Farming Chit Chat

whelan1 · 31-07-2012 02:00PM

would that be the norm in the dairy sector? I thought calves were normally seperated from the cows after the first feeding.[/QUOTE]
sure i am far from normal! it just doesnt work for me taking the calf straight off the cow, think its great for the calf and cow to have the few days togrther

1chippy · 31-07-2012 08:09PM

I've bought a fair share of calves this year. Mainly off two dairy farmers. The ones left on the cows those few days longer are far superior calves. I bought five off one of them a few months back. He had taken three off the cows and there were two still on them when i was there. He asked if i would leave them with him a few weeks and he would ring when he wanted them collected, so me being so nice and thinking of the saving on milk replacer i did. went back and took the calves that were already off the cows, he hadnt weaned the other two.
The two left on the cows were twice the weight at least of the other ones and thats when i last seen them. i still havent picked them up yet.

The only reason i'm buying calves is that i am trying to gather a good batch of limos of bf. the prices people get for bucket fed yearlings do not justify what is put into them. some lads have said isnt it a great way of holding money together. i reckon if i could find a good source for these heifers reared, i would be at it. Milk replacer and crunch fairly adds up .

just do it · 31-07-2012 08:15PM

1chippy wrote: »

I've bought a fair share of calves this year. Mainly off two dairy farmers. The ones left on the cows those few days longer are far superior calves. I bought five off one of them a few months back. He had taken three off the cows and there were two still on them when i was there. He asked if i would leave them with him a few weeks and he would ring when he wanted them collected, so me being so nice and thinking of the saving on milk replacer i did. went back and took the calves that were already off the cows, he hadnt weaned the other two.
The two left on the cows were twice the weight at least of the other ones and thats when i last seen them. i still havent picked them up yet.

The only reason i'm buying calves is that i am trying to gather a good batch of limos of bf. the prices people get for bucket fed yearlings do not justify what is put into them. some lads have said isnt it a great way of holding money together. i reckon if i could find a good source for these heifers reared, i would be at it. Milk replacer and crunch fairly adds up .

Is there much work in it Chippy? I'd imagine until they're off the milk replacer there is a fair amount. Did you ever toy with getting a few BF cows to run with them and double or triple suck? I like the idea as well of direct sourcing LMxBF heifers. I rang two local lads who have switched to BF bull in anticipation of quota going in 2015.

1chippy · 31-07-2012 08:30PM

just do it wrote: »

Is there much work in it Chippy? I'd imagine until they're off the milk replacer there is a fair amount. Did you ever toy with getting a few BF cows to run with them and double or triple suck? I like the idea as well of direct sourcing LMxBF heifers. I rang two local lads who have switched to BF bull in anticipation of quota going in 2015.

we double and triple sucked a long time ago. don't really want to go down that route again. The work load isnt massive i have a reasonable set up
sorted for it. its my first year in a long time wiith calves that arent suckled. i have what i want in regards breeding. weights will be a lot lighter than suckled and i will end up having heifers four to five months longer off the buckets before they will be fit for bulling. They will be on meal for a fair share of the time and i just reckon the costs wont add up. But its pretty hard to find lim x bf bulling heifers. at least this way i see the cows they are off. (no holstein).

Mac Taylor · 31-07-2012 10:15PM

Christ the weather here is shocking. Blowing a gale and periodically bucketing it It was dark at 9:30. It I had the fire lighting I would think it was November. The weather forecast for the next few days is more of the same. The RTE forecaster was almost sorry giving the forecast. Talking to a few auld guys at the weekend & they reakon this is as bad a summer as they can remember.:(:(

Bodacious · 31-07-2012 10:55PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

Christ the weather here is shocking. Blowing a gale and periodically bucketing it It was dark at 9:30. It I had the fire lighting I would think it was November. The weather forecast for the next few days is more of the same. The RTE forecaster was almost sorry giving the forecast. Talking to a few auld guys at the weekend & they reakon this is as bad a summer as they can remember.:(:(

Its absolutely cat weatherwise, rained all day .. got soaked to the skin, land saturated and we have dry land!

