I'm glad you got it off your chest and hopefully you feel better for it.
    People can read your contributions, and read mine, and decide for themselves who they believe.
    And given the subject matter the vast majority will be polarized one way or another even before reading either. It's the small minority who are not that ultimately matter.


  • #153
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    awec wrote: »
    Why are you continually going on about this goose and gander nonsense? Are you really that worried that the ladies have a private subforum? Why does it bother you so much?
    What bothers me is that you seem to feel that tGC should not have one and that only men should "step outside that comfort zone", rejecting any suggestion that we should have the same right to "that comfort zone" as women. That I find, whatever the motivation or logic behind it, to be sexism.
    Do you have anything to back up your assertion that the rule against ladies lounge criticism was brought in to curtail freedom of expression?
    I already did that.


  • #154
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • #155
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    awec wrote: »
    Where did I reject that right? Stop being so overly emotive. I said there was no need for a private forum and men shouldn't be afraid of female input, that's not a rejection of any right.
    So arguing that tGC should not have such a private forum does not impinge upon the rights of those men here who would prefer post in that "comfort zone" you find so objectionable? Go figure.
    You have so far presented nothing to prove that the rule was introduced to curtail freedom of expression in this forum.
    I have, whether you're listening is another matter. I argued my point, if you don't accept it no problem, I doubt if any argument, evidence, smoking gun or whatever would convince you otherwise.


  • #156
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • Advertisement
  • #157
    Pawwed Rig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,454 ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    Seriously lads. The request in the Original Post is for feedback yet any feedback that is contrary to the established consensus here gets argued down by the forums regular posters.

    This is kind of self defeating


  • #158
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    awec wrote: »
    Can you tell me what right men have to a private subforum on boards.ie? And how exactly I have rejected this right?
    The same right as any group on Boards has to a private forum, and given that private fora exist already on the basis of gender specific membership, it would indicate that men have an equal right to the same. That is how rights work, after all, in a society that claims equality.

    As to your rejection, you've argued that:
    awec wrote: »
    I can see why men might think they are more comfortable in a male only environment. My point is that they need to step outside that comfort zone, as staying within it is the easy way out.
    You might disagree with the idea, but then allow people to decide for themselves, rather than deny them that opportunity (were we to follow your argument).

    That you've avoided making similar observations of the private forum on tLL would lead me to believe that you would not say the same there (if you would, then fair enough, but you have been avoiding this point like the plague). If so then the basis of your logic is ultimately founded in sexism, which I reject completely.


  • #159
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • #160
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • #161
    Pawwed Rig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,454 ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    awec wrote: »
    This is a discussion forum, of course feedback is going to be discussed and debated. I'm sure The Corinthian is no so delicate that he can't take feedback on his opinions posted on this thread.

    But of course people are going to react to feedback that continually takes thinly veiled digs at the forum.

    I am not referring to solely TC. He can argue his own case if he wants.
    I posted earlier in the thread and had to defend everything I said as it is picked apart by the forums regulars as did others before that. I have been involved in change management in various organisations and when collecting feedback it is much more beneficial to allow everybody their say and then make an informed decision at the conclusion. This attack on anyone who might dare to suggest change defeats the purpose of a feedback thread.

    Surely if you don't agree a simple 'I do not agree with this' would suffice?


  • Advertisement
  • #162
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    awec wrote: »
    I'm sure The Corinthian is no so delicate that he can't take feedback on his opinions posted on this thread.
    No, but I'll have to admit that there's a limit to how I can respond and defend my arguments when attacked on all sides by typically partisan posters. Boards eats up enough of my time as it is - indeed, when I posted this morning I didn't think that anyone would even be bothered by the suggestion that maybe having a male only private forum would be so objectionable.
    But of course people are going to react to feedback that continually takes thinly veiled digs at the forum.
    There's nothing thinly veiled about them - it's called criticism. How moderation has been done here in the past by certain moderators has been pretty shabby IMO, and I've said why.

