Senator John Crown calls for ban on tobacco products by 2025

RUCKING FETARD · 28-06-2012 01:26AM #1

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0627/senator-calls-for-ban-on-tobacco-products-by-2025.html

The senator, who is also a consultant oncologist, said the measures should be adopted at a European level.
He said placing a ban on the manufacturing and sale of cigarettes should be a long-term goal.

Senator Crown said: "It will give the companies time to re-tool the machines to make something else.
"This is a time when the world is short of food. Imagine all that agricultural land being used to produce cancer causing tobacco instead of being used to grow food.

"It will allow the pension funds to reinvest and it will give the addicts due notice, if you're still alive in ten to 15 years, you won't be able to get cigarettes legally."

Senator Crown, along with Jillian van Turnhout and Mark Daly, advocated a Bill that will see a ban on smoking in cars in Ireland when children are in the vehicle. The Bill was approved by the Cabinet yesterday.

Good, could even shorten it to 2020.

With it being a Tax staple though, will it ever happen?

Pushtrak · 28-06-2012 01:28AM

If they were to do this, they'd make up the loss of tax in other stuff. Oxygen tax anyone?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8eoEygHyho

Posted it in the other thread, but it bears repeating. Its the onion, but reality is being just as crazy. Or, people are advocating for it, I should say.

scudzilla · 28-06-2012 01:28AM

This guy is talking through his hoop, most non smokers will be jumping around with glee at this news, without realizing that the income tax rate will probably go up to 35/40% to cover the loss of tax from smoking.

Pedant · 28-06-2012 01:31AM

Look at what happened during the Prohibition era in the US. This will only fuel criminality and gangland violence.

Mickey H · 28-06-2012 01:32AM

He can f*ck right off, the sandal wearing hippie twat.

/Rolls up a smooth Old Holborn...

JupiterKid · 28-06-2012 01:33AM

At least he's laid bare the aim of the health fascists - to criminalise smoking and smokers.

Does anyone else see the irony in this? We replace religious moral intolerance with "healthy living" intolerance...

The Radiator · 28-06-2012 01:34AM

Nah, they should just tax the hell out of it even more. Be a bit silly banning when they could just make it a super luxury product and make a load o' money.
People should be able to choose for themselves whether they smoke or not

My name is URL · 28-06-2012 01:34AM

I'm a smoker and I'd love to see them made illegal. It will reduce the number of deaths caused by the habit. Of course some people will buy them illegally, but the numbers of people taking smoking up in the first place would be greatly reduced, and the onus would be on smokers to at least try harder to quit.

I really hate the pussyfooting that goes on in relation to tobacco. Nobody denies that it's a lethal addiction but yet far more innocuous things are regularly banned.

Pushtrak · 28-06-2012 01:42AM

My name is URL wrote: »

I'm a smoker and I'd love to see them made illegal. It will reduce the number of deaths caused by the habit. Of course some people will buy them illegally, but the numbers of people taking smoking up in the first place would be greatly reduced, and the onus would be on smokers to at least try harder to quit.

And then... http://arabia.msn.com/business/press/press/2012/april/cigarette_market_egypt/ministry-health-confirms.aspx

Dr. Latif explained that, “illegal cigarettes are often manufactured and stored in highly polluted and infested areas. Based on other independent researches indicated that illicit cigarettes contain metals and toxic substances that are gravely harmful to the consumer’s health.”

http://www.birminghammail.net/news/birmingham-news/2012/04/27/children-sold-illegal-cigarettes-at-20p-a-pop-by-unscrupulous-midland-corner-shops-claims-former-scotland-yard-detective-97319-30848927/

Children sold illegal cigarettes at 20p a pop by unscrupulous Midland corner shops, claims former Scotland Yard detective

So, it would just expand the drug war. Not exactly doing anything for the greater good, IMO. It would be giving up on the money that was being made on tax, creating a vacuum in which criminal enterprise can make money... Not really seeing the gains.

28-06-2012 01:46AM

How long til the "we all have to pay for your healthcare" argument comes along. **** it, I don't want anyone else paying for my healthcare if it impinges on my right to give myself cancer.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 28-06-2012 01:52AM

You won't around in 13 years Senator Crown, you and the rest of your talking shop will be abolished.

Scioch · 28-06-2012 01:52AM

Good to see someone is trying to make progress in relation to this. The tax should be moved onto unhealthy foods. Much wider base to draw from so wouldnt affect prices too much.

admiralofthefleet · 28-06-2012 01:53AM

he can shove it up his bollox

/lights benson

humbert · 28-06-2012 01:53AM

If only stupid ideas caused cancer there'd be fewer people like him.

unkel · 28-06-2012 01:54AM

I'm no believer in making things illegal. I'm no believer that making smokes even more expensive than they are now would help in people smoking less or giving them up. That ain't gonna work.

The only thing that will work is for culture to change into making smoking less socially acceptable and less cool for younger people to start doing. This has been going on for a good few years now and it is working. Slowly.

Pushtrak · 28-06-2012 01:54AM

LordSmeg wrote: »

Good to see someone is trying to make progress in relation to this. The tax should be moved onto unhealthy foods. Much wider base to draw from so wouldnt affect prices too much.

This isn't a tax. It's a ban.

Scioch · 28-06-2012 01:56AM

Pushtrak wrote: »

This isn't a tax. It's a ban.

I know, the loss of tax which will result from the ban is what I'm talking about.

