Alan Shatter Dishing Out Citizenship Like Confetti

Nodin · 13-05-2012 03:51PM

galgar wrote: »

Why the need to get documents stamped by the Nigerian Embassy if the applicants have pleaded asylum here as refugees. Surely their former Embassy would be the last place they would go to.

Theres no mention of who, what or why as regards to these people being granted citizenship. Nor are exact numbers given.

senordingdong · 13-05-2012 03:53PM

Another said that other nationalities are not being asked to certify their documentation, and accused the Passport Office of discrimination.

It's good to see the PO upholding its rules but with the above quote I doubt this stand will last too long.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 03:53PM

Nodin wrote: »

A stupid remark with zero basis in fact.

How many of the failed asylum seekers(90% whom claim asylum are refused) have been deported?

Any lad with a bit of intelligence could come and work here, just by taking advantage of one of the many, many loopholes.

Even if he has dodgy paperwork, he may still receive citizenship.

Joke shop of a country.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 03:55PM

Nodin wrote: »

Theres no mention of who, what or why as regards to these people being granted citizenship. Nor are exact numbers given.

Seeing as only a few hundred work permits have ever been issued to Nigerians we can deduct that many of them were indeed former asylum seekers.

Nodin · 13-05-2012 03:58PM

IrishAm wrote: »

Seeing as only a few hundred work permits have ever been issued to Nigerians we can deduct that many of them were indeed former asylum seekers.

....I'd hestitate to guess what you "deduct", given this thread.

juan.kerr · 13-05-2012 04:02PM

Does he not realise we have enough of them here already?

Nodin · 13-05-2012 04:06PM

juan.kerr wrote: »

Does he not realise we have enough of them here already?

We've enough of who?

bwatson · 13-05-2012 04:07PM

IrishAm wrote: »

http://metroeireann.com/article/naturalised-nigerians-up-in-arms,3322

- Free access to Ireland for anyone who visits the UK "for the Olympics".

:mad:

Can you really be critical of something like this?

Thousands of people from North America, Australasia etc will be travelling to London and will be spending money on accommodation, food, memorabilia, and various other tourist related things. Surely making it as easy as possible for these tourists to take a short plane ride and do the same sort of thing in Ireland is not something to complain about?

lividduck · 13-05-2012 04:07PM

IrishAm wrote: »

How many of the failed asylum seekers(90% whom claim asylum are refused) have been deported?

Any lad with a bit of intelligence could come and work here, just by taking advantage of one of the many, many loopholes.

Even if he has dodgy paperwork, he may still receive citizenship.

Joke shop of a country.

Joke shop of a thread, to be expected by this op.
Have you looked up the word "intelligence"

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 04:10PM

bwatson wrote: »

Can you really be critical of something like this?

Thousands of people from North America, Australasia etc will be travelling to London and will be spending money on accommodation, food, memorabilia, and various other tourist related things. Surely making it as easy as possible for these tourists to take a short plane ride and do the same sort of thing in Ireland is not something to complain about?

North Americans, Australians etc are already non visa required nationals.

They can already come here as they please.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 04:18PM

Nodin wrote: »

....I'd hestitate to guess what you "deduct", given this thread.

Let me explain. To gain citizenship one has to be resident in Ireland for at least five years.

Time spent as a student doesnt count, so we can deduct that they werent students.

Marriage to an EU citizen didnt, pre 2008, give one right to remain in Ireland, so we can deduct that they were not married to EU citizens, as the judgement was issued just four years ago.

Only five hundred work permits have ever been issued to Nigerians. So we can deduct that the majority of them werent on work permits.

What other option is there, but the asylum route?

Mena · 13-05-2012 06:05PM

IrishAm wrote: »

Only five hundred work permits have ever been issued to Nigerians. So we can deduct that the majority of them werent on work permits.

What other option is there, but the asylum route?

757, but don't let fact checking stop you. Oh, and that excludes numbers from '99 to '03 where the stats weren't collected. How many in total were issued from '99 to '03 you ask? 148 564, of which any number could have been from your target demographic.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 06:37PM

Mena wrote: »

757, but don't let fact checking stop you.

Wrong.

Mena wrote: »

Oh, and that excludes numbers from '99 to '03 where the stats weren't collected. How many in total were issued from '99 to '03 you ask?

Wrong 99-02.

Mena wrote: »

148 564, of which any number could have been from your target demographic.

Wrong. Circa 60,000 from 99-2002.

From here; http://www.djei.ie/labour/workpermits/statistics.htm

Nigerian asylum Applications lodged worldwide between 1998-2005 and their success rate(source UNHCR).

Country/ No of As applicants/ Recognition rates as refugees
Austria/ 7,879 / 0.3%
Belgium/ 1,074 / 0%
Denmark/ 351 / 2.3%
France / 6,025 / 2.0%
Germany / 5,387/ 0%
Spain/ 7,514 / 0.1%%
Switz/ 3,041 / 0.7%
UK / 8,509 / 0.3%
Italy/ 758/ 2.3%
Sweden/ 1,345/ 0%
Netherlands/ 2,607/ 0.6%
USA / 1,134/ 27.5%

Ireland/ 20,701/ 0.6%

According to the DoJ, 80% of all Nigerians claim to be without any form of travel documents when making their claim for asylum here.

But, yeah. I am sure that none of our new citizens were former asylum seekers. Even if the figures point to the contrary.:D

Nodin · 13-05-2012 06:43PM

IrishAm wrote: »

....................

According to the DoJ, 80% of all Nigerians claim to be without any form of travel documents when making their claim for asylum here.

But, yeah. I am sure that none of our new citizens were former asylum seekers. Even if the figures point to the contrary.

Why are you so fixated on Nigerians?

RobbingBandit · 13-05-2012 06:51PM

You do all realize these guys have signed up for operation "Human Shield" to gain their citizenship, in the event of a war they will be our Canon Fodder.

Benny_Cake · 13-05-2012 07:23PM

IrishAm wrote: »

Ive read it after I had a discussion about it with somebody who closely works with, in a professional capacity, the ORAC.

ORAC only deals with asylum seekers who are applying for refugee status. They do not have any power regarding citizenship, or other forms of immigration. So I would suggest that you wouldn't attach too much credibility to what this person said.

Mena · 13-05-2012 07:32PM

IrishAm wrote: »

Wrong.

Yes you are. Check again. My figures include renewals which is in each case, a totally new application. You can download the spreadsheets from '04 to '12.

IrishAm wrote: »

Wrong 99-02.

Correct, you're wrong again. Go take another look, read it slowly this time.

IrishAm wrote: »

Wrong. Circa 60,000 from 99-2002.

From here; http://www.djei.ie/labour/workpermits/statistics.htm

There's no "Circa" anything about it. Let me help you with the math:

Year - WP Applications
1999 - 6250
2000 - 18006
2001 - 36436
2002 - 40321
2003 - 47551

Total = (keep up here now) 148 564.

Your own link gives this data to you for pete's sake.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 08:03PM

Mena wrote: »

Yes you are. Check again. My figures include renewals which is in each case, a totally new application. You can download the spreadsheets from '04 to '12.

Your figures include renewals so they are wrong. If I get my passport renewed, I am still one person. If a lad gets his work permit renewed, he is still one person too.

You are double counting people. Its dishonest

Benny Cake wrote: »

ORAC only deals with asylum seekers who are applying for refugee status. They do not have any power regarding citizenship, or other forms of immigration. So I would suggest that you wouldn't attach too much credibility to what this person said.

I am well aware of that. But seeing as the vast, vast majority of Nigerians resident in Ireland were once asylum seekers, 80% of them with no documentation and only 0.6% of them being deemed above board, it comes to no surprise to people who dealt with them in a professional capacity.

From 1999-2005 20,701 Nigerians applied for asylum in Ireland. Each and every asylum seeker is given a PPS number to avail of medical care, their weekly payments, etc. etc. From 2000-2005(No figures available for 1999) 19,056 PPS numbers were issued with PPS numbers.

The figures dont lie.

Sources(Welfare.ie, CSO, UN, MoJ).

Mena · 13-05-2012 08:06PM

IrishAm wrote: »

Your figures include renewals so they are wrong. If I get my passport renewed, I am still one person. If a lad gets his work permit renewed, he is still one person too.

You are double counting people. Its dishonest

You stated that only 500 work permits had ever been issued to Nigerians. I've proved you wrong.

The fact that you ignore the rest of my post confirms you're talking crap or just copy pasting from someone on p.ie.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 08:11PM

Mena wrote: »

You stated that only 500 work permits had ever been issued to Nigerians. I've proved you wrong.

The fact that you ignore the rest of my post confirms you're talking crap or just copy pasting from someone on p.ie.

You are double counting people. One person remains one person, no matter how many times they renew their visa. You are either being deliberately obtuse, or a bit touched.

And I copy and pasted **** all.

dr.bollocko · 13-05-2012 08:13PM

IrishAm wrote: »

You are double counting people. One person remains one person, no matter how many times they renew their visa. You are either being deliberately obtuse, or a bit touched.

And I copy and pasted **** all.

This hasn't gone as well as you'd hoped, has it?

By all means, continue with the bluster for a few more posts though.

When you're in a hole you should stop digging but I'll give you a shovel for a few more posts before I lock this up.

IrishAm · 13-05-2012 08:18PM

dr.bollocko wrote: »

This hasn't gone as well as you'd hoped, has it?

On the contrary, it turned out exactly how I thought it would.

galgar · 13-05-2012 08:20PM

Why does every discussion on this site descend into bitching between a few people that is totally off topic. Argue in private amongst yourselves and when resolved come to the discussion of the post title.

Nodin · 13-05-2012 08:22PM

galgar wrote: »

Why does every discussion on this site descend into bitching between a few people that is totally off topic. Argue in private amongst yourselves and when resolved come to the discussion of the post title.

....the OP was actually just an excuse to rant about immigration, so really, whatever it said on the Ticket, the train was set on a different track from the get-go.

MadYaker · 13-05-2012 08:29PM

I really don't care about this. Im wondering why it annoys you so much OP? What direct effect will this have on you?

dr.bollocko · 13-05-2012 08:31PM

IrishAm wrote: »

On the contrary, it turned out exactly how I thought it would.

It must be difficult to type with your fingers in your ears and your eyes covered.

It would be beneficial for future discussions like this if you admitted to yourself that the world and peoples perception of articles does not bend to suit your world view and this is likely to continue.

We'll leave it at that on this one.

Alan Shatter Dishing Out Citizenship Like Confetti

Comments