    Or would you prefer a feedback thread where we all have a group hug instead?
    awec wrote: »
    Personally, I think you have a chip on your shoulder and suffer a bit from small man syndrome. You want a male only forum just because the ladies have one. This clearly really annoys you, for a reason totally unknown to me.
    So you've finally just decided to attack me personally without any further pretence. Nice.
    I genuinely could not care less if the ladies have a private forum or not. Apparently this makes me sexist. If not caring that the ladies have a private forum or not makes me sexist then I guess I'm sexist.
    No, avoiding a question that may reveal you to have double standards with regards to genders is a strong indicator that you are indeed sexist.

    Even if you don't care if tLL has such a forum, if you truly believed in what you say applies to both genders you would have said that even there it's probably a bad idea, even though how they run the forum is their business.

    But you didn't and when people refuse to answer such questions, experience has taught me it's because they typically have something to hide.


  • #163
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    I suppose what it comes down to is what is sought by those on this forum and that comparisons with other fora are not an argument for why tGC should have the same, but against why tGC should not have the same.

    If people want greater (legal) freedom of expression on certain topics, then they should have it, especially if it is awarded in other comparable fora. If not it's a moot point or they need not click into the threads.

    If people want a gender-based private forum, then they should have it, especially if it is awarded in other comparable fora. If not it's a moot point or they need not join that private forum.

    If people want to discuss men's skin care and other so-called 'fluff' discussions, then they should have it, especially if it is awarded in other comparable fora. If not it's a moot point or they need not click into the threads.

    If people want this and it is denied for no rational reason, especially if it is awarded in other comparable fora, then there is a problem with tGC and if that doesn't change then people will simply post elsewhere as has slowly been happening on certain topics, leaving tGC only nominally serving the posters it claims to serve - which is why my first post in this thread suggested that it should change its name.


  • #164
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • #165
    D'Agger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,385 ✭✭✭✭D'Agger


    tbf I've already outlined in a post my interpretation of feedback - if a mod comes in and sees one side of an argument as per how to improve the forum - what use is that? The thread becomes self defeating imo

    The fact that regular posters on the forum are responding to feedback on the forum isn't an indication that we're defending our turf or something ridiculous like that - moreso we're showing the flip side of the coin to allow mods to gather better overall feedback. I don't think I'm acting like the cavalry charging in to defeat you're points, but this is a forum not a blog - points are discussed, for every argument there can be a counter argument. (*note to self, stop using military terms :pac:)

    What does irk me slightly is hearing suggested improvements that I wouldn't necessarily agree with, then when I respond with my own views on this feedback I'm getting 'Stop arguing this is feedback' as though I'm trying to debunk every point being made by certain posters which I can assure you isn't the case.


  • #166
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    ok folks, we'll leave this thread open for another 24 hrs or so and then close it, have a mod-discussion, taking all points on board, and get back to ye with any changes/updates etc.

    so, speak now or forever hold your peace (or at least til the next feedback thread!).


  • #167
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    awec wrote: »
    Perhaps the reason people are posting less in these threads you speak of is not because of the moderation but rather because of who else is posting in them and the soapboxing that occurs?
    I've noticed a recent propensity with posters using terms like straw man and soapboxing on Boards recently, without apparently knowing what these terms actually mean. Do you know what soapboxing means?

    Or had you not done with me on this thread?


  • #168
    Panthro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,057 ✭✭✭✭Panthro


    The Corinthian wrote: »
    I've noticed a recent propensity with posters using terms like straw man and soapboxing on Boards recently, without apparently knowing what these terms actually mean. Do you know what soapboxing means?

    Or had you not done with me on this thread?

    This isn't feedback to the forum, if you wish to discuss the matter further with awec, take it to PM.
    Not here.


