We haven't had a good Public Sector bashing thread in ages

Pedant wrote: »

You gave me an example of a cartel that was partially state sponsored. That's not good enough.

to you its not, but for you

Oh, that article if you read it was 2 swiss banks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_Suisse

Did Credit Suisse receive any state money - I dont think so

I'll take that as a point proven again

read the article

Motor trade does not get state funding - really come on your losing it

as you said yourself

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Less of the childish name-calling please.

/mod

Pedant wrote: »

The two swiss bank (UBS and Credit Suisse) actually did receive state money, see here. Those banks were part of a greater international cartel of banks, some of whom also received state support. Please do a little bit more research.

Your avoiding the motor trade example

In any case back to bank cartel, if swiss government supported cartel by financing bank, then how come they were the ones to remove it.

The criminal 'The General' was on the dole while carring out major crime, did the Irish government support his crime by financially supporting him with dole money -> no. In fact they took dole payments off him and the public servant who signed off on it was seriously injured for doing it. A public servant on an average wage doing his job.

cartels should be illegal, even calls that OPEC should be illegal. Just one of those things private sector trying to maximise profits and its down to police etc to stop them. Just cause a government may give a grant or loan etc does not in any way signify that they support cartels. The reason for grants, loans etc is to stimulate the economy.

Pedant wrote: »

I've already tackled it. That cartel (being private) wouldn't have last too long, like most other private non-government sponsored/funded cartels. I don't see what the issue is here.




Well, if I gave money (no matter what form) to a criminal, technically I am supporting him, regardless of whether I knew he was actively committing crime or not. Technically, the Irish government were unintentionally supporting his crimes, but I'm sure that concept is beyond you. They may have cut dole payments off him, but they didn't ask for the money they gave him earlier back.



I believe that any state sponsored cartel should be illegal. Not private cartels. I seriously don't believe that the government should hinder two companies who voluntary enter into an agreement together, be it price fixing, etc... You haven't yet falsified my claim, however, that private non-state supported/funded cartels will ultimately fail due to competition.

I honestly feel as though we're going around in circles here.

I can see why you have issues with public sector

Best of Luck in leaving Cert, better change your views for economics or you'll end up loosing a grade of two as you views are off the wall with nothing to back them up except your own opinion. How can you say a private cartel wont last, cause it says so in a book ?

The dole did not supports the general, he had so much money it did not count, drop in the ocean

Irish government support criminals and criminal activity is off the wall

why would people set up a cartel if it was going to fail, it takes legal action to get rid of them. How long to you would it take a private cartel to fail, how long is a short time ? how long is a piece of string more like

Pedant wrote: »

From what you've posted on this thread so far, I'm convinced that the education I've received thus far is greater than yours.

However, you are correct, I am anti-government. I don't believe that the private sector can do no wrong, no system is perfect, there are bad people in the world - we have to accept that. Though I think it'd be very naïve of you to suggest that the public sector or government is capable of any greater good. In fact it's quite the opposite.

The incentive to do wrong is not brought about by freedom, but by power over others. An old phrase, "power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely" - I've already mentioned that on this thread so far, I think. It only takes one malevolent people to get into a seat of power (such as that provided by the government) for everything to be fucked up. That power is not easily attained outside government, unless supplied by the government.

No, people need to stand up to what is right and people do. Read up on easy eddie in the windy city, what he did for his son and why O'hare airport got its name. You will undertand he went against absolute power in Chicago and his son was a war hero

Oh what would James Connolly say of you views, men like him that fought for our freedom and gave their lives. So sad that this is the way the youth now think.

Pedant wrote: »

O'Hare helped catch Al Capone for tax evasion. Personally, I don't see tax evasion as unethical (that's another discussion entirely), but Al Capone needed to be stopped nonetheless.

Al Capone was a criminal gangster who got powerful during the Prohibition era. He profited from the black market sale of alcohol (much the same way as modern gangland criminals profit from the sale of illegal drugs).

If the state had not done the stupid thing of making alcohol illegal (enshrining alcohol prohibition in the US Constitution), you wouldn't have the likes of Al Capone growing a mass criminal industry. Again, his rise can be blamed on blow-back from government policy. The state was to blame for the likes of Al Capone.

Indeed, many gangland thugs nowadays would not have so much power if the possession and sale of drugs wasn't illegal.



Connolly was a socialist trade-union swine. If his like weren't kept down we'd be living in a soviet satellite state. Not much freedom there. I'd rather imperialism was fought based on ideals of true liberty, like the Enlightenment ideas brought into being during the American Revolution.

I would ask all public servants to read this, with views like this how could you ever be appreciated

Pedant wrote: »

How? What? Where? Why?

Puzzlement doesn't suit you darling. Not your style, it isn't "in" this year.

Pedant wrote: »

Connolly was a socialist trade-union swine.

Please explain to me why you consider James Connolly a swine?

What exactly about him gave you this opinion?

True he was a socialist and trade unionist but why is that a bad thing?

When he was working for unions one third of Dublin's population lived in slums. Prior to the advent of trade unionism in Ireland, unskilled workers lacked any form of representation. Furthermore, there were many more unskilled labourers in Dublin than there were jobs for them. Thus unskilled workers often had to compete with one another for work on a daily basis, the job generally going to whoever agreed to work for the lowest wages. Unskilled workers in Dublin were very much at the mercy of their employers. Employers who suspected workers of trying to organize could "blacklist" them, practically destroying any chance of future employment. He helped form a worker's militia named the Irish Citizen Army to protect workers' demonstrations after the first Bloody Sunday and the frequent brutality of the Dublin Metropolitan Police.

when ireland sorts out it's public services problems..........their will be a basis for a great recovery......

Pedant wrote: »

We need as small a government and public service as possible - a minarchy. Only the jails, police, courts and a legislature. Police chiefs should be elected on a local level.

i think the number one priority is a national health service.......paid for by central taxes......maybe a dispensing charge for prescriptions......

there are too many differrent rules to the present system.....

Pedant wrote: »

We need as small a government and public service as possible - a minarchy. Only the jails, police, courts and a legislature. Police chiefs should be elected on a local level.

So what no Schools, hospitals, roads, fire brigade and so on? Or should they be run by Coca Cola or someone similar?