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Hardware Discussion Thread

13536384041111

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    Brian wrote: »
    I believe LG shifted focus to 60 Hz passive 3D.

    On the other hand, there's speculation that the LG panels in the Catleaps are prototypes for forthcoming 120 Hz IPS panels, so keep an eye out for that.
    I can only imagine a price tag on those things... I'll syick to my e-ips for awile I guess


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    Hopefully not too much, their 120hz 3d hd monitor was like half the price of the benQ one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 712 ✭✭✭deejer


    I know this has been asked here before but cant see if for the life of me. Im looking for a 60-64gb SSD for my HTPC and I am wondering what the best price/performace drive is.

    The crucial M4 and the Vertex 3 are both just under 90euro on Komplett but I remember reading that the smaller versions of these drives didnt have as good performance as the larger capacity models


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,979 ✭✭✭Tea_Bag


    they don't, but it doesn't matter. get the m4 and don't worry about it.


    in other news, anyone want to see quad SLI water cooling at its finest? ;)

    you nostalgia you lose.

    here


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    Tea_Bag wrote: »
    they don't, but it doesn't matter. get the m4 and don't worry about it.


    in other news, anyone want to see quad SLI water cooling at its finest? ;)

    you nostalgia you lose.

    here

    only the cool kid parents had PC with voodoo stuff :(

    all i had was 2mb vram on board. later upgraded to savage4 32mb!!!! it still ran diablo 2 like shiet... hard to believe it, but diablo 2 was sort of benchmark...


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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    at least you HAD a computer.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    at least you HAD a computer.

    true, but it was second hand old machine. pentium 1 200mhz 32 ram and 2mb on board. it was already old when i got it :(. what can i say, i came from poor part of europe :(


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,699 ✭✭✭Brian


    Lime iMac G3 babyyyy

    apple_m4984_imac_g3_333_fruit_colors.jpg

    I think it's still in my attic along with the G4 / Van Gogh. Back when Apple was a company for geeks :/


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    Broke link TB.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,979 ✭✭✭Tea_Bag


    Broke link TB.
    its working fine for me on PC and mobile?



    quick question lads, would i be cutting it too close with a 450W superflower amazon with a 2500K and a 6870?


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  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 4,282 Mod ✭✭✭✭deconduo


    Tea_Bag wrote: »
    its working fine for me on PC and mobile?



    quick question lads, would i be cutting it too close with a 450W superflower amazon with a 2500K and a 6870?

    Nope, it would be fine.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭Serephucus


    Tea_Bag wrote: »
    its working fine for me on PC and mobile?



    quick question lads, would i be cutting it too close with a 450W superflower amazon with a 2500K and a 6870?

    Works fine here too.

    As deconduo said, you'll be fine. I've specced the same for a tonne of people here already.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,979 ✭✭✭Tea_Bag


    sound. and what upgrade path would i have w/r/t GPU's?


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 4,282 Mod ✭✭✭✭deconduo


    One idea as to why Ivy Bridge could be running so hot:

    http://www.overclockers.com/ivy-bridge-temperatures


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭Serephucus


    That's interesting. Do we know if any of the reviewers anywhere actually received a retail chip, or were they all ES?


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 4,282 Mod ✭✭✭✭deconduo


    Serephucus wrote: »
    That's interesting. Do we know if any of the reviewers anywhere actually received a retail chip, or were they all ES?

    No idea. Once the retail chips start shipping we'll see if Intel changed it though. If not then I think we'll still be recommending the i5-2500k for anyone not water cooling.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    i would not expect a lot from retail version. TTL did mentioned that he talked to retailers with their retail versions and results were same.

    like deconduo, i will recomend i5 2500k too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭Serephucus


    No, TTL talked to other reviewers, and people in retail, but I'm almost positive that he didn't actually mention retail chips.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    Serephucus wrote: »
    No, TTL talked to other reviewers, and people in retail, but I'm almost positive that he didn't actually mention retail chips.

    well i am not sure now and cba going to check now! :o


    though lets be realisitc, there will be feck all or minimal difference. so i would not hold my breath.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭Serephucus


    Usually, yes. But if Intel really did fundamentally change its heatspreader design (to something worse), we could see a very big drop in temps if they use the old design.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    Serephucus wrote: »
    Usually, yes. But if Intel really did fundamentally change its heatspreader design (to something worse), we could see a very big drop in temps if they use the old design.

    the problem is not in design now, but in the fact that they used less silicon in it. they shrank it to make it cheaper to manufacture and it to be more efficient. they cant just go to old setup as there is no space for it.

    there is no way intel will give worse CPUs to reviewers, then ones for retail. Good reviews sell product, bad reviews decrease sales. I would give the best examples of my product to reviewers, not the worse ones.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,979 ✭✭✭Tea_Bag


    what's stopping people from soldering their own chips a la pencil mod days?