  • #169
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    Panthro wrote: »
    This isn't feedback to the forum, if you wish to discuss the matter further with awec, take it to PM.
    Not here.
    Apologies, I didn't see your post (or you hadn't yet made it) when I replied.


  • #170
    johnr1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 965 ✭✭✭johnr1


    sam34 wrote: »
    I don't mod TLL, never did, have never been asked to and never will mod it, so I don't know where you're getting that from.

    I deliberately stay out of the men's rights /discrimination etc threads now, specifically to avoid the accusations and allegations you have just levelled at me, of a 'woman wading in telling men what to talk about in their forum'. my mod actions in this forum are largely closing medical-advice requests, deleting/banning trolls or spam and deleting chat-only posts in the easy-on-the-eye thread -I genuinely don't see why or how my gender is an issue there.

    I've never noticed that in tll wibbs deals with male posters- I doubt that's a mod policy as it doesn't make any sense from a mod-team point of view.

    Apologies, I was wrong there about tll. Your list of forums is long.

    I see you put a "now" in an important place in the next paragraph. It's good to see growth and learning. This is exactly what I think is appropriate for a female mod in a male oriented forum, and what I was suggesting in a cack handed way that obviously offended you, despite what I said at the end of the post which you either didnt read or chose not to believe.

    My point re Wibbs was that when a woman says something stupidly misandrist in tll, it's usually a female mod who slaps her down, which is gratifying to see as a man. Also, the offender will probably learn something rather than put it down to a touchy guy. Same reactions would apply here.

    Finally, to everyone else, I NEVER anywhere suggested that either there shouldn't be a female mod in tgc, or that there ought to be a private forum for men, as I don't believe either course of action is necessary or would advance anything.

    And that's me done. I've given my opinions, I'm not going to argue them here with anyone.

    .


  • #171
    Dolbert
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,154 ✭✭✭Dolbert


    I wasn't going to post in this thread, but I feel the need to defend myself after repeatedly being called a troll in this thread, for posting this. I'm genuinely at a loss. If anyone is unclear as to why I requested it to be shut down, just have a read of it and see what kind of BS it descended into by the end (also a pretty handy definition of soapboxing for anyone who isn't sure).

    The decision to post the thread was not borne out of anything devious or underhand, despite the repeated accusations of such being levelled at us. Myself and byrned17 were discussing the hostility we were met with from some men, when we mentioned that we were feminists. She wondered if it would be a good topic to post in TGC, to get some real insight from a male perspective. I agreed it should be fine as long as we were respectful throughout, which we were. Byrned17 apologised on thread for posting on the blog before consulting the forum, which was a genuine mistake.

    That's it. That's all there was to it. I will happily show anyone the bloody emails where we first casually discussed it, to show the total lack of ill-intent behind it.

    I am not and have never been a troll. I have however been bullied off my own thread in TGC and for that reason I won't be back.


  • Advertisement
  • #172
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • #173
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    Dolbert wrote: »
    I wasn't going to post in this thread, but I feel the need to defend myself after repeatedly being called a troll in this thread, for posting this. I'm genuinely at a loss. If anyone is unclear as to why I requested it to be shut down, just have a read of it and see what kind of BS it descended into by the end (also a pretty handy definition of soapboxing for anyone who isn't sure).
    You requested it shut down because for some strange reason it didn't occur to you that using us as guinea pigs for your little experiment, without disclosing this and then misrepresenting what was said to fit your own agenda, might oddly get people's backs up. And so you preferred to silence this dissent, which the moderators facilitated for you - which is actually the reason that thread was brought up here, not because of your actions per say.

    Soapboxing, BTW, differs from debate or discussion in that it is essentially a monologue. If someone gives their views, but is then willing to defend them with argument and/or evidence, then they are in a dialogue. If, on the other hand, they consistently either ignore challenges to their views, or use digression (changing the subject) or walk away on some spurious moral pretext (allowing them not to have to defend themselves) then that's a monologue and thus soapboxing.