Annual herd test tomorrow and its going to be torrential rain down the back of the neck

:D:D:D

Birdnuts · 31-07-2012 11:07PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

Christ the weather here is shocking. Blowing a gale and periodically bucketing it It was dark at 9:30. It I had the fire lighting I would think it was November. The weather forecast for the next few days is more of the same. The RTE forecaster was almost sorry giving the forecast. Talking to a few auld guys at the weekend & they reakon this is as bad a summer as they can remember.:(:(

You can say that again - glad I got the hay sorted on my place in the West as it looks like this part of the country is set for the worst of it!!

pakalasa · 01-08-2012 07:11AM

I've also heard a few older people say that it's the worst summer that they can remember too. I managed to get my silage made at the weekend between the heavy showers. What a relief to have it done.

kevthegaff · 01-08-2012 07:21AM

pakalasa wrote: »

I've also heard a few older people say that it's the worst summer that they can remember too. I managed to get my silage made at the weekend between the heavy showers. What a relief to have it done.

I still have 30 acres to get in(hilly ground) bloody sick of it with no aftergrass for the cows also:(

bbam · 01-08-2012 08:39AM

pakalasa wrote: »

I've also heard a few older people say that it's the worst summer that they can remember too. I managed to get my silage made at the weekend between the heavy showers. What a relief to have it done.

From my patchy memory the "summer" is similar to 85/86. The major difference in this part of the world is that round bale silage is allowing fodder be saved where back then it was lost wholesale...

reilig · 01-08-2012 09:17AM

bbam wrote: »

From my patchy memory the "summer" is similar to 85/86. The major difference in this part of the world is that round bale silage is allowing fodder be saved where back then it was lost wholesale...

We made 6 pits of silage in the corners of the fields in 1985 - you just couldn't travel on them. We had a 20 diesel with double wheels and a buckrake for picking the grass up. I remember opening up one particular pit that had been made in partucularly wet weather and the steam rose out of it for days. The smell was the strongest silage smell that you could ever imagine. We were milking 20 cows at the time and they were glad to see the silage that winter. A lot of farmers to the north of us, in mountain land, got no silage of hay that year and it couldn't be bought either. Many suffered severe losses that winter.

whelan1 · 01-08-2012 09:19AM

kevthegaff wrote: »

I still have 30 acres to get in(hilly ground) bloody sick of it with no aftergrass for the cows also:(

that should help your superlevy problems:D

rancher · 01-08-2012 09:22AM

bbam wrote: »

From my patchy memory the "summer" is similar to 85/86. The major difference in this part of the world is that round bale silage is allowing fodder be saved where back then it was lost wholesale...

I won't forget 85/86, both years wrote off 60 acres wheat and interest rates in the high teens, only sheep now and even though they're not poaching and there's plenty grass, they are not thriving. Had a teagasc adviser one time who used to say '' You wouldn't thrive either if there was a pint of water thrown on your dinner every day''.....how true

vanderbadger · 01-08-2012 09:29AM

http://www.farmersguardian.com/home/machinery/machinery-features/on-test-loader-tractors-still-a-popular-work-horse/45392.article
interesting loader tractor comparison article
features, massey,deutz, kubota and zetor

bbam · 01-08-2012 09:32AM

reilig wrote: »

We made 6 pits of silage in the corners of the fields in 1985 - you just couldn't travel on them. We had a 20 diesel with double wheels and a buckrake for picking the grass up. I remember opening up one particular pit that had been made in partucularly wet weather and the steam rose out of it for days. The smell was the strongest silage smell that you could ever imagine. We were milking 20 cows at the time and they were glad to see the silage that winter. A lot of farmers to the north of us, in mountain land, got no silage of hay that year and it couldn't be bought either. Many suffered severe losses that winter.

Round us many lads just pushed their "hay" into the backs of ditches after it had turned plack on the fields, cattle were literally given away. We shared silage with a relation who had lost everything they tried to make up. It was a terible time..

Tipp Man · 01-08-2012 09:57AM

vanderbadger wrote: »

http://www.farmersguardian.com/home/machinery/machinery-features/on-test-loader-tractors-still-a-popular-work-horse/45392.article
interesting loader tractor comparison article
features, massey,deutz, kubota and zetor

Would love 1 of those deutz's - they will be on the list next time the tractor is being changed

vanderbadger · 01-08-2012 09:59AM

Tipp Man wrote: »

Would love 1 of those deutz's - they will be on the list next time the tractor is being changed

was talking to a silage contractor who reckons deutz are the best tractor you can buy..he doesnt have any mind you but that was his opinion, is it true that hurlimann are identical tractor but much cheaper?