My name is URL · 28-06-2012 01:57AM

Pushtrak wrote: »

And then... http://arabia.msn.com/business/press/press/2012/april/cigarette_market_egypt/ministry-health-confirms.aspx

http://www.birminghammail.net/news/birmingham-news/2012/04/27/children-sold-illegal-cigarettes-at-20p-a-pop-by-unscrupulous-midland-corner-shops-claims-former-scotland-yard-detective-97319-30848927/

So, it would just expand the drug war. Not exactly doing anything for the greater good, IMO. It would be giving up on the money that was being made on tax, creating a vacuum in which criminal enterprise can make money... Not really seeing the gains.

If it was done over night then of course many problems would arise. I meant that it should be progressively outlawed, with proper help for smokers along the way, and carried out on a set timescale & with an encompassing legal framework to deal with any fallout. You could decriminalize possession while still targeting criminal groups.

The ultimate goal being that people are left knowing that taking up the habit in the first place has no measurable benefits whatsoever. It's not a social or party drug, the only people that see any real upsides to using it are those already addicted.

Pushtrak · 28-06-2012 01:58AM

LordSmeg wrote: »

I know, the loss of tax which will result from the ban is what I'm talking about.

Oh, right, I get you now. You'd probably have to tax the unhealthy food 300% for that plan to work though. So, it wouldn't work.

JupiterKid · 28-06-2012 02:03AM

If it becomes illegal to smoke or buy tobacco products perhaps we can enact the death penalty for selling cigarettes.

Really great idea.

Scioch · 28-06-2012 02:03AM

Pushtrak wrote: »

Oh, right, I get you now. You'd probably have to tax the unhealthy food 300% for that plan to work though. So, it wouldn't work.

I dunno there is an awful lot of money being handed out for unhealthy foods. And much more people eat junk than smoke so you'd be taxing a much larger group over a huge number of products. Might not make up the entire shortfall but it would gather a sizable chunk if not.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 28-06-2012 02:04AM

Wouldn't a stupid ban like this also have a negative impact on the tourist industry. Smoking is as prevalent as ever on the continent, these people aren't going to holiday here anymore.

Jester252 · 28-06-2012 02:08AM

Well if smoking banned then what becomes the goverment new bitch?

Pushtrak · 28-06-2012 02:14AM

My name is URL wrote: »

If it was done over night then of course many problems would arise. I meant that it should be progressively outlawed, with proper help for smokers along the way, and carried out on a set timescale & with an encompassing legal framework to deal with any fallout. You could decriminalize possession while still targeting criminal groups.

The ultimate goal being that people are left knowing that taking up the habit in the first place has no measurable benefits whatsoever. It's not a social or party drug, the only people that see any real upsides to using it are those already addicted.

I'm really curious how people would react if you replaced this thread with alcohol and drinkers.

JupiterKid wrote: »

If it becomes illegal to smoke or buy tobacco products perhaps we can enact the death penalty for selling cigarettes.

Really great idea.

No, I'm sure people would be happy with heavy fines as some attempt to make up for the loss of money from smokers no longer paying tax*.

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Wouldn't a stupid ban like this also have a negative impact on the tourist industry. Smoking is as prevalent as ever on the continent, these people aren't going to holiday here anymore.

Well, this trend of banning smoking is fairly large scale in global terms. Not entirely global, but it gets around, that's for sure. So, if it were to be in play here, it'd likely end up in play elsewhere as well.

*Boards needs a shake-head smiley. Roll eyes wouldn't have been appropriate there.

Sindri · 28-06-2012 02:19AM

I'll just grow tobacco myself then. Maybe form an Amateur Tobacco Smoking and Cultivating Club where for a membership fee you get some organization merchandise which may include tobacco to "sample". The membership fee would be weekly of course. Then I can market it to the kiddies.

The Radiator · 28-06-2012 02:22AM

Sindri wrote: »

I'll just grow tobacco myself then. Maybe form an Amateur Tobacco Smoking and Cultivating Club where for a membership fee you get some organization merchandise which may include tobacco to "sample". The membership fee would be weekly of course. Then I can market it to the kiddies.

But that's illegal, I'm telling

StupidLikeAFox · 28-06-2012 02:25AM

Completely agree with his motives in that smoking should be discouraged and stamped out. But when has telling people they can't do something actually resulted in them not doing it?

The Radiator · 28-06-2012 02:31AM

ColHol wrote: »

Completely agree with his motives in that smoking should be discouraged and stamped out. But when has telling people they can't do something actually resulted in them not doing it?

Since never

MaxSteele · 28-06-2012 02:41AM

Although I'm of the belief that prohibition doesn't work and aside from the criminality and black market that would take over tobacco ..... it would be a great long term goal if accomplished.

I seriously can't understand people who smoke or support it's existence (basically the majority of my mates, father etc etc :rolleyes:). Nearly everyone I know complains about addiction to it, tries giving up but will probably lambast the idea of being rid of it.

I'd almost rather see people on recreational drugs like Cannabis or cocaine instead increasing their smoke related disease chances of cancer, bronchitis or a tumor the size of a new born baby in their larynx.

Pushtrak · 28-06-2012 02:58AM

MaxSteele wrote: »

I seriously can't understand people who smoke or support it's existence (basically the majority of my mates, father etc etc :rolleyes:).

Would there be the same level of bafflement be raised if it were alcohol that was under discussion? Not directed at just you.

Stiffler2 · 28-06-2012 11:09AM

meh

Senator John Crown calls for ban on tobacco products by 2025

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