    And in this regard, you and your ilk came a lot closer to fitting that definition when you silenced the argument than any of your critics.


  • #174
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    please keep on-topic folks


  • #175
    Dr Galen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    Ok so I'm back now and I had asked Sam if she would kindly leave the thread open for a few extra days because I wanted to respond to a few points that had been raised.

    To that end, I'm going to go on a bit of multi-post/quote rampage so that I make sure and say all the things I wanted to say :) Bear with me


  • #176
    Dr Galen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    I have no issue with it.

    Loads of forums have a similar thread and tbh, it never caused any hassle. Sure, it does look like some people post a bit more than others, but like, so what. You get those types of people everywhere. Some people just aren't shy about such things, and see no issue with it. Others do like a bit of thanks-whoring, but again, I say big deal.

    I wouldn't be in favour of limits or any other such malarky tbh as I think it simply just doesn't need it. It's not an issue in my book. If that was the only thing that we had an issue with then I'd be Happy Mod G :)


  • #177
    Dr Galen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    Again, I don't have a huge opinion on it.

    At the time that thread was created, there was a bit of a groundswell of people calling for it. Somewhere to post images of pretty people, it caused a bit of consternation in some quarters, but a bit of compromise was worked out and it ticks over grand. We get the odd person posting something NSFW, but it's rare enough really.

    As for it objectifying people (women), well thats a bit of a bone of contention with me if I'm honest. I think that whole concept has been taken and society in general has run with it. Seriously, why is not ok to have a look and an appreciative nod over someone who is beautiful? That's human nature, it's in our genetics. There appears to be a movement in society, which is saying that this a bad thing. Of course, when that becomes nothing more than pervy leering then I have an issue, and I am not a fan of such behaviour at all, but come on.

    For the record, I'd be saying the same about the same thread in any other forum, that was mostly filled with male pictures.

    And also for the record, we were quite clear at the start, that the thread in question was not a boys only club, girls and guys who like guys are more than welcome to post in there, I think it would actually be a good thing tbh and might open a few men's eyes as to what women/other guys genuinely find attractive etc.


  • #178
    Prick!
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 936 ✭✭✭Prick!


    Dr Galen wrote: »
    I have no issue with it.

    Loads of forums have a similar thread and tbh, it never caused any hassle. Sure, it does look like some people post a bit more than others, but like, so what. You get those types of people everywhere. Some people just aren't shy about such things, and see no issue with it. Others do like a bit of thanks-whoring, but again, I say big deal.

    I wouldn't be in favour of limits or any other such malarky tbh as I think it simply just doesn't need it. It's not an issue in my book. If that was the only thing that we had an issue with then I'd be Happy Mod G :)

    I suppose you're right, it does let you get to know the clubbers. i.e the ones who post often are, how do I say it, find themselves aesthetically pleasing :P A picture tells a thousand words, isn't that what they say? :P


  • #179
    Dr Galen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    Pembily wrote: »
    I went into the online dating thread when I was dating. I went in to see the success story when I thought my online dating experience was going badly.

    What I didn't like was the creepiness and I eventually avoided it. Not because I wasn't dating but because I didn't like the thread...

    Re the KYL and Easy on the Eye, I don't see the harm. I don't think the Easy on the Eye objectives anyone.
    Dravokivich wrote: »
    The thread was never meant to be a discussion on individual dates. It was meant to be on the "merits" / "incentives" / "pros" / "cons" / "what have ya" of online dating based on peoples experiences and/or perceptions of it.

    I agree that discussing dates could be considered a progression of such, but it's a very loose connection for what is essentially gossip by tying it in and stating the people dating met through OD.
    sam34 wrote: »
    my issue with the OD thread is that it's not a gender specific thread, so why is it in this forum, which is a male-orientated forum?
    Princess Peach wrote: »
    I don't read or post in that thread so don't have much to say, but out of curiosity I searched the Ladies Lounge and the OD thread there was closed because it got too chatty and it had wasn't solely female orientated.