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 4,282 Mod ✭✭✭✭deconduo


    Another article by Anadtech:

    http://www.anandtech.com/show/5763/undervolting-and-overclocking-on-ivy-bridge

    These two graphs are the important ones:

    Max%20OC%20Voltage_575px.png
    Temperature_575px.png

    This is done with an Intel liquid cooler, similar to the H100 I believe. Its interesting that even though the Vcore starts pretty low, you really need to put a lot in to get any reasonable overclock. That's probably one of the reasons its running so hot as well. TJMax for Ivy Bridge is 105°C, compared to 98°C for Sandy Bridge, so you would expect it to run slightly hotter. However almost hitting boiling on liquid cooling is pretty bad.

    Here's another comparison someone did:

    4dslc.png

    Cinebench score doesn't mean much for gamers, but it does give an idea of how the chips scale with overclocking. Its funny that one of the big improvements being marketed for Ivy Bridge was lower power consumption, yet with any significant overclock that goes out the window.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 4,282 Mod ✭✭✭✭deconduo


    Tea_Bag wrote: »
    what's stopping people from soldering their own chips a la pencil mod days?

    -You need access to the proper equipment, fluxless solder etc.
    -One tiny mistake = dead chip.
    -Without the IHS the chip will sit lower in the socket, you'll need to account for this which is pretty tricky to do.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭Serephucus


    the problem is not in design now, but in the fact that they used less silicon in it. they shrank it to make it cheaper to manufacture and it to be more efficient. they cant just go to old setup as there is no space for it.

    there is no way intel will give worse CPUs to reviewers, then ones for retail. Good reviews sell product, bad reviews decrease sales. I would give the best examples of my product to reviewers, not the worse ones.

    Go read the article deconduo linked. What you're saying is exactly what's not happening. It's playing a part, but it's not the main reason for the temp spikes.

    As for the reviewers, that's what they've always got - engineering samples. It's a given that they always run a bit hotter than regular chips, but this thing with the heatsink (not calling it a heatspreader) TIM isn't very well known. That's certainly not a way to get positive reviews, as you say, but I can't see any other reason for the huge temperature spikes.

    Those tests were done on water? Jesus, that's terrible. I'd expect to see those with an air cooler, sure, but nowhere near this high in a loop. Looks like I might well be getting a 2600K if things don't improve.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    Serephucus wrote: »
    Go read the article deconduo linked. What you're saying is exactly what's not happening. It's playing a part, but it's not the main reason for the temp spikes.

    As for the reviewers, that's what they've always got - engineering samples. It's a given that they always run a bit hotter than regular chips, but this thing with the heatsink (not calling it a heatspreader) TIM isn't very well known. That's certainly not a way to get positive reviews, as you say, but I can't see any other reason for the huge temperature spikes.

    Those tests were done on water? Jesus, that's terrible. I'd expect to see those with an air cooler, sure, but nowhere near this high in a loop. Looks like I might well be getting a 2600K if things don't improve.

    Well one facts stays same: ivy can go and hug bulldozer. They can be shiet together now! :)


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 4,282 Mod ✭✭✭✭deconduo


    Well one facts stays same: ivy can go and hug bulldozer. They can be shiet together now! :)

    I wouldn't say that at all. At a guess it will probably work out like this:

    -For the average person that doesn't overclock, Ivy will be better. It gives better performance per clock, lower power consumption, and a couple of other benefits like native PCI-E 3.0, SSD caching etc.

    -For extreme overclockers that push their chip to the absolute limit, Ivy will be better. The higher temperatures can be overcome with a top end loop, and Ivy gives better performance per clock.

    -For the average enthusiast who will overclock on air, Sandy will be better. You'll probably see similar performance from SB@4.8GHz vs IB@4.5GHz, but lower temperatures, power consumption and price means that SB will win out.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,911 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    I wonder will they still offer sandy after ivy will come out in full blast. Or just untill stock lasts. In my opinion SB is still better package.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭Serephucus


    Something to consider:

    Based off a few benchmarks on Guru3D, IB is about 15% better than SB. Taking that into account, a 2600K @ 4.8GHz is about equal to a 3770K @ 4.2GHz. This is achievable at about a volt, and will only get up to about 60*C.

    Not too bad when you think you could still probably get to 4.4 or so with reasonable temperatures...


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,979 ✭✭✭Tea_Bag


    that's a bit more solid info. I'd be tempted if the 3570K was the same performance gain per clock (as the 2500k), came in at roughly the same price, and could hit at least 4.5Ghz.


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