Tipp Man · 01-08-2012 10:04AM

vanderbadger wrote: »

was talking to a silage contractor who reckons deutz are the best tractor you can buy..he doesnt have any mind you but that was his opinion, is it true that hurlimann are identical tractor but much cheaper?

I believe so - I couldn't say for definite if all the parts are exactly the same but certainly a lot of them are

I suppose you'd loose out with the hurlimann when you'd go to trade it again

kevthegaff · 01-08-2012 10:37AM

whelan1 wrote: »

that should help your superlevy problems:D

thats nice

JohnBoy · 01-08-2012 10:39AM

Same, deutz, hurlimann and I think lambourghini are all the one company.

some stuff has deutz origins, some same.

not sure how much of hurlimann or lambourghini survive in current models

kevthegaff · 01-08-2012 10:50AM

JohnBoy wrote: »

Same, deutz, hurlimann and I think lambourghini are all the one company.

some stuff has deutz origins, some same.

not sure how much of hurlimann or lambourghini survive in current models

is it hard getting parts for an older Same or Lambourghini

JohnBoy · 01-08-2012 12:36PM

not a clue, sorry

reilig · 01-08-2012 12:43PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

is it hard getting parts for an older Same or Lambourghini

Parts are easy enough to get for them. They can be expensive though. There aren't many spurious manufacturers of parts for them unlike MF and Ford.

Atilathehun · 01-08-2012 06:43PM

rancher wrote: »

bbam wrote: »

From my patchy memory the "summer" is similar to 85/86. The major difference in this part of the world is that round bale silage is allowing fodder be saved where back then it was lost wholesale...

I won't forget 85/86, both years wrote off 60 acres wheat and interest rates in the high teens, only sheep now and even though they're not poaching and there's plenty grass, they are not thriving. Had a teagasc adviser one time who used to say '' You wouldn't thrive either if there was a pint of water thrown on your dinner every day''.....how true

Well, this evening takes the biscuit!!! After an absolute torrential day yesterday, heavy showers last night, today is sunny but cool. This evening is heavy rain again and quite cold, and getting duskish right now at twenty to eight.
Fertiliser I spread three weeks ago, had had no effect so far!!! Waste of money I think.

whelan1 · 01-08-2012 07:22PM

lovely evening here:o

J DEERE · 01-08-2012 08:29PM

just do it wrote: »

Is there much work in it Chippy? I'd imagine until they're off the milk replacer there is a fair amount. Did you ever toy with getting a few BF cows to run with them and double or triple suck? I like the idea as well of direct sourcing LMxBF heifers. I rang two local lads who have switched to BF bull in anticipation of quota going in 2015.

Surprised how many suckler farmers are actually going the BFx route with their replacements. We're actually moving away from that for a number of reasons. This all from personal experience, Im not knocking anyones system or plans for the future.

1) The cost of buying the calf, rearing it, wintering it, getting it in calf and then getting it to calving is underestimated. Depending on your system, it could be another 18 months before you sell. Essentially you could be looking at 48 months without anything to show from your purchased calf. 4 years. Simmental heifer calves were making 400 this Spring as were Limousins. Friesian cross heifers are very hit and miss. Out of 10, maybe 6 might be of good quality. Buying in as weanlings or 400kg heifers may be dearer but worth it and better value in the long run

2) Regardless of what the experts say, you will very rarely get a Friesian cross heifer big enough to calf at 2 years old

3) Too much milk can be a bad thing. We've had numerous cows lose tits to mastitis due to having too much milk. Its easy to say multi-suckle these cows but in my opinion that is single-handedly the most time consuming job a farmer can put on himself

4) The studies from Derrypatrick show that the FriesianX offspring is heavier at weanling than the traditional Ch or Lim calf. They don't command the top price in the ring though as they are a much plainer animal. Are there any figures which compared the weights of these animals at 12, 15 and 18 months? Off point but to be honest, from what I've seen at Derrypatrick, its probably the last place a farmer should be setting as a benchmark for a realistic and profitable suckler system.

5) Even though you may have what looks like a Limousin, remember that there is 50% Friesian blood in her. We have found FriesianX cows hard to keep in condition over the winter which results in higher feed costs. The condition of the cow affects everything from fertility to calving

When we started into suckling, we bought in 100 BFX heifer calves at the time. Of these we had 60 calf. In the end, only 20 or 25 of these were worth their salt with regards fertility, quality of offspring and general longevity. However, some of the best cows we have are daughters of these cows crossed with Limousins. If you can pick up second generation BFx cross heifers then take the hand off the man selling them

1chippy · 01-08-2012 09:22PM

Its a 1chippy trial rather than a derrypatrick copycat. I was nearly all limo out of sim cows. mainly for the reason you get a fairly consistant batch of fairly good calves with a limo bull. I'm currently expanding and doing so with a variety of breeds and instead i'll be throwing at lot to ai. Apersonal favourite of mine is the black limo out of belguim blue but i really dislike the calving, so i kept these to a mi nimum. I have been taken advice for everywhere and to tell you the truth i'm pretty stubborn and have to f*k up for myself.
To tell you the truth j deere i would love to go out and buy a really good batch of bulling heifers and work from there, however ive bought a fair share and at this stage i need to cut my clothe to suit my means. things are too volatile at the moment to invest serious capital in one massive
gamble. The limo out of bf will work outas dear but spread out over a longer period and less risk. I have a shed another pit and more reseeding to do. i'm not just to full capacity and the calves work ok.

Pat the lad · 01-08-2012 09:31PM

Would love 1 of those deutz's - they will be on the list next time the tractor is being changed[/Quote]

yeah same here. always had a soft spot for Deutz. neighbour used to draw beet with a dx 650- some beast in it's day. always tinkered with getting one for hauling cattle trailer, slurry, silage etc.
Cousin has 2 deutz's at the moment and swears by them?

Juniorhurler · 01-08-2012 09:32PM

J DEERE wrote: »

Surprised how many suckler farmers are actually going the BFx route with their replacements. We're actually moving away from that for a number of reasons. This all from personal experience, Im not knocking anyones system or plans for the future.

1) The cost of buying the calf, rearing it, wintering it, getting it in calf and then getting it to calving is underestimated. Depending on your system, it could be another 18 months before you sell. Essentially you could be looking at 48 months without anything to show from your purchased calf. 4 years. Simmental heifer calves were making 400 this Spring as were Limousins. Friesian cross heifers are very hit and miss. Out of 10, maybe 6 might be of good quality. Buying in as weanlings or 400kg heifers may be dearer but worth it and better value in the long run

2) Regardless of what the experts say, you will very rarely get a Friesian cross heifer big enough to calf at 2 years old

3) Too much milk can be a bad thing. We've had numerous cows lose tits to mastitis due to having too much milk. Its easy to say multi-suckle these cows but in my opinion that is single-handedly the most time consuming job a farmer can put on himself

4) The studies from Derrypatrick show that the FriesianX offspring is heavier at weanling than the traditional Ch or Lim calf. They don't command the top price in the ring though as they are a much plainer animal. Are there any figures which compared the weights of these animals at 12, 15 and 18 months? Off point but to be honest, from what I've seen at Derrypatrick, its probably the last place a farmer should be setting as a benchmark for a realistic and profitable suckler system.

5) Even though you may have what looks like a Limousin, remember that there is 50% Friesian blood in her. We have found FriesianX cows hard to keep in condition over the winter which results in higher feed costs. The condition of the cow affects everything from fertility to calving

When we started into suckling, we bought in 100 BFX heifer calves at the time. Of these we had 60 calf. In the end, only 20 or 25 of these were worth their salt with regards fertility, quality of offspring and general longevity. However, some of the best cows we have are daughters of these cows crossed with Limousins. If you can pick up second generation BFx cross heifers then take the hand off the man selling them

J Deere, you make a lot of sense. Particularly the last bit. A few of these Br Fr x Lm cows about the place AI'd to breed replacements are the maintenance of your herd.

Juniorhurler · 01-08-2012 09:34PM

Pat the lad wrote: »

Would love 1 of those deutz's - they will be on the list next time the tractor is being changed

yeah same here. always had a soft spot for Deutz. neighbour used to draw beet with a dx 650- some beast in it's day. always tinkered with getting one for hauling cattle trailer, slurry, silage etc.
Cousin has 2 deutz's at the moment and swears by them?[/QUOTE]

Drove one for a summer. Serious tractor even today.

Farming Chit Chat

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