    I have no opinion, just passing on my observation :P
    Galvasean wrote: »
    I get a lot of use out of that OD thread. I like it better since the stricter rules came in. While it's not a gender specific thread, neither are many of the threads that pop up in all honesty. I would not like to see it closed down, although if a more appropriate forum could be found to house it (I have no idea exactly where right now) I'd support that move and follow the thread there.

    edit: what I'm getting at is when you cut around the fluff there is some really good advice in said thread and a surprising sense of community and support. I would consider it a great shame if such was to be lost from boards.ie
    That said, there are one or to posters who in recent weeks seem to be 'wrecking the buzz' with constant (not to mention very repetitive) negativity. While it's probably fair to say we all like (/need?) a good moan every once in a while, some of the regular posters take it too far in this sense. In all honesty I don't even know why said people bother participating in the thread at all when a Ranting & Raving thread would be a more appropriate place of output for them.
    Maybe it's time certain posters were politely asked to 'move along' and leave the thread some room to breathe?


    In an ideal world, I'd love to find that thread a new home (forum) to reside it, if I'm being totally honest.

    What started out as a discussion around online dating in the current day and it's acceptance and such, has spawned into the great big boards online dating megathread. Thats not what it was supposed to be about.

    Don't take that to mean that as a standalone thread I'm slagging it off, or saying that for some people it's not a useful resource. I'm just not sure that the remit of tGC and that thread really fit any more.

    FWIW it can be a pain to Modsometimes, but hey, that goes with the territory. I think Panthro did a great job in setting some new guidelines for it, which has made it quite a bit easier to look after I'll admit.

    One of the posts I've quoted above mentions tLL and why they shut down their version, tbh, that is how I feel about it. I'd think people could maybe have a think about if there is a more suitable place on the site for it and we could discuss the idea of moving it there?


  • #180
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,179 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    This post has been deleted.


  • Advertisement
  • #181
    Dr Galen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    The Corinthian wrote: »
    [PERSONAL_OPINION]I think the way men's rights are dealt with in tGC has been done to death for the purposes of a feedback thread; I voiced my concerns, iptba is happy enough and others gave various other opinions and suggestions.

    But actually debating men's rights or Feminism here is probably counter-productive to the purpose of this thread at this stage (I'm not blameless on this count, I may add).

    Where it comes to this topic, unless anyone has anything new to add, I suspect it's up to the moderators to agree upon and implement a policy. Presuming they do either, of course.[/PERSONAL_OPINION]


    I think you are more or less right here TC in that the subject has been done to death.

    Do I think that there is room for more open discussions around Mens Rights etc, - yes I do.

    I also remember that in the past, things became a bit of free for all, and when you tried to Mod such threads, it became an awful exercise in rules lawyering and mega PM conversations. It was mainly what made me step down from Modding here if I'm honest, and I think you know, I really used to love this place.

    So......

    If there are going to be more discussions around that area then some changes might need to happen, and imho people will need to recognise that when things go awry and people (on either/any side of the argument) get sanctioned, then that's how it has gotta be, for the benefit of the forum as a whole. There can't and won't be any free for alls. Not that I think that this is what you arguing for TC, just sayin is all.

    I also wouldn't be a huge fan of threads becoming just a place to bash feminism etc. That isn't what it should be about. Arguments should stand on their own two feet without resorting to he said she said or they have so why can't we type stuff. There is a fine line here I'd feel, some discussions will be better suited to going to the Humanties forum, others best served by staying here.

    Finally, it has to be recognised, that a lot of people just aren't interested in the Men's Rights agenda. Be that right or wrong, it's true. We can't have a small cadre of posters taking over with such threads, when the majority don't have the interest. That said, I would have been relatively ignorant of a lot of things until I read about issues here, and I think thats a good thing